Queries about customising/upgrading

Dave!

Hey folks,

after having attended my first skirmish , I've decided that I'm in need of a scope on the oul FAMAS And since I'm putting a scope on it I figure it might be a good idea to upgrade the spring to get some more range on it, and thus be able to do a bit more snipeination!

I've got a decent idea of what I need to do for this, but I just want to check with you lot to see if I've missed anything.

I have to get:
-Scope mount (this presumably doesn't need any extra parts to be put on the gun)
-Scope (is this a decent one? don't wanna break the bank, but don't wanna waste my money either!)
-1J spring

With the spring, I don't need to get a more powerful motor to cater for this, do I? From what I understand if I start to go over 1J then I'll have to invest in other parts so that the gun doesn't fall apart, but 1J should be alright. Confirmation?

Have I missed anything else for this (small) project?

Thanks chaps!

o1s1n

Sorry to burst your bubble, but you only really need a scope like that for a sniper weapon. Well over 1j. The best you can do with a famas is to buy a red dot scope. But even at that, you'll rarely use it. Just ask N.O.I.P!

The Famas itself is well known for not really taking upgrades. It's the one major downside to the gun. So I wouldn't go messing with springs or anything.

Fiach Dubh

Yeah you'll need an M100 spring to get you up to about 327 fps with .20g BB's. I don't think you need to replace anything else if you're just doing a spring job on it. You'll need a 20mm rail to attach the scope and ring mounts. Does the FAMAS have one? I don't recall.

o1s1n

If you want to get a red dot, get this one

http://cgi.ebay.com/G-P-30mm-Aimpoint-Red-Dot-Sight-w-L-Shaped-Scope-Mount_W0QQitemZ270085753001QQihZ017QQcategoryZ66827QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem

I was going to get one for my Famas but had no money. You could always mount a rail on the bottom yourself. Something I plan on doing. Took the lower bi-pod rail off my UTG.
Just need to figure out how to fix it on.

Upgrade potential: This is where the gun falls down a little, you can only upgrade this gun to a M120 (400fps) because of the older motor. However who needs more than 400fps on a assault rifle? You can however upgrade the gears, and hop-up, and the barrel. However all of these will only add up to a expensive rifle that really doesn’t perform much better than a stock AEG.

Excellent stuff. If that information is correct, I'll have a 1j Famas as soon as I can!

Fiach Dubh

In terms of range Oisin is right, you won't really need an optical zoom scope. However for hunting targets in cover its dead handy. I'm getting a 4x scope for the FN SCAR I've ordered, the advantage is I've order high mount rings with the scope that allow me to use the rifles iron sights when the scope is on.

o1s1n

Another project you could do would be to take the front little barrel off, buy a Famas silencer thread, and screw on a really really long silencer. something like this;

http://www.wolfarmouries.co.uk/airsoft/bb/product.asp?page=product&id=KASIL04

Imagine the length you'd get the barrel up to :eek:

If you did that, upgraded the spring to about 1j...THEN an optical zoom scope might work.

Unless you're doing that though, I'd stick with the red dot.

Dave!

o1s1n wrote:

Sorry to burst your bubble, but you only really need a scope like that for a sniper weapon. Well over 1j. The best you can do with a famas is to buy a red dot scope. But even at that, you'll rarely use it. Just ask N.O.I.P!

The Famas itself is well known for not really taking upgrades. It's the one major downside to the gun. So I wouldn't go messing with springs or anything.

I was messing with whupass's AUG and found the scope to be very handy and I think it'd be a great addition to the FAMAS tbh! I found there was a number of times during the game that the scope would be quite useful, and with the slightly more powerful spring even more so.

As for the red dot, I had a go of that as well and have to say I didn't like it at all

As for putting on a longer barrel, yeah that'd also be good, although the barrel is exceptionally long as it is (for an AEG). It's longer than a few lower grade sniper rifles.

So the zoom scope is unnecessary? I suppose considering the joule limit, a 9x zoom is a bit pointless, but I'd still like a scope of some sort so I can do some (relatively short range) sniping if the opportunity presents itself! Any recommendations?

o1s1n

Hmmm. I might buy one of those scope rails and try out my sniper scope for the fun of it. Might be a bit of craic.

[--SC(+)PE--]

i read of some reddot scope with a 2 power zoom which would seem perfect, id say a 3 power zoom would be the absolute max that yad need, im going be making a sort of shortish range dmr rifle as my next purchase [either an Aug an Armalite sniper or an m14, with a 550 mm tighbore a new hopup and a 1 joule spring. itl never have the range i realy want but should be fun enough for some semi auto action .whupass's aug? :eek: what types he got?

nonex

In terms of range Oisin is right, you dont need a zoom scope.
but for targets in cover its handy.
a 3 x 9 scope would be handy for scaning before moving out of cover.
it's always nice to see and not to be seen

liamo333

[--SC(+)PE--] wrote:

.whupass's aug? :eek: what types he got?

That wasnt whupass's aug it was my aug he just borrowed it for a while. Its a classic army aug a1 btw

Dave!

What about this one...
http://cgi.ebay.com/4x20-Metal-Hunting-Rifle-Scope-for-22-Caliber-SC-41_W0QQitemZ270087048968QQihZ017QQcategoryZ31714QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem

Why is it so cheap?

liamo333 wrote:

That wasnt whupass's aug it was my aug he just borrowed it for a while. Its a classic army aug a1 btw

Oh right sorry, whupass owned the P90 then

Fiach Dubh

DaveMcG wrote:

What about this one...
http://cgi.ebay.com/4x20-Metal-Hunting-Rifle-Scope-for-22-Caliber-SC-41_W0QQitemZ270087048968QQihZ017QQcategoryZ31714QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem

Why is it so cheap?



Oh right sorry, whupass owned the P90 then

You need to use a screw driver to zero that scope, not practical to change settings in the field. It has a basic crosshairs with no illumination too, hence the price. If you're willing to pay more they have some nice 4X's with clicky windage adjust, they go for around $35. Oh and that FAMAS rail you listed will be fine, just remember you'll need mounting rings for the scope. They cost $4.99 on eHobby.

Dave!

Ah I see, this one here looks a bit better...
http://cgi.ebay.com/4x22-ARMORED-MILITARY-CARRY-HANDLE-RIFLE-SCOPE-SC-13_W0QQitemZ270072133057QQihZ017QQcategoryZ31714QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem#ebayphotohosting
4x22, clicky adjuster

I'm not sure what mounting rings I need to get for it though There's a load of them here...
http://stores.ebay.com/eHobby-Asia-Airsoft-Supplier_Accessories_Scope-Red-Dot_Mount-Rings_W0QQcolZ4QQdirZ1QQfsubZ2823616QQftidZ2QQpZ2QQtZkm

Which would fit the scope?

Cheers!

Fiach Dubh

DaveMcG wrote:

Ah I see, this one here looks a bit better...
http://cgi.ebay.com/4x22-ARMORED-MILITARY-CARRY-HANDLE-RIFLE-SCOPE-SC-13_W0QQitemZ270072133057QQihZ017QQcategoryZ31714QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem#ebayphotohosting
4x22, clicky adjuster

I'm not sure what mounting rings I need to get for it though There's a load of them here...
http://stores.ebay.com/eHobby-Asia-Airsoft-Supplier_Accessories_Scope-Red-Dot_Mount-Rings_W0QQcolZ4QQdirZ1QQfsubZ2823616QQftidZ2QQpZ2QQtZkm

Which would fit the scope?

Cheers!

That first scope is a bolt on job for M16/M4 type handles. This is a nice illuminated scope, the one I've ordered.

http://cgi.ebay.com/TASCO-4x32-Blue-Illuminated-Mil-Dot-Rifle-Scope-SC-12_W0QQitemZ270087614675QQihZ017QQcategoryZ31714QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem

The 25/30mm rings should take it. I ordered these.

http://cgi.ebay.com/1-25mm-HIGH-See-Through-Weaver-Scope-Ring-Mount-SM-22_W0QQitemZ270087626522QQihZ017QQcategoryZ52512QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem

[--SC(+)PE--]

illumination is so cool if not all that usefull but still

That wasnt whupass's aug it was my aug he just borrowed it for a while. Its a classic army aug a1 btw

my mistake suppose he'l get another p90 before hed even consider one

Fiach Dubh

Yeah it's not really needed in a normal game but if I end up going to a two day mil-sim game it'll come in handy for dawn/dusk. 11 levels of illumination

[--SC(+)PE--]

the crosshairs on that one are the same design as the one i have, i think their realy nice, would be interesting to see it on a famas maybe a silencer to;) ? it would be a little different from the norm and id say itl look pretty savage

Fiach Dubh

It'd be quite unique alright. I want to see a FAMAS with a box mag on it. With it's uber rate of fire it'd be like an LMG Would take some heavy modding though.

[--SC(+)PE--]

ya i tought about a famas support weapon before, i tought it would look alot like the type 89? from battlefield 2 [think thats the one i havnt played it since airsoft became legal lol] but it actualy looks a good bit different it would just look like... a famas with a drum mag realy, but its still cool

Dave!

[--SC(+)PE--] wrote:

the crosshairs on that one are the same design as the one i have, i think their realy nice, would be interesting to see it on a famas maybe a silencer to;) ? it would be a little different from the norm and id say itl look pretty savage

Take a look at this little baby!
http://chatairsoft.com/forum/aeg-reviews/342-tm-fa-mas-review.html



Sweeeeeet....

o1s1n

DaveMcG wrote:

Take a look at this little baby!
http://chatairsoft.com/forum/aeg-reviews/342-tm-fa-mas-review.html



Sweeeeeet....

Ah yes, I'm pretty sure I posted up that picture before.

See what I mean about the long silencer working with a scope?

It has to be done!

[--SC(+)PE--]

i agree, the first thing im going to do to my Aug is make a long custom outer barrel [thicker one like a hbar or just add a nice silencer] well after i rip off the front grip of course

o1s1n

How long of a silencer do you want for it? I was trying to find the longest one possible for my Famas. They're quite hard to find.

Pity the Mac 11 wouldn't fit it. That'd look crazy.

liamo333

Does a silencer actually improve accuracy? I thought it was just filled with foam to muffle the sound.

Dave!

liamo333 wrote:

Does a silencer actually improve accuracy? I thought it was just filled with foam to muffle the sound.

Well it lengthens the barrel too so it should improve the accuracy.

o1s1n

Well, it just means that the bb gets to stay in the barrel for longer. Should improve accuracy. That would be why sniper rifles have long barrels.

Okay, the real ones are rifled along the inside of the barrel. But going by the airsoft guns I have, my sniper rifle is infinitely more accurate then my Mac 11. Probably one of the best barrel length comparisons I can come up with.

Fiach Dubh

It may improve accuracy slightly but not by much. In real steel guns it's the rifling that has the most to do with accuracy. Since AEG's are smooth bore it doesn't make much difference. Take an old smooth bore musket (very long) and put it up against a modern rifled barrel pistol. The pistol will be more accurate.

If you are changing out the barrel make sure it's a 6.04mm tight barrel. That'll help a bit.

o1s1n

I'm no ballistics expert, but wouldn't the barrel being longer mean the bb has more time to pick up speed without the full effects of gravity? Surely this would Improve accuracy quite a bit as it would keep the bb on its trajectory for longer?

Or am I just talking sh!te?

Fiach Dubh

No you are right in a way. A longer barrel does improve accuracy in both real steel and Airsoft. The only problem is that Airsoft barrels are smooth bore and the barrel diameter is larger then the BB, it has to be. The problem there is that the BB can strike the side of the barrel as it travels down it. Each time it does it loses energy, the longer the barrel the more chances it has of loosing energy. The tight barrels help with that problem to a degree but you're going to quickly reach a point where a longer barrel does more harm then good, that of course is talking about 1 joule or less guns, more power brings it back up again.

So you're not wrong per say.

whupass

[--SC(+)PE--] wrote:

my mistake suppose he'l get another p90 before hed even consider one

wellllllllllll (no i gotta stick to my guns!) p90s are great of course i'd get 20 more before a steyr aug*drool*

i used liams aug for amost of a match and the scope was SOOOOOO good that i want it to be my next buy

[--SC(+)PE--]

its a 1.5 power scope is it cos that would seem perfect allright

liamo333

The scope is brilliant allright gonna zero it in tonight hopefully.

Kroko

About M100 spring - it may take you well over 1 J limits, depending what other parts you used. I have M100 in my Classic Army M15A2, and together with Hurricane upgrade parts: cylinder, cylinder head and so on, making the gun more airtightit - it gets 380 fps (1,32 J with 0,2 g bbs). With a tightbore and better (more slippy) bbs (like TM instead of Blasters I am using now) M100 would shoot even at 390 fps...
Well, I don't use it in Ireland - just in Warsaw, Poland. I have one that is below 1J, M90 spring, SRC M4A1 gun, it is a tad below 1J (320 fps with 0,2 g bbs).
I travel to Ireland quite often, so I wondered: is it illegal to use 380 fps gun (ie over 1J) at all circumstances or it is just illegal if it is not licensed with the Garda? Sorry if it is OT...

Dave!

Thanks for that Kroko, I'll have to find a different spring to bring me to the 1J mark.

It is illegal to use and I think even possess a gun that fires a 0.2g BB 380 fps, in Ireland, without a licence. If the muzzle energy is less than 1J then it's in the same class as a toy; but if it's above that, it's a firearm, and you'd need a licence for it.

And also I should point out that even if you do get a licence for it, the 1 site that is opened in the Republic of Ireland won't let you use a gun that's over 1J even if you have a licence (and the guns are chrono'd before-hand) -- and I presume the rest of the sites to open will follow suit -- so I'd say your best bet would be to buy another gun to bring to Ireland, or else downgrade your current gun whenever you're coming here.

Sorry dude!

Kroko

Thanks Dave, as I wrote, I have two guns - one that shoots at 380 fps, the other at 325 fps, which is below 1J.

But what about semi-automatic weapons? Like sniper rifles, spring or gas (Dragunov, Tanaka, M700 KJW?). They all all around 550 fps with 0.20 g bbs. Are bolt-action sniper rifles that exceed the limit illegal as well?

Dave!

I'm afraid that all guns must be below the 1J limit, single shot or otherwise! You'd have to bring the 325 gun (actually I think the limit is 320 with .2g, but I'd say they'd give you plus or minus a few fps) if you intend on playing over here.

But that should be plenty to be honest mate. We just had a CQB skirmish today and my AK was chrono'd @ 258 fps, and it was fine. Most guns seemed to be 250-285 I think, so you'd still have the most powerful gun in the site. And we had a skirmish in a site in Northern Ireland, which has a higher limit I believe, and I had a FAMAS firing around the same FPS, and again, it was fine.

Kroko

I guess you are right. I am just used to 350 fps CQB limit, 450 fps woodland-automatic, whatever you have with bolt-action or semi. I asked about sniper-rifles due to the fact that if you are a sniper and have to abide by the 1J limit - than sniping is out of question... Just about how close to "real combat" the skirmish is supposed to be: ideally sniper rifles should have the greatest range, support rifles (Minimi, M249 somewhat less), then assault rifles, then submachine guns.
On the other hand, 325 limit may be fine: when there are no limits, there is an "arms race". No kidding. When I started playing airsoft here in Warsaw, my first gun was 270 fps. But then some people took to upgrading to get a better range. So I bought a new one, the 325 fps one. And there were other guys who kept putting stronger springs, stronger cylinders, torque-up chain rings, everything airtight... So 3 months ago I bought a 380 fps carbine, what is pretty much "regular" velocity. But there are already some guys who pretty much replaced everything inside for strongers parts and have rifles shooting at 450fps... That is what I call an "arms race". If everybody has a similar range, then better tactics/strategies are needed, not just upgraded guns.

I have another question - how many people do usually take part in an airsoft skirmish in Ireland?

Dave!

Kroko wrote:

I guess you are right. I am just used to 350 fps CQB limit, 450 fps woodland-automatic, whatever you have with bolt-action or semi. I asked about sniper-rifles due to the fact that if you are a sniper and have to abide by the 1J limit - than sniping is out of question... Just about how close to "real combat" the skirmish is supposed to be: ideally sniper rifles should have the greatest range, support rifles (Minimi, M249 somewhat less), then assault rifles, then submachine guns.
On the other hand, 325 limit may be fine: when there are no limits, there is an "arms race". No kidding. When I started playing airsoft here in Warsaw, my first gun was 270 fps. But then some people took to upgrading to get a better range. So I bought a new one, the 325 fps one. And there were other guys who kept putting stronger springs, stronger cylinders, torque-up chain rings, everything airtight... So 3 months ago I bought a 380 fps carbine, what is pretty much "regular" velocity. But there are already some guys who pretty much replaced everything inside for strongers parts and have rifles shooting at 450fps... That is what I call an "arms race". If everybody has a similar range, then better tactics/strategies are needed, not just upgraded guns.

I have another question - how many people do usually take part in an airsoft skirmish in Ireland?

Yeah ideally I'd like snipers to have a higher limit, otherwise there's no point really. You could just put a scope on an AEG and "snipe" on fully-auto...!!! I believe in the UK they have different limits for AEGs and rifles.

That's interesting about the whole "arms race" thing. I guess that's another good thing about having some sort of limit.

As to your last question, airsoft was only legalised in the Republic of Ireland a few months ago, and the growing community on this website is pretty much the first reasonably large group in the Republic that has taken to the sport (as far as I know anyway), so we're kinda leading the way.
There's still a small following compared to Northern Ireland and Britain, and the rest of Europe of course, but that's mainly because the sport was only recently legalised, and as a by-product of that, there's only 1 site in the country that we can skirmish on -- and today was the first day it's been opened! So you can appreciate that because it's so new down here, it hasn't had the same level of exposure as in other countries, and so most people haven't heard of it, so we have to explain it as being a "paintball-like" sport.

Judging by the fairly rapid growth of new members on this site, more people seem to be becoming aware of it, and so we'll have more people attending skirmishes, and with the growth in popularity comes a good business opportunity for those who are willing -- and so we'll probably see a few more skirmish sites being opened in the near future, thereby perpetuating the trend of: more interest, more sites, more awareness, REPEAT!!! lol

I kinda rambled on there a bit, sorry

Kroko

So go on leading the way! Airsoft is a great sport, one of the most exciting ones.
And anyway - if some time you happen to be in Poland/Warsaw - take your rifle with you... There are around 10 airsoft free (yep, no admission fees!) fields around and in Warsaw, skirmishes are regularly fought every Thu night (CQB), Saturday morning (woodland), Sunday afternoon (open area and CQB).