A Quandary

Bog Man

So here is my question.

Have been married for years, some would say a model husband & good father. Like any couple we have had arguments but sort them out and get on with living.
I have always known that my wife never generated the 'spark' in me that some women have, but she is a good person.
More recently, while she was away for a few days, she arranged for a family member to help mind our kids when I was at work. This lady I have known for years and although I always thought of her as attractive never thought anymore of her.
Over the course of those few days I got to know her better (no hanky panky). She is still beautiful, but also smart honest witty and very kind. She lit a spark in me. When the time came for her to go home I realised I was sad to see her leave, as she hugged me goodbye I was torn up inside.
To make matters worse when my wife arrived home, she was in foul humour and immediately picked a row with me. My normal reaction would have been to tell her to ***k off, but instead to my surprise, the tears ran down my face as I realised I did not love the person before me.
Since then I have experienced depression, have lost a serious amount of weight and general ill health, people say I look like sh*t. I have gone to the GP and even counselling. One wanted to medicate me, the other just sat and listened but offered no solutions to this malaise.
I have considered seperation, my bank manager thought my salary was very good until I asked about getting a new mortgage in the event of a seperation. I have done the sums over and again, I can continue to be comfortable but unhappy or, be free and live in a cardboard box dining out of wheelie bins.
I dont want to hurt my wife, but I dont love her, I dont even enjoy sex anymore. I dont want to hurt my kids. I want to be happy once again.
Constructive opinions please.

Oryx

First off, OP, I feel for ya. Yours is a really difficult situation. But not impossible. You do need to get your head straight before making any big decisions, tho. You say you are depressed, and as you already know its your situation thats causing it, you really need to talk it out with someone. Medication can help immediate symptoms, but getting to the root of the problem is the only way to solve it. I wouldnt make any rash decisions about leaving until youve had time to get out of this rut of depression.

It doesnt seem to me that the other woman has any real appeal to you, and she simply shone a light on your own relationship, and made you think very deeply about your life, and happiness. As I said I simply suggest finding a counsellor to talk to. If at the end of the day you do decide to leave your wife, hopefully you will be sure enough of what you are doing and will be able to work out the practicalities.

Trinity

Theres nothing worse than finding yourself trapped in a loveless relationship, you are trying to do the right thing by everyone and end up sacrificing your own happiness. I was suprised at the amount of couple that stay together purely for financial reasons.

I dont think anyone here can encourage you to end your marriage and it would be irresponsible to do so, however i am sure a lot of people will understand your predicament.

Have you spoken to your wife at all about your feelings? Does she know why you are depressed? I know its a difficult thing to do, to tell someone you do not love them but you have to be honest for everyones sake.

Do you think there is anything you can do as a couple to get that spark - or do you feel yourself its gone beyond that?

Beruthiel

Bog Man
I've sent you a PM.
B

Bog Man

Thanks for your responses.
Just to point out
1. My G.P. is of the opinion that I am not clinically depressed but that short term medication might help - This seems illogical to me & as useful as a chocolate teapot.
2. A counsellors function is to help a person come to a rational decision on a difficult choice or to assist the patient to achieve clarity or to help the patient to deal with harsh reality. I have put my thoughts on paper, refining them and basically creating a balance sheet. My counsellor found this method somewhat black&white but efficient.
3. I have tried to speak to my wife but have given up. In the past, she has really taken unfair advantage of me but that is not the issue. She is afraid of losing me (or so she says) but know what? I am cold - I dont want to hurt her but I dont love her.
4. I think of that other lady every day. I have made a point of avoiding her as I will not run the risk of exposing my feelings towards her. I want to gather her up in my arms & hug her. But never will as the collateral damage would be too great.
5. I have a duty. Honouring that duty is not guaranteed to make me happy, but the duty remains.

Borat_Sagdiyev

Bog Man wrote:

Thanks for your responses.
Just to point out
1. My G.P. is of the opinion that I am not clinically depressed but that short term medication might help - This seems illogical to me & as useful as a chocolate teapot.
2. A counsellors function is to help a person come to a rational decision on a difficult choice or to assist the patient to achieve clarity or to help the patient to deal with harsh reality. I have put my thoughts on paper, refining them and basically creating a balance sheet. My counsellor found this method somewhat black&white but efficient.
3. I have tried to speak to my wife but have given up. In the past, she has really taken unfair advantage of me but that is not the issue. She is afraid of losing me (or so she says) but know what? I am cold - I dont want to hurt her but I dont love her.
4. I think of that other lady every day. I have made a point of avoiding her as I will not run the risk of exposing my feelings towards her. I want to gather her up in my arms & hug her. But never will as the collateral damage would be too great.
5. I have a duty. Honouring that duty is not guaranteed to make me happy, but the duty remains.

I'm in shock. Thats the most upstanding, honourable thing I've ever heard of. To be willing to sacrifice your own happiness for others is truly legendary.

But your duty is to your children. I don't know if staying with your wife just to please her is healthy for the relationship, it certainly is not helping you.

LadyJ

Bog Man wrote:

5. I have a duty. Honouring that duty is not guaranteed to make me happy, but the duty remains.

I'm not going to say too much here because I can hardly begin to imagine how distressing your situation must be. However,I will say this; Your duty to your kids is to always love them and take care of their needs. It would be great for them to have two parents who are madly in love but the fact is they don't.

Living a lie is destructive for everyone involved and although it is really beautiful that you would be willing to do it in an attempt to keep everyone happy, in the long run it really really won't.

You do have a duty to your wife but you must remember the duty you have to yourself also. You can still be a good father and a good person if you are true to yourself.

free2fly

I am so sorry for your pain OP. I was in the same situation not that long ago. It took me a very long time to make my decision. I didn't want to hurt anyone. I was very, very unhappy with my marriage.

The advice given here is good. Take some time to sort yourself out before you decide what to do. If you'd like to PM I talk to you a bit more.

b3t4

Would you consider marriage counselling?

A.

neuro-praxis

I know this is un unpopular opinion, but I definitely believe that you should not leave your wife. You do have a duty to love her - you made a covenant to make it work even when things sucked, and you should continue to honour that. You are responsible for the fact that you are married to her - if you knew that she didn't do it for you then surely you knew this day would come?

You need to exhaust every single avenue before you can decide to leave her. Marriage counselling together should be your first step, not last resort. You need to make her talk and make her listen. You need to be discussing these issues with her, not with us, or with a counsellor on your own.

Relationships when they reach very long term can become boring and empty. I honestly believe that this only happens by letting the love and joy drip out bit by bit.

Once you have thoroughly argued out and cried out and thrashed out the problems together you could look at creative ways of loving each other and investing romance into your relationship. Youw ill never have the thrill of the chase again but you could possibly rekindle something deeper and much stronger than that.

All I am saying is don't give up yet. At the point where she has completely given up on you I think you might be justified to leave, but just try, try, try to make this work. For all the right reasons.

free2fly

neuro-praxis wrote:

I know this is un unpopular opinion, but I definitely believe that you should not leave your wife. You do have a duty to love her - you made a covenant to make it work even when things sucked, and you should continue to honour that. You are responsible for the fact that you are married to her - if you knew that she didn't do it for you then surely you knew this day would come?

You need to exhaust every single avenue before you can decide to leave her. Marriage counselling together should be your first step, not last resort. You need to make her talk and make her listen. You need to be discussing these issues with her, not with us, or with a counsellor on your own.

Relationships when they reach very long term can become boring and empty. I honestly believe that this only happens by letting the love and joy drip out bit by bit.

Once you have thoroughly argued out and cried out and thrashed out the problems together you could look at creative ways of loving each other and investing romance into your relationship. Youw ill never have the thrill of the chase again but you could possibly rekindle something deeper and much stronger than that.

All I am saying is don't give up yet. At the point where she has completely given up on you I think you might be justified to leave, but just try, try, try to make this work. For all the right reasons.

I don't mean to sound disrespectful, but have you, personally, ever been in a loveless marriage?

neuro-praxis

No disrespect inferred...or implied with my response:

No, but I am married, and I don't think that lovelessness "just happens" - it is something that needs to be allowed to happen (except of course in exceptional circumstances where one or both partners struggles with addiction, very severe mental illness or is abusive).

I just have a conviction that when you've made the kinds of promises that you do in marriage vows that you ought to fight to the last before you jack it all up and start all over again.

I have seen a number of friends of mine left to pick up the pieces while their spouses went off to "find themselves" because they weren't completely happy, and take it from me, it is a fuc|<ing mess.

free2fly

neuro-praxis wrote:

No disrespect inferred...or implied with my response:

No, but I am married, and I don't think that lovelessness "just happens" - it is something that needs to be allowed to happen (except of course in exceptional circumstances where one or both partners struggles with addiction, very severe mental illness or is abusive).

I just have a conviction that when you've made the kinds of promises that you do in marriage vows that you ought to fight to the last before you jack it all up and start all over again.

I have seen a number of friends of mine left to pick up the pieces while their spouses went off to "find themselves" because they weren't completely happy, and take it from me, it is a fuc|<ing mess.

I don't disagree with you that it sometimes is allowed to happen. But when it does happen there are times when it just can't be repaired. And I am speaking from my own personal experience here. In my case when the effort was finally made by my husband it was far too late to repair the damage that had been done. I chose to leave. And I am far happier today because of it. And so is he to be honest.

I am not saying that the OP should leave by any means. Perhaps his marriage can be saved. But the generalization that all couples, other than the circumstances that you stated above, should make their marriages work is just not feasible. Sometimes children are happier and more stable when their parents don't stay together. Do you think that having your parents fight all the time and who obviously don't love each other anymore are good role models for their children?

neuro-praxis

free2fly wrote:

In my case when the effort was finally made by my husband it was far too late to repair the damage that had been done.

Right. Don't worry, I am not judging you for your decisions. But you've said when the effort was finally made...and the point that I am making is that for a successful marriage you need ongoing effort.

Sometimes children are happier and more stable when their parents don't stay together. Do you think that having your parents fight all the time and who obviously don't love each other anymore are good role models for their children?

Love is not a feeling. Love is expressed through actions, and treating one another with grace, compassion, humility and love itself breeds feelings of love. Couples who scream and shout, insult and hurt at one another are not loving one another well (surely you agree?). I am speaking from my own experience when I say that you have to make the right choices in how you treat each other to breed attitudes of care and love (this is something I regularly fail at when my husband and I end up in massive rows because of our collective ignorance and selfishness).

I think the above statement about happy children is a well used cop-out. No doubt children are happier when Mum and Dad are apart and there is no more screaming. However, those are not the only two choices. It is possible that your marriage could have worked, but you both made choices to end it. You can't say its end had nothing to do with you, can you?

Don't get me wrong - believe me I can understand conflict in a relationship (after ten years with my partner we have been on that road). The point that I am making to the OP is that he should try every last thing he can to make this marriage good again. If it still doesn't work then perhaps it is best for everyone to end it. This is not living a lie - it's being authentic and true to the covenental promises you made at the altar (or registry office).

I think that if couples do not try to make their marriage work, well then, the marriage will fail. Simple as.

dame

LadyJ wrote:

I'm not going to say too much here because I can hardly begin to imagine how distressing your situation must be. However,I will say this; Your duty to your kids is to always love them and take care of their needs. It would be great for them to have two parents who are madly in love but the fact is they don't.

Living a lie is destructive for everyone involved and although it is really beautiful that you would be willing to do it in an attempt to keep everyone happy, in the long run it really really won't.

You do have a duty to your wife but you must remember the duty you have to yourself also. You can still be a good father and a good person if you are true to yourself.

Well said LadyJ. OP, I think you need to go to marriage counselling with your wife, but to be honest, if you always knew there was no spark there then maybe it is time to face up to that and end the relationship in as amicable a way as possible for all concerned.

P.S. A shoebox can be a happy home. Any home is only as happy as the peole in it.

Black Swan

Try marriage counselling with your spouse before making the big decision?

King of Kings

hey - been in a similar situation.

I have a 4 year old child and to be honest since the separation i am happier and subsequently a better dad. hence I'm doing my duty a lot better,

I think you should try marriage conselling and maybe organise regular time with you and your wife to kick start things before you seek separation.

but believe me- you mightn't be able to get a mortgage but cardboard box city is probably an exaggeration.

Peyton Manning

*post withdrawn*

Hope everything works out for the best.

Arc.

LegacyUser

'as someone who grew up under a loveless marriage i can tell you this duty to your kids is bulls*it.

sure, you'll appear like the perfect family to the outside world but trust me you wont hide it eventually from the kids. they're smarter then you give them credit for. i remember for as long as i remember wishing my parents would break up just so they'd be happier. we appeared like the perfect family but it was just a cover. it teachs your children that they have something to be ashamed of and should hide they're true feelings.
thats not healthy

oh and theres evidence to support growing up in this type of environment of fighting and bitching and no love is far more damaging then a broken home. trust me on this.'