I'm now a professional pub player

NickyOD

So the club was quiet on Wednesday ngiht. Not enough players for our 30+5 freezeout because it clashed with a very popular pub game at the barge pub in Ennis. I went down there with one of my dealers to see to see what the commotion was about and by showing my face maybe spread the word about my club and see if any players were interested in some cash action afterwards.

The tournameny was a €50 buy in with 3 rebuys and one top up. The starting stack was 5K. rebuys got you 5K but the top up got you 25K in chips!!

Blind levels were about 20 minutes I think, starting at 100-200/200-400/300-600/500-1000/1000-2000/2000-4000/3000-6000/5000-10,000/10,000-20,000/20,000-40,000

Tournament was self deal. I honestly don't know how much rake was taken but I think it was very low, because the payouts were good.

It was self deal. There was no cutting card and I could see the base card most of the time someone else was dealing. I said something the first time but then stopped because it was just slowing the game down so much. I gambled a lot early, got aces busted, used all my rebuys and topped up to have basically the shortest stack I could have of 30K after the rebuy period. I double up with AT V KQ, Then gambled on a flushdraw and a gutshot when I open pushed for 86K into 32K pot. I was called by 2 pair and I hit my flush. Wakka Wakka!! After that I was a huge chip leader and basically smashed up the tournament. I was chip leader going into the final table with a massive stack of 8.5 big blinds. everage looked to be about 3 blinds. I saw some players with 4 blinds limping in then folding to a raise. Players in the blinds with half their stacks in the middle were folding to raises. I was getting walks on my Big blind when the small blind had half a big blind left, that sort of stuff. I won €1800 for first place. Sweet!!! To be fair to the organisers they are very nice people, try to run a very fair game, and are restricted by time so the tournament has to be crapshooty.

Some interesting rules here in the Wesht. In the event of an odd chip in a split pot the two players are dealt 2 holdem hands and then a flop, turn and river is dealt to decide who gets it. You can say "I call", throw in a chip and then say "and I raise this much" and throw in more. If you throw in one big chip and say nothing its a raise. If your blinds are in before the blinds go up then the blinds don't go up. After the tournament there were, wait for it, 5 full cash games going on in the pub and they went on until 4 or 5 in the morning. They were mostly gambling games like 7 card brag, southern cross and draw poker.

How will I ever be able to get these players to come to my poker room? It's just a totally different culture.

Atlas_IRL

How will I ever be able to get these players to come to my poker room? It's just a totally different culture.

simple..... its called alcohol.



actually strange that the cash games went on for so long cause these games are normally a crap shoot as they have to be kicked out at about 12... although there's prob a lot more lock-ins down there

Did you have a chat with the TD? maybe he can promote your club to people or do a deal with you of some sort

NickyOD

Atlas_IRL wrote:

simple..... its called alcohol.



actually strange that the cash games went on for so long cause these games are normally a crap shoot as they have to be kicked out at about 12... although there's prob a lot more lock-ins down there

Did you have a chat with the TD? maybe he can promote your club to people or do a deal with you of some sort

I don't think having a bottle license would change a thing, and to be honest even if it did I don't think I would want alcohol and poker side by side in my card room.

I did speak to the TD, but I don't want to step on anyone's toes. I can't walk into a pub and pass out flyers and business cards because I'm taking away their business.

It just amazes me that playerrs will play self deal, non table-stakes games in a pub where arguments are constant but will not play in a poker room where the games are guaranteed to be well run and fair.

Fatboydim

It's a mystery to me as well Nicky. Sounds very much like one of the pub games in Westport. Strange rules... For example player bets out of turn, player yet to act raises so player who called goes to take chips back. I sounded like a right wanker when I told one player he was string betting. I couldn't help myself... it just came out. - Then I hit top pair with a good kicker. Make a bet to indicate I've got it [ Large enough I thought] Get reraised by player who has A3os no draws and he hits his ace. Later same player - bets the same way with trip kings and knocks me out. - Very few arguments though... But then... over on a couple of tables they're playing southern cross, twin towers and all sorts of mad games with thousands in the pot. Mad... completely mad.

NickyOD

Fatboydim wrote:

Strange rules... For example player bets out of turn, player yet to act raises so player who called goes to take chips back.

lol! That's actually a good rule Len.

"10.08 ACTION OUT OF TURN.
A player who makes action out of turn shall be held to that action when it is his turn, unless intervening action changes the action the out-of-turn actor is facing."

Scotty #

NickyOD wrote:

.....The starting stack was 5K. rebuys got you 5K but the top up got you 25K in chips!!.....

Nicky, I presume your [slightly] exaggerating all this!!!:eek:

I was at a wedding a while ago and met up with an old buddy of mine. He was actually the guy who introduced me to poker. 5 card draw... about 18 Christmas's ago!! Anyway... the conversation eventually moved to poker and he said " I don't really like that Texas stuff... to much luck involved...give me 5 card any day"

Tar.Aldarion

If your blinds are in before the blinds go up then the blinds don't go up.

My favourite rule.

ditpoker

i can beat that rule... i was playing a texasnights pub game at the weekend...

i bet 600 into a 1000 pot on the flop, villain in the hand raises to 1000, i.e. only 400 more, i say "minimum raise must be to 1200" at this three people at the table tell me i'm wrong and he can bet what he likes. I say that that wouldn't make any sense cos then he could make it 625, and i could make it 650 and we'd be here all day, so the table (yes, all of them) called for a ruling, i explained the situation to the TD expecting to be agreed with, afterall it was the TD wasnt it... but no... TD says "no he can raise whatever he likes, you only have to double the blinds bet preflop" ...

so i decide i wasnt going to get involved with this and simply reraised... to 1025... sadly it took him a few seconds to decide if he'd call my massive reraise. :rolleyes:

valor

lol min bet poker.

Tar.Aldarion

Keep raising by 25 all night.

BigDragon

Scotty # wrote:

Nicky, I presume your [slightly] exaggerating all this!!!:eek:

100% true. Top-up 5x the starting stack. Fcuk GJP. Theres valyyyya. :rolleyes:

Hawk Eye

Was at a pub tourney last night, better structure then the usual ones anyway can anyone tell me what a check bet is? I started breaking my **** laughing at this term everyone seem to be using it, something to do with the minimum bet which I taught would have been fairly obvious.

Tar.Aldarion

Maybe just a term for a raise when there has been no raise before.
I usually check fold in these situations.

Lplate

NickyOD wrote:

How will I ever be able to get these players to come to my poker room? It's just a totally different culture.

Nicky, you're pissing against the wind. I play in my local from time to time and I just can't persuade the guys playing there to go to the Cue Club. They travel long distances regularly to play in pub tourneys but will not go to the club. I've asked why a few times and never really get an answer. The only reason I can come up with is a sort of feeling of intimidation with everything being "proper" and maybe being worried about looking foolish. It's a shame because there are a couple there who I think would do quite well in a better game once they'd seen it in action.

Jaden

2 Suggestions:

Offer to bring dealers for the last 2 tables, in return for being let pimp your club.

Offer a high hand prize of a free ticket to one of your tournies, in return for pimpage.

Tar.Aldarion

A lot of people do not like the 'strict' rules of poker and would ony play home games or in pubs. Fair enough imo.

Fatboydim

I agree that there's probably an intimidation factor to some degree. There's also a feeling that Texas hold 'em is a new fangled game... But something else as well. I think many of them begrudge the idea of Rake. These guys don't mind pissing their money away on two outers or gutshot straight draws... But they'll park half a mile away rather than pay 6oc an hour for a car park. They argue over a 10c rise in a pint. They'll go from bookmaker to bookmaker to get a price of 3/1 instead of 11/4.

kebabfest

Poker players are very much creatures of habit and go to what they know.
I remember old Merrion players who would never set foot in the Fitz and visa versa.
A club where I am from managed to get a load of players as the manager used to organise a vegasnites type thing in a local pub. Then when he opened the club everybody came along.
If you put on a little mini-festival (bit the bullet and add cash to prizes etc.) THEY'LL COME.
Once you have a poker player in the once and the likes the gaff they'll defo come back. (although getting the pints in is hard to compete with!!)
is there no loophole by making it a members club and asking people to bring their own booze.

patmac

NickyOD wrote:

Tournament was self deal. I honestly don't know how much rake was taken but I think it was very low, because the payouts were good.

It was self deal. There was no cutting card and I could see the base card most of the time someone else was dealing. I said something the first time but then stopped because it was just slowing the game down so much. I gambled a lot early, got aces busted, used all my rebuys and topped up to have basically the shortest stack I could have of 30K after the rebuy period. I double up with AT V KQ, Then gambled on a flushdraw and a gutshot when I open pushed for 86K into 32K pot. I was called by 2 pair and I hit my flush. Wakka Wakka!! After that I was a huge chip leader and basically smashed up the tournament. I was chip leader going into the final table with a massive stack of 8.5 big blinds. everage looked to be about 3 blinds. I saw some players with 4 blinds limping in then folding to a raise. Players in the blinds with half their stacks in the middle were folding to raises. I was getting walks on my Big blind when the small blind had half a big blind left, that sort of stuff. I won €1800 for first place. Sweet!!! To be fair to the organisers they are very nice people, try to run a very fair game, and are restricted by time so the tournament has to be crapshooty.

After the tournament there were, wait for it, 5 full cash games going on in the pub and they went on until 4 or 5 in the morning. They were mostly gambling games like 7 card brag, southern cross and draw poker.

Standard.
As regards getting them into the casino you should talk to the crowd who own the one in Athlone they have totally decimated the PE Monday night game in the Shamrock Lodge which is thinking of moving to a Tuesday night because thats the night the casino is closed, the €100 buy in could be a factor.

gosplan

Hey Nicky,

I take it your club is in Ennis as well then?

Looking for a Christmas poker night with a mate somwhere outside Dublin.

Can anyone recommend a good play to go and play till all hours.
(Criteria: lots of drunks, not too far to drive)

leaba

Could also be to do with perception...

It's not unusual for people to be in a pub 5 or 6 nights a week without raising an eyebrow, but if you go to a casino/card room once in a while you've clearly got a gambling problem.

sprocket1

id ring the police and complain about all the noise in the area with the afterhours drinking etc you know the crack as a harrissed neighbour etc especcially on the night in questiion hopefully they will raid the place when the cash games are in full flow

NickyOD

sprocket1 wrote:

id ring the police and complain about all the noise in the area with the afterhours drinking etc you know the crack as a harrissed neighbour etc especcially on the night in questiion hopefully they will raid the place when the cash games are in full flow

No, No No!! I wouldn't want that at all!!! The pub is not in a residential area and the crowd from what I saw is not rough.

I met lots of really nice people there and I would never want to get in the way of a harmless social outlet. The guy running the tournaments is a nice man who doesn't try to rip people off. I don't think he has any involvement in the side games. People just seem to be bringing their own cheap dice chips to the pub.

Yes it's completely illegal what goes on their but at the end of the day if I can't get my poker room up to scratch and offer them a game that will drag them away from the pubs then that's my problem and no one elses and I'm not going to use any underhanded tactics to impact on any other games going on in the town.

sprocket1

on a promotion note what about a topless dealer night?? (female would be my persusion ,others here may have their own tastes)

nipples like monkeys fingers and that you could hang a wet duffle coat off them would of course be a natural prerequisite during the interview process

dvdfan

Im not sure how to get the player from pub to club but i play alot online yet i havent played at all in the local club or any of the pub tourneys. 2 Main reasons are 1) none of my mates play and 2) although i know the rules pretty good from online play its a whole new ball game playing live. A flyer/business card with rules for newbies might help explaining the basic rules possibly, and things like what check/raise/all in mean etc

For me the main thing keeping me out of the local club is going in and basically making a fool of myself. Also maybe having someone friendly their that will explain the rules to newbies might encourage new people...like they do in lap dancing clubs:D

Maybe thats over the top but i still think a flyer or maybe business cards like nightclub concessions explaining how a poker clubs works and the basic rules, things like tipping, is it optional, whats a fair amount, are you greeted and asked where you want to sit or do you just sit at a table, how do you buyin, do you go to a cashier and get chips or do u get them at the table etc etc and put them out in the pubs and chippers (that dont promote their own poker games). Ennis seems popular enough for stags and parties and theres always a few degenerate gambler from the group that might not know theres a club in town.

I know the above might sound like strange questions for regulars but for someone like me who has never set foot in a poker room but plays online these are types of things id like to know in advance to prevent me looking like a fool

DubTony

Nicky, without a doubt it's the intimidation factor. Going to the pub, having a few drinks and playing some cards is, for most fellahs, all they want. The card rooms have a distinct characteristic that pub games don't; people know what they're doing. And for guys who just want a bit of craic, a card room is seen as way too serious and not as much fun.

I played (badly) in the double chance in the SE on Thusday last and to be honest, I think I'd rather have been watching telly. Meanwhile a bunch of lads from (I heard) Paddy Power were at another table having the time of their lives in what was a very pub-like atmosphere. Lots of shouting and laughing, and having a great time.

Here's a suggestion. Convince the guy who organises the pub game that he should try a night in your card room. Open up the place for a private tournament when you're usually closed so that none of the players will be intimidated by the "how could you call with that" brigade. If he can get a gang over there some night you'll be on a winner. Offer the players vouchers that will cover their registration for future tournaments in the club and cross your fingers.

The thing about advertising is that you never know how much of it is effective. This way you'll know for sure as these guys come back to the card room, vouchers in hand, with their voucherless buddies in tow.

GL

Doc Farrell

NickyOD wrote:

No, No No!! I wouldn't want that at all!!! The pub is not in a residential area and the crowd from what I saw is not rough.

I met lots of really nice people there and I would never want to get in the way of a harmless social outlet. The guy running the tournaments is a nice man who doesn't try to rip people off. I don't think he has any involvement in the side games. People just seem to be bringing their own cheap dice chips to the pub.

Yes it's completely illegal what goes on their but at the end of the day if I can't get my poker room up to scratch and offer them a game that will drag them away from the pubs then that's my problem and no one elses and I'm not going to use any underhanded tactics to impact on any other games going on in the town.

don't be hasty Nicky - he may have a point!
and be sure to tell a few gossips that it was you who made the phonecall!

classic! always follow internet advice! have you thought of perhaps setting a small fire too!

the only way to get people in is to have plenty of small tourneys with 5 euro regs. casinos are places where the majority of punters lose money (sorry to be obvious) so you have to attract them in with good food, inexpensive games and most importantly of all - a pleasant environment. one asshole player can ruin an entire cardrooms future.

I go to the fitz for dinner, sometimes I don't even intend to play, because the food is good and very cheap. advertise the same and put a few well structured gauranteed prize pool 20 euro rebuy games on.

make sure the guys at the front door are positive and professional and be direct with drunks and loudmouths. don't take any attitude from fools and especially from foolish staff.

most regulars play in tourneys not to win first prize but to have a chat and hit the odd final table and just to get away from idiots at work. Mr. Ivory is successful because he is trusted. It takes a long time to gather that trust and the foolish words of the wrong kind of customer or security to undermine it. Good luck with the venture Nicky!

and make that phonecall!