Should i chance a server setup?

jasperok

Wel at the mo just 20 pcs into a switch into a router working fine though no networking worth talking about and sharing a printer off a print server,
I'd love to try and get the network running of a server for more administration reasons really and ease of use for the users.
what would the specs have to be?
and i'd have to use windows as we pay for volume liscencing with them
i'd love to give each user a username and password that would work on any computer and also restrict internet use and sites at certain times and also some small storage space htey could accsess.
can this be done by a relative server novice who is quite it literate?
any suggestions would be great!

inode

it can be done pretty easy with server 2003. just read up on setting up active directories. to give everyone some space just map network drives to their account. and you can select what times during the day the internet can be accessed ( cant remember where that setting is though)

also when setting up the accounts look up changing the password policy.

i got a server working with all the user accounts without much prior knowledge of a server. so you should be ok. just google setting them up.

WizZard

Let me know if you need hardware (i.e. a server) as I am decommissioning a few servers (which have loads of warranty remaining) at work which would be absolutely perfect for a small office server.

BTW I'd also recommend Windows 2003 Small Business Server as it includes Exchange (and SQL I think) so that you can set up a proper mail system etc.
Post here or in the Windows if you need help setting it up

tech

What you need is SBS 2003 Premium to get ISA and also SQL, ISA will allow you restrict internet access, but can be a pain to setup dont really like ISA 2004 now.

You will also need a firewall solution, Central Antivirus, BAckup solution, do you require VPN access

jasperok

windows2003server edition seems to be what we have available under our volume liscensing, i would love to give it a lash but i am worried there will be a very steep learning curve - i have a spare box i could try it on and plug it in and out reverting back to my current setup after test runs - thing is though its a p4 2.8ghtz with 512cache and 512 of pc3200 memory with an ide 80gb drive wonder would it suffice?
mail is not an issue
controlling internet accsess and enabling user accounts is the main issue also to have some file space for users.

tech

A single disk is a NO go really if your going to call it a server, you ideally need HARDware RAID 1 and id be going to RAID 5

Also what about backups?

jasperok

really? could you breccomend a spec of pc for such a setup?

tech

I would recomnned Server hardware

ML 350
3 x 72 gig disk
Smart Array contoller
SDLT drive with SCSI card
Server 2003
Backup Software Veritas or Arcserve
Antivirus software
Hardware Firewall

Capt'n Midnight

tech wrote:

A single disk is a NO go really if your going to call it a server, you ideally need HARDware RAID 1 and id be going to RAID 5

Also what about backups?

Two choices here,

If downtime is allowed / tight budget then Mirror IDE/SATA drives
OR
If downtime is not allowed / loadsamoney HOT SWAP RAID 5 with HOT SPARE (basically SCSI)

HARDWARE Raid 5 without hot swap, you'd have downtime to replace the drive and would not benefit enough from the performance on a small network,
SCSI drives allow better queueing of commands and can handle multiple requests better, so they are beneficial when you have lots of users even if on paper SATA has the same transfer rate.

Mirror IDE/SATA means you can read the data on any PC
SCSI hot swap means you are limited to servers with the same type of card, tip - unless you have a very good reason, always use the scsi card defaults for RAID setup, or write the settings on the server case, you don't want to risk loosing everything because the backup battery on the RAID card went flat (usually settings would be pulled from drive but don't risk it)

WizZard

jasperok wrote:

really? could you breccomend a spec of pc for such a setup?

A PC isn't really recommended as it will be on 24/7. PC components aren't designed for this (Although they can do it, just sometimes not reliably - not what you want for a server)

Basically I would recommend a server chassis - any brand with good support.
SCSI drives (3 is best, but two could feasibly work if the budget is really tight)
A DLT drive if you need backup, else a external drive caddy + drives that you can take off-site. This external hard drive method of backup is common is smaller businesses that can't justify a tape drive.

Windows Server 2003
You'll also need ISA server (or similar) to use for internet restriction, maybe this is included in the licensing you have?

tech

I agree with you, U cant expect pc hardware to run your business, I've seen some people using a pc as a server single, eithere system board and disk fails and buy buy then , usually with no backups and no hardware to replace it with

If you do decide to go go down the route of using a pc this is what I would do

Buy 2 pc;s of same spec,

use a software mirror of the system 2 x 300 gig SATA or IDE and test moving the disks into the spare system and check will it boot, this way you have a spare pc / Sever tested that it will work if a system board or PSU faiils simply move the disks into the spare pc, also if a disk fails you have it on a mirror I would also test this buy removeing disk 1 from the live box and fitting to spare pc and modifying the boot.ini to make it boot,

this way if tough not ideal you have options if the hardware fails an also if a disk fails

Anyone got any thoughts on this?

WizZard

Not a bad solution but the cost/maintenance of two PCs in the long run probably outweighs the initial cost of a server. Plus you'd need two licenses for Windows Server 2003.

tech

technially you would I suppose as it would be an OEM Lic, but at the same time 99% of the time unless you have the disks in the 1st box, you can always replace the syustem board from pc 2 to pc1 and the same with the disks?

Capt'n Midnight

tech wrote:

technially you would I suppose as it would be an OEM Lic, but at the same time 99% of the time unless you have the disks in the 1st box, you can always replace the syustem board from pc 2 to pc1 and the same with the disks?

OEM licenses are non transferrable.
If you upgrade OEM with a retail upgrade or volume license upgrade it is still not transferrable.
IIRC you have to upgrade OEM and get software assurance in the first 2/3 months to turn it into a transferrrable license.
Or buy a non OEM license


Don't forget that in addition to the server license you may also need to buy client licenses as well.

jasperok

the hartdware requiremnets reallly have me suprised - and why cant you turn a server off at the end of the day?
i was hoping some duocore e6700 with a gig of ram and ok sata raid mirrored would do the trick?

as regards software i must read up - i ass/u/me/d that windows server2003 would infact do all i required so it seems i will have to have to use other software to allow internet control file sharing - ....

is there a good beginners site somewhere
i feel a cram coming on....
thanks

WizZard

jasperok wrote:

the hartdware requiremnets reallly have me suprised - and why cant you turn a server off at the end of the day?

Well technically a server should use only certified, reliable hardware. Hence you don't find many "servers" in use that are home made
Lots of reason for the specialised hardware, even down to network cards that are designed for high throughput, which home adapters are not always able for, hard drives that can consistently, and reliably serve >150mb/s 24/7 etc
Active Directory is not designed for being turned on an off at will, neither are many other services, and users tend to dislike when a file/email they are working on disappears because the server got rebooted...

jasperok wrote:

i was hoping some duocore e6700 with a gig of ram and ok sata raid mirrored would do the trick?

It would run Windows Server 2003 - it would not be server hardware though. And the RAID would be software RAID, which is generally not portable and definitely not as fast/reliable/flexible as hardware based RAID.

jasperok wrote:

as regards software i must read up - i ass/u/me/d that windows server2003 would infact do all i required so it seems i will have to have to use other software to allow internet control file sharing - ....

is there a good beginners site somewhere
i feel a cram coming on....
thanks

You're on one
Or try http://www.windowsnetworking.com/