Broadband plan is scrapped

molinaalexis

THE Government has decided to scrap its Group Broadband Scheme after two years and over €5m in investment.

Minister for Communications Noel Dempsey said yesterday that the service, designed to speed up to rollout of broadband in rural Ireland, was "too slow".

In the two years since the Group Broadband Scheme only 7,200 subscribers have signed up from potential pool of 400,000 subscribers.

Heinrich

Did you expect anything better than this? At least it's only 5 million. Does anything work according to our esteemed government's plan? Anything at all?

molinaalexis

Do we have a goverment in this country ?

damien

Vote the deceitful man out and all his colleagues. He's strung along a lot of desperate people who wanted broadband. The public can decide to do something come the election or they can accept the status quo.

jwt

I've been waiting for over 10 months for the next phase of funding to be announced for a local GBS.

Was continually told it was on its way, wait a while etc.

How exactly does Minister Dempsey think people would subscribe and GBSs be rolled out when no one could access the money!!!!!!


John

knipex

There was supposed to be a group broadband scheme in my area (Croom co. Limerick). I got the contact details and sent about 20 emails to the organiser. Never received a reply.


Was a joke as far as I could see.

thegills

There was €25M earmarked for GBS, whats going to happen to the remaining €20M. My community was lucky enough to get a GBS and we now have over 200 subscribers. Whilst the funding was worthless the process put in place by the DCMNR (for Phase 2 GBS only) gave our communitys effort some guidance and a means to approach the carriers.
I think the idea is good and shouldn't be cast aside but the funding needs to be re-evaluated.
thegills

oscarBravo

What needs to be re-evaluated is the timing. In the first two phases there was a deadline for the submission of proposals. Any project which wasn't ready by the deadline didn't get done.

With an open-ended timetable for the submission of proposals, the GBS could have worked a lot better. There were many projects which weren't ready in time for the second call for proposals that would have been submitted if a third round had been opened up as promised.

I'll confidently state my opinion that if the process had been an open-ended one rather than one with artificial deadlines for submissions, the uptake would have accelerated steadily.

jwt

With an open-ended timetable for the submission of proposals, the GBS could have worked a lot better. There were many projects which weren't ready in time for the second call for proposals that would have been submitted if a third round had been opened up as promised.

I'll confidently state my opinion that if the process had been an open-ended one rather than one with artificial deadlines for submissions, the uptake would have accelerated steadily.

Absolutely! Particularly when local communities were told to wait until third round was announced.

Blaster99

It has always been my opinion that GBS was a complete waste of money so that fact that it's gone is only good. Little mickey-mousey wireless schemes is not where it's at.

thebman

Well Last Mile did Group Broadband in a some areas and look at their service currently in 2007.

512Mbps download/ 128Mpbs upload with 10GB allowance.
All this can be yours for 80 Euro installation and 40 Euro a month afterwards.

You can use it for VOIP/gaming etc.. but the ping times are too high for you to use it for any of that.

netwhizkid

I have been aware of this since Monday. I was told that it being scrapped as they had even laid off the Regional Co-Ordinator as they had no funds to pay him.

I contacted The Department of Communications and was told that a new National Broadband Plan is currently under consideration and will be launched soon with large press releases in the Media with a Grinning Dempsey no Doubt, I wonder if they will fly in Kim Il-sung from NK for the gala launch.

damien.m wrote:

Vote the deceitful man out and all his colleagues. He's strung along a lot of desperate people who wanted broadband. The public can decide to do something come the election or they can accept the status quo.

I couldn't have put it better myself, I would expect alot of press releases and more propaganda soon as the Election will be held in April I can confirm. This coincides nicely with the maturing of the SSIA's and is between the bi-monthly utility bills which will bite hard around then, plus it is before the €40 Credit Card Tax that all Credit Card holders will have to pay, plus the Opposition is gaining Ground Fast.

Vote Fianna Fail & the PD's out over this and everything else.

Altreab

jwt wrote:

I've been waiting for over 10 months for the next phase of funding to be announced for a local GBS.

Was continually told it was on its way, wait a while etc.

How exactly does Minister Dempsey think people would subscribe and GBSs be rolled out when no one could access the money!!!!!!


John

This is another example of Dempsey mismanagement and its another in a LONG list. Hw has been totally inept in every area he has been involved in. Huge problems in all areas of the department. Communications (Eircom and Comreg)...Marine (handling of salmon stocks without a hint of a reasonable compensation to the offshore fishermen) ... Natural Resources (Letting Shell get away with no more than a slight BOO when they broke his own Minesterial order) Has there been a worse minister in the last 30 years in Goverment?

For Communications there definitely hasnt. IMHO

wiredup

Blaster99 wrote:

It has always been my opinion that GBS was a complete waste of money so that fact that it's gone is only good. Little mickey-mousey wireless schemes is not where it's at.

What do you suggest then?
Eircom, Satellite?????

For rural areas wireless is perfect. It's as good as DSL and in my opinion better because you can loose your land line.

Your attitude stinks.
I've been waiting 2 years from GBS to come to me. The customers are here, there is money to be made but now the government have confirmed they cannot be bothered. This country could be so much more........................

Heinrich

Altreab wrote:

Has there been a worse minister in the last 30 years in Goverment?

For Communications there definitely hasnt. IMHO

Cullen, Harney, MacDowell, O'Malley, choice of Aherns? Take your pick.

The problem is that these guys haven't the faintest idea about the departments they are lording over.

They could start looking where Broadband is working and take their leads from there. There is a village in the canton of Vaud, Switzerland with approximately 200 souls and it has had BB for at least 10 years. Must be the money.

ScumLord

In the two years since the Group Broadband Scheme only 7,200 subscribers have signed up from potential pool of 400,000 subscribers.

To a certain extend the people can be blamed for that, they just won't sign up for these things but if it was roled out much more would actually get the service.

oscarBravo

Blaster99 wrote:

It has always been my opinion that GBS was a complete waste of money so that fact that it's gone is only good. Little mickey-mousey wireless schemes is not where it's at.

I respectfully submit that the thousands of people who wouldn't have broadband at all, were it not for "little mickey-mousey wireless schemes", would disagree.

viking

oscarBravo wrote:

I respectfully submit that the thousands of people who wouldn't have broadband at all, were it not for "little mickey-mousey wireless schemes", would disagree.

I agree, it was all we had until eircom decided to enable the exchange out of the blue but boy were we glad it was there, "mickey-mouse" or not.

I suppose when the Department has allegedly not got enough staff to run it properly then something has to give, looks like the GBS got it in the neck...

mayhem#

molinaalexis wrote:

In the two years since the Group Broadband Scheme only 7,200 subscribers have signed up from potential pool of 400,000 subscribers.

Which clearly indicates that there is no demand for broadband in rural areas.
/me dons flame-retardant underwear..
;-)

E.

dahamsta

thegills wrote:

There was €25M earmarked for GBS, whats going to happen to the remaining €20M.

Very interesting question. Ploughed back into the Reannouncement Pool I'll wager.

I hope IrelandOffline will ask the Dishonourable Minister this question.

adam

Blaster99

oscarBravo wrote:

I respectfully submit that the thousands of people who wouldn't have broadband at all, were it not for "little mickey-mousey wireless schemes", would disagree.

All they could get was connectivity to a mickey mousey wireless scheme because the money was spent incorrectly, so that's not much of an argument is it? The whole thing was obviously a complete failure if only a couple of thousand people got connected. The sooner it was scrapped the better.

thebman

Reforms in the scheme to fix the issues might have been a better route than scrapping the entire scheme.

We'll have to wait and see what they actually plan to do with money left over before deciding if it was a good idea to cancel the group broadband scheme.

Assuming they have a plan.

JohnC.

I heard Damien talking to George Hook about it on Newstalk on my way home from work. He did mention that it was only open for a limited time, but only barely got to mention it. I think maybe that fact could have been emphasised a bit more as being the reason why nobody signed up recently.

I also learned that Damien has a stalker:eek:

oscarBravo

Blaster99 wrote:

All they could get was connectivity to a mickey mousey wireless scheme because the money was spent incorrectly, so that's not much of an argument is it?

...as opposed to doing what with it? What would you suggest the €5m should have been spent on? How many people would have been connected to broadband as a result?

Blaster99 wrote:

The whole thing was obviously a complete failure if only a couple of thousand people got connected.

I'm not sure exactly how it was supposed to be any more successful than it was, considering that no applications for funding have been permitted since April 2005. The numbers are also misleading, given that (in my experience, at least) customers continue to be connected to these schemes on an ongoing basis, but no further grant money is payable once the deadline for completion of each scheme has passed, and therefore these new customers are not counted.

Blaster99 wrote:

The sooner it was scrapped the better.

It was scrapped at the end of April 2005. It just wasn't announced until now.

Altreab

Blaster99 wrote:

All they could get was connectivity to a mickey mousey wireless scheme because the money was spent incorrectly, so that's not much of an argument is it? The whole thing was obviously a complete failure if only a couple of thousand people got connected. The sooner it was scrapped the better.

The schemes may have been "Mickey Mouse" IYHO but it also had the side effect of Gettting Eircom off its arse in rural areas and actually upgrading their local exchanges in much the way they do when other wireless companies start working in an area.

SkepticOne

Altreab wrote:

The schemes may have been "Mickey Mouse" IYHO but it also had the side effect of Gettting Eircom off its arse in rural areas and actually upgrading their local exchanges in much the way they do when other wireless companies start working in an area.

I would agree with this. Before the GBS, Eircom had a scheme whereby you registered your interest having your exchange upgraded. If the number of registrations of interest passed a certain "trigger level" then they would consider upgrading your exchange. The problem was that these "trigger levels" usually exceeded the total number of households in the town. The scheme was not really about upgrading exchanges but rather about justifying Eircom's lack of action outside the major urban areas. Once the scheme got going, Eircom actually participated in some of them. Because the GBS was not exclusively for Eircom's benefit, Eircom were forced to radically lower their criteria. In fact, shortly after the GBS was announced, Eircom announced a further upgrading of exchanges largely overlapping the same communities that would have been covered by the GBS. This is the real success of the GBS although, as pointed out by oscarBravo and others, things could have been much better.

Zaphod

"Dempsey rejects IFA proposals on broadband provision"

Ciaran Mullooly, Midlands Correspondent, reports that the IFA said a group scheme failed because the service was too expensive in the countryside

link: http://dynamic.rte.ie/av/230-2213285.smil

MrShadow

Lucky enough to be in Sligo where fastcom offer 2mb down 2mb up for €40 a month

you cant even get that upload with Eircom's current offering. All thanks to GBS for getting it started. Recently Eircom press released that they were upgrading 2 local exchanges for broadband. (and why is this ? out of the goodness of their little hearts. Call me cynical but I think not!)

thebman

I think they should have had minimum standards for what speeds would be required for a Group Broadband Scheme as Lastmile is way worse than what MrShadow is saying fastcom provide for the same price.

No consistency or basically a good idea implemented in a half ass way.

jbkenn

brim4brim wrote:

I think they should have had minimum standards for what speeds would be required for a Group Broadband Scheme

They did, 512k

jbkenn

Blaster99

oscarBravo wrote:

...as opposed to doing what with it? What would you suggest the €5m should have been spent on? How many people would have been connected to broadband as a result?

Was the budget not €25m? Regardless, the money would have been better spent on tender to ensure everyone got/gets broadband. More money would no doubt have been required but wasting 3-4 years on GBS wasn't the alternative.

As for the eircom enabling exchanges "problem", what do you guys expect them to do? They are obviously going to roll out broadband where feasible and will continue to do so. The same goes for their competitors no doubt. There was a handful of GBS schemes and eircom has enabled hundreds of exchanges since the GBS started. I fail to see the connection.

SkepticOne

Blaster99 wrote:

Was the budget not €25m? Regardless, the money would have been better spent on tender to ensure everyone got/gets broadband. More money would no doubt have been required but wasting 3-4 years on GBS wasn't the alternative.

Most likely this would have resulted in the tax-payer subsidising the extending of Eircom's monopoly which, of course, has been the problem all along.

I think the big mistake of the Government was when Eircom announced the ubgrading of 200 exchanges in response to the threat to their monopoly posed by the GBS, the government should have changed the scope to include smaller towns thereby keeping the pressure up on Eircom.

watty

The GBS was rubbish in a way. It should be scrapped as it was working very badly. Except the reason for scrapping it is a lie.

It should be replaced with a NEW GBS.
* No date for putting in applications
* 100% capital funding for backhaul setup
* 100% capital funding for basestations
* Group must have a viable business plan for costs of Client gear, running Network etc . Viability to be verified by independent auditors, not DMCR.

OR
Replace with tenders for different areas for provison from existing "real" Internet companies at a minimum 1M down / 128k up and maximum 70ms ping (to avoid poor 3G or Satellite solutions).

Altreab

Altreab wrote:

This is another example of Dempsey mismanagement and its another in a LONG list. Hw has been totally inept in every area he has been involved in. Huge problems in all areas of the department. Communications (Eircom and Comreg)...Marine (handling of salmon stocks without a hint of a reasonable compensation to the offshore fishermen) ... Natural Resources (Letting Shell get away with no more than a slight BOO when they broke his own Minesterial order) Has there been a worse minister in the last 30 years in Goverment?

For Communications there definitely hasnt. IMHO

Oh and of course i forgot his earlier hi-tech adventure with electronic voting!!

shortys94

Did this effect westnet? I just noticed their website is down, or is it just being edited.

oscarBravo

shortys94 wrote:

Did this effect westnet?

Not particularly.

shortys94 wrote:

I just noticed their website is down...

Not from here, it's not.

wiredup

oscarBravo wrote:

Not particularly. Not from here, it's not.

Are you guys extending your network to reach Partry this year? My neighbour seem to suggest you are in March??????

Re: your website.
Can't you get your forum up and running. It would be very useful for your customers, potential customers and locals to communicate at your site.

oscarBravo

wiredup wrote:

Are you guys extending your network to reach Partry this year?

Almost certainly, but I'm not in a position to give a timeframe right now.

wiredup wrote:

Re: your website.
Can't you get your forum up and running. It would be very useful for your customers, potential customers and locals to communicate at your site.

We don't have a forum. If we decide we need one, we'll look at taking a commercial interaction forum here on boards.

I know the website's a bit crap, but it will be replaced soon.

clohamon

molinaalexis wrote:

THE Government has decided to scrap its Group Broadband Scheme after two years and over €5m in investment.

Comptroller and Auditor General looks into government waste.

He can be contacted here http://www.audgen.gov.ie/viewdoc.asp?fn=/documents/Contact_points.htm