best place to go for ski holiday???

wanabe

please help,
i'm booking a ski holiday round mid to end of february for myself and the mrs.! dont have a clue where to go! any advice would be greatly appreciated!!!
cheers!!!!!!!!!!

ditpoker

Arinsal in Andorra is cheap and cheerful. topflight.ie will sort ya out with a good package. Its good for beginners, and there's 20-30cm of snow there which is grand. There's limited runs but if your just looking for something basic its perfect. tax free too i think so very cheap once there. Only problem is there is potentially a long transfer from airport to location. If not on a budget and are looking for high class slopes try france.

i'll be going to bulgaria!!

ditpoker

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055036298 also click here and support the opening of a ski forum!

5starpool

For a combination of lively town, decent selection of slopes for beginners, usually good snow and cheap prices, you can't really go wrong with Livigno in Italy. Mid-end Feb though is usually the dearest time to go due to half term breaks in schools and they might be all booked up.

Andorra also ticks the above boxes and is very popular with first timers. France, Austria and Switzerland usually have the shortest transfer times from airoprst though, and Andorra the longest (up to 7 hours in some cases). Hope it goes well for you.

banchang

If you are a beginner I strongly recommend Niederau Austria, Hotel Staffler (Google it to have a look, Inghams & others do it from Dublin).

Its a stones throw from the nursery slopes, great food (all-in price, incl a litre of red or white wine on your table at dinner whether you want it or not !), & very reasonable prices.

If you are staying in this hotel make sure to request a room on the other side of the building from the disco.

Slopes in this resort are great for beginners/intermediates, not much challenge above that, but presume you are in the first category.

jank

Ive heard that the ski is crap this year because of the lack of snow. Is this true.
Was planning to book sometime in feb but recent reports have put me off.

Imposter

There is very little snow at the moment but that should change in the next few weeks.

I was skiing the last 3 days and while the whole resort wasn't open there were runs open and the snow up top (say above 1000m) was good. Down lower it wasn't so good but was mostly skiable. There are patchy bits though as there is a lot less snow than usual.

Once it snows for a few days the resorts will be the same as always so not going in february or march would be silly as there has to be snow before then.

wanabe

thanks for all the advice guys. kinda leaning towards france at the moment! does web cams on www.snoweye.com are class! looks like good snow in a lot of resorts and its only jan.

ionapaul

If you want to have an enjoyable holiday on the cheap (who doesn't?) then I have the answer for you: go to Zakopane in Poland. Fly to Kracow with the wonderful Ryanair, rent a minibus to take the group up to Zakopane (in Feb 20005 this cost us the equivalent of EUR100, seated 10 of us), have a house rented up there for the week / fortnight and away you go! I have been to Livigno, which is cool, but Poland is way WAY cheaper and can be just as fun if you got a good group going.

I should note that for me and most of our crew, the snowboarding was secondary in importance to the availability of hot babes, good food and cheap booze! There is no 'unified' ski pass to buy that works throughout the different runs surrounding the town, you gotta purchase each one daily. That said, for 8 days of awesome snowboarding, drinking, eating and partying in our own mansion, I only spent EUR800 over the entire week (flights, living expenses, snowboard rental, taxis, ski passes) - that includes eating a 3 course meal every night and drinking obscene amounts of alcohol while there! Show me a better value week on the slopes in Europe...

robinph

wanabe wrote:

does web cams on www.snoweye.com are class!

More snowy webcams here.

jank

Anybody know the best place travel agents for deals

Ill love ya loads!:)

jank

Booked Alpbach in Austria. Think its a good deal especially flying out of cork.
Having a look around at the webcams and the forecast. Still very bare from the looks of it.

I remember Slovenia last year there was snow everywhere but this year there is **** all. And it was around this time last year too!!
Just hope for a blizzard the week before we go!!

Anybody ever been to alpbach??

sharingan

wanabe wrote:

i'm booking a ski holiday round mid to end of february for myself and the mrs.! dont have a clue where to go! any advice would be greatly appreciated!!!

As a beginner we found Livignio (italy) to be excellent. Good night life, superb nursery slopes (we are talking miles of breadth here) and lots of higher blue runs to challenge what you have learned.

As a couple, you will be looking for hotels too, self catering isnt an option (price). I am not too sure what your tastes are, but a couple may want different things out of a ski-holiday than a thirsty bunch of lads/lasses or a group of hardcore skiers. Perhaps the character of the resort might be more important.

We were in Soll/Ski Welt (austria) last week. Tough for beginners as the skiing around Soll was poor and hard. Beginners really only could do 2 short runs. Skiing in Westendorf was considerably better. Higher austrian & french resorts have better snow.

jank wrote:

Anybody know the best place travel agents for deals

DirectSki.com is excellent. Really good booking experience too. Many operators have terrible
on-line booking features.

ditpoker wrote:

Arinsal in Andorra is cheap and cheerful. topflight.ie will sort ya out with a good package. Its good for beginners, and there's 20-30cm of snow there which is grand.

20-30cm? Ew. Note that Andorra is very touristy. Arinsal in particular can be very tough for beginners in poor snow conditions due to the lack of dedicated nursery slopes and the fact that the piste operators will overcrowd the slopes. I would recommend Pas de la Casa over Arinsal any day.

banchang wrote:

If you are a beginner I strongly recommend Niederau Austria, Hotel Staffler (Google it to have a look, Inghams & others do it from Dublin).

Very quiet night life though. And the resort is small.

banchang wrote:

Slopes in this resort are great for beginners/intermediates, not much challenge above that, but presume you are in the first category.

Agreed, it was good for learning last year.

Imposter wrote:

There is very little snow at the moment but that should change in the next few weeks.

Note that poor snow conditions make skiing harder, especially for beginners. For better snow conditions I would recommend higher altitude resorts where they can run the snow cannons. Note that nursery slopes tend to be lower, making for tough skiing.

Imposter

sharingan wrote:

We were in Soll/Ski Welt (austria) last week. Tough for beginners as the skiing around Soll was poor and hard. Beginners really only could do 2 short runs. Skiing in Westendorf was considerably better. Higher austrian & french resorts have better snow.

I've been to Söll and I know the conditions so far this year are crap but there is nothing wrong with it in skiing terms for beginners and intermediates. Beginners don't need very many runs and there are quite a few blues and easy reds in Söll. Sure the beginner won't get out into the big resort but such a skier will/should be more interested in practising his or her technique than trying out loads of different pistes.

sharingan

Imposter wrote:

I've been to Söll and I know the conditions so far this year are crap but there is nothing wrong with it in skiing terms for beginners and intermediates.

Intermediates are fine, but beginners no. Beginners ski school lift pass in the Soll area, gets you the short nursery run and a 1 minute descent further up the mountain. Its pretty piss poor actually - spending most of your skiing on draglifts and chair lifts.

Imposter wrote:

Beginners don't need very many runs and there are quite a few blues and easy reds in Söll.

Skiing conditions are quite difficult currently. There aren't any 'easy' reds in Soll at the moment as a result.

Imposter wrote:

Sure the beginner won't get out into the big resort but such a skier will/should be more interested in practising his or her technique than trying out loads of different pistes.

I wouldn't stereotype beginners like that. When we were beginners, trying new runs, especially long but untaxing blue runs was part of the fun. It gave for a big sense of achievement, and exploring is fun. Some people learn better than others, and restricting them to 1% of the overall piste is not fun. The guys didn't complain that much, but they missed out on some way better beginner runs in Brixen, Scheffau and Westendorf.

It just doesn't compare at all to the quality and availability of blue runs in soemwhere like Livignio.

Imposter

sharingan wrote:

Beginners ski school lift pass in the Soll area, gets you the short nursery run and a 1 minute descent further up the mountain. Its pretty piss poor actually - spending most of your skiing on draglifts and chair lifts.

Well when I was there the beginner pass (the local Söll pass) got you about 5 or 6 chairlifts as well as the nursery runs at the bottom. The blue run ot the bottom from the middle was just a narrowish road and not very nice for a beginner and the red to the bottom got a bit nasty towards the end of the day and wasn't in any way suitable for beginners but up top it was no problem at all for beginners. There was one easy red part coming off a chair lift just above the gondola station that wasn't all that difficult for anyone that had got past the nursery slopes.

I wouldn't stereotype beginners like that. When we were beginners, trying new runs, especially long but untaxing blue runs was part of the fun. It gave for a big sense of achievement, and exploring is fun. Some people learn better than others, and restricting them to 1% of the overall piste is not fun. The guys didn't complain that much, but they missed out on some way better beginner runs in Brixen, Scheffau and Westendorf.

It just doesn't compare at all to the quality and availability of blue runs in soemwhere like Livignio.

Would their passes not have been limited in Brixen, Scheffau and Westendorf too? They could have always got the full pass but if you are going for a week and getting lessons most of the week you go where the instructor brings you.

The reality is that a hell of a lot of the blue runs i've seen all around Austria are roads. Some are wide enough to be easy to ski for a beginner and others aren't. I'm sure other countries are similar. I guess it depends on the group that's going skiing where you go to but I know a few places in Austria that are nice and flatish for beginners but boring as hell for intermediates. Similarly there's a few resorts with some beautiful tough reds and easy blacks that a beginner just couldn't go near. I actually though Söll had a fair enough mix for everyone.

sharingan

Imposter wrote:

Well when I was there the beginner pass (the local Söll pass) got you about 5 or 6 chairlifts as well as the nursery runs at the bottom.

But not this year. Soll has been really hurt by the weather. As much as I complained about it, we probably lucked out on the best week of the season so far.

Imposter wrote:

The blue run ot the bottom from the middle was just a narrowish road and not very nice for a beginner

Closed.

Imposter wrote:

and the red to the bottom got a bit nasty towards the end of the day and wasn't in any way suitable for beginners

Closed.

Imposter wrote:

but up top it was no problem at all for beginners. There was one easy red part coming off a chair lift just above the gondola station that wasn't all that difficult for anyone that had got past the nursery slopes.

You are limited to the nurserly slopes only, the 2 man lift run, and that easy-red I think. But snow conditions are making those easy-reds quite difficult indeed. That nursery area is probably very close to melted now.

Imposter wrote:

Would their passes not have been limited in Brixen, Scheffau and Westendorf too? They could have always got the full pass but if you are going for a week and getting lessons most of the week you go where the instructor brings you.

There is a higher proportion of blues in Brixen, Scheffau & Westendorf. Skiing was easier and snow was better. The poor snow also meant that you couldn't 'ski-over'. The runs were longer and more satisfying too.

Imposter wrote:

The reality is that a hell of a lot of the blue runs i've seen all around Austria are roads. Some are wide enough to be easy to ski for a beginner and others aren't. I'm sure other countries are similar.

Not really. A blue run is a blue run. Its got more to do with the steepness of the slope, and the skill required to descend it. Factors like whether steep sections are coupled with natural brakeing areas are a factor, also whether there is merging traffic. Scheffau/Brixen & Westendorf had big wide blue runs.

Imposter wrote:

I guess it depends on the group that's going skiing where you go to but I know a few places in Austria that are nice and flatish for beginners but boring as hell for intermediates. Similarly there's a few resorts with some beautiful tough reds and easy blacks that a beginner just couldn't go near. I actually though Söll had a fair enough mix for everyone.

It does. It broke our hearts to read the lie of the land and know how great this could have been. We had several favourable reports from mixed-skill groups too. But Soll in its current condition cannot be recommended this year unless there is some kind of miracle snow storm. You are better off checking higher resorts this year, where subzero nighttime conditions allow snowcannons to maintain the slopes.

5starpool

There is a new Winter Sports forum here that will hopefully get some good discussions like this going.

"If you build it they will come......"

/end shameless pimping

Cheese Princess

Went to Livignio last year in a group of 9. We were a mixed bunch experience-wise and everyone had a really great time. As a beginner the instructors were great and we had plenty of variety of slopes. We went with Directski who did a good all-inclusive deal - we had 2 apartments in the middle of Livignio. The nightlife is good and there are some great restaurants. The only drawback is the long-ish transer from the airport - about 4.5 hours, but the scenery is amazing.

Imposter

sharingan wrote:

Not really. A blue run is a blue run. Its got more to do with the steepness of the slope, and the skill required to descend it.

It has everything to do with the steepness afaik. I've seen a lot of blues which are used to get people to the bottom instead of reds and they are roads. They are narrow and often have a steepish drop on one side. At the bigger resorts it's better and yes of course most resorts have nice big blue runs somewhere but these roads are dangerous imo and are needed as they are the only 'easy' (less stepp) way to the bottom in a lot of cases.

It does. It broke our hearts to read the lie of the land and know how great this could have been. We had several favourable reports from mixed-skill groups too. But Soll in its current condition cannot be recommended this year unless there is some kind of miracle snow storm. You are better off checking higher resorts this year, where subzero nighttime conditions allow snowcannons to maintain the slopes.

Yep that's ****. I'd be gutted if I forked out what most from Ireland have to fork out for a ski holiday only to discover bad snow conditions.

Looks like it's going to snow next week though which should allow me to extract some value from my season pass Anyone going skiing from next week should be ok if the weathermen are to be believed.

sharingan

Imposter wrote:

It has everything to do with the steepness afaik. I've seen a lot of blues which are used to get people to the bottom instead of reds and they are roads. They are narrow and often have a steepish drop on one side. At the bigger resorts it's better and yes of course most resorts have nice big blue runs somewhere but these roads are dangerous imo and are needed as they are the only 'easy' (less stepp) way to the bottom in a lot of cases.

It simply depends on the resort. There are plenty of resorts like you said whose blues are summertime roads with snow on them. They are not that challenging really, but they are tiring, especially when you control your speed too much and have to walk. If there is any steepness at all to them they can be quite hard, especially if very narrow, but most of those should be reds.

But there are plenty of resorts which have blues that don't fit the criteria for blue run that you describe. Pas de la Casa has a gorge run thats a blue - narrow, but bowl shaped, its easy to do and a lot of fun. Livignio has a lot of wide blue runs that can get quite steep in places - but the steepness is coupled with arrest hills or long plateaus - the lie of the land will help correct your speed. Arinsal has quite a few blue runs where you can go quite fast indeed, especially near the top, and as beginners we had no trouble with them (we thought they were a lot of fun actually). Niederau had a section near the bottom - a steep descent section followed by a long plateau, it was troubling to beginners who had not got comfortable with skiing at speed, and boarders had some issues with it, but it was still a blue.

Any resort that has a bias towards the beginner/inexperienced intermediate will have a lot of unconventional blue runs, especially if the resort is large. The phenomenon of which you speak tends to occur more in more challenging resorts which are trying to increase their blue count (as beginner-biased resorts make more money).

Imposter wrote:

Yep that's ****. I'd be gutted if I forked out what most from Ireland have to fork out for a ski holiday only to discover bad snow conditions.

In future I will go with higher, good infrastructure resorts. It seems to be the only reliable way to get snow. Height and infrastructure can overcome a weak snow season. I refuse to ski in rain again.

Imposter wrote:

Looks like it's going to snow next week though which should allow me to extract some value from my season pass Anyone going skiing from next week should be ok if the weathermen are to be believed.

Snow is falling and temps are below freezing, even Soll is predicted some snow:
http://www.skiwelt.at/index.php?l=de&nID=x42fb0e54956f35.02971788

More interesting is the freezing conditions, Soll has a great %coverage by snow cannons and their piste operators are really good at using that snow. Anyone who is there already, spend your time in Westendorf for the best skiing. People going next week should have a better holiday. As little as a 20cm snowfall should reopen nearly all the slopes again.

Imposter

sharingan wrote:

In future I will go with higher, good infrastructure resorts. It seems to be the only reliable way to get snow. Height and infrastructure can overcome a weak snow season. I refuse to ski in rain again.

The disadvantage with going higher is on a normal year it gets really cold the higher you go. I was skiing 2 weeks ago in the rain too and I fould the best thing to do was to go with no goggles or glasses. The snow wasn't *too* bad.

I was chatting to a work colleague last week. Now this guy knows his stuff. He's from Bad Gastein and is a judge on the snowboard circuit (half pipe i think). Anyways he was saying that this year was a right off as the ground has not frozen and that any snow that falls will not stay as long as it would have normally. I hope he's wrong!

sharingan

Imposter wrote:

The disadvantage with going higher is on a normal year it gets really cold the higher you go. I was skiing 2 weeks ago in the rain too and I fould the best thing to do was to go with no goggles or glasses. The snow wasn't *too* bad.

I can deal with cold. The worst place that the cold effects you is on rickety slow chairlifts. This year the beginner lads were dressing down the whole time, they couldn't wear their ski jackets because it was too warm, and went up with wind protectors/hiking jackets instead. You can always add layers; whats probably a greater concern is high-altitude stamina.

I also had the same goggles issue as yourself. I was wearing standard shades though, and I just had to take them off. My skiing improved when I could make out the definition of the slope. I am not generally a goggles guy except when it is actively snowing.

Imposter wrote:

I was chatting to a work colleague last week. Now this guy knows his stuff. He's from Bad Gastein and is a judge on the snowboard circuit (half pipe i think). Anyways he was saying that this year was a right off as the ground has not frozen and that any snow that falls will not stay as long as it would have normally. I hope he's wrong!

Bad Gastein is not doing too bad for Austria though. I would say what he means by that is that there will be almost no extended skiing in europe as a result of that. This mostly affects the off-piste though - I could visibly see that disappearing in Soll. But good piste operators use the off-piste as a snow resevoir, and when the off-piste is exposed it accelerates the melting of the pistes as the trees and brown earth absorbs sunlight very well.

Thinking of booking a late March or April holiday? Bring your mountain bike or hiking boots.