Tenant giving notice

Lex Luthor

My tenant has just called me to let me know she would like to give notice. From what I remember on my lease I signed with her in April, it was a months notice, but I'll have to read it later. She has been in the house for about 18 months. I think she is looking to bail this week as her rent is due at the end of the week for next month and she already has a house lined up. Can I hold her to a months notice? I have 1 months deposit from her.

aniascor

After 18 months, I think you are legally entitled to 6 weeks' notice, regardless of the lease. Check with threshold to confirm or look up details on oasis.gov.

BC

Yep you are entitled to the full notice. You can keep the deposit in lieu of the rent owed. Check out threshold.ie

Lex Luthor

I can't find anything on oasis.gov about the notice period required if given by the tenant...only the landlord

http://www.oasis.gov.ie/housing/renting_a_flat_or_house/if_your_landlord_wants_you_to_leave.html

aniascor

Found this:
Tenants can terminate a tenancy without giving a reason but must give notice.
Length of tenancy Notice by tenant
Less than 6 months 4 weeks (28 days)
6 months to a year 5 weeks (35 days)
1 – 2 years 6 weeks (42 days)
2 or more years 8 weeks (56 days)

It's about half way down this page: http://www.oasis.gov.ie/housing/renting_a_flat_or_house/types_of_tenancy.html

Lex Luthor

aniascor wrote:

Found this:
Tenants can terminate a tenancy without giving a reason but must give notice.
Length of tenancy Notice by tenant
Less than 6 months 4 weeks (28 days)
6 months to a year 5 weeks (35 days)
1 – 2 years 6 weeks (42 days)
2 or more years 8 weeks (56 days)

It's about half way down this page: http://www.oasis.gov.ie/housing/renting_a_flat_or_house/types_of_tenancy.html

Thanks for that...

does this have to come from her in writing or will a telephone call suffice and does the notice period start on the date I receive the letter/call?

It looks from this I am entitled to 6 weeks notice, but the deposit is equal to a months rent. If she does decide to move out this week, I take it I can just keep the deposit, but to be honest I don't think she will want to do this and lose her deposit as she'll need it to move on.

There was a line in the 2nd page of the lease about a Break Out Clause, which at the time was witten in as 'None'.

jesus_thats_gre

How about telling her that she will have to pay whatever for the amount of days the house remains empty, i.e. if you get the house rented again within a week or two, she will only own you a week or two's rent. Relatively fair assuming she was a decent tenant.

Lex Luthor

thats the plan jesus, but I have to be strict in asking for my min 6 weeks notice as I can't take the hit financially in letting her leave early. If she does manage to find a tenant for me then I'll be happy.

if she doesn't manage to find a tenant and leaves that with me, would I be within my rights to take the cost of re-advertising out of the deposit seeing as she is only 6months into the lease?

Lex Luthor

just got a call telling me I'll be getting 3 3/4 weeks rent paid into my account this Friday and take it or leave it as I'm only entitled to 4wks notice and not the 6 I am entitled to. :rolleyes: We'll see....!!!!!!!!!!!;)

daiixi

Well if she's paying 3 3/4 weeks rent into your account and you still have her bond, then you're set if you're entitled to six weeks notice. However if you find someone to move in in a week or two are you going to refund her the extra money she's paying?

Lex Luthor

daiixi wrote:

Well if she's paying 3 3/4 weeks rent into your account and you still have her bond, then you're set if you're entitled to six weeks notice. However if you find someone to move in in a week or two are you going to refund her the extra money she's paying?

of course

Lex Luthor

The request for a reference came in this morning so the 3 3/4 weeks has now been increased to the 6 weeks, as I think they have gotten the correct info.

Everyone is happy

Lex Luthor

Lex Luthor wrote:

Everyone is happy

I take that back. I only received the rent paid in on Friday for 2 weeks and I'm told I can take the remainider from the deposit, ie. keep the deposit. I told them I cannot do that as the deposit is not for paying the last months rent, but now I'm not getting any calls or texts returned. What to do? They are getting social welfare rent allowance, so if I hear nothing by 12, then I will probably contact them to give them a kick up the ar$e

aniascor

Have you had any luck finding new tenants? I know you are legally entitled to 6 weeks' notice, but that is obviously going to be a lot of hassle to enforce here. For the duration of the notice period, you are allowed to show the property to perspective tenants, providing reasonable notice of the viewing is given to the current tenants. I would concentrate on this for the next week or two and see what happens. Maybe you will be able to replace your current tenants sooner rather than later, and then everyone really would be happy. Especially you if you can cut your time that the property is empty for down to a couple of days.

Otherwise, your only option is to hang on to the deposit to cover the last month's rent, and if there are any damages that would have been coming out of the deposit, go through the small claim's court to get the money for that if they refuse to pay it.

Lex Luthor

aniascor wrote:

Have you had any luck finding new tenants? I know you are legally entitled to 6 weeks' notice, but that is obviously going to be a lot of hassle to enforce here. For the duration of the notice period, you are allowed to show the property to perspective tenants, providing reasonable notice of the viewing is given to the current tenants. I would concentrate on this for the next week or two and see what happens. Maybe you will be able to replace your current tenants sooner rather than later, and then everyone really would be happy. Especially you if you can cut your time that the property is empty for down to a couple of days.

Otherwise, your only option is to hang on to the deposit to cover the last month's rent, and if there are any damages that would have been coming out of the deposit, go through the small claim's court to get the money for that if they refuse to pay it.

no luck yet finding a tenant and I still haven't received any written notice to say they are leaving either. I am insisting on my 6 weeks notice as I am entitled to it. They knew well in advance they were moving out and have tried to pull a fast one. I also have a very good suspision that the reason they want to use the deposit is that there is damage there and they are fearing I'll take the deposit or a portion of it to pay for it. I also have a voicemail from their new landlord to call him back to supply with a reference so I'll be making that call today

Budd

They've given you 4 weeks notice and they've given you 18 months of tenancy. How about cutting them some slack. What difference will 2 weeks make to you as you can have the house rented in the meantime.

Lex Luthor

Budd wrote:

They've given you 4 weeks notice and they've given you 18 months of tenancy. How about cutting them some slack. What difference will 2 weeks make to you as you can have the house rented in the meantime.

Because, if it was me who wanted them out, I'd have to give them 6 weeks notice. So what if they have given me 18 months of tenancy? What difference does that make?

Budd

Typical landlord. Just trying to **** people over and make as much money as possible. Now you are going to make sure they don't get to move into somewhere else.

Have you ever thought of how difficult it is as a renter to move between tenancies without losing out on hundreds? To try and have a place lined up the same week as the one you are leaving and still give the right amount of notice? Its not easy so a little bit of compassion should be given.

hmmm

aniascor wrote:

For the duration of the notice period, you are allowed to show the property to perspective tenants, providing reasonable notice of the viewing is given to the current tenants.

Where does the law say this? I'm not saying it doesn't, I just can't find reference to it.

Lex Luthor

Budd wrote:

Typical landlord. Just trying to **** people over and make as much money as possible. Now you are going to make sure they don't get to move into somewhere else.

Have you ever thought of how difficult it is as a renter to move between tenancies without losing out on hundreds? To try and have a place lined up the same week as the one you are leaving and still give the right amount of notice? Its not easy so a little bit of compassion should be given.

This type of attitude pi**es me off. They told me last week they knew when they signed the renewal lease 6 months ago that they probably wouldn't be there for the year, so why sign it then?

If they know their rights, then they should be able to give the required notice and move without hassle. I've been a renter in the past and have always complied with the regulations, so just because some people are disorganised, why should I have to foot the bill? Nobody should have to lose out on hundreds if they get their act together. These people tried to screw me out of money and maybe more if the house is not in an acceptable condition when I take it back, so I am quite within my rights to get whats coming to me.

I've been into the PRTB today and they have advised me what to do, so I'll be proceeding as advised. As far as they are concerned, she has broken all the rules of the lease and does not have a leg to stand on.

At this stage, I am not going to chase up the owner of the house they are moving to, as be it on his head to take them on without checking them out properly.

aniascor

I think it falls under this:

Pt.2 S.16(c) allow, at reasonable intervals, the landlord, or any person or persons acting on the landlord’s behalf, access to the dwelling (on a date and time agreed in advance with the tenant) for the purposes of inspecting the dwelling,

But not having a law degree, I can't be sure!

Providing the landlord with access to the dwelling for the purposes of showing the property to potential tenants during the last few weeks of an existing tenancy is also a common clause in a lease.

hmmm

aniascor wrote:

I think it falls under this:

Fair enough. I don't agree btw that this clause allows "showing" of the house, this clause ties in with earlier clauses about landlords ensuring that the property is in a fit state and upkeep is appropriate.

Providing the landlord with access to the dwelling for the purposes of showing the property to potential tenants during the last few weeks of an existing tenancy is also a common clause in a lease.

True.

Lex Luthor

Went to the house today to take back my keys and found the carpets, particularly in the main living room, an absolute disgrace. I was told by the tenant that this was normal wear & tear but it looks like a herd of elephants trampled through it. I'm afraid that even a professional cleaner would have difficulty shifting half of the stains on it. They told me it was oil and had been there for months, so the carpet in that room is a write off. The bedrooms are no better. They didn't even make an effort to clean the house and there were large stickers on one of the bedroom walls, that when I tried to take off, it took large section of the paintwork off with it. They even had the neck to say they were advised not even to clean the place as they deem it to be "normal wear & tear". Since they used the deposit to pay the last month rent and basically left me high & dry, I have no comeback on the day today to get any re-imbursement. My only course of action is to lodge a complaint with the PRTB and let them handle it from there and see if they can recoup some of the money towards it.

What I'm looking to do at the moment is try to get an idea of what I would be owed for getting the house back to an acceptable condition.

To replace the living room carpet, I'm guessing €150. I'm willing to deduct 20% from that as they lived in the house for 18months, so that amounts to about a 20% (€30) write off for their wear & tear (12.5% per annum).

I got a quote recently from Chemdry to clean my stairs/landing & 2 bedrooms for €140, so I'll guesstimate the same in this house.

As for cleaning the place, I'm guessing €40 to a local person to give the house the once over. Probably take about 2hrs.

The 2nd bedroom to get re-painted after I remove all the wall stickers will probably cost about €100.

Total €400.

If I had a deposit, I'd have taken that out.

Would this be a reasonable amount to put in a claim for?

The garden is also in a state and the lawnmower I supplied is still in its box, brand new.

Considering the house was new with all new carpets, etc when they moved in, I'd expect it to have been returned to me in a reasonable condition, but they just looked at me as if I was expecting too much.

The_Conductor

Your calculations re: the cleaning and maintenance of the house seem reasonable enough- the garden though is another matter- unless you had a specific arrangement with them that they were to maintain the grounds, it would be assumed that you would do it, or organise to have it done. If the garden is a wilderness, it could well cost you to retrieve it to a reasonable state. At least its the right time of the year for doing remedial gardening work......

Good luck at the PRTB re: getting money back from the tenants...... I have a funny feeling the small claims court may the only realistic avenue open to you......

Lex Luthor

smccarrick wrote:

Your calculations re: the cleaning and maintenance of the house seem reasonable enough- the garden though is another matter- unless you had a specific arrangement with them that they were to maintain the grounds, it would be assumed that you would do it, or organise to have it done. If the garden is a wilderness, it could well cost you to retrieve it to a reasonable state. At least its the right time of the year for doing remedial gardening work......

Good luck at the PRTB re: getting money back from the tenants...... I have a funny feeling the small claims court may the only realistic avenue open to you......

The garden is not a wilderness, it just wasn't maintained at all. The lawnmower was never even used, although it looked like just weeds gew and a once over with the lawnmower will take car of most of them. It was the basic attitude of the tenant leaving saying that this was normal state to leave any house after renting.

As for the PRTB, I called in to them last week and they said that the small claims court won't deal with issues like this any more since the PRTB was set up. All claims are to go through them. I have the forms and took over 30 pictures yesterday. I just have to get my stuff together and send it in within 28 days.

shoegirl

Lex Luthor wrote:

thats the plan jesus, but I have to be strict in asking for my min 6 weeks notice as I can't take the hit financially in letting her leave early. If she does manage to find a tenant for me then I'll be happy.

if she doesn't manage to find a tenant and leaves that with me, would I be within my rights to take the cost of re-advertising out of the deposit seeing as she is only 6months into the lease?

Well you have 4 week deposit, so you'd be entitled to keep that in lieu of notice, you can demand another 2 weeks from her, but the chances of getting it are virtually nil, and you'll only get her back up more.

Would suggest that you just tell her that if she leaves without giving the correct notice you'll have to keep her deposit as specified in the lease.
4 weeks is a not unreasonable length of time to find a new tenant anyway.

shoegirl

Lex Luthor wrote:

Considering the house was new with all new carpets, etc when they moved in, I'd expect it to have been returned to me in a reasonable condition, but they just looked at me as if I was expecting too much.

Have to say I'm not surprised. My best friend bought a house that was 2 years old and rented to the worst rent allowance scum you'd find anywhere for 2 years. Aside from solicitors letters being sent to the address for a previous scumbag tenant looking for 12k they owe to the nearest credit union, we've also found bail receipts etc. And they not only made bits of the house, it actually looked like a house that was 25 years old and hadn't been decorated since it was built.

Some tenants have no respect sadly.

shoegirl

Lex Luthor wrote:

They are getting social welfare rent allowance...

...surprise, surprise. RA tenants are higher risk. Take it from me as a PAYING tenant whose often had her life made a misery by rent allowance chancers living next door or downstairs. At least look for references next time, or don't take RA in future - at very least the wear and tear is at least 35% more than paying tenants since they are spending their time at work.

However, would say this pretty much stymies you with the Tenancies Board, since they won't have the cash income to pay up what you are owed. I'd write it off and look for professional tenants next time. I wouldn't give anybody a reference either until I'd had a quick check on the condition of the property. Mind you, they had barefaced cheek to ask you for one in the first place.

Lex Luthor

PRTB said they would chase her up for the money owed. Once I submit the forms with evidence and a reasonable account of what I'm owed, then, they follow up from there. Whether they get a response or not, I don't know or what course of action they take if they get no response. All I can do is try. What they did tell me is that 9 times out of 10, when they get involved and send out the request for payment, they get it. Time will only tell.

As for the reference, the new landlord said he would wait until we took the keys back yesterday to call us and get an idea of what condition the house was left in and what attitude they took with us. Needless, to say my wife had a few choice words to say about them. Up to him now what he does. Out of my hands.

The deposit only covers the rent not paid, I'm out of pocket for any damage that was done.

miju

shoegirl wrote:

...surprise, surprise. RA tenants are higher risk. Take it from me as a PAYING tenant whose often had her life made a misery by rent allowance chancers living next door or downstairs. At least look for references next time, or don't take RA in future - at very least the wear and tear is at least 35% more than paying tenants since they are spending their time at work.

However, would say this pretty much stymies you with the Tenancies Board, since they won't have the cash income to pay up what you are owed. I'd write it off and look for professional tenants next time. I wouldn't give anybody a reference either until I'd had a quick check on the condition of the property. Mind you, they had barefaced cheek to ask you for one in the first place.

get the **** off your high horse will you

i've friends who are paying rent out of their own pocket and have wrecked two different apts , on the other hand i get rent allowance and maintain and respect and repair minor problems with the property, in fact where i'm renting at the moment theres two particular apts who are causing mayhem / disturbance to neighbours and 1 of them OWNS the apt and the other apt has profs renting in it who are in work ALL day but come home blare the music and have parties on the balcony



just because someone is one rent allowance doesnt mean someones poor / waster / dont work or scum , in fact i probably have more freed up income than you do , you may be a paying tenant but your obviously an ignorant one