Raw feedback - Taker decides

Mr.Nice Guy

What a fantastic episode of Raw that was. Anyone else agree? The WWE are on fire right now.

- I knew Taker would select Batista but the segment was nicely played out nonetheless.

- 7 matches, none of which were tarnished by run ins and DQs but which all instead featured clean finishes. (Take note Russo)

- What a magnificent promo given by Ric Flair to Carlito. It had me glued to the screen. They can do great things with this storyline.

- The triple threat main event was really good too. HBK/Cena should be a lot of fun.

- They also had me looking forward to No Way Out by the end of the show.

There's been no mention of Hulk Hogan, Stone Cold or Mick Foley being at WM23 but despite that I'm really looking forward to the show.

I've given Vinny Mac a hard time in the past (rightfully so in most cases) but right now he's doing everything spot on in my opinion.

What did you make of the show?

Fozzy

I just had a read of the results, sounds like a good show. I'm not looking forward to WM as much as I usually did in the past, so maybe if it's as good as you're saying it'll get me in the mood!

I was looking forward to the rumoured Shawn vs Booker match though. The most recent reports were having them wrestle without the involvement of Vince and Trump. I'm picking Taker and Cena for the wins right now by the way!

Just as a side note, I was listening to a Vince Russo interview last night and he insisted that he never books finishes to matches, unless it's absolutely important to a storyline that a match finishes a certain way. Otherwise, he said he stays out of it, cos he's not a wrestler and doesn't think that he should be telling them how to wrestle, only how to tell the storyline

Vince135792003

I hope they keep it up. The way they having been booking the main event angles has been done so well. With UFC very hot right now and WWE getting hot right now, there may be casualties though.

Meltzer made the point that the best thing to happen to the WWE was Triple H getting injured in a weird sort of way. It created real animosity and heat in the eyes of the fans with Orton and Edge making that angle much more hotter. It lit a fire under Shawn Michaels. Plus with the next few months looking like really good business, when Triple H does come back it'll give the WWE another boost.

Ph3n0m

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

What a fantastic episode of Raw that was. Anyone else agree? The WWE are on fire right now.

- I knew Taker would select Batista but the segment was nicely played out nonetheless.

- 7 matches, none of which were tarnished by run ins and DQs but which all instead featured clean finishes. (Take note Russo)

- What a magnificent promo given by Ric Flair to Carlito. It had me glued to the screen. They can do great things with this storyline.

- The triple threat main event was really good too. HBK/Cena should be a lot of fun.

- They also had me looking forward to No Way Out by the end of the show.

There's been no mention of Hulk Hogan, Stone Cold or Mick Foley being at WM23 but despite that I'm really looking forward to the show.

I've given Vinny Mac a hard time in the past (rightfully so in most cases) but right now he's doing everything spot on in my opinion.

What did you make of the show?

Lets just wait and see if we get more then the single diamond in the rough that we have come to expect from WWE programming

Vince135792003

Ph3n0m wrote:

Lets just wait and see if we get more then the single diamond in the rough that we have come to expect from WWE programming

Theres been a fair few diamonds lately though. I'm not saying this is a new big era or anything. But they have been putting decent Raws and Smackdowns consistently for about the last 6 weeks.

The middle of the card still might be a little lacking in comparison to 2000 when you had a really great mid card with Angle, Jericho, Benoit Edge etc...

But as far as the top of the card goes, I think its comparable to the momentum they had with the Triple H Batista program (except they have a few feuds in this instance).

I think the last few weeks have got people caring about the WWE ie. who's gonna face who, who'll go over who etc.. And that hasn't happened for a while.

evad_lhorg

well considering the teams for the main event at no way out it was pretty obvious who was going to be facing who at wrestlemania.

Reganio 2

Just looked at wwe.com. It says the Trump is going to be at Raw (which airs on a thursday in the states next week or this week not sure) and he has a special business proposal that will change mc Mahons life forever but they are also hinting that he will join the kiss my ass club. Another job for Ace Steel I reckon.

Terry

Damn it. where are the spoiler tags?
I haven't watched the main event yet.

Ph3n0m

Well the title did say Taker decides - what else did you think you would find in the thread?

triple h

I am a big RAW fan anyway, but last nights RAW was fantastic.
The womens match was great too.

Terry

Ph3n0m wrote:

Well the title did say Taker decides - what else did you think you would find in the thread?

Well, not to mention that the thread title itself is a spoiler, the undertaker segment was at the start of the show. I was referring to the triple threat match. Remember, not everyone stays up to watch the live airing and not everyone catches the show on a tuesday either.

irishcrazyhorse

julep wrote:

Well, not to mention that the thread title itself is a spoiler, the undertaker segment was at the start of the show. I was referring to the triple threat match. Remember, not everyone stays up to watch the live airing and not everyone catches the show on a tuesday either.

well its no-ones fault if you dont want to watch something till a few days after it was first aired!
Fair enough when ist smackdown or ecw which arnt aired here till the weekend but you cant expect everyone to wait!
if you miss it just hit wwe.com and see the finishs if you dont want to stay up

triple h

every monday after football i would be up till 2.30 (i am fired up after football) so i watch the first half hour, then i sky+ the rest. I have said a million times in here and i still cant say it enough " sky+ is the fecking business" If i wake up early tuesday i watch a bit before work and how i watch the rest of it during tuesday may vary most weeks.

SKY+

Vince135792003

If your on a wrestling forum and you see a title like that, you are taking your chances when it comes to spoilers.

Ph3n0m

julep wrote:

Well, not to mention that the thread title itself is a spoiler, the undertaker segment was at the start of the show. I was referring to the triple threat match. Remember, not everyone stays up to watch the live airing and not everyone catches the show on a tuesday either.

Well if you knew that the thread title itself was a spoiler - what on earth possesed you to open a thread that contained atleast one spoiler to a program you hadnt watched yet - c'mon you're not 5 anymore - if the title mentions something as vague as "taker decides" - chances are something about Raw is going to be revealed - therefore you have the choice to either open it or not, simple as that

Fozzy

Vince135792003 wrote:

Meltzer made the point that the best thing to happen to the WWE was Triple H getting injured in a weird sort of way. It created real animosity and heat in the eyes of the fans with Orton and Edge making that angle much more hotter. It lit a fire under Shawn Michaels. Plus with the next few months looking like really good business, when Triple H does come back it'll give the WWE another boost.

I heard someone say at the weekend that the best thing to happen them was Roddy Piper finding out he had cancer, which is a bit stranger, but Edge and Orton wouldn't have got the tag titles if he was fit. I'm sure they'd have still been fighting DX, but it's one way to look at it

Piper sounds like he's doing ok, he's shooting a film this week

Mr.Nice Guy

julep wrote:

Damn it. where are the spoiler tags?
I haven't watched the main event yet.

Mea Culpa. I thought by putting Raw feedback in the title that only those who saw the show would check it out. Sorry if it spoiled the programme for you.

Terry

Ph3n0m wrote:

Well if you knew that the thread title itself was a spoiler - what on earth possesed you to open a thread that contained atleast one spoiler to a program you hadnt watched yet - c'mon you're not 5 anymore - if the title mentions something as vague as "taker decides" - chances are something about Raw is going to be revealed - therefore you have the choice to either open it or not, simple as that

Spoiler tags are there for a reason. As I said, not everyone stays up.

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Mea Culpa. I thought by putting Raw feedback in the title that only those who saw the show would check it out. Sorry if it spoiled the programme for you.

Don't worry about it. It's not the end of the world.

Double C

From PWInsider

THE SECRET TO WORLD WRESTLING ENTERTAINMENT'S CREATIVE SUCCESS IN THE LAST 8 DAYS AND WHY IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH SPORTS-ENTERTAINMENT
by Mike Johnson @ 2:15:00 PM on 2/6/2007

KEEP IT SIMPLE, STUPID

In many ways, World Wrestling Entertainment should be elated that HHH is too injured to compete at Wrestlemania. Now, obviously it hurts to have one of their biggest "go-to" performers out on injured reserve. It's a terrible break for him to miss his first Wrestlemania since he debuted for the company, but let's be honest here. HHH's injuries forced Vince McMahon and WWE creative to kick away their crutch and walk on their own two feet. In doing so, WWE's title scene feels the freshest that it has in a long, long time.

Need proof? In just the last nine days, let's look at what the company has accomplished:

*They had one of their most respected veterans, The Undertaker, win the Royal Rumble, gaining a ton of momentum in the process.

*Undertaker eliminated Shawn Michaels to win the Rumble, facing off with him for the first time since 1998, with the two putting on an ending so good that not only would fans want to see it again, but neither performer lost anything in the eyes of their fans.

*In just three TV shows, the mystery over what championship match the Undertaker would choose (coupled with the fact that he's undefeated at Wrestlemania) added intrigue and interest into not just the title match, but all three championships.

*They put over Undertaker as a monster challenger because all three champions, for lack of a better term, were scared sh**less at the idea of having to face him.

*Shawn Michaels broke through with some of his most inspired mic work in years, coming off not sappy or fake or like an adult pretending to be a teenager but instead like an athlete who wanted to be the best in the world one more time.

*Shawn Michaels and John Cena win the Tag Team champions and a week later, are destined to face off at the biggest show of the year, sparking off immediate distrust between two performers who need to work together.

*They set up two babyface vs. babyface matches (unless there are turns pending) for the biggest show of the year, providing a different spin on their biggest stage.

*Not only are Cena and Michaels now the distrusting team, but so are Undertaker and Batista, since they have to go into No Way Out working together.

*Speaking of veterans, where does Ric Flair in his new passionate role as the bitter veteran angry at the business passing him by, replacing those of his ilk with lazy pretty boys like Carlito fit in?

*Not to mention, where do Edge and Randy Orton stand with each other and in the big picture, as we move closer to Wrestlemania?

What's the secret here? Is it $250,000 Divas? Silly vignettes? Exploding cars? Characters acting like children? Big movie actors? Champions picking up doggie poop? Worms? Midgets under the ring? Sports-entertainment and all the other hallmarks of the WWE "brands"?

Nope.

It's old school professional wrestling and that's why it's working.

We've got a collection of competitors vying to prove what they know in their hearts to be the truth - that they are the best in the world at what they do. We all know what their goals are and as a fan, it's easy to identify with who you want to see succeed and who you don't.

Then you break it down to the top four competitors - two of whom believe they are the best in the world because they are champion, and two of whom are old, grizzled veterans looking to prove their best days aren't behind them, but in the future.

Two competitors have the gold, two covet the gold, and none of the four trust each other for a second not to slice their throats to get it. It's a thing of beauty to watch develop and I hope no one drops the ball en route to Detroit.

For all the talk of glitz and glamour and feature films and brand synergy and stock dividends, it's the oldest storyline in the wrestling playbook - Wrestler A wants what Wrestler B has and is willing to do whatever it takes to get it - that sparks the most interesting set of Wrestlemania main events in recent memory.

In eight days, World Wrestling Entertainment went from Wrestlemania feeling like yet another run of the mill deal to something unique and special, because it's a throwback to the days where the championship was the most important thing in the lives and the actions of the performers.

Undertaker notwithstanding, WWE can leave the special effects and assorted goofiness at home. Give us a Wrestlemania headlined by ultimate battles for the ultimate prizes of that world.

It sounds so simple yet is so perfect.

So please, as the saying goes, keep it simple, stupid.

In the end, we'll be glad you did.

Sorry about the big cut/paste job but this is a good article pointing out what WWE have been doing right over the last 2 weeks. No matter how they try and sugar coat it, wrestling is at its best when its about wrestling, and for the first time in a long while they have me interested again.

Minto

^^^^^That is so true! Triple H's injury, may have been a good thing, although I feel for the guy cos he's missing his first 'Mania since he came to WWE.

I'm really likeing the feel of this years WM. And the wholr Ric Flair/Carlito thing, WWE are finally doing some things right. Keepit up Vinny!

Mr.Nice Guy

Yeah that's a good article. Wrestling is best when it's about competition, hell Punk was getting over through that philosophy.

It's best to leave all the BS aside and focus on the tried and tested stuff.

Mossy Monk

watched RAW last night and for the 1st time in ages i loved it

even the womens match was good

Minto

The womens match was good? God,Vince must be on holidays from creative at the moment!

Still it's great news to see the WWE doing things right again.

Fozzy

I was going to post a link to that article, it's spot on. I've always believed that wrestling sells, as long as it's done right. Meanwhile TNA have Russo with the complete opposite mindset

Vince135792003

Minto wrote:

The womens match was good? .

Its really was. Melina and Mickie have legit bad blood going back to OVW and you could tell watching the match with it being quite stiff.

Minto

Vince135792003 wrote:

Its really was. Melina and Mickie have legit bad blood going back to OVW and you could tell watching the match with it being quite stiff.

Riteo, i'm staying in to watch RAW tommorow night! I'm also really looking forward to the Flair/Carlito thing, heard it was done really well.

Charlie

Whilst I don't think the WWe has fully turned things round or is entering a new golden era, I would agree with most others that Raw is becoming really enjoyable and worth the stayin up late. I checked my Sky+ planner and it syas that RAw airs 4am next Tue morning. However, I know that in the states, Raw is actually airing on Thur. night. Does this mean we're getting Raw 3 days earier than the Yanks?

Charlie

Does anyone think the WWE might book a finish that results in Batista retaining the title and Undertaker retaining his streak. At the moment I really can see this happening as I think the WWE wants to push Batista super hard, but wants to keep the streak going. Furthermore, does the Undertaker want to take on all the extra work of being champ.

I could see the WWE turning Batista heel at WM (as it has been rumoured he may be turning heel soon) whereby he retains the title via some sort of DQ leaving TAker's streak unbroken. Or, could it be possible that Kane interferes in the match, attacking the Undertaker, thus resulting inn Batista holding onto the title and the streak unbroken. Kane and Undertaker would then go on for one last big feud together before Kane retires.

I am not saying that I am a big fan of such hoxy finishes but it really wouldn't suprise me as it would seem foolish to throw the deadmans's streak away yet the WWE seems really behind the idea of Batista as being Champ and a clean loss to the Undertaker could (in Vince's eyes) damage Batista's image as a top card contender.

Mr.Nice Guy

charlie mchugh wrote:

I checked my Sky+ planner and it syas that RAw airs 4am next Tue morning. However, I know that in the states, Raw is actually airing on Thur. night. Does this mean we're getting Raw 3 days earier than the Yanks?

Yep. According to the Wrestling Observer...

--Raw will be airing from 2-4 a.m. late Monday night in the U.K., the same time as in Canada (one hour tape delay) for the show that doesn't air until Thursday in the U.S.

charlie mchugh wrote:

Does anyone think the WWE might book a finish that results in Batista retaining the title and Undertaker retaining his streak. At the moment I really can see this happening as I think the WWE wants to push Batista super hard, but wants to keep the streak going. Furthermore, does the Undertaker want to take on all the extra work of being champ.

I could see the WWE turning Batista heel at WM (as it has been rumoured he may be turning heel soon) whereby he retains the title via some sort of DQ leaving TAker's streak unbroken. Or, could it be possible that Kane interferes in the match, attacking the Undertaker, thus resulting inn Batista holding onto the title and the streak unbroken. Kane and Undertaker would then go on for one last big feud together before Kane retires.

I am not saying that I am a big fan of such hoxy finishes but it really wouldn't suprise me as it would seem foolish to throw the deadmans's streak away yet the WWE seems really behind the idea of Batista as being Champ and a clean loss to the Undertaker could (in Vince's eyes) damage Batista's image as a top card contender.

I can't see that happening. A heel turn could happen alright but a DQ ending seems highly unlikely to me. Has that ever happened at a Wrestlemania main event? I don't think it has.

I think a lot depends on Batista's workrate. He's been pretty lethargic as the champ so if he keeps that up I can't see him ending the streak.

Charlie

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

I can't see that happening. A heel turn could happen alright but a DQ ending seems highly unlikely to me. Has that ever happened at a Wrestlemania main event? I don't think it has.

I think a lot depends on Batista's workrate. He's been pretty lethargic as the champ so if he keeps that up I can't see him ending the streak.

You're probably right but when is the last time a face has lost his heavyweight title at mania.

J.R.HARTLEY

Fozzy wrote:

Piper sounds like he's doing ok, he's shooting a film this week

thats the best bit of news in this thread,
i still don't think batista deserves to end the streak, there are many more deserving people that could build a real push, whether their first big push or indeed to resurrect a slightly stalled career like Benoit whos criminally negelected at the moment.

Vince135792003

I can't see them wasting the rub someone would get in beating 'Taker at wrestlemania on Batista.

He's had alot of injuries and he's a shoulder tear away from being in serious trouble. He's looked so tentative since he's come back. In 2 years time, Batista mightn't even be wrestling. I don't think its worth the risk in wasting it on him.

I think you have 'Taker win and then let Batista, Kennedy and maybe bring over Edge to chase him.

nacho libre

I'm finding it hard to build any enthusiasm for Batista V 'Taker at Wrestlemania maybe the storyline in the coming weeks will change my mind. I just think Benoit or even Regal being better wrestlers and seemingly more passionate about wrestling are more deserving of the chance. I realise sentiment or what someone deserves doesn't matter one iota in these things.

Fozzy

I feel almost the same way about this Taker vs Batista match as I did about HHH vs Cena last year. I didn't want Cena to win at all, but I kind of assumed that he wouldn't. I don't really mind Cena too much at this stage, but I would hate to see Batista end Taker's winning streak. That honour should go to a younger guy next year, if at all

I really don't see a dq finish happening. They'll obviously build it up at title vs streak, and if there isn't a clear winner it'll leave the fans feeling cheated. Much like if the Joe/Angle ironman match would have if it had been a draw

What I would love to see is for Taker to win, then feud with Benoit, dropping it to him over the summer. They could have some great matches. I heard an interview Regal did last month in England, he said that for the first time in his career he feels ready to carry the title, but he doubts it'll happen. It's something I would love to see. Regal vs Benoit for the title, it'd be some match

nacho libre

Fozzy wrote:

I feel almost the same way about this Taker vs Batista match as I did about HHH vs Cena last year. I didn't want Cena to win at all, but I kind of assumed that he wouldn't. I don't really mind Cena too much at this stage, but I would hate to see Batista end Taker's winning streak. That honour should go to a younger guy next year, if at all

I really don't see a dq finish happening. They'll obviously build it up at title vs streak, and if there isn't a clear winner it'll leave the fans feeling cheated. Much like if the Joe/Angle ironman match would have if it had been a draw

What I would love to see is for Taker to win, then feud with Benoit, dropping it to him over the summer. They could have some great matches. I heard an interview Regal did last month in England, he said that for the first time in his career he feels ready to carry the title, but he doubts it'll happen. It's something I would love to see. Regal vs Benoit for the title, it'd be some match

I like your thinking! The last match Benoit and Regal had was compelling to watch because it was a stiff match between two technical Wrestlers. Both of them wrestling for a title would make for a great feud too.

Minto

I really think Regal deserves the belt, its way overdue and it would be great for SmackDown!, cos they are sorta presenting it as more of a 'wrestling' show Vs. RAW as being more of a 'sports entertainment' show.

Fozzy

charlie mchugh wrote:

Kane and Undertaker would then go on for one last big feud together before Kane retires.

I just read JR's most recent blog, he says that neither Taker nor Kane will be retiring anytime soon

Charlie

Fozzy wrote:

I just read JR's most recent blog, he says that neither Taker nor Kane will be retiring anytime soon

Interesting, as I thought Kane was pretty set on retiring over the next year or so.

Would anyone else like to see a return of the masked Kane? Much like the Undertaker being at his best when he says nothing at all, I thought Kane was much more effective when he was a silent, (except for the voice box stint :rolleyes: ) masked monster, who was cloaked in mystery. When he was masked he was abled to be a convincing heel or face. Currently though, I feel he can't really carry off either role that well.

nacho libre

charlie mchugh wrote:

Interesting, as I thought Kane was pretty set on retiring over the next year or so.

Would anyone else like to see a return of the masked Kane? Much like the Undertaker being at his best when he says nothing at all, I thought Kane was much more effective when he was a silent, (except for the voice box stint :rolleyes: ) masked monster, who was cloaked in mystery. When he was masked he was abled to be a convincing heel or face. Currently though, I feel he can't really carry off either role that well.

Yes i would. It's funny you mention that because JR in a recent blog said Kane's character was unique and far more effective when he was the masked monster.

Mr.Nice Guy

charlie mchugh wrote:

Would anyone else like to see a return of the masked Kane? Much like the Undertaker being at his best when he says nothing at all, I thought Kane was much more effective when he was a silent, (except for the voice box stint :rolleyes: ) masked monster, who was cloaked in mystery. When he was masked he was abled to be a convincing heel or face. Currently though, I feel he can't really carry off either role that well.

Yeah I agree with you. Actually I think it could make for a very good storyline similar to the one around WM20 when Taker gave up the biker gimmick. They could have his face burned somehow and then let him disappear for a few months. I'd love it if they did that.

Gillie

RAW was amazing!
Great matches.
Unbelievable promo by Flair! WOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

Now I am always someone who'll admit when i'm wrong and it appears I may have been "wrong" about taker! I was in total shock at:
-The guys shape
-His segment with the three chumps er champs!
Best shape of his life?

Well done Marc! We'll see if he can do it at WM!
Looking forward to Edge/Orton as well if they go down that road!
Hope HBK kicks the livin shít outta Cena!

Fozzy

I watched Raw yesterday and I enjoyed it a lot more than the last time I watched. Although considering that the last I saw was the Donald vs Rosie episode..it wasn't that hard to beat. Very good show though, I could ask a few questions about the logic of certain bits, but I'll assume they're ignoring things so that they can better build for WM