my line sucks

phantom_lord

villain is a multi-tabling tag, a little bit of history between us, usually keep out of each others way, he folds alot if his c-bet is raised. 18/12/5 over 900

MP ($138.75) [Hero]
CO ($27)
Button ($232.80)
SB ($108.75)
BB ($14.25)
UTG ($32.94)

Hero is MP with 5h, 5c
Preflop: (6 players, $0)
UTG calls $1, Hero calls $1, CO folds, Button calls $1 and raises $8, 2 folds, UTG calls $8, Hero calls $8

Flop: 3d, 5d, 2c (3 players, $27)
UTG checks, Hero checks, Button bets $30, UTG folds, Hero calls $30

I've limped called, so it's not gonna be too difficult to work out my hand, so if I c/r he's gonna fold, really should have led out, y/n?

Turn: 8d (2 players, $87)
Hero checks, Button checks

looks like my fd hit

River: Js (2 players, $87)
Hero bets $40,

expecting him to make a crying call

Ste05

Yep, I lead the flop, although what is with him raising 8 BB's PF?? Is this standard for him??

Although with 900 hands play with someone, I'd probably play it a certain way against him based on his tendancies and what he thinks of how I play hands.

phantom_lord

Ste05 wrote:

Yep, I lead the flop, although what is with him raising 8 BB's PF?? Is this standard for him??

Although with 900 hands play with someone, I'd probably play it a certain way against him based on his tendancies and what he thinks of how I play hands.

not really...normally 4, misclick? maybe cause of the cs on the table?

nearly all those hands are mined.only played with him yesterday and today, and didn't really get involved, especially oop.

Mr. Flibble

If I think its likely he has a big pair I would always lead on that flop that deep. Does he usually raise so much with a big hand preflop? Those overbets seem to be AK or AQ alot. As there's a FD and STR8 draw it makes it very difficult to fold an overpair.
If he has AA he is probably never folding that flop to a lead because of the combined likelyhood that you have a draw and he has a gutshot.

And as you are so deep the best way to build a big pot is to lead.
I think its pretty unlikely he has QQ/KK/AA if he folded to the river bet.

phantom_lord

Holdem No Limit - $1 BB

Button ($91.50)
SB ($90.50)
BB ($63.09)
UTG ($89.50)
CO ($198.88) [Hero]

Hero is CO with Qh, Qc
Preflop: (5 players, $1.5)
UTG calls $1 and raises $4, Hero calls $5, 3 folds

Flop: 3c, 6c, Tc (2 players, $11.5)
UTG bets $8, Hero calls $8

Turn: 8s (2 players, $27.5)
UTG bets $20, Hero calls $20

River: 4s (2 players, $67.5)
UTG bets $50, Hero calls $50

Results: UTG has Jd, Js
Hero has Qh, Qc
Hero wins $164.5 with Pair: Queens

any comments on this? same guy.

phantom_lord

Mr. Flibble wrote:

If I think its likely he has a big pair I would always lead on that flop that deep. Does he usually raise so much with a big hand preflop? Those overbets seem to be AK or AQ alot. As there's a FD and STR8 draw it makes it very difficult to fold an overpair.
If he has AA he is probably never folding that flop to a lead because of the combined likelyhood that you have a draw and he has a gutshot.

And as you are so deep the best way to build a big pot is to lead.
I think its pretty unlikely he has QQ/KK/AA if he folded to the river bet.

no, he normally raises 4bbs, checked up pt, never saw more than that.

he called the river bet.




checking the flop was pretty bad. I think playing too passively oop is a big leak of mine, probably better examples than this, but I just really didn't like this hand.

pok3rplaya

Dude you need to raise pf way more. Raise 55 and you avoid that situation.

Ste05

The second hand seems good.

I think in the first hand against a standard multi-tabling TAG who doesn't have much play with me, I'll lead, and hope to stack an over pair and not worry about a cont. bet from AK, etc. Although you'll have to be leading in that spot with flush and straight draws too, would you play them passively as well or would you lead out with them hoping to take the pot down too.

Ste05

pok3rplaya wrote:

Dude you need to raise pf way more. Raise 55 and you avoid that situation.

Why does he want to avoid that situation??

phantom_lord

pok3rplaya wrote:

Dude you need to raise pf way more. Raise 55 and you avoid that situation.

That was a mistake not raising that hand I sent you! I pretty much always raise there!

I open raise most pairs, and I'd raise 88+ here, i thought limping 55 and other low pairs would be better utg+1 after a limper? no?

Ste05 wrote:

The second hand seems good.

I think in the first hand against a standard multi-tabling TAG who doesn't have much play with me, I'll lead, and hope to stack an over pair and not worry about a cont. bet from AK, etc. Although you'll have to be leading in that spot with flush and straight draws too, would you play them passively as well or would you lead out with them hoping to take the pot down too.

yeah i usually lead draws and sets here, think i was distracted during this hand.

robinlacey

i think you should raise this preflop,limp calling makes your hand fairly transparent,and if you raise you will take down a lot of pots with a c-bet,and if you do hit your hand won't be nearly as obvious

phantom_lord

robinlacey wrote:

i think you should raise this preflop,limp calling makes your hand fairly transparent,and if you raise you will take down a lot of pots with a c-bet,and if you do hit your hand won't be nearly as obvious

I was only raising 77/88+, but yeah, that makes perfect sense.noted.

spectre

Hero did not open preflop, he limped after UTG limped which is fine with our holding. I would never open limp with 55

Leading the flop is the best way to get all-in as we're not very deep

ianmc38

1 of the most obvious leaks of many of the .50/1 TAGs on tribeca is how they play small pocket pairs. They limp from UTG/UTG+1 and raise from CO or button. When one of these guys limp calls from EP and a flop like 346 comes along, I usually keep the pot smaller with overpairs as 33/44/66 form a large part of their range. By limp calling, your hand becomes really transparent and you will win the least from a decent, thinking opponent. Raising from UTG+1 after a limper is my standard line. Also, I'd probably donk bet for 2/3rd pot in the hand as played.

pok3rplaya

I don't mean we want to avoid that situation just that we create better ones by raising.

Ste05

Not really it's just a different type of strategy. If you are a tighter than tight Rock, then yes absolutely use these hands as your balancing hands, but what do you limp with in this situation? Suited connectors? suited A's? gapped suited cards? etc.?? If there isn't the chance of you limping with a PP, after a while your semi-bluff leads with draws/sets basically become impossible. With enough history with an opponent.

Limping behind an UTG limper is probably the best spot to limp with a hand like this.

Just to be clear I'd also raise sometimes here with 55, but certainly not everytime as a standard, I think there's far too much formulaic poker talked about on this forum. It's about the reasoning behind a play and not just to say what people do in certain situations.

ianmc38

.50/1 is all about formulaic ABC poker!

Ste05

So you limp then??

EDIT: Actually it doesn't matter, it's just different formula's really.

ianmc38

Rarely. Against people who like to limp monsters UTG i limp. Otherwise I generally raise. My version of ABC may be different to others though!