Boxers you like

Bodhidharma

I'vr taken my inspiration from the soccer forum here. So who are the boxers you admire?

As all of us who love the sport know, boxers are without doubt the most determind, admirable and interesting sportsmen alive. No other sports produces the types of stories that boxing does. Its a fact that of all the greatest sports books and movies are all on boxing.

Here are my picks

Erik Morales - for never picking an easy fight
George Foreman - for his unbelievable self belief
Joe Frazier - for sticking to his opinion that Muhammad Ali is a self serving, egoist, coward (I agree)
Bernard Hopkins - one word ....dedication
Floyd Mayweather - love him or loathe him, the boy is sweet as sugar in the ring

Barrera, Gatti, Ward, Holyfield and Tapia - Guts
Jones Jr, Mosley, Trinidad - Skill

Of all the fighters i have loved, no one has come close to Erik Morales. I am not ashamed to say that when he was stopped against Pac man, i had a lump in my throat. It was the saddest sight i've ever witnessed in the world of sport. It felt like my pet had been put down after 12 years. But thats boxing for you. It is impossible to describe to the uninitiated the emotions involved in watching it (let alone doing it).
Boxing for me is all about honor. When i think of the admiration footballers get compared to the heros of boxing, it makes me sick. They are genuine heroes. They stuggled to get to the top through sheer hard work and are potentially the greatest role models young kids could have.

OK rant over. What do you think?

megadodge

Boxing for me is all about honor. When i think of the admiration footballers get compared to the heros of boxing, it makes me sick. They are genuine heroes. They stuggled to get to the top through sheer hard work and are potentially the greatest role models young kids could have.

You say that and yet just before it you called Muhammad Ali a COWARD ???

No man who ever steps into the ring more than once should be called a coward, but Ali of all people.
Have you ever seen him fight ? Seriously.

Raekwon

Bodhidharma wrote:

As all of us who love the sport know, boxers are without doubt the most determind, admirable and interesting sportsmen alive. No other sports produces the types of stories that boxing does. Its a fact that of all the greatest sports books and movies are all on boxing.

Well said!

The fighters I really admire are:

Oscar De La Hoya - Probably my favourite fighters that is still active today (for now anyway). He gets a lot of criticism from the media but has never ducked a challenge even if he was fighting way above his natural weight (middle weight vs. Bernard Hopkins) He has also fought some of the best fighters of his generation including: Rafael Ruelas, Genaro Hernandez, Julio Cesar Chavez (twice), Pernell Whitaker, Ike Quartey, Felix Trinidad, Shane Mosley, Arturo Gatti & Fernando Vargas. And his has been a world champion is five different weigh classes, from super-feather weight to middle weight.

Roberto Duran - 'No Mas' aside Duran has been on of the all time greatest fighters and defenatly one of my favourites. Like De La Hoya he moved up the weight divisions and won world championship titles on his way. He has been in some classic fights with ring legends like Sugar Ray Leonard (3 times), Marvin Hagler, Thomas Hearns, Wilfred Benitez & Esteban De Jesus. The only real flaw in his career was that he never knew when to quit and IMO he should of hung up his gloves after his rubber match with Leonard in 1989.

Evander Holyfield - He has the biggest heart in boxing and is one of the greatest fighters of all time. After beating Dwight Muhammad Qawi, Ossie Ocasio & Carlos De Leon to unify to Cruiser weight division, 'The Real Deal' moved up to beat Buster Douglas for the unified Heavyweight championship. He has won a version of the heavyweight title 5 times and no other heavyweight in history has done that. He also beat some great fighters like Riddick Bowe, Larry Homes, George Forman, Michael Moorer and of course who could forget his fights with Mike Tyson. Like Duran though, he does not know when to quit and he recently won a fight by knock out at the ripe ol' age of 44.

Bodhidharma

megadodge wrote:

You say that and yet just before it you called Muhammad Ali a COWARD ???

No man who ever steps into the ring more than once should be called a coward, but Ali of all people.
Have you ever seen him fight ? Seriously.

First of all have i ever seen Muhammad Ali fight? Obviously not, in fact i dont even know what he looks like. Ridiculous question.

Secondly why is Ali "of all people" not a coward? It goes without saying that no fighter is cowardly as in a wimp or something. Ali is a moral coward, someone who takes the easy way out of things and generally does what he's told.
I dont buy into this image thing with Ali. Anyone who has read anything on the man knows that he was a nasty bastard. Particularly in relation to women. There are three things in particular that bother me about Ali.

1. Didn't join the army because the Nation of Islam TOLD him not to.
2. He used to treat his opponents with great disrespect. "Uncle Tom", calling Joe Frazier a gorilla etc
3. He introduced some woman he was having an affair with as his wife to the president of the Philipines while his wife was at home looking after his children.

Basically i think the guy was an egomaniac who never spouted an opinion that was his own.

(before all the fans come in giving me grief about parkinsons and charity and stuff, i'm talking about Ali in his prime)

walshb

Ali, the greatest fighter of all time and the greatest sports athlete of all. As for being a coward. I think Ali proved he wasn't a coward by having the guts to say NO to the war. Fair enough I believe men should serve their country when asked. It's why we have freedom and democracy after all. But Ali knew he would never have been in danger had he signed up, it's not like he was going to be put in the front line or anything, just like Presley before him. So it wasn't his 'cowardice' that made him say no. He just firmly believed that saying NO was the most important thing and the right thing and I think he was vilified in the end after all the bad press Vietnam received. He is a real hero and an inspiration to all the fighters you mentioned my friend

The easy option for Ali would have been to say YES!!!!

walshb

Other greats of course Ray Robinson who was the best fighter of alltime outside of the Heavyweight division. What a talent. Ray Leonard, the complete fighter. Hearns, damn exciting and Oscar.

megadodge

First of all have i ever seen Muhammad Ali fight? Obviously not, in fact i dont even know what he looks like. Ridiculous question.

You've seen him fight and you call him a coward !!
THAT'S RIDICULOUS !!!

In relation to his outside the ring persona, if you called him 'gullible' I would have no problem as I certainly think he was led down the garden path by the Nation of Islam for a long time. However as Walshb said, going into the army would have been nothing other than a PR exercise for the military and he would have been touring around giving exhibitions like Joe Louis and SRR before him helping 'lift morale' within the troops. He wouldn't have come within an ass's roar of any action. The much harder thing to do was refuse induction. He was lambasted throughout his country (becoming even more unpopular than he already was), stripped of his title and very nearly bankrupted by that decision.

Anyone who has read anything on the man knows that he was a nasty bastard. Particularly in relation to women.

So having sex with loads of very willing women means he's a nasty bastard ?

As for introducing his soon-to-be wife as his wife - so what ? How does that make him a coward ?

I will agree with you on one thing though and that is his treatment of Frazier was terrible. I never liked that myself and when Joe announced a few years back that he didn't care one whit about Ali's illness, I was one of the minority who thought that was quite acceptable bearing in mind all the sh!t he had to put up with from Ali.

So at times, I agree, he certainly was nasty.

But calling him a 'coward' - that's unacceptable as it's factually incorrect.

walshb

My view is simple. Ali was the greatest fighter of alltime and also the most colorful and charismatic athlete the world has ever seen. Possibly one of the most colorful and charismatic person the world has ever seen. Was he perfect? absolutely not, who is?. Could he be nasty?, most definitely and the big thing I found from studyinG Ali was that he seemed racist. Racist towards the white establishment, not the ordinary white man, just those who oppressed him and the black people in America. Can't say I really blame him, due to the times he grew up in.

As for the Frazier era. My view is that Ali did take things a little too far, but I firmly believe from what I've read and saw that Ali had nothing but the utmost respect for Joe Frazier and deep down he loved the guy. Most of the taunting was all about the hype and building up the fight. Ali just didn't realise how Frazier was affected. I remember after the thrilla in manila when Ali said Frazier was the second greatest fighter ever. Now there's a compliment.The beautiful thing about Ali and simplest thing was his innocence, He was child like, and it's as if he never grew up. That's why he was so endearing to so many and what a quality to have.

RealJohn

Guys, all this bitching about Ali isn't doing the discussion any favours. You're not goin to agree, so I'd say drop it and concentrate on talking about fighter's good points.

Current favourites would be Mosley (great to see him looking like he's coming back to form. Would like to see him hold a title again before he retires), Hatton (the guy is getting too much protection but he always brings a great fight, whoever he's against), Pac Man (Barrera and Morales, with no disrespect intended to them, would not be holding the interest they do now if Manny hadn't been added to the mix. Also, south-paws are great:D ) and Winky Wright (so consistantly clinical and for that, he never gets the respect he deserves. And he gave up an easy world title to keep testing himself against the best. And a south-paw again:D )

From times past, only two names really stand out: Barry McGuigan, a true Irish sporting ambassador and a uniting icon for a devided community.

And I couldn't justifiable leave it without mentioning Iron Mike in his prime (in the ring only mind). Tyson was just something else back in the early days. It's such a pity how the mighty have fallen.