Sylvia Brown

6th

Just thought I would share this as Sylvia's name pops up a bit here. Would love to know what people thing.

Obviously I want it discussed rather than thowing out wild or insulting comments ..... remember people, respect.

'Psychic' Sylvia Brown blows big prediction

Shawn Hornbeck's parents received the best possible news when their son was found alive more than four years after his abduction.

For self-proclaimed psychic Sylvia Brown, however, the news was not so good.

In February 2003 on "The Montel Williams Show," Brown told the Hornbecks that their son was dead. She described his killer and even said where his body could be found.

Oops.

Yes, as it turned out, Shawn Hornbeck wasn't dead, his abductor looked nothing like the man Brown described, and Shawn's body, obviously, wasn't buried anywhere. That's three strikes right there.

Of course, Brown's standard disclaimer is that she isn't perfect and only God is right 100 percent of the time. But you would at least expect a person with true psychic powers to be able to predict the future with greater accuracy than you'd get by pure chance.

For years, James Randi, a professional magician and debunker of paranormal claims, has offered a $1 million prize to anyone who can demonstrate psychic abilities under scientific, controlled circumstances. So far, he's had no takers. Brown once agreed to take Randi's test but later backed out, he says.

Brown's response is to attack the scientific method. In a message posted on her official Web site, Brown writes, "The very nature of (Randi's) work is negative; i.e. one that tries to disprove the very nature of spirituality. Can God be 'proven' by scientific methods?"

But in her book "Prophecy: What the Future Holds for You," Brown claims an accuracy rate of near 90 percent. So, why the fuss about someone else testing her rate?

Perhaps it's because others who have kept track of Brown's public predictions give her far from a passing score. You'd be better off flipping a coin. Maybe that quarter in your pocket is psychic?

Give credit to CNN's Anderson Cooper for being willing to take on Brown, and for apparently forcing the issue with his colleague Larry King, who too often has given Brown an unchallenged platform for her predictions.

Of course, the Hornbeck case isn't Brown's first high-profile miss. In 1999 on "Montel," she told the grandmother of Opal Jo Jennings that her granddaughter had been abducted by a white slavery ring and taken to Japan. Opal's remains eventually were found not far from where she disappeared, and an autopsy determined she had been killed soon after her abduction.

Brown, of course, is just one of many self-proclaimed psychics claiming the ability to see the future and talk to the spirits of the dead. But there is no evidence any of them, from John Edward to James Van Praagh, is doing anything more than cold readings, an old carnival trick any halfway competent magician can perform.

The trick is to throw out pieces of information and slowly draw more information from the person being "read," allowing the cold reader to make educated guesses based on the information he has learned.

With practice, you can learn cold reading, too. But being a good cold reader doesn't mean you have paranormal powers. In fact, it probably means you don't.

Only Brown knows if she really believes she is psychic. But if she does, she shouldn't object to having her abilities submitted to a scientific test. Hopefully, there won't have to be another Hornbeck case before TV personalities like Montel Williams decide to stop giving people like Brown a free ride.

Article HERE

dib

Well the article itself is fairly negative and drips tabloid sleeze. "Writers" like that annoy me.

While I'm obviously pleased that she was wrong and there is a happy ending to that case, it is a shame that she was so inaccurate. I'm sure it happens now and again. No psychic in my experience has ever claimed to be infallible.

6th

She does claim to be 90% right.

There is nothing really wrong with how its written as we cant genuinely expect everyone to believe. I mean, what reason have they.

The fact is this women felt confident enought to go on national TV and give these details face to face to the parents of the missing man.

I'd like to ask her some questions:

In what form did she get the information?

Did it give the actually information or did she have to interprit it?

If she was 'given' the information, then was she purposely lead astray?

She says that no one is right 100% of the time but given that she was so specific, 'why' was she wrong?

Its not good enough for me for someone to simply say 'I was wrong" in a situation where real peoples felings are at stake in such a serious matter.

Its very easy to pick at how people like this journalist write but look at what he is reporting rather than how he reports it.

Aisling&M

I agree with Dib.....the entire theme of the article is to ridicule the fallen psychic. I have an inkling that Sylvia Browne is a true psychic but has moments of inaccuracy or perhaps moments when she crosses the line between reading psychically and reading psychologically.
I feel sorry for her really.

6th

What can we expect from the reporter? He is doing nothing wrong in this case. She was very wrong but because she is 'one of us' we have to feel sorry for her and protect her?

She is not the victim here, the family she gave the information to are.

Now most here will know I am a believer but that does not mean that in cases like this I will presume that someone is genuine.

Has anyone got anything they can show me to say that this woman is genuine?

I judge on personal experience as much as I can so I cant say wether she's is fooling people, genuine, or believes she is genuine.

People were very quick to jump on Derek Acorah when he got shown in a bad light and now most here say MH is just for a laugh and not for real.

6th

Aisling&M wrote:

I feel sorry for her really.

Why? Seriously I'd like to know what it is she deserves or needs sympathy for? Is it because she was wrong?

If she knows that she could well be wrong then why go on TV and tell a famil that their son is dead? Why say that you know where his body is buried? Why say you can discribe his killer?

She got alot of information at the time this happened, it wasnt just that she was a little off.

Aisling&M

I feel sorry for her as it is a major blow to her personally I can imagine.
My personal experience would tell me that she is genuine, hence my support of her.
From my own personal experience and from readings I have gotten from very trusted people I know mistakes are made. It is not an exact science.

Another angle that I have past pondered is whether it is possible clairvoyants can see a possible future which is one of many paths of 'destiny' and not necessarily the one that was ventured upon.

If you subscribe to the type of thinking that there are multiple fates dependent upon multiple choices made on the basis of numerous previous choices then perhaps there is a correlation between what the psychic gets wrong and what actually happens in the persons life.

The element of choice augments our undecided fate - does it not?

kshiel

To me the reporter did his job. Sylvia Brown got it serious wrong on this occassion anyway and would have caused serious hurt to that poor family, thankfully he did turn up alive. I do believe there are geniune psychics out there who get information involing difficult cases and are right. She does claim to be 90% correct and maybe she has been in the past but clearly not this time. I am sure it will do a lot of damage to her career but its a case for her to suck it up for now untill she can prove otherwise. Can't be easy for all involved in that situation.

6th

Ok I can understand you choose to believe she is genuine but I would love to know what that is based on, her public personna, her books? Is there any 'real' reason to believe her?

I accept that there are unlimited possible futures but this was her saying what 'had' happened.

Again like I said, why take the chance with peoples feelings if you know full well you can be wrong? Is it worth the risk? I'm sure only the family can answer that.

SB made the choice to go public with this so why feel sorry for her when she is wrong .. as she most knew she could be?

I'm am not critisizing her saying she 'is' fake but more critisizing her for beleiving it was her place to make the choice.

6th

Imagine i stood at the base of a building and told people to throw their babies out a window to me. I've caught alot of babies doing this before and tell the people that. If I fail to catch a baby am I responsible at all?

Aisling&M

I'd feel sorry for anyone who genuinely believed they were helping and it ended up hurting the person instead. If she is as I believe a conscientuous person who would be in turmoil over this then I think she deserves a little sympathy.

It's the same way I feel sorry for someone who is driving a train when someone jumps infront of the tracks or when a person makes an ethically wrong decision and ends up hurting people in the process.

I wouldn't go out and publically do what she is doing and my belief that she is more genuine than false is based purely on my own gut instinct.

Aisling&M

6th wrote:

Imagine i stood at the base of a building and told people to throw their babies out a window to me. I've caught alot of babies doing this before and tell the people that. If I fail to catch a baby am I responsible at all?

That is just a ridiculous statement to make and not really on topic now is it?
Did she tell them to go sacrifice a child to make their some come back to life? No.......

6th

The train metaphore isnt exactly perfect. It would be more like driving around where you 'know' there will very likely be people walking.

She is doing this a long time and is well aware of the fact that she can be wrong. She chooses to risk other peoples feelings.

Plenty of people get by without 'answers' but she feels its her place to step up and give people those answers ... even though she might be wrong.

Its a dangerous game and she chooses to play it, and we cant deny that she have greatly benefitted from it so far.

6th

Aisling&M wrote:

That is just a ridiculous statement to make and not really on topic now is it?
Did she tell them to go sacrifice a child to make their some come back to life? No.......

I used it to explain a point, it is no more off topic than the use of trains to elaborate a point.

She claims she can do something and based on that people come to her and she goes public with it. She states her information as fact for the most of it and only when she is wrong will she say that she's nott perfect.

If you believe I am being off topic or ridiculus with my commments then the report post function is right .....

<- there

dib

6th wrote:

but more critisizing her for beleiving it was her place to make the choice.

I don't see how you can criticise anyone for believing. SB obviously believed in herself enough to go with this information and I'm sure she didn't go public without due consideration.

Brown, of course, is just one of many self-proclaimed psychics claiming the ability to see the future and talk to the spirits of the dead. But there is no evidence any of them, from John Edward to James Van Praagh, is doing anything more than cold readings, an old carnival trick any halfway competent magician can perform.

The trick is to throw out pieces of information and slowly draw more information from the person being "read," allowing the cold reader to make educated guesses based on the information he has learned.

With practice, you can learn cold reading, too. But being a good cold reader doesn't mean you have paranormal powers. In fact, it probably means you don't.

This is rubblish. There is no evidence that SB was cold reading either and for the reporter infer that that's what she did is wrong.

I am not defending her because she is "one of us". I agree that SB was wrong in this instance and has been wrong before but how many times has she been right? I'm sure the reporter wouldn't pen an article about those instances or if he did it would probably be with his trademark sarcasm and derision. Just because it is a heavily publicised mistake doesn't mean that she is more "fake" than if she got the lotto numbers wrong. I am not belittling the seriousness of that particular issue btw.

Aisling&M

I certainly don't feel the need to report you.

6th

The thing isdib is that you can prove that cold reading works but you cant prove psychic ability. So for the sake of reporting which do you think is safer to do?

Alot of us on hereknow each other so with that I know I respect both your beliefs and personal experiences but having not had dealings with SB I can not just believe she is genuine.

dib, I can critisize her for people because her belief in herself puts other peoples feelings in danger of being hurt.

6th

OT: I love that we can have discussion like this when it isnt all patting each otehr the back. We all understand we can get heated but at the end of the day go back to our usual relationships.

Aisling&M

and henceforth this will be known as civilisation.

6th

Ok well its very different when you actually watch the video below. The confidence she has when see tells the mother taht her son is dead ... it disturbed me a little:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkbkkkT6ejA

6th

Listen to the bit when the parents tell that Sylvia Brown asked for $700 to give them any further help on the matter ... her usual rate.

Can someone tell me how someone who believes they can help in a situation like that can honestly say they will only help if paid. I can understand taht people have to make a living but SB is not exactly struggling financially!

dib

6th wrote:

Listen to the bit when the parents tell that Sylvia Brown asked for $700 to give them any further help on the matter ... her usual rate.

Can someone tell me how someone who believes they can help in a situation like that can honestly say they will only help if paid. I can understand taht people have to make a living but SB is not exactly struggling financially!

That is fairly ****ty. I wonder if she gave the parents a refund when the child was found alive.

6th

They never paid her and she didnt help any more. She would only talk to them on camera at the Montel Show.

kshiel

That is awful. It doesn't paint a pretty picture of SB anyway. I cannot understand if someone who claims to have these sorts of details on a missing person and who knows they can be wrong (as lets face it we all can be) wouldn't just go to the police give them the details and let them follow it up. She may have believed that the information she was getting was correct whole heartly and may not have wished to cause any stress to that family, then why take the chance knowning she could be wrong. Sorry to say this but to me she is a woman who got cockey and really messed up and as the world works, responibility for ones own actions can be a b*tch.

6th

No respect for her, imo an evil woman. (or deluded but for the sake of sensationalism I'm sticking with EVIL)

tj-music.com

6th wrote:

No respect for her, imo an evil woman. (or deluded but for the sake of sensationalism I'm sticking with EVIL)

Nazis were EVIL ... Murderes are EVIL - SB may not have been right and perhaps she is cocky but I do believe that she genuinely believes what she says. I don´t think she is that stupid to come on national TV in front of an audience of millions knowing that she talks a lot of bull****.

Yes she surely overcharges people and "what goes around comes around" as we have seen in her case but as a media man I know just how easy it is to blow things out of perspective. She definitely messed up that case but I am sure he has helped a lot of people over the years.

6th

Ok, say she believes what she says ..... does that make it easier for this family or the families in all the other cases where she has been wrong? And looking into it the last couple of days there are alot.

So heres my points:

• Knowing that she may be completely wrong, she still thinks its ok to give information to families which will affect their lives in the most serious of ways.
  
• Believing she can help people who are genuinely suffering, she chooses only to do so if they pay her large sums of money.
  
• Knowing she is could be wrong, she puts herself in the spotlight - does she deserve sympathy when the media pick up on the many cases where she is way off?

I just dont get it, plenty of people on here have slated Derek Acorah as a fraud but this woman gets cuddles when she f**ks up? Derek Acorah is a showman but I've never heard of him going out and damaging lives like this.

celtic1888

Aisling&M wrote:

Another angle that I have past pondered is whether it is possible clairvoyants can see a possible future which is one of many paths of 'destiny' and not necessarily the one that was ventured upon.

id fall in line with the above......any "fortune tellers" ive been too, well any renowed one has maintained that the cards & their ability isnt to predict exactly what the future is but to predict possible outcomes & its your choice what road you take.....to me that makes sense....as its our own free will that dictates our future & not what a bloke in a dark room says;) i trust the "psychics" who dont promote themselves as being "genuine" as they dont feel the need to advertise as they dont have too, word of mouth spreads about them & the crowds flock....whereas this Sylia bird is obviously "power hungry" & loves the lime light & if thats the case...you'd want to make bloody sure youre right 90% of the time & not as wrong as she was with that family.......christ id ring her f*ckin neck.....imagine the cheeky hoor wanting 700$ for "helping more".........ill stick to the "dark rooms" myself......which ive had a fair amount of success with i must say.........

Aisling&M

I have no problem with Derek Acorah, I like him and he is as entertaining as skillful in mediumship.

SB over charges........no question about it. I think it's wrong to charge that amount, regardless of who you are.

Are you saying 6th that no-one should do anything that may have a serious consequence should they be wrong?

I have been to many specialist doctors who charge multiple hundreds of euros and have done serious harm to me physically yet I wouldn't expect them to stop practicing. They did their best at the time with the information they had and the capacity of understanding what was wrong with me (for information sake, I'm okay now though ).

So, I have been prescribed medicines that have actually physically harmed me. Should I now go and tell them to quit medicine even though they may have helped thousands of other people? No...... I told them the consequences and asked them to be more careful with other patients.

SB didn't prescribe medication or tell them to do anything that would cause physical harm to anyone. She may have told them incorrect information that upset them but that's it. Words. They have an impact but seriously, to suggest she should never open herself up to try and help people is far too basic a suggestion for the problem of psychic inaccuracy.

also.......the consultants and special doctors I went to charged a small fortune for their 'help'!

6th

But doctors credentials can be checked ... would I let someone operate on me who I only heard to be good by word of mouth? NO

SB claims to be right 90% of the time ..... from what I have researched thats some quality BS from SB.

Are you saying 6th that no-one should do anything that may have a serious consequence should they be wrong?

If its other peoples lives you are dealing with then I would sit down and look at my success rate. She's been wrong on alot of big cases she has done ... if anyone can show me a big case where she was right I'd love to see it?

I have to say though that I have no problem with people making a living but in this case I am sickened by the fact she would not help find the body of a missing person unless the family pay - I dont know anyone who wouldnt help in a case like that. Do the volunteers out on the search ask for money?

I know it looks like I'm being hard on SB but I think people like her do more damage to the area than good.

maggz

Thats so terrible, really taking advantage of peoples vunerable state.

I went to one of Irelands most famous fortune tellers a couple of years ago. I dont want to mention any names but basically at the time there was a person gone missing and it was all over the papers. The so called fortune teller told me that they knew what happened the missing person and went on to basically tell me what some of the papers were speculating. A few days later the truth came out as to what happened the missing person and the fortune teller was totally wrong. I thought it was awful

Sorry for being so vague, but i dont think its fair to give away the identity of the missing person or the fortune teller

celtic1888

maggz wrote:

Sorry for being so vague, but i dont think its fair to give away the identity of the missing person or the fortune teller

dont want a name but would this person be in the limelight.....like that SB wan?? papers etc?? im not trying to find out who it is but it would sort of "prove" my point if it is

maggz

Not really in the limelight, but very well known. I have seen her on the tv once or twice, but i dont think she's like one of these people who do the horoscopes on the newspapers or tv though (but not 100% sure).

celtic1888

maggz wrote:

I have seen her on the tv once or twice.

thats enough of a limelight for me..........i would trust the ones who shun the LL much more then ones that do, i go to one who has point blank refused offers from the late late show etc doesnt advertise nothing.....just word of mouth

kshiel

I dont think its fair to shoot down all those who choose the lime light as people have put it. Some of these people could be geniune and their path has lead them this direction. And could be in their own right gifted. I am sure that those who did not choose to go on TV etc have been wrong in some of their readings, prediction etc but its just that they are not public so no one knows of it except those directly affected.

6th

I agree kshiel ... i for one am an attention whore, and anyne who's been on one of the trips will agree.

celtic1888

kshiel wrote:

I dont think its fair to shoot down all those who choose the lime light as people have put it. Some of these people could be geniune and their path has lead them this direction. And could be in their own right gifted. I am sure that those who did not choose to go on TV etc have been wrong in some of their readings, prediction etc but its just that they are not public so no one knows of it except those directly affected.

yeah didnt mean to "sh*ite" on all & sundry.....& of course none of them are 100% correct or claim to be...i just think the ones on the telly are in it more for monetary gain & fame rather then just in it to use their gift for the greater good....not them all though of course

6th

I normally defend those on tv because i have met Colin Fry & Tony Stockwell and got a feel for them. I've no problem with people making money and putting themselves out there but Sylvia Brown (who I normally would take no notice of) is a vile creature.

If someone like her works with spirit guides or 'angles' well then how can they work with her knowing she lets people suffer?

kshiel

6th wrote:

I agree kshiel ... i for one am an attention whore, and anyne who's been on one of the trips will agree.

Well Said, Well Said (she cheers clapping her hands);)

Although as regards to spirit guides/angels etc they are not responsible for her actions they can only warn or give the information, what is done with it, is up to us. I know I have ignored some advice given to me by mine and paid the price, so maybe if the case is she has ignored hers also she will to and it seems she already is with the damage done to her rep.

6th

Why give her the inf othough if she will mis-use it?

btw I know there are no answers to my questions.

kshiel

It baffles me too I suppose you could go into the whole plupet talk on how they wont abandon us and will always give us the benefit of the douth and all that, but dont think that would wash to well. But from my own experience even when the wrong choice is made they do still try and help us in that difficult time but bare in mind we are responsible for our own actions in the long hall.

SkepticOne

I think these sorts of people should be used for entertainment only. I'm shocked to see from that report the police taking Browne seriously and actually diverting their investigations because of her predictions.

6th

There have been cases where psychics have genuinely helpbut I just dont like this woman and how she works.

badger80

6th wrote:

There have been cases where psychics have genuinely helpbut I just dont like this woman and how she works.

Psychics are ether so vague that you can make any possible outcome fit the prior predictions or they make numerous predictions so one is bound to have a grain of truth, they publicize the hits and ignore the misses. These people are ether delusional or parasites that pray on people when they are at there most venerable.

6th

Really badger, and what cases are you talking about here or are your opinions based on anything at all?

Where as I agree with you in many cases, this is not alays the case.

sensitive_soul

Hmm...I bought her book MEETING YOUR SPIRIT GUIDE with a free meditation CD.....It's ok but I find that her method is very 'I AM RIGHT, this is how it is, the only way it is' so you get a little distracted, another thing, her meditation doesnt have a grounding exercise which is REALLY important if you're trying to connect through meditation. I would still like to find a little more about her. That's just my opinion on that book.