SA a joke

John Wine

It used to be the pinnacle of someone's career getting an internationl cap. Now many teams just experiment in Test matches unless it's a World Cup, VI nations, or Tri-Nations.
I can't believe how poor SA were yesterday.
Test matches are started to remind of Soccer friendlies - they are becoming meaningless.

zAbbo

Knee-jerk reaction ?

SA need to find combinations and are doing what any other test team are doing this autumn, and mixing it up.

They don't have the luxury of 6nation games, to try and mould a World Cup squad.

Look at Australia, switching wingers to centres, half backs to centre, and centres to half back in the hope to find out more about versatility and combinations.

I'm not sure what we will gain by playing our best XV in 3 tests ?

What were SA supposed todo ? they rested some of the older players and rewarded the top performers from the Currie cup to come in and show what they can do in test matches.

From SA's disastrous tri-nations, they need to find players who cans step up to WC rugby, of course any team missing Matfield and Berger is going to suffer, I think Steyn on the wing for them looks a good player, so there are some positives.

i think you're way off the mark with this thread, and should put the squad selection in context (poor tri-nations, world cup coming up, and rewarding currie cup players)

Endurance Man

John Wine wrote:

It used to be the pinnacle of someone's career getting an internationl cap. Now many teams just experiment in Test matches unless it's a World Cup, VI nations, or Tri-Nations.
I can't believe how poor SA were yesterday.
Test matches are started to remind of Soccer friendlies - they are becoming meaningless.

Considering we where putting out an experimental team against one of irelands strongest teams in a long time, we didn't do that badly.
Ireland new our back row where inexperienced and took advantage of it a few times.

John Wine

zabbo wrote:

i think you're way off the mark with this thread, and should put the squad selection in context (poor tri-nations, world cup coming up, and rewarding currie cup players)

If they want to experiment to that extent, play an 'A' match.
It would have been nice to see both teams play their strongest teams. I can't take games seriously if teams don't.

toomevara

John Wine wrote:

If they want to experiment to that extent, play an 'A' match.
It would have been nice to see both teams play their strongest teams. I can't take games seriously if teams don't.

Take your point to an extent, but experimentation to a greater or lesser degree is an absolute essential, indeed i'd say duty, for any coach. An A game while uselful can never replicate the intensity of a full international test and if you've got a player who is genuinely putting his hand up, a friendly international is the place to check him out. Look at Steyn for example, looked good in a team on the backfoot, I'd imagine White would be pleased with his first cap performance...

In terms of ireland our first fifteen is practically picking itself at the moment. When it comes to SA rugby though the picture is a lot less clear, with alot of players in the mix, and then if we factor in the ridiculous equalisation laws which mean that politics plays a huge part in the selection process I dont think SA can be said to have fielded a proper 1st XV in quite a few games......

RuggieBear

I seriously doubt that a full strength Irish team will tour Argentina (What moron scheduled that little trip btw?).

That was a pretty weak SA team and imo opinion the result was a bout right for the full strength Irish team versus the saffie 2nd/3rd stringers

toomevara

RuggieBear wrote:

I seriously doubt that a full strength Irish team will tour Argentina (What moron scheduled that little trip btw?).

Spot on, dont know whether to laugh or cry, and I'll tell you something for nothing, a second string Irish team will be eaten alive in Argentina, its a bloody bear pit, dont know what purpose that will serve for squad cohesion unity etc....

RuggieBear wrote:

That was a pretty weak SA team and imo opinion the result was a bout right for the full strength Irish team versus the saffie 2nd/3rd stringers

Yep, i'd go with that in the main, think we'll really be able to guauge the Irish performance against the England/SA match up next weekend. They're both in an, 'ahem' rebuilding phase, and coming off a string of dissapointing performances, defeats (all black tri-nations blip aside for the Boks). If currently abject england beat them well, I'd say the irish win will be put in context......

Goodluck2me

RuggieBear wrote:

That was a pretty weak SA team and imo opinion the result was a bout right for the full strength Irish team versus the saffie 2nd/3rd stringers

theres only ONE stringer!lol

walshb

What is it with Irish sports fans and analysts and the media, we're not happy just to see Ireland win, we want them to have to fight so hard for a bit of success. They go out and beat South Bloody Africa, a world power for years in Rugby and still we have fans and the media not happy, using excuses for the 'weakness' of the opposition. They won, and won well and played damn well. This is rampant thru all sports in Ireland. I used to box and when Ireland would defeat an international team, again the panelists and so called experts, instead of praising the efforts of the boxers, they'd slate the standard of the opposition

John Wine

walshb wrote:

What is it with Irish sports fans and analysts and the media, we're not happy just to see Ireland win, we want them to have to fight so hard for a bit of success. They go out and beat South Bloody Africa, a world power for years in Rugby and still we have fans and the media not happy, using excuses for the 'weakness' of the opposition. They won, and won well and played damn well. This is rampant thru all sports in Ireland. I used to box and when Ireland would defeat an international team, again the panelists and so called experts, instead of praising the efforts of the boxers, they'd slate the standard of the opposition

That SA performance was one of the worst I have ever seen from them.
It is disappointing to see such a power house in Rugby be so bad.
It's nothing to do with Ireland. In Boxing fights, it is man against man and there is never a case of a team playing a 2nd or 3rd string side and trying out a hole load of new moves for a more important tournement.
For SA that match against Ireland was more of a training session.
Ridiculous. You would see less missed tackles in a AIL match.

Peter B

walshb wrote:

What is it with Irish sports fans and analysts and the media, we're not happy just to see Ireland win, we want them to have to fight so hard for a bit of success.

I'm not happy because I didn't enjoy the match. When I was on the Dart into Lansdowne we were informed it would not be stopping in Sandymount or Lansdowne. This ment we had to walk from Sydney parade, arriving 18 minutes late into the match.

Also atmosphere was very poor in Lansdowne although maybe it was just where I was sitting (Up in the rafters on the West Stand).

Ireland were the far better team, but yet the result was never certain. They made so many mistakes, and we failed to punish. Yes it was South Africa. It was also a home match, they were a weak team. If we took everything at face value, we would be way over-confident.

Ireland have had a lot of success in recent times. We won the Triple Crown
(Beat England and a crappy Wales) twice. Still have not won the grand slam in recent years. Our level has raised but also so should our goals and aspirations.

I found that many people saying they couldn't believe it we beat South Africa. If you know your rugby you can understand that beating a second-string boks team is nothing to write home about, especially with a mediocure performance. We have ascended to the best 4 teams in the world and our 1st team should have a chance of beating anybody at home, maybe with execption of the All Blacks. In contrast people were so dissappointed we lost the the All Blacks 34 - 23 and 27 - 17 but these were far better results and deserve more credit then they got.

John Wine

Peter B wrote:

I found that many people saying they couldn't believe it we beat South Africa. If you know your rugby you can understand that beating a second-string boks team is nothing to write home about, especially with a mediocure performance. We have ascended to the best 4 teams in the world and our 1st team should have a chance of beating anybody at home, maybe with execption of the All Blacks. In contrast people were so dissappointed we lost the the All Blacks 34 - 23 and 27 - 17 but these were far better results and deserve more credit then they got.

Yeah I would agree with that.
The performances against the All Blacks were far better.
I'm not getting too excited about the Oz match considering they seem to be more interested in experimenting.

walshb

I'm in full agreement that we should strive to be grand slam champs and be the best. I never celebrate failure like the Irish soccer team or 0-0 draws etc etc. But Ireland beat South Africa, they didn't draw or lose and it is South Africa we are talking about. Now had it been Japan or Romania or Canada, I wouldn't be too concerned, but to beat South Africa, no matter what spin the begrudgers put on it or what strength side they claim were put out is a damn fine achievemnet, yet all we are hearing is the negativity about the opposition. We aren't happy unless we are taken to extra time or have to really struggle for victory. Take the win as easy as you can get it I say.

Did anyone find George Hooks comments about how he was 'hungry' and 'when are we finishing up here'? disgracefu?l. Here's a guy paid very well to discuss the game and he couldn't wait for the programme to finish, all because he was bored and hungry.

Chucky the tree

walshb wrote:

I'm in full agreement that we should strive to be grand slam champs and be the best. I never celebrate failure like the Irish soccer team or 0-0 draws etc etc. But Ireland beat South Africa, they didn't draw or lose and it is South Africa we are talking about. Now had it been Japan or Romania or Canada, I wouldn't be too concerned, but to beat South Africa, no matter what spin the begrudgers put on it or what strength side they claim were put out is a damn fine achievemnet.

It certainly wasnt a damn fine achievement and of course it mattered what sort of team they put out! If they but there u19s you would you still consider it a fine achievement?

You say we should strive to be the best, yet you celebrate a victory over a extremely weakened SA side as if it were there first team.

walshb

Chucky the tree wrote:

It certainly wasnt a damn fine achievement and of course it mattered what sort of team they put out! If they but there u19s you would you still consider it a fine achievement?

You say we should strive to be the best, yet you celebrate a victory over a extremely weakened SA side as if it were there first team.

So Chucky, were you sad and not celebratory?
They won and in your opinion and certain others, SA were poor. I say they were SA and to beat any SA team, you have to play damn well.
Ieland had the home advantage and that definitely gives any home team an edge. They played very well and yet yiu like so many other Irish sports fans just can't accept it. Did you want them struggling for their lives on the pitch barely scraping a win, before you will be happy?

Like I said it's opinion not fact that SA were weakened or poor. I say they were SA, maybe not the best ever SA team, but SA nonetheless and Ireland deserve a heap of raise for their fine performance

Chucky the tree

walshb wrote:

So Chucky, were you sad and not celebratory?
They won and in your opinion and certain others, SA were poor. I say they were SA and to beat any SA team, you have to play damn well.
Ieland had the home advantage and that definitely gives any home team an edge. They played very well and yet yiu like so many other Irish sports fans just can't accept it. Did you want them struggling for their lives on the pitch barely scraping a win, before you will be happy?

Like I said it's opinion not fact that SA were weakened or poor. I say they were SA, maybe not the best ever SA team, but SA nonetheless and Ireland deserve a heap of raise for their fine performance

I didnt celebrate really. We beat a 2nd string SA team, surely the days of IRish teams celebrating wins over Southern Hemisphere opposition like we have won the world cup is over? We'd come close to beating the full SA team, so i am not be delighted with an easy win over a SA team who can barely tackle.

You judge a team on their performance, not the nation they play for. That SA team was terrible, anything other then a comfortable win would of been very disappointing.

crybaby

In contrast people were so dissappointed we lost the the All Blacks 34 - 23 and 27 - 17 but these were far better results and deserve more credit then they got.

they were good performances not great, we should have won the first test really and our rugby team is at a level now where any defeat should be treated as a disappointment because we are genuinley good enough to beat any team in any venue and we need to keep up these high aspirations going into a WC