Do Protestants feel alienated in Ireland?

Jigsaw

I was just wondering do Protestants feel alienated in Ireland? I was brought up in a Protestant background but now feel no affiliation to it. I fail to see why one cannot be Protestant and Irish. Tbh I VERY rarely go to church but I love Irish culture. I spent a large proportion of my formative years in Donegal (Glencolumbkille) and spend many weekends in Dublin. I feel Irish and I a be down in the pub with my Donegal shirt on for the GAA and with my Ireland shirt on for the rugby but I wonder how well I would be received in the event of a united Ireland. Now I am now political or economic expert but in principle I'd love this island to be united.

It seems to me (and I may be wide of the mark) that Protestants are seem as bad. Where I go to church (and I don't even go) doesn't really matter.

My dad was brought up as Church Of Ireland but loved and played football and hurling and also spoke Irish.

I don't know where I stand. I hate the nonsense. I have for a time yearned to move to Dublin but I'd love to learn a bit more. I think I just want the same as what YOU want.

J

InFront

I attended a mainly Protestant secondary school here in Dublin (although I'm not one myself) and I never got the impression that this was an issue.

However I have heard a lot of young Irish people make jokes about it a mixed company, in a way they probably wouldn't joke about other faiths. For example, pointing out a "Protestant characteristic" as an intended joke.
I'm not sure if that means that they feel so comfortable with the two traditions that it isn't a serious issue anymore, or that there is a contempt for their religion. I would guess it's the former as opposed to the latter, judging by the people concerned.

Ultimately, if someone abroad asked me if Irish people have indigenous religious divisions on the south of the island, my answer would be 'No. Religion is not a big issue there.'

/Andy\

InFront wrote:

I attended a mainly Protestant secondary school here in Dublin (although I'm not one myself) and I never got the impression that this was an issue.

However I have heard a lot of young Irish people make jokes about it a mixed company, in a way they probably wouldn't joke about other faiths. For example, pointing out a "Protestant characteristic" as an intended joke.
I'm not sure if that means that they feel so comfortable with the two traditions that it isn't a serious issue anymore, or that there is a contempt for their religion. I would guess it's the former as opposed to the latter, judging by the people concerned.

Ultimately, if someone abroad asked me if Irish people have indigenous religious divisions on the south of the island, my answer would be 'No. Religion is not a big issue there.'

Agreed definitely, noone I know would consider it an issue in any way. If there was a united Ireland, Republicans might take exception to Unionists and vice versa but for most Southern people that would be because of political reasons rather than sectarian ones

Zambia

Have to agree once you cross the border no-one gives a flying Fart , what religon you are.

Possibly in a UI it still may be issue in Ulster as we just have a history of it. But as you would agree with me I'm sure we are getting better.

Fratton Fred

Try being a divorced English Protestant, then try marrying an Irish Catholic girl in a Catholic church. The poor old Priest had to have holy water sprinkled on him to get over the shock.

It's amusing the ignorance of some people towards protestants. I've heard "Do they baptise their young" (No, but we do eat our first born) as well as "Do they take communion" (no, they just lay a bit of bread and a dash of dessert wine to get the crowds in). Some people really believe it is a different religion, rather than just a different form of Christianity.

That aside, amongst the younger generation there is no problem, most people in Ireland I have met seem to have a huge problem with the Catholic church rather than the Anglican one.

DublinWriter

Jigsaw wrote:

I fail to see why one cannot be Protestant and Irish.

You're hitting several nails on several heads there, Jigsaw.

Many people think loyalist means Protestant and nationalist means Catholic, but it's not always the case. Consider some of the people nationalists consider to be heros - Wolfe Tone, Robert Emmet, Roger Casement, Douglas Hyde, James Connolly - they were all Protestants.

Conversely, William Joyce (Lord Haw Haw) and his parents were Catholic Unionists.

A friend of mine comes from a farming background in Wexford. His family were Protestant going back as far as they can remember. In his last year in secondary he switched from an exclusive Protestant boarding school down south to a comprehensive nearer to home. He always goes on about the how iconography scattered around the school made him feel a little uneasy (i.e. statues of Mary, crucifixes), but he mostly jokes about it.

He's a Nationalist, but is more assertive about his Protestantism that his folks were. I know his folks pretty well, and they are very quiet, decent farming folk, but not really active in their local community and really only mixing within their local Church of Ireland congregation.

I read somewhere that the general attitude of the apolitical Protestants who remained south of the border after 1921 was to keep their heads down (for whatever reason) and I think there's still a wee element of that in Southern Irish Protestant culture today, but I think that's will all change for the better.

I guess that would be an understandable attitude to take considering how DeValera almost tried to spot-weld the Catholic Church to the state in the 1930's.

Again, I think it’s always important to distinguish Protestantism from Unionism, to celebrate your down culture and to respect those of others.

Jigsaw, regarding coming to Dublin, you’d need to have two heads and be pained blue for people to give you a second look here.

bringitdown

50% of my family are Protestant. 50% Catholic. (4/4)

However only my mother and father still keep their faith the rest are lapsed, agnostic or athiest at this stage!

Don't think any of us ever felt alienated, if anyone cracks a nasty "proddy" joke or similar in my presence I generally point out that I am of a protestant family or crack a catholic joke back in their direction. And they usually shutup and get embarassed. Never had an agressive reply in that situation.

We only maintain one tradition tho. an the 12th of July all of the Protestants in the family get together and march the traditional route down the corridor to the sitting room where we play with all the Catholics toys.

El Stuntman

Jigsaw wrote:

I was just wondering do Protestants feel alienated in Ireland? I was brought up in a Protestant background but now feel no affiliation to it. I fail to see why one cannot be Protestant and Irish. Tbh I VERY rarely go to church but I love Irish culture. I spent a large proportion of my formative years in Donegal (Glencolumbkille) and spend many weekends in Dublin. I feel Irish and I a be down in the pub with my Donegal shirt on for the GAA and with my Ireland shirt on for the rugby but I wonder how well I would be received in the event of a united Ireland. Now I am now political or economic expert but in principle I'd love this island to be united.

It seems to me (and I may be wide of the mark) that Protestants are seem as bad. Where I go to church (and I don't even go) doesn't really matter.

My dad was brought up as Church Of Ireland but loved and played football and hurling and also spoke Irish.

I don't know where I stand. I hate the nonsense. I have for a time yearned to move to Dublin but I'd love to learn a bit more. I think I just want the same as what YOU want.

J

I'm Protestant and have never felt alienated in the South (where I've lived all my life). There have been some strange moments though such as the day the Pope came to to town and all my childhood friends headed off to the Phoenix Park to see him and I wasn't allowed! Also wondering why everyone had dirty faces on Ash Wednesday. Wondering what to do when the rosary is being said at a funeral (why do they say it so fast?).

My wife is Catholic, most of my friends are Catholics (of the usual lapsed variety), we chose to have our daughter baptised CoI but as far as I'm concerned, she can make up her own mind when she's older. This just gives her more options.
As regards attitudes towards Protestants in the Republic, I think it's a non-issue for the vast majority of the population. There are jokes amongst my friends (both ways might I say) but let's face it, religion is no longer the deal it once was. And that's a good thing imo.

I think if you were to ask my parents generation (back in the good old days when Dev asked Bishop McQuaid what government policy should be) the same question, they might give you a somewhat different answer. It sounded a more repressive society where Protestants tended to band together, intermarry etc.

Our grandparents generation would probably tell an even more different story; remember that a fairly vicious campaign of sectarian murder and forced eviction was practiced in the countryside after 1922 against those perceived as 'Big House' Protestants, i.e. the former ruling class. The Protestant population of the South dropped sharply in that period with many choosing to emigrate to England.

As for Northern Protestants attitudes towards the South, I think they have probably changed rapidly in the last decade or so (especially among the younger generation). They are jealous of our economic success and also enjoy our more relaxed society (the North is still highly respressive in many ways) - hence so many of them are moving here. Will still be generations before the sectarian attitudes on both sides are removed however - the only answer is integrated, non-religious schooling imo. Good luck with that!

there's a long rambling reply for ye now!

CerebralCortex

I was raised a catholic but reject every aspect of it now and its done me more good than harm. I don't think religion is a big issue in Ireland two of my best friends have protestant backgrounds and it just isn't an issue. Despite this I still experience a huge amount of alienation/isolation and it has to do mainly with my lifestyle choices more than anything else. Irish pub culture is the new church/crutch and if you're not in you're not in.

karen3212

I must admit my ignorance but I didn't know any divorced person could remarry in a catholic church. For me religion/lack of is not an issue for me. I get annoyed though when people ask me my religion, not sure why it irks me.

Jigsaw

Thanks folks, those are some interesting perspectives. I suppose it makes sense that a lot of these issues are generational. I was warned by someone that there may be prejudice towards me if I moved to Dublin, but then again that was from an older generation and tbh anyone I've met there have been sound. Only positive experiences so far. Any further little anecdotes or points of views would be gratefully received!

El Stuntman

Jigsaw wrote:

I was warned by someone that there may be prejudice towards me if I moved to Dublin!

yes there will be massive prejudice

but only because you're 'a bleedin' culchie'!

mike65

Except in a few wierd backwaters I reckon people don't really give a hoot one way or the other, the problems are primarily with the state - its when schooling and medical proceedures enter the mix you see how one faith is clearly favoured over another, in fact any other.

Mike.

El Stuntman

mike65 wrote:

when schooling and medical proceedures enter the mix you see how one faith is clearly favoured over another, in fact any other.

Mike.

yes, I have to admit I would be a bit freaked to send a child to the local convent/Christian Brothers school (maybe that's just me)

also, hospital faith-based policies are very scary things - especially for women

Fratton Fred

CerebralCortex wrote:

I was raised a catholic but reject every aspect of it now and its done me more good than harm. I don't think religion is a big issue in Ireland two of my best friends have protestant backgrounds and it just isn't an issue. Despite this I still experience a huge amount of alienation/isolation and it has to do mainly with my lifestyle choices more than anything else. Irish pub culture is the new church/crutch and if you're not in you're not in.

just to comment on that, whilst it is not a big issue, you still know they are Protestants. I am used to not knowing my friends religion and only finding out when they are married, have kids baptised or die.

A good friend of mine, who I had known for about 12 years, mentioned one day that he was Catholic. My now wife was surprised that I did not know, we were surprised that she was surprised (If you get what I mean). In Ireland I have found that whilst religion is not an issue, it is still there.

FTA69

I'm a Protestant of working class origin, and I ended up in the Republican Movement! As people alluded to, I don't think religious descrimination is really an issue in the 26 Counties.

Múinteoir

Immigration has changed the whole dynamic now too. There are a lot more Protestants in the South now based on immigration from Protestants communities from all over the world coming to Ireland. A lot of it seems to of a more evanagelical type too.

And then of course in the North you have Polish Catholics in the mix too and amny of them joining the police force there!

Zambia

M&#250 wrote: »

Immigration has changed the whole dynamic now too. There are a lot more Protestants in the South now based on immigration from Protestants communities from all over the world coming to Ireland. A lot of it seems to of a more evanagelical type too.

And then of course in the North you have Polish Catholics in the mix too and amny of them joining the police force there!

Think your a wee bit of there many are applying and possibly some get in. But its good to see.

just like there needs to be a few Black, Polish and Asian gardai

stovelid

El Stuntman wrote:

yes there will be massive prejudice

but only because you're 'a bleedin' culchie'!

Roffle.

Jigsaw, I lived in Belfast for a few years from the end of the 90's and I had never even considered the idea of thinking about who was Protestant and Catholic until I moved there from Dublin. I've never really heard of discrimination down here.

Most NI protestants that I know think of themselves as Irish, even if they are politically Unionist.

Macy

Fratton Fred wrote:

In Ireland I have found that whilst religion is not an issue, it is still there.

I'd agree with that. Maybe there's not discrimination among the general population, but it's still something that's mentioned, especially at times of weddings and christenings. I know people in my work who worry about how people would react to their religion, so they keep it quiet.

I want to send my kids to non-demonational schools but there is simply no realistic option especially at Primary Level. I find it appauling that state funded schools should be under so much control of the Catholic Church to the extent that in some areas they are even restricting enrolement to Catholics. I would hope that clinical needs are over riding religious belief in our hospitals these days, but it'd be interesting to see what their ethos would suggest if it was, for example, a case of Mother or Baby in our Maternity hospitals.

Speaking as a Catholic who was lucky enough to be brought up in a multi-demonational environment...

luckat

The Declaration of Independence talks about the division between a minority and the majority carefully fostered by an alien government.

At the time, the effects of this were clear throughout Ireland.

With independence, this difference became irrelevant in the Republic, because there was no advantage accruing to being either Protestant or Catholic.

In the North, the differences were still fostered, and the advantages still accrued, so naturally it makes a difference which religion you are.

It honestly gives me the creeps, the way Northerners have to know what religion you are, and the way they ask sneaky little questions - "Where did you go to school?" - "Is there a chapel in your area?" - to find out. Icky.

El Stuntman

luckat wrote:

It honestly gives me the creeps, the way Northerners have to know what religion you are, and the way they ask sneaky little questions - "Where did you go to school?" - "Is there a chapel in your area?" - to find out. Icky.

lol the ones you know must be amateurs, in my experience they can usually tell just by looking at you...("so are you a Catholic Muslim or a Protestant Muslim?")

it freaks them out a bit to meet Southern Protestants with Catholic names!

stolenwine

The person that I know who has the biggest issue with protestants is Mary-

Speaking on Morning Ireland, Mrs McAleese said of the Nazis: “They gave to their children an irrational hatred of Jews, in the same way that people in Northern Ireland transmitted to their children, an irrational outrageous hatred, for example, of Catholics, in the same way that people give to their children, an irrational outrageous hatred of those who have different colour.”

Have you ever heard her speak, she is such a spoofer, "building bridges.....blah.......*hands in circling motion" .....blah"

She has no real power whatever, she's an ex-lawyer so she knows a bit of garbled rhetoric, that's the sum of all her parts. It's boring if she dissapeared tommorow I wouldn't give one.

Jigsaw

Aaaaargh!! Just wrote a big mad post there with loads of great points only for a my computer to balls up.

Maybe it just wasn't meant to be. Will save it for later.

bringitdown

Jigsaw wrote:

Aaaaargh!! Just wrote a big mad post there with loads of great points only for a my computer to balls up.

Maybe it just wasn't meant to be. Will save it for later.

Must be one of them protestant computers.

/sorry couldn't resist

Raskolnikov

My long-term partner is a Northern Ireland Protestant and she's shocked by the tolerance between Catholics and Protestants down here.

The only problem she finds is that religious people like her parents would be offended by some of the mickey-taking that goes on here. I think it's more of an anti-religious sentiment than bigotry though.

LordSutch

As a Protestant I definately felt alienated & foreign down here back back in the 80s ~ but not any more .......................

Dunno if its because I am now much older and more thick skinned? or because our RC brothers & sisters have eased-off Catholicism? but nowadays I would give as good as I got, (if a jibe was made) and either way, to be a Protestant in 'Catholic Ireland' back in the 80s was no fun, and you either kept your head down or took the flack and married an RC ~ in which case your Childere were brought up RC anyway ~ you just couldnt win back then ...................

Not any more thankfully

pwd

I'm a protestant from south dublin and have rarely felt alienated.
I lived in Ennis for a while. I saw an Irish flag with the orange part torn off flying outside a shop. The mundanity of it made it seem so acceptable, and I was offended and felt alienated then.

Some feelings of alienation come from what other protestants have said to me - when I was young I was told that catholics have no conscience and are just animals really - which was shocking and not an idea I entertained.

Generally the only peope who have any issue with you being protestant are total idiots, and I don't mind being alienated from total idiots.

Tar.Aldarion

I doubt you would feel any prejudice at all, I only have met one professing catholic(I know of) under 50.

Jackz

I think it has reached a stage where prodestants don't feel alienated. With any insults viewed as a joke (insert retort) or from people not worth considering. The key being; the majority of people in the country realising that religion is not relevent when forming your opinion of a person.

Its positive that most young prodestants today are moving in wider social circles and not just part of a community within a community. My grandfather for example was viewed as a black sheep becasue he played gaelic football while his brothers on the other hand only really interacted with other prodestants (church,school,aggriculture,rugby).

It is probably the case that older generations felt a certain need/want to become clanish and this has resulted in a feeling of alienation for some older prodestants.

In all I think things look positive for the future.

A Dub in Glasgo

ArthurF wrote:

As a Protestant I definately felt alienated & foreign down here back back in the 80s ~ but not any more .......................

Dunno if its because I am now much older and more thick skinned? or because our RC brothers & sisters have eased-off Catholicism? but nowadays I would give as good as I got, (if a jibe was made) and either way, to be a Protestant in 'Catholic Ireland' back in the 80s was no fun, and you either kept your head down or took the flack and married an RC ~ in which case your Childere were brought up RC anyway ~ you just couldnt win back then ...................

Not any more thankfully

Maybe it was more to do with your British Unionist views rather than your religion?

LordSutch

A Dub in Glasgo wrote:

Maybe it was more to do with your British Unionist views rather than your religion?

'Ouch' ~ exactly, correct ...............

I wasnt part of that Mono-Cultural, Catholic, Gaelic Ireland of the 80s!

Very true indeed Dub, but now things are far far better and we are all allowed to have different views, Irish people are now much more broad minded, Prods are now made to feel welcome, Unionists also, and even Paisley is now seen as friend rather than foe.

But I was talking about the 1980s when if you didnt fit-in neatly to the Catholic~Gaelic~Anti Unionist~Anti prod/ Anti British picture > then you didnt fit-in 'period' as I am sure that many thousands of people who left these shores right up until the mid-90s might tell you.

I Grew-up here in the 80s.

Gobán Saor

I get really fed up when I drive from Dublin to Belfast these days. Nice new shiny motorway from Dublin almost to the border complete with spectacular bridge over the Boyne. Then a pathetic little meandering single carriageway (with some sections of dual cariageway) takes you the rest of the way.

I blame all those workshy lazy Protestants. Now if only they'd develop a proper Catholic work ethic........

A Dub in Glasgo

ArthurF wrote:

I am sure that many thousands of people who left these shores right up until the mid-90s might tell you.

I left in the early to mid 90s

I Grew-up here in the 80s.

So did I

Fratton Fred

Gob&#225 wrote: »

I get really fed up when I drive from Dublin to Belfast these days. Nice new shiny motorway from Dublin almost to the border complete with spectacular bridge over the Boyne. Then a pathetic little meandering single carriageway (with some sections of dual cariageway) takes you the rest of the way.

I blame all those workshy lazy Protestants. Now if only they'd develop a proper Catholic work ethic........

what, you mean got a load of Poles to build a new road??:D

darkman2

In answer to the question -


Do Protestants feel alienated in Ireland?

TBH I dont think ppl in this country give a flying f**k anymore what religion you are. Its about time Protestants in the North came to grips with that fact. Of course they mentally are still in the 1600's. Completely detached from reality.

El Stuntman

darkman2 wrote:

TBH I dont think ppl in this country give a flying f**k anymore what religion you are. Its about time Protestants in the North came to grips with that fact. Of course they mentally are still in the 1600's. Completely detached from reality.

ahem, could I respectfully suggest that there those on both 'sides' in the North who could be described as being mentally still in the 1600s?

bigotry and sectarianism isn't an exclusively Protestant thing you know!

Zambia

Gob&#225 wrote: »

I get really fed up when I drive from Dublin to Belfast these days. Nice new shiny motorway from Dublin almost to the border complete with spectacular bridge over the Boyne. Then a pathetic little meandering single carriageway (with some sections of dual cariageway) takes you the rest of the way.

Hey steady on its being built , and I think you guys are paying for a bit of it too .... cheers

odonnell

This is an interesting thing to think about, and its intriguing to see peoples experiences from different backgrounds.

I was brought up protestant until about the age of 12 when i rejected it. Im from Glasgow and now I have lived in dublin for a grand total of a little under 3 years. Ive never had problems living here regarding my religion (im NOT christian) and ive never been denied anything because of who i am, where im from, what i believe etc.... but what i DO find, is that people are very ready to make broad assumptions based on what they know about you. Its very surprising how much people think they know about you based on your accent.

For example:

I have a Glasgow ccent - i live in dublin - i must be a Celtic fan? Wrong
I have a glasgow accent - i live in dublin - im a catholic? Wrong
Im Scottish, NOT a celtic fan... i must be a hibs fan and a catholic - Wrong
Ok, so im a Rangers fan, From Glasgow - i MUST be a protestant - WRONG

Ok...so where were we again? My Name is O'Donnell...sure...i must be from up north? Wrong. O'Donnell - your family is Catholic? Wrong.... yadda yadda yadda.... lots of things that are assumed and not necessarily true, but worryingly theyre all about relgion or political persuasion.

In Dunnes one time, a guy tried to start a fight with me because he heard my accent - said i was British Scum...and that i should eff off back to the motherland because this is HIS country - fair enough, i couldnt argue with that. Just a shame we werent in Glasgow when he said that i thought to myself...

So there are a lot of things people ASSUME about you based on very few details. But as far as life goes here in Dublin, I havent found myself to be held back at all, nor have i found people really give a damn no matter what you are or where youre from. Theyre just ignorant enough to ASSUME things rather than ask you outright... no harm though.

Mick86

Fratton Fred wrote:

Try being a divorced English Protestant, then try marrying an Irish Catholic girl in a Catholic church. The poor old Priest had to have holy water sprinkled on him to get over the shock.

I attended a C of I service on a few occasions. When the Rector's wife was told I was a Catholic SHE looked like she wanted to sprinkle me with holy water or the Protestant equivalent.:D

El Stuntman wrote:

There have been some strange moments though such as the day the Pope came to to town and all my childhood friends headed off to the Phoenix Park to see him and I wasn't allowed!

Why?

El Stuntman wrote:

Wondering what to do when the rosary is being said at a funeral (why do they say it so fast?).

You should think aboutsomething else until it's all over, thats what I do. They say it so fast because it's tedious and boring and they want to get it over with.

Anyway Catholics or nominal catholics will have to get more tolerant because there's lots of odd religious buildings cropping up about the place.

El Stuntman

Mick86 wrote:

Why?

I think my parents were afraid I might be torn limb from limb by the raving hordes of Catholic pilgrims

I dunno - maybe because he's not my spiritual leader? It would be like heading off to Tehran to check out the Ayatollah's latest moves...

RalphCifaretto

DublinWriter wrote:

You're hitting several nails on several heads there, Jigsaw.

Many people think loyalist means Protestant and nationalist means Catholic, but it's not always the case. Consider some of the people nationalists consider to be heros - Wolfe Tone, Robert Emmet, Roger Casement, Douglas Hyde, James Connolly - they were all Protestants.
.

James Connolly was catholic.

O'Leprosy

His wife, Lily Reynolds , was a Protestant. Incidentally, Padraig Pearse's father, James Pearse, was English, don't know what his religion was.

RalphCifaretto

O'Leprosy wrote:

His wife, Lily Reynolds , was a Protestant. Incidentally, Padraig Pearse's father, James Pearse, was English, don't know what his religion was.

I was fully aware of all those completely irrelevent facts cheers.

SarahSassy

I went to a mixed school and there was never any issue.

My name is a 'typical' protestant surname and people generally consider that I am CoI even though I am Catholic. Not that thats anything to do with the price of butter but thought Id throw it in

I guess I have had some less than pleasant experiences in recent years directed at the Catholic religion... I have heard some truly ignorant statements from some (supposedly) adult Church of Ireland people about the Catholic religion / practices - one particularily ignorant comment was relating to Catholic funerals where they stated we bury people while they are still warm. I put that down to the ignorant individuals involved. These individuals also stated they would not let a Catholic mind their children. These were born and raised southern CoI women in their early thirties. More recently a friends family didnt want him to marry a Catholic girl as his brother already had and they wanted some CoI grandchildren....

I also see in the financial services industry, in certain northern banks, that there tends to be a 'boys club' in place whereby CoI people tend to get the promotions whether deserved or not. I think this is less evident (but still there) now but was blatent up to 8 / 10 years ago...

Dont get me wrong and think I that I am negative towards CoI - I have friends and family who are CoI and its also in my blood. I do sometimes wonder is there prejudice from the CoI community towards Catholics.... Just throwing it out there to see what people think as I am no expert on the topic but its something I have been curious about for years.

However, I have to say I think both religions have taken 2nd place to the new religion in Ireland - MONEY

El Stuntman

SarahSassy wrote:

I guess I have had some less than pleasant experiences in recent years directed at the Catholic religion... I have heard some truly ignorant statements from some (supposedly) adult Church of Ireland people about the Catholic religion / practices - one particularily ignorant comment was relating to Catholic funerals where they stated we bury people while they are still warm. I put that down to the ignorant individuals involved. These individuals also stated they would not let a Catholic mind their children. These were born and raised southern CoI women in their early thirties. More recently a friends family didnt want him to marry a Catholic girl as his brother already had and they wanted some CoI grandchildren....

I also see in the financial services industry, in certain northern banks, that there tends to be a 'boys club' in place whereby CoI people tend to get the promotions whether deserved or not. I think this is less evident (but still there) now but was blatent up to 8 / 10 years ago...

Dont get me wrong and think I that I am negative towards CoI - I have friends and family who are CoI and its also in my blood. I do sometimes wonder is there prejudice from the CoI community towards Catholics.... Just throwing it out there to see what people think as I am no expert on the topic but its something I have been curious about for years.

I don't think that you can extrapolate from this that there is a general anti-Catholic bias amongst the entire protestant community. Maybe if anything, it goes to show that stupid, ignorant and uneducated people will always be amongst us (such as your 30-something lady friends).
Certainly if you go into a CoI church, you will find a warm welcome there whatever your religion - Catholics are invited to take communion there but the same invitation does not apply to Protestants in Catholic churches. Food for thought?

RalphCifaretto

El Stuntman wrote:

Certainly if you go into a CoI church, you will find a warm welcome there whatever your religion - Catholics are invited to take communion there but the same invitation does not apply to Protestants in Catholic churches. Food for thought?

I'm not catholic, or a fan of catholicism, but that seems fairly reasonable to me. For someone who doesn't believe in transubstation to consume the host is fairly disrespectful and I'd imagine would constitute a "sin".

I suppose the same should go for the mongos who dredge along to mass every sunday with absolutely no faith whatsoever but happily plod up for communion.

biko

El Stuntman wrote:

Certainly if you go into a CoI church, you will find a warm welcome there whatever your religion - Catholics are invited to take communion there but the same invitation does not apply to Protestants in Catholic churches. Food for thought?

Why should it be? CoI is a mixed church for Protestants as well as Catholics.

A catholic church is not mixed. Nor are Presbyterian churches. I went it to a church in Derry to light a candle for my father. They don't do that there, it was a Protestant church. No harm, I just went down the street to a church where you can light candles.

El Stuntman

biko wrote:

Why should it be? CoI is a mixed church for Protestants as well as Catholics.

what??? I must have missed that meeting!

no seriously, please check your facts....

biko

El Stuntman wrote:

what??? I must have missed that meeting!

no seriously, please check your facts....

Don't worry, here are the notes:

Is the Church of Ireland Protestant or Catholic?

It is both Protestant and Catholic. For this reason it is incorrect to refer to members of the Church of Ireland as 'non-Catholic'.

The terms Protestant and Catholic are not really opposites.

http://www.ireland.anglican.org/index.php?do=about&id=103
From CoI own website. You seen it?

El Stuntman

maybe you should have read further down the page....my italics

What is the difference between the Church of Ireland and the Roman Catholic Church?
The chief difference is that one Church is under the jurisdiction of the Pope and the other is not. This results in certain importance differences of belief and practice. However, it should be noted that the beliefs and practices held in common greatly outweigh those that separate the two Churches.

The Roman Catholic Church teaches that the Pope has, by divine right, jurisdiction over the universal Church, and that in certain circumstances his utterances are infallible. The Church of Ireland does not accept either of these teachings, and resists the claim of the Pope to rule over and speak for the universal Church.
Furthermore the Roman Catholic Church teaches that belief in the Immaculate Conception of the Blessed Virgin Mary, and in her Corporal assumption, are necessary for salvation. These beliefs had for a long time been widespread in Catholic Christendom, but were regarded with varying degrees of certainty. However, within the last hundred and fifty years, the Roman catholic Church has pronounced them to be necessary for salvation.

The Church of Ireland teaches that neither Holy Scripture, nor the understanding of the Scriptures by the early Fathers of the Church, support these doctrines.

The Church of Ireland, as a Reformed and Protestant Church, doth hereby re-affirm its constant witness against all those innovations in doctrine and worship whereby the Primitive faith hath been from time to time defaced or overlaid, and which at the Reformation this Church did disown and reject.