KK- Ace on Flop

AmarilloFats

1/2



Villain is 38vpip/27pfr over 80 hands.
Only at table a few hands
1 limper, villain makes it $10, I make it $40 with KsK in the cut off
Villain calls

Flop A 2s 4s (pot 82)

Villain checks. I have 160

I bet $55, Villain covers and goes all in. I call.

Thoughts

Flushdraw

What hand did you put him on when you called??

phantom_lord

ugh

phantom_lord

Flushdraw wrote:

What hand did you put him on when you called??

flushdraw

AmarilloFats

WEll I bet an amount that I thought He would think his all would have fold equity.
I put him on AX, QQ JJ TT 99 88 77 66 55 44 33 22 , other random sh!t a small% of the time

Maybe a flush draw but rarely.

I decided I should not give up on the flop (check fold) to a player with his stats.
A pot sized bet commits me and wouold make a bluff from him less likely so I bet 55 into the 80.

sikes

AmarilloFats wrote:

wouold make a bluff from him less likely

great move

valor

dont bet the flop

phantom_lord

AmarilloFats wrote:

WEll I bet an amount that I thought He would think his all would have fold equity.
I put him on AX, QQ JJ TT 99 88 77 66 55 44 33 22 , other random sh!t a small% of the time

Maybe a flush draw but rarely.

I decided I should not give up on the flop (check fold) to a player with his stats.
A pot sized bet commits me and wouold make a bluff from him less likely so I bet 55 into the 80.

you could just check behind, and call him down on the turn/river if u expect him to bluff it.

cooker3

Check is good, if he bluffs a bit then call him down.

opr

Déjà vu

Opr

AmarilloFats

sikes wrote:

great move

Heads up for $1000?sikes?

thats why I DID not bet that amount!!! I said a full pot bet Would make a bluff from him less likely...So I Bet 55 into 80

I posted a hand that I was:

1. not happy with my play.
2.unsure of the best way to proceed post flop


So if I check flop what size bet do I call turn??

sikes

AmarilloFats wrote:

Heads up for $1000?sikes?

LOL. If only I had the roll.

i misread your post, regardless, any bet on that flop is stupid.

You seem happy to stack off in the hand, so let him do the betting which is highly likely.

AmarilloFats

sikes wrote:

LOL. If only I had the roll.

Dinero facile for you!

sikes wrote:

any bet on that flop is stupid.

I think ur right

good luck with your roll building

sikes

AmarilloFats wrote:

good luck with your roll building

So you are playing 1/2 and are rolled for 1k$ heads up games?

Captain Tom

i think this forum can do without these 2+2 style hu for rolls challenges tbh.if you cant take someone disagreeing with the way you played a hand then dont post it in the first place.

phantom_lord

esp. when u bet a A high flop and call an all-in with KK

Goodluck2me

Captain Tom wrote:

i think this forum can do without these 2+2 style hu for rolls challenges tbh.if you cant take someone disagreeing with the way you played a hand then dont post it in the first place.

STFU - Heads up for rolls? $5+.50 on PPP NOW!:D

Captain Tom

goodluck2me wrote:

STFU - Heads up for rolls? $5+.50 on PPP NOW!:D

lolol.you're outta your league,im a $10+1 sng baller.

phantom_lord

one time on uber tilt I 4-tabled micro limits shoving every hand, one guy got all abusive so I challenged him hu for rolls, he sat down at .5/1 with $20

LuckyLloyd

This post has been deleted.

Goodluck2me

Captain Tom wrote:

lolol.you're outta your league,im a $10+1 sng baller.

dang!

AmarilloFats

Captain Tom wrote:

i think this forum can do without these 2+2 style hu for rolls challenges tbh.if you cant take someone disagreeing with the way you played a hand then dont post it in the first place.

shurrup I wass messing. and he did not disagree, he misread, and quoted out of context in an acerbic manner.

pok3rplaya

don't bet that flop.

Gholimoli

You say that a full pot bet would commit you to the pot and would make a bluff less likely from him and that’s why you only bet $55.
But you called an all in from him any way !
Why did you call if you were not committed as judging by your own words the $55 was designed not to make you commit?
In any case what you said does not make sense,you are speaking of him bluffing and you not committing .
This cant happen.
If your bet was designed to induce a bluff then you must call and calling is the proper play and if your bet was to stop a bluff then you should have folded.
As others have said I think betting is not good here.
If you had TT,JJ,QQ a bet would have been fine but not with kk.

ianmc38

phantom_lord wrote:

one time on uber tilt I 4-tabled micro limits shoving every hand, one guy got all abusive so I challenged him hu for rolls, he sat down at .5/1 with $20

Hope you hit and ran after taking half.

AmarilloFats

Gholimoli wrote:

If you had TT,JJ,QQ a bet would have been fine but not with kk.

why?

Gholimoli

AmarilloFats wrote:

why?

In a raised pot and A high flop you are either way ahead with KK or way behind generally.
As such it’s often good to go in to a passive mode like check calling.
Your hand generally doesn’t need protection.

With TT,JJ and to a less degree QQ you also need to protect your hand against over cards.
Even though your opponent may already have the A,there still a good chance he may for example have KQ v your TT,JJ.as such you need to bet to protect against over cards.
Basically with KK on A high flop you are not that worried about giving free cards but with TT, JJ, QQ you should be.

Flushdraw

Gholimoli wrote:

You say that a full pot bet would commit you to the pot and would make a bluff less likely from him and that’s why you only bet $55.
But you called an all in from him any way !
Why did you call if you were not committed as judging by your own words the $55 was designed not to make you commit?

I think u miss his point Gholi. He's speaking from the villains point of view in this hand. He wants the villain to bluff the pot but if he bets 80, he thinks there is little chance of the villain coming over the top because he feels amarillo will be commited to call but if the bet was only 55, the villain may feel that he could push amarillo off the hand with an allin push.

I think Amirillo is saying that either way, he's willing to put all his chips in the pot on the flop

Marq

Flushdraw wrote:

I think Amirillo is saying that either way, he's willing to put all his chips in the pot on the flop

which is a decision he seems to have made without any extra info about his opponents hand at all.

Ian made a good post that relates well to this situation in the JJ/QQ donkament/cash game thread.

Rnger

If you look at this from the villains pov...

Amarillo's 3bet preflop indicates a big pair or AK (or 67s the odd time). An A flopped making it LESS likely he has AK and means a high pair lower than AA is more likely. The $55 looks like a c-bet with precisely what he has, and should fold to a raise.

The problem with this is that the villian actually does have an A here most of the time here and isnt making a move

phantom_lord

if i think my opponent has ak, and there's an a on the flop, I usually expect to be behind and wouldn't shove on a bluff.

handsfree

maybe i'm reading this wrong but i'd call here alot.

PF the villian might not want to look like he'll fold to a reraise everytime

on the flop. the 55 bet looks like a continuation and if you had AA you'd probably check so he might be happy if he has QQ or JJ or even 10 10.

Bandana boy

I think that a player who is 38/17 necesarily call 3 bets of 40 quid with nothing so an Ace is very likely in his range here
I would not be trying to induce a bluff here by betting out and I dont think having invested 40 pre flop that we need to commit our 160 either

Betting out 55-65 is not terrible as we are representing our AK we need to fold to action though
If you think he will bluff a lot then check call is probably better and keeps the pot a little more under control

Trampas

So what did he turn over??

AmarilloFats

alot of good advise here thanks.
I felt 2 things happened when the ace flops
1. he could he made a pair of aces
2. i don't ( usually) get much value from what i felt were the bulk of his range ie PP's 88+

3. u don't wanna play a big pot here 'cause if u do ur losing


If I had of checked behind on the flop and called his turn bet (40 -55)
he would given up on river(without ace or set)..I think this is default play

but I felt he had a PP preflop. and I went with my read and played it to extract value from wot i felt his range wass

but He had A9 and i made me look reall goodt

David Michael

AmarilloFats wrote:

alot of good advise here thanks.
I felt 2 things happened when the ace flops
1. he could he made a pair of aces
2. i don't ( usually) get much value from what i felt were the bulk of his range ie PP's 88+

3. u don't wanna play a big pot here 'cause if u do ur losing


If I had of checked behind on the flop and called his turn bet (40 -55)
he would given up on river(without ace or set)..I think this is default play

but I felt he had a PP preflop. and I went with my read and played it to extract value from wot i felt his range wass

but He had A9 and i made me look reall goodt

Some times it is just hard to lay down JJ+ Even with that A/K on the flop.

But I think with enough smacking of mine head against the wall.. it will sink in I can do it if I feel the villan is playing a flush draw with a helpfull suited flop... but an A or K with JJ/QQ.... hard.

But it is a fuk'd up game at times.

/Goes of to invent David $$$'s to feel better.... not that I am bitter that my JJ just got busto by an floped A...

Tar.Aldarion

Similar just happened to me.
I have JJ
He raise 5k preflop and I call.
Flop A24
He goes all in.
I fold, he shows 33.
Running it over in my head about whether I should have folded or not.

Ace2007

let me get this right - u bet $40 pre flop and got 1 caller. is this pot limit or no limit?? regardless of what game it is....

when the flop came A 2 4 ( 2 spades) - why did u only bet $55 - surely if u had the intention of calling any raise he made - u would bet the pot - about $85 - otherwise it imo shows that u don't have an ace.. and therefore his raise was a good move - since most ppl would fold after betting only $55.

if u only betted $55 in the hope that he would raise on a bluff- then u deserved to lost the pot- since there was a fd and sd on the board..

btw what did he have and what was the turn/river - u win/lose/split pot

phantom_lord

Ace2007 wrote:

let me get this right - u bet $40 pre flop and got 1 caller. is this pot limit or no limit?? regardless of what game it is....

when the flop came A 2 4 ( 2 spades) - why did u only bet $55 - surely if u had the intention of calling any raise he made - u would bet the pot - about $85 - otherwise it imo shows that u don't have an ace.. and therefore his raise was a good move - since most ppl would fold after betting only $55.

if u only betted $55 in the hope that he would raise on a bluff- then u deserved to lost the pot- since there was a fd and sd on the board..

btw what did he have and what was the turn/river - u win/lose/split pot

lol

fuzzbox

Ace2007 wrote:

let me get this right - u bet $40 pre flop and got 1 caller. is this pot limit or no limit?? regardless of what game it is....

when the flop came A 2 4 ( 2 spades) - why did u only bet $55 - surely if u had the intention of calling any raise he made - u would bet the pot - about $85 - otherwise it imo shows that u don't have an ace.. and therefore his raise was a good move - since most ppl would fold after betting only $55.

if u only betted $55 in the hope that he would raise on a bluff- then u deserved to lost the pot- since there was a fd and sd on the board..

btw what did he have and what was the turn/river - u win/lose/split pot

Whats a matter you, eh?
Whaddya think you do, eh?
Its a not so bad,
Its a nicea place,
Ah shaddapaya face.

Lafortezza

On Topic plz. Helpful replies only plz. Don't turn off my luckbox plz.

Captain Tom

fuzzbox wrote:

Whats a matter you, eh?
Whaddya think you do, eh?
Its a not so bad,
Its a nicea place,
Ah shaddapaya face.

im definately stealing this joke.

accensi0n

Captain Tom wrote:

im definately stealing this joke.

good ol' tommy tiernan.