Wheat beers?

um7y1h83ge06nx

Firstly, I'm not as much as a connoisseur as you guys are when it comes to alcohol, so pardon the ignorance!

Anyways, what's your view on wheat beers? I have a fondness for Erdinger, but think it's quite expensive. Cheapest I have seen it is in Tesco for €2.51 for a 500ml bottle. Any cheaper/better alternatives?

Remember buying some cans (€1.29) that Lidl had to celebrate Oktoberfest, a Fink Brau brand of wheat beer. Was actually decent enough, not as nice as Erdinger though.

Seems to be a huge lack of choice in this type of beer in this country.

Thanks!

noby

Erdinger is probably the most well known, and popular. Lovely on a hot summer afternoon.
€2.50 isn't a bad price in comparison to other imported bottles. Tesco's own brand wheat beer is also a good one, but I don't know the price.

happy_acid_face

Any good off licence should stock a few extra wheat beers.

Here's some names to look out for....

Franziskaner - Possibly the most known wheat beer next to Erdinger. Slighty heavier beer. (Dark and gold label with a monk on the front)

Schofferhoffer - Lighter beer so easier to drink more off. I find wheat beers can be quite heavy leaving you feeling very full after a couple. (Bright orange label)

Weinstephaner - One of my favourites. Full of flavour and is one of oldest breweries in the world. (Blue and white label)

Paulaner - Another one of the most well known wheat beers. Very good. (Cream coloured label)

Bishcoff - Lesser known but still a good wheat beer. (Light brown label with a building on the front, i think!)

All of the above are German Breweries that produce wheat beers. But, these brands do also produce clear (Kristal), dark (Dunkel), and other versions also. Check the label has "weissbier" on it or just hold the bottle up to the light to see if its cloudy.
McHughs on the Killbarrack and Malahide Road stock all of the above, and more. They all retail around the 2.50 mark but Scofferhoffer, Franziskaner and Weinstephaner fall under the Mix and match offer we have. This means they are €2.50 each or five for €10 and mix in together with other beers on the same deal. As far other shops go, i know most O'Briens should have a couple of Weissbier's in stock. World beers, weissbier in particular, have become very popular and nearly every off licence i've been in over the last year has had one or two. Now you know the names, you should find them easy to find! But if you're ever in doubt just ask the staff. I'm sure they'll point you in the right direction. Hope that helps!

happy_acid_face

Also worth mentioning is Belgian White beers. Hoegarrden and Kronenberg Blanc would be two examples. They're are made pretty much the same idea but are alot lighter than the german ones. The flavours can be very in you're face too. If you've ever read a discription of a beer and though "what a load of bull!", try the Kronenberg Blanc and i bet you'll taste pineapple! The Hoegarrden has a very noticable cinnamon taste too!

(German Weissbier uses at least 50% wheat, where as Belgian white beer uses a 50 50 mix and then use cinnamon, cloves, etc to add more in your face flavours)

um7y1h83ge06nx

Thanks for that lads, think some sampling is in order!

Good overview there happy_acid_face. Think I'll print that and stick it in the back pocket whenever I go on my next visit to a decent off licence.

happy_acid_face

no probs, happy to help!

Zaph

There's also at least one irish wheat beer, Curim, brewed by the Carlow Brewing Company. It's a clear rather than cloudy beer, and is fairly easy to come by in supermarkets. It's not in the same league as the German beers, but it's tasty enough and worth a try.

rubadub

Emory Plain Seesaw wrote:

I have a fondness for Erdinger, but think it's quite expensive. Cheapest I have seen it is in Tesco for €2.51 for a 500ml bottle. Any cheaper/better alternatives?

expensive relative to what? your erdinger is €5.02 per litre and is 5.3%.
Most bottles of heineken etc are more than €5.02 per litre (i.e. more than €1.66 per 330ml bottle). and most are under 4.5%.

The main cost of drink is the duty and this is directly related to the %, so the erdinger is usually very good value, even moreso in pubs. Order a pint glass of erdinger and you usually get over a pint since the glass is larger than 1 pint.

um7y1h83ge06nx

rubadub wrote:

expensive relative to what? your erdinger is €5.02 per litre and is 5.3%.
Most bottles of heineken etc are more than €5.02 per litre (i.e. more than €1.66 per 330ml bottle). and most are under 4.5%.

The main cost of drink is the duty and this is directly related to the %, so the erdinger is usually very good value, even moreso in pubs. Order a pint glass of erdinger and you usually get over a pint since the glass is larger than 1 pint.

Well, I'm still trying to get out of my student ways of considering standard fare to be whatever was 6 for €7! Remember going through heaps of Carlsberg Export in 2nd year as Dunnes kept having great offers on slabs of it. Then in 4th year getting boxes of Miller bottles.

And of course what was the nicest of the 6 for 7 beers was a big argument among us at the time. We finally settled on this, from best to worst; Prazky, Tuborg, Dutch Gold, Amsterdam.

But thinking about it, something like Erdinger doesn't work out to be too expensive and it is definitely a lot nicer than Dutch Gold!

rubadub

I'm still trying to get out of my student ways of considering standard fare to be whatever was 6 for €7!

Yep, I used to have all the cans calculated, how much "bang per buck", in my day it was cider since the tax wasnt as bad then, or royal dutch since it was 5%.

If you do that with the likes of erdinger it is actually very cheap. I was drinking in paired rounds with a mate of mine in town. In one pub it was over €10 for 2 drinks and he was moaning at me for drinking "expensive" pints of erdinger. My pint was €5.10, his 330ml bottle of heineken was €5. Mine had over 568mlx5.3%=3010 "units", while his has 330mlx4.3%=1419 "units". So my expensive pint has over twice the alcohol than his bottle, never mind the better quality.
You can do this with any pints, if an erdinger is 5.3% €5.30 then it is the same price alcohol wise as a pint of standard 4.3% lager at €4.30. But usually these days a pint of lager is more than €4.30 and an erdinger is less than €5.30

Frankiestylee

Oh I love Bischof... I haven't had it in a while but I called it Malteser Brau ... cause it's got a nice maltyness to it.

Some other names you might see around the place that fit the bill : Schneiderweiss, Flensburger and Weltenburg ... though the Flensburger is normally overpriced for what it is because it's got a swing top.

Definitly give Weihanstephaner and Bischoff a try, they're lovely. Franzi has a bit of a weird taste that some people don't like.
Also, if you're all about more taste then go for the Dunkel variety of most of the Weiss biers, they're yum.

Is Radeberger a weiss beer? I forget what it's like.

Kronenberg blanc is a bit mank (oh it rhymes) if the German bad boys are your thing. There are much better Belgian wheat beers to tickle your taste buds, I dunno what the K Blanc is doing, but it's most certainly not being tasty.

rediguana

Is Leffe (blonde) a wheat beer? It's great stuff. Forget the cost, it's just a beer, it won't break the bank.

oblivious

rediguana wrote:

Is Leffe (blonde) a wheat beer? It's great stuff. Forget the cost, it's just a beer, it won't break the bank.

nope, its an Belgian abbey style beer

carrotcake

Frankiestylee wrote:

Is Radeberger a weiss beer? I forget what it's like.

nah, it's a pils. nice stuff.

gotta love living in germany

Frankiestylee

carrotcake wrote:

nah, it's a pils. nice stuff.

gotta love living in germany

I'm gonna have to shoot somebody in work then. I had the German beers arranged into weiss beers and non weiss beers ... then I took a few days off and it's all gone mental! We're talking two rows of Becks and no Franziskaner to be seen!

happy_acid_face

since were on the subject, drinking a new wheat beer right now. Sierra Nevada Wheat Beer... Not as bad as i thought an American wheat beer would be. Quite refreshing but not as flavoursome. Worth a try though!

oblivious

America wheat beers dont have the banana and clove phenols that is assoicate with the German hefeweizen, some are fermetnion with a standard ale yeast


It would be worth a try, where is it on sale?

happy_acid_face

Mchughs on the Killbarrack road have it but it's new to the irish market so i wouldn't be surprised to see it pop up in more off licences coming into the summer.

(It's not like German wheat beers who use at least 50% wheat in their weissbier, more like a belgian with a 50 50 ratio so it ends up quite light rather than the heavy german ones)

dcarroll

Emory Plain Seesaw wrote:

Well, I'm still trying to get out of my student ways of considering standard fare to be whatever was 6 for €7! Remember going through heaps of Carlsberg Export in 2nd year as Dunnes kept having great offers on slabs of it. Then in 4th year getting boxes of Miller bottles.

And of course what was the nicest of the 6 for 7 beers was a big argument among us at the time. We finally settled on this, from best to worst; Prazky, Tuborg, Dutch Gold, Amsterdam.

But thinking about it, something like Erdinger doesn't work out to be too expensive and it is definitely a lot nicer than Dutch Gold!

bavaria by a country mile

rubadub

carrotcake wrote:

Originally Posted by Frankiestylee
Is Radeberger a weiss beer? I forget what it's like

nah, it's a pils. nice stuff.

gotta love living in germany

I am not saying it is a wheat beer, but it could possibly have been a wheatbeer brewed pilsner style. I think pilsner only refers to brewing technique rather than ingredients. Just like you could lager a wheatbeer, is that then a wheatbeer, or lager?

I find it odd there are so many names for variations of "normal" beer, yet wheatbeer get lumbered under the same umbrella. Or do they have many different named types. I mean you could have a wheatbeer that tasted like weak budweiser, or a stout.

jester77

Augustiner and Maisels are 2 of my favourites, worth checking out!

If your thinking of sampling it would be almost worth your while to come over for a week! What you'd save in the price of the beer would cover the cost of the flight!

oblivious

rubadub wrote:

I am not saying it is a wheat beer, but it could possibly have been a wheatbeer brewed pilsner style. I think pilsner only refers to brewing technique rather than ingredients. Just like you could lager a wheatbeer, is that then a wheatbeer, or lager?

I find it odd there are so many names for variations of "normal" beer, yet wheatbeer get lumbered under the same umbrella. Or do they have many different named types. I mean you could have a wheatbeer that tasted like weak budweiser, or a stout.

No, pilsner is a style on to its self, defined by the malt, hops and especially the water used. You can larger any beer if you want, duvel is give a lagering period and Baltic porter are some times made with larger yeast, but wheat beers are meant to be consumed fresh and young. Lagering when done properly takes months and would take away for the beer. Some consider a lighter version as crystal or America wheat beer, but if you want a bigger one you could try a Weizenbock like Aventinus.

Home brewers do brew wheat stouts, but I suspect that the flavor is nearly all swamped with the roasted malt in the beer.

There are number of different stouts around Irish dry (Guinness), sweet, oatmeal, imperial, foreign, American and not including the range of porters that are available. But asked people what is stout they usually name Guinness!

rubadub

oblivious wrote:

No, pilsner is a style on to its self, defined by the malt, hops and especially the water used.

I thought the main distinguishing factor of pilsner is that it is usually brewed to almost complete dryness. I remember miller brought out their "miller lite" here years back and had to rename it "miller pilsner", since no lads would be seen dead drinking "lite" beer, just like we now have 7-up free, coke zero, & pepsi max. It was only 4.2% and most pilsners I have had are over 5%.

Have you any good links about beer varieties.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pilsner only mentioned "pale malts"

oblivious

A lot of “beers” clam to be Pilsner’s , but are bear no relationship to the original , Miller and there kind are generally describe as America pilsner. Pilsner Urquell is brewer with very soft water, softer than any of the major brewing cites and which allows the delicate sazz hops to come out. Water with high bicarbonate (temporary hardness) can bring out harshness in the hops. German Pilsner’ on the other hand are generaly dryer than their Bohemian counterparts.
Here are some interesting articles


http://www.london-porter.com/

http://www.india-pale-ale.com/

http://www.allaboutbeer.com/features/lager.html

http://www.allaboutbeer.com/features/231russianstout.html

http://www.allaboutbeer.com/features/mild.html

guildofevil

There are many beers which are fermented to a good degree of dryness. Some are not even lagers let alone Pilsners.

Orval, for example, uses a top fermenting ale yeast to ferment their beer to a pretty dry state, then they use Brettanomyces in the bottle to attenuate it even further.

A Pilsner is simply a style of lager characterised by grain choice, hop choice, water chemistry and brewing techniques. It is a dry style, but it is not the only dry style.

Imposter

oblivious wrote:

but if you want a bigger one you could try a Weizenbock like Aventinus.

I must try that stuff at some stage before i'm drunk. Someone landed a crate of it in after we had finished a keg of guinness and a keg of beer and it tasted ok, but to be honest dishwater could have probably tasted ok too at that stage! It did have the effect of ended the party though as those that were relatively sober up to then, weren't so sober afterwards.

oblivious

Imposter wrote:

I must try that stuff at some stage before i'm drunk. Someone landed a crate of it in after we had finished a keg of guinness and a keg of beer and it tasted ok, but to be honest dishwater could have probably tasted ok too at that stage! It did have the effect of ended the party though as those that were relatively sober up to then, weren't so sober afterwards.

Its deceptive coming in at 8%, I have a few bleary nites on it, but there Eisbock kicks in at 12%! :eek:

happy_acid_face

rubadub wrote:

I am not saying it is a wheat beer, but it could possibly have been a wheatbeer brewed pilsner style. I think pilsner only refers to brewing technique rather than ingredients. Just like you could lager a wheatbeer, is that then a wheatbeer, or lager?

I find it odd there are so many names for variations of "normal" beer, yet wheatbeer get lumbered under the same umbrella. Or do they have many different named types. I mean you could have a wheatbeer that tasted like weak budweiser, or a stout.

Heres a very basic description of what the differences are. At the start, beer as we know it now was very different. The basic ingredints of beer are water, malt, hops, barley and yeast. Most beer was dark in colour and unfiltered and tended to be more similar to ales, porters and stout. Pilzner was the style that changed all this. It was invented in the town of Pilsen, Chech Republic an was made by changing the way the beer was brewed. Originally beer was top fermented which gave its darkness. By using bottom fermenting yeasts and cooler casks the result was a much clearer beer.

A Wheat Beer is made with the same basic ingredients only a high poportion of wheat is added. It is mostly top fermented, its the law to do so in Germany, and comes with a good few of its own styles. Firstly, the two main varities are the German "Weissbier" and the Belgian "Witbier".
German Weissbier is made using at least 50% malted wheat when brewing but it is not uncommon to use as much as 80%. The result is a Heavy, full on flavoured beer. This type of beer also has its own sub styles, the most common in Ireland being Hefe-Weissbier, Kristal and Dunkel. Hefe-Weissbier is the cloudy beer that most of us have seen. The Kristal is a clear filtered version and the Dunkel verson being the dark one.
Belgian Witbier uses up to 50% unmalted wheat in its brewing which leaves it with a lighter body. It also uses various other additives such as cloves, corriander and orange peel to inhance the flavour.
Finally, the term "Larger" is used as a blanket to cover most different styles of beer

kenmc

happy_acid_face wrote:

The basic ingredints of beer are water, malt, hops, barley and yeast.

Erm, malt is the result of processing the barley - it's called 'malting'. i.e. malt is barley. So the golden 4 ingredients, in the famous German Reinheitsgebot, were yeast, barley, hops and water

Hefe-Weissbier is the cloudy beer that most of us have seen.

Hefe is the german for 'yeast', so that is why it is cloudy, there is yeast floating in the beer. A fantastic source of vitamin b6, and useful in the body for processing alcohol. you will usually experience less hangovers as a result of yeast-beer.

Finally, the term "Larger" is used as a blanket to cover most different styles of beer

Nope, 'Larger' is a term used to define something of being of a bigger size than something else . 'Lager' on the other hand is the process in which the beer is laid to condition in a cold environment, typically around 5 degrees. The process is called 'lagering' and is used as a means to self-filter the beer. Usually a 'lager yeast' (as opposed to an ale yeast) would be used, as most ale yeasts stop working at those cold temperatures, whereas lager yeasts are designed for the cold. Almost any style of beer can be laid to lager, in theory.

oblivious

kenmc wrote:

Erm, malt is the result of processing the barley - it's called 'malting'. So the golden 4 ingredients, in the famous German Reinheitsgebot, were yeast, barley, hops and water.

Reinheitsgebot is a bit of a con, it was orignaly a charter developed by the Bavarian nobility as they held the monopoly on malted barley. Thus to keep the money coming in and prevent non malted cereals been use the Reinheitsgebot was developed. Malted wheat was exempted as wheat beers were originally the preserve of the nobility. But over the years it has been modified, yeast was not in the originally as it was a few centuries till it was discovered to the agent that fermented the beer.

But not to say it has helped to keep the mega swills from crushing some truly wonderful beers!

kenmc

oblivious wrote:

But not to say it has helped to keep the mega swills from crushing some truly wonderful beers!

Definitely!

happy_acid_face

kenmc wrote:

Erm, malt is the result of processing the barley - it's called 'malting'. i.e. malt is barley. So the golden 4 ingredients, in the famous German Reinheitsgebot, were yeast, barley, hops and water

Appologies, as you can see i post after work, which tends to be long hours and late nights. Malt wasn't ment to be in there. sorry, i was tired. Sure i started talking about unmalted and malted wheat after...

Hefe is the german for 'yeast', so that is why it is cloudy, there is yeast floating in the beer. A fantastic source of vitamin b6, and useful in the body for processing alcohol. you will usually experience less hangovers as a result of yeast-beer.

As i said very basic description. I knew what heffe stood for, just wasn't going into detail

Nope, 'Larger' is a term used to define something of being of a bigger size than something else . 'Lager' on the other hand is the process in which the beer is laid to condition in a cold environment, typically around 5 degrees. The process is called 'lagering' and is used as a means to self-filter the beer. Usually a 'lager yeast' (as opposed to an ale yeast) would be used, as most ale yeasts stop working at those cold temperatures, whereas lager yeasts are designed for the cold. Almost any style of beer can be laid to lager, in theory.

I was wrong in what i wrote "Finally, the term "Lager" is used as a blanket to cover most different styles of beer". I ment to say "can" be used as a blanket.... Just tired. Writing fast, wanted bed, typo's and words wrong all over the place...