Rant about FPS on console pads

Zombrex

After buying my faboulous 70 euro second hand Xbox I finished Strangers Wrath there a few days ok. Great game and also very easy to control in first person view, which was a plesent surprise. The last FPS on a console I played was on the PlayStation and I hated it, the analogy stick made it impossible to control properly, you would end up wizzing past the target and shooting up the wall.

So, after Strangers Wrath I was thinking that game designers must have figured out how to make FPS work in the time since my PS1 days. The analog stick moves perfectly. Even the slightest movements are picked up allow for pin point shots, while big movements will smoothly move you around. No jerky "jumps" once you reach a certain threshold on the stick.

So after my good experience and my confidence in console FPS renews I loaded up Time Splitters: Future Shock. Talk about disappointment. I was back to not been able to control the bloody thing. You move the analog stick slightly, nothing happens. Move it a bit more, you turn very slowly. Move it a bit more all of a sudden you have turned 90 degrees and are looking at a wall.

Messed around with the sensitivity settings but to no avail.

Hoping this was just a problem with TS I loaded up Halo 2. Same problem. Sensitivity on 3 (default) and I find I either have to aim very slowly (while getting shot at) or move quickly and just hope that when I take my hand off the analog stick I stop somewhere close to my target and the auto aiming takes over.

After the easy of aiming and logical set up of the analogy stick in Strangers Wrath that made pin point aiming almost as good as a mouse on a PC, I'm so disappointed with the rest of the FPS on the Xbox.

I hope it is just something to get used to, but after the 10th time I slowly aimed in Halo to have the enemy move slightly to the left, me move the analog stick a slight bit more to find myself spinning around to face a wall, I was ready to throw my pad at m own wall.

Rant over

Nick_oliveri

The SmartJoy Frag is an adapter you might find useful. (One for ps2 and xbox) Lik-Sang used to sell it until they shut down. I'm sure you could find something on e bay.

Yes, halo2 can be annoying. I would love to play strangers wrath. Sounds good.

Vegeta

i think the nintendo Wii could solve/marry the 2 together perfectly but no the current way they are going about it

Right I played BF2 quite a bit before my graphics card melted and I loved the mouse aiming and turning, its just class

But I HATE HATE HATE using a keyboard to move the player, it drives me nuts, i am just so crap at it, get a hand cramp and generally find it very uncomfortable

I would love the ability to use a mouse for aiming and a joystick for moving my character, which is kinda like the Wii but not quite

If i were making an FPS for the Wii it would come with a mouse mat and the remote control looking part would be moved like a mouse for aiming and the nunchuck(sp?) would be used to move replacing w, a, s, d etc

humanji

Wicknight wrote:

After buying my faboulous 70 euro second hand Xbox I finished Strangers Wrath there a few days ok. Great game and also very easy to control in first person view, which was a plesent surprise. The last FPS on a console I played was on the PlayStation and I hated it, the analogy stick made it impossible to control properly, you would end up wizzing past the target and shooting up the wall.

So, after Strangers Wrath I was thinking that game designers must have figured out how to make FPS work in the time since my PS1 days. The analog stick moves perfectly. Even the slightest movements are picked up allow for pin point shots, while big movements will smoothly move you around. No jerky "jumps" once you reach a certain threshold on the stick.

So after my good experience and my confidence in console FPS renews I loaded up Time Splitters: Future Shock. Talk about disappointment. I was back to not been able to control the bloody thing. You move the analog stick slightly, nothing happens. Move it a bit more, you turn very slowly. Move it a bit more all of a sudden you have turned 90 degrees and are looking at a wall.

Messed around with the sensitivity settings but to no avail.

Hoping this was just a problem with TS I loaded up Halo 2. Same problem. Sensitivity on 3 (default) and I find I either have to aim very slowly (while getting shot at) or move quickly and just hope that when I take my hand off the analog stick I stop somewhere close to my target and the auto aiming takes over.

After the easy of aiming and logical set up of the analogy stick in Strangers Wrath that made pin point aiming almost as good as a mouse on a PC, I'm so disappointed with the rest of the FPS on the Xbox.

I hope it is just something to get used to, but after the 10th time I slowly aimed in Halo to have the enemy move slightly to the left, me move the analog stick a slight bit more to find myself spinning around to face a wall, I was ready to throw my pad at m own wall.

Rant over

Maybe you're just rubbish at playing games!

Zombrex

humanji wrote:

Maybe you're just rubbish at playing games!

Your mom'ma! :cool:

CiaranC

This used to be a huge bone of contention with me, but Ive recently started playing CoD3 on the 360 and it just... works.

Maybe its just a bizarre co-incidence, but I can consistantly finish top scorer in player matches. Its great fun. Im at a loss as to whats changed, as I was rubbish at Halo 2, with and without the smartjoy frag.

Clank

I used to play PC only for years, then got an Xbox with Halo and never looked back.
You just get used to it over time.

Balfa

CiaranC wrote:

I can consistantly finish top scorer in player matches

Has it occurred to you that all tha players you're finishing ahead of are also using a joypad? heheh.

Yeah, I can't stand FPS games on consoles. Even the good players aim roughly in the vicinity of their prey and then strafe left and right to get their shots on target. It's stupid. I refuse to buy any for consoles as the best experience will always be had on PC. It's like you're just handicapping yourself using a joypad.

joe_chicken

CiaranC wrote:

This used to be a huge bone of contention with me, but Ive recently started playing CoD3 on the 360 and it just... works.

Maybe its just a bizarre co-incidence, but I can consistantly finish top scorer in player matches. Its great fun. Im at a loss as to whats changed, as I was rubbish at Halo 2, with and without the smartjoy frag.

I think the 360's analogues are great...

Not having a playstation or xbox (of any kind), I was always frustrated by FPSs on consoles when I played them in friends house... (Timesplitter's and Halo being the big 2)

The mouse/keyboard has been my favourite since I played Unreal for the first time 8 odd years ago

I played Ghost Recon (360) though recently and the controllers just seem to fit my thumb better... I could never get a grip on the ones for playstation or xbox

CiaranC

Has it occurred to you that all tha players you're finishing ahead of are also using a joypad? heheh.

Obviously. So did everyone finishing ahead of me in Halo 2 on xbox, which is the point.

Even the good players aim roughly in the vicinity of their prey and then strafe left and right to get their shots on target.

This isnt the case with CoD3.

Altough there is an aiming reticule that appears to let you know your shots are on target, which is probably criminal to PC purists.

Zombrex

The thing that annoyed me was the O.W.I managed to get the aiming system down so well with "Strangers Wrath", which proves it is possible.

Which makes it even harder to understand why games like Halo and Time Splitters have such bad aiming systems.

Maybe it is coming from PC FPS games, where one expects uniform movement of the gun (i always turn off mouse acceleration on the PC), rather than this kinda logaritmic system they have in Halo 2 (slight movement slight movement slight movement up to a threshold, then massive movement)

As someone said, I might just need to get used to it.

johnny_ultimate

I've got used to it tbh. PC fps's have their strong points for sure, but the simplicity of console often appeals to me.
Mainly because Stranger's Wrath is so damn cool.

K.O.Kiki

It could also be because Halo & Time Splitters came out yonks before Stranger's Wrath, meaning the SW dev's had time to look at & play with all the different FPS games & figure out what they got right & wrong...

Oh, and I can't stand keyboards for movement either. Get cramps. Plus, joypads level the playing field a bit, don't you think?

thebman

God no. Keyboards and mouse are so much better for FPS than any console controller. Console controllers are just a compromise, they don't offer the control a keyboard and mouse do. Duel analog is such a terrible way of control in FPS because you can't turn fast and if you can turn fast, you can't make the smaller movements that you can with a mouse.

Wii could change that but I have my doubts given no developer (including Nintendo) seems to have managed it yet. Metroid Prime 3 should be close hopefully.

CiaranC

Keyboards and mouse are so much better for FPS than any console controller.

Really? Thanks for letting us know. Im sure nobody here has played quake, doom, half life or unreal on a PC.

brim4brim wins the 'todays most redundant post' award

Mr. Presentable

I'm a fairly brutal FPSer on LAN with my mates - FEAR etc, but online against console gamers I rock!

There's a definite advantage for PC. Having said that, my first FPS was Doom on PSOne. Ah, Deathmatch with the link cable - happy days.

Zillah

Balfa wrote:

Has it occurred to you that all tha players you're finishing ahead of are also using a joypad? heheh.

Exactly. You throw a mouse user with minimum competancy in there I'd be suprised if he didn't wipe the floor with them. Especially if they don't get auto aim.

Creamy Goodness

playing console fps with controller is like playing soccer with no legs tbh.

K.O.Kiki

Zillah wrote:

Exactly. You throw a mouse user with minimum competancy in there I'd be suprised if he didn't wipe the floor with them. Especially if they don't get auto aim.

Not a chance.
I'm starting to feel that people are too locked into their "x is better"-agenda to realise that it's like comparing apples & oranges -- they're both equally good & bad, and you pick your favourites, so let others pick theirs.

Oh, and -for the record- I haven't seen a single CS:S/UT player yet who can beat a Halo 2 player at their own game, or vice-versa.

Zillah

K.O.Kiki wrote:

I'm starting to feel that people are too locked into their "x is better"-agenda to realise that it's like comparing apples & oranges -- they're both equally good & bad, and you pick your favourites, so let others pick theirs.

No, they're not equally good, they use fundamentally different mechanisms and one of those mechanisms is inferior.

A mouse allows you to place the crosshairs at a new coordinate. The speed at which it moves is dictated by the speed at which your hand moves, which means we get a nice brain-to-game interface. Your hand may as well be the crosshairs from the brain's point of view.

A pad requires you to give the crosshairs a new direction, measure its journey and stop it at the required point. The speed at which it moves is dictated by how far the stick has been pushed. That means there is a worse brain-to-game interface. There is an extra processing step.

Its hard to explain to someone who doesn't already get it.

Balfa

Cremo wrote:

playing console fps with controller is like playing soccer with no legs tbh.

Haha, that's perfect.

K.O.Kiki, I'm not sure if you're aware he meant having someone use a mouse against people using controllers, or if you thought he meant having someone proficient with a mouse use a controller against other controllers.

If it's the latter, I agree with you, but if it's the former, you're smoking something... I'd love to see someone with a joypad try to beat someone with a mouse.

And what Zillah says above is true. Most humans are pretty good at estimating distance, but most of them probably don't even know what to measure acceleration in, never mind having any hope of actually estimating it.