'Points race' may be over as CAO requirements tumble

whassupp2

'Points race' may be over as CAO requirements tumble
Seán Flynn, Education Editor




CAO points requirements for a broad range of courses at third level have dropped significantly this year, in a move which could signal the end of the so-called "points race".

With the notable exception of medical-related courses, points are down across a broad range of courses in arts, business, science and social science.

Points for the most popular undergraduate course in the State - arts at UCD - have fallen from 370 five years ago to 350 this year. Points for arts and social science courses are down right across the university sector.


It is expected that more than 75 per cent of all students will secure one of their top three CAO choices this year. In a reversal of the situation two decades ago, there is intense competition between the various third-level colleges for students to fill their places.

Points are also down for most business courses, including NUI Galway, which is down 15 points to 400. The requirements for science courses are also moving downwards, with science at Trinity College Dublin dropping 25 to 415.

With the exception of Trinity, all other universities have seen points for most of their higher degree courses courses decline. In NUI Galway, points for 29 courses are down, while just five have increased. Commerce with German in Galway is down by 140 points.

The private college Dublin Business College, which charges students about €4,000 per year, has also seen increases in points in nine of its 12 courses.

Career experts predict some institutes of technology (IOTs), in particular, could struggle to fill places this year. More than 36,000 places for ordinary degree and certificate courses are available this year, mainly in IOTs.

But based on last year's trends, less than a third of this figure will be filled. This raises questions about the long-term future of some courses offered by the IOTs.

The fall in points - and the ability of virtually all students to secure places through the CAO - also raises questions about the huge post-Leaving Cert (PLC) sector, which offers thousands of places every year. There were fears that points could have increased this year because of the strong grades achieved by many students in the Leaving Cert. Some 17 per cent of students secured 450 or more points this year compared with just 13 per cent two years ago. But these fears were ill-founded.

There are several factors behind the decline in points levels and foremost of these is falling student numbers. Some 3,000 fewer students completed the Leaving Cert this year compared with last year, while the overall figure sitting the exam (51,000) is down from a high of close to 70,000 two decades ago.

There has also been an increase in the number of courses available to students. This year there are more than 800 courses available through the CAO compared with a fraction of this figure in the 1980s.

Career experts do not expect the points race to return in the short term. The number of Junior Cert students was up by about 2,000 this year, but with more places available this is not expected to lead to increased points levels.

Medical and paramedical courses are the one area which bucks the points trend this year. Students needs a minimum of 570 points - the equivalent of six A grades in the Leaving Cert - to have any chance of gaining entry to one of the five medical schools.

John McGinnity, the deputy registrar at NUI Maynooth, said this year's points represents a landmark moment in the CAO process and could signal the end of the traditional points race. He said falling enrolment meant that 2006 was "the best year to take your Leaving Cert for quite a number of years".

For many years, he said, there has been a significant over-demand for places at third level. "This year has seen a rebalancing between the supply and demand for places."

Zapp Brannigan

Arts has dropped! Well then I'm definitely in, I already had a 40 point cushion!

happydance

My goodness...it starts already!

whassupp2

I cant seem to find a full table of points yet but it doesnt mention engineering courses falling.

EdgarAllenPoo

Where'd you get this and does it give points for Mater Dei and Carlow IT?

TheTrooper

Well I am hoping Engineering courses fell. Fingers crossed eh?

happydance

I think it's from the irish times web site, thats the guy who writes for them, right?

whassupp2

Click here:


http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/pdf/a4_front_20060821.pdf

exiot

Nothing said about Comp Science, hopefully it fell as usual..

EdgarAllenPoo

Yeah, I went to the site, shame it doesn't give any specific points though.

happydance

That link does though! Not for pharmacy though which is a pity!

JCB

Interesting points from the link:
UCD Arts/UCG = 350
UCC Arts &Social Science = 345
UCC Law = 485
UCD law = 495
SPD Teaching = 455*

porn_star

i could of gotten into arts with my points from last year then, there was no need for me to repeat :rolleyes:
oh well

ThE_IVIAcIVIAIV

lets hope 1 in 4 of my choices drop alot so i can get into it and not wait until second round!

EdgarAllenPoo

Sending my brother to the spar in Irishtown to get the indo.

R0C0

Any idea wat time we'll be able to get the full list at??

whassupp2

whaen the newspapers hit the shops. Anyone in Dublin will get them 1st

Serenity

Looks like I got Arts in UCD then! But will hold off on the celebrations until I get a look at the CAO offers.

fish-head

Whoo I couldn't be more into Arts!

R0C0

Just read in the Examiner for anyone interested "points requirements are down for about half of Level 8 engineering degrees."

whassupp2

...thats good news for me

marie_85

Just over five hours left.... I want to do Media Studies in Maynooth. The points last year were exactly what I got in my Leaving so I'm extremely nervous... But I'm taking it as a good sign that Arts in Maynooth has dropped so much!

JCB

Examiner Article:
21 August 2006

70% of CAO applicants offered college places

By Niall Murray, Education Correspondent
OVER 70% of this year’s 63,170 CAO applicants have been offered a college place this morning as points have fallen or remain unchanged for around two-thirds of all courses.


They include nearly 16,000 of the 56,500 Level 8 (honours bachelor) degree applicants offered their top choice and 25,319 of around 42,700 Level 7/6 applicants getting their first preference course.

Around 21,000 of the 44,751 school-leavers and other prospective higher education students to receive an offer have a choice of courses from both lists, with the deadline for acceptances being August 29.




For almost 14,000 applicants with no offer to date, the second round of offers will be made on September 1 — but hundreds of vacant places will also be available on the CAO website in the coming days.

With 38,000 places to be filled this autumn, the general drop in points reflects a rise in the number of courses to about 1,000 and the fact 4,000 fewer students sat the Leaving Certificate this summer.

However, these factors did not result in a complete drop in points as more than one-third of CAO applications were from mature or overseas students and others taking the non-traditional route to college.

Formal notifications of first-round offers are being posted this morning but thousands of applicants have been accessing the CAO website since 6am today to check if they qualified for their chosen courses.

Health science degrees make up eight of the 10 courses needing most points for entry, but points for medicine have not risen for the first time in a number of years. They are the same as last year for four of the country’s five medical schools and down 10 points for the Royal College of Surgeons.

Despite this levelling off — possibly due to 70 extra places for Irish students being funded by the Government this year — prospective trainee doctors still required at least 570 points out of a maximum 600.

Elsewhere, general arts degrees are down 10-30 points on last year, while points requirements are down for about half of Level 8 engineering degrees.

Some two-thirds of business degrees saw points requirements fall or remain at last year’s level

While most teacher training degrees fell between five and 15 points.

Engineering, technology, computing and information systems courses were among the 40 Level 7/6 programmes least in demand, as places on them have been offered to all those meeting basic entry requirements, such as minimum grades in maths and English.

Click here for irishexaminer.com stories before this date

XchampagneX

I got my first choice! Now just have to wait for the CAO offers to come through to confirm it!

InFront

Pretty sh1t way to find out if you didnt get your course though isnt it

R0C0

It is indeed!

Kwekubo

The Irish Times wrote:

With the notable exception of medical-related courses, points are down across a broad range of courses in arts, business, science and social science.

<snip>

Medical and paramedical courses are the one area which bucks the points trend this year. Students needs a minimum of 570 points - the equivalent of six A grades in the Leaving Cert - to have any chance of gaining entry to one of the five medical schools.

Damn it. I'm on 565. I'm getting marked up by hook or crook. Although I don't really suppose I expected the points to budge downwards.

Thanks for the article anyway whassupp, I can now put to rest what notions I had of staying up til six to check the points.

UnitedIrishman

If Arts in Galway drops to 360 I'm sorted. Otherwise, I'm still ok with my 3rd choice.

Anyone verify this?

JCB

UnitedIrishman wrote:

If Arts in Galway drops to 360 I'm sorted. Otherwise, I'm still ok with my 3rd choice.

Anyone verify this?

Arts In Galway is 350!!
It said so on the paper!

68 lost souls

JCB do you have a paper?

68 lost souls

Got the paper! Got my course by 45 points!

Shanegggg

68 lost souls any chance u could tell me the points for engineering in DIT and Mechanical in DIT too?

Would be much appreciated!!

68 lost souls

Engineering common entry level 8 is 420. Whats the course code for Mechanical cant see it written here?

Raphael

Don't suppose you could check Theoretical Physics in UCD and Trinity for me? I'll give you shiny things!

68 lost souls

Theoretical Physic ucd - 450 trinity - 490 randome selection.

Mechanical ENgineering level 6/7 Dit is 350


Anyone else?

Shanegggg

Should be just down as Mechanical Engineering coarse code is DT074 if that helps!
Its the level 8 Mechanical Engineering one!

Can u check commerce in Ucd too if u get the chance?

Thx a million!

68 lost souls

Commerce is 455,

DT025 is Engineerin - common 1st year at 420 points.

Shanegggg

Whoops sorry meant DN074!!
And its actaully in UCD. God i shoulda really looked at my application form more carefully!! :rolleyes:

Thats the mechanical Engineering level8 code!!

68 lost souls

Mechanical ENgineering in UCD is 435. Glad I can help, hope everyone gets what they want? Will I be seeing you in DIT? Will be doing product design myself. 370

Absolut

Can you tell me what the points are for GY309?

Shanegggg

68 lost souls wrote:

Mechanical ENgineering in UCD is 435. Glad I can help, hope everyone gets what they want? Will I be seeing you in DIT? Will be doing product design myself. 370

Yeah thanks a million!! Yeap looks like it now. Got 390 and thought mechanical might go down! So assuming i get the points for Electrical and Electronic Engineering in DIT DT021, I shall be seeing u there!!

68 lost souls

Financial MAthamatics and Economics - 365, down from 400 last year, good luck with it.

68 lost souls

Then yes Shaneggg I will they were 350.

Shanegggg

Nice. Cheers. I can finally get to sleep now!! Shall c u there in freshers week i presume. Good luck with product design i know a guy who's doing it too. Thx

68 lost souls

Will do. Thanks good luck with the Engineering, we'll prob have some lectures together. THat's cool another one of my friends is doing Product Design aswel, thats 3 out of 4 people I know now. Well, Im off to bed aswel. Good luck to everyone else. Sorrry I cant stay up and help everyone else but they will be up on cao.ie in an hour anyway.

MunkyHed

Arts with music is gone up 90 points.
WTF?
My brother is completely gutted. He thought he had enough plus 20 points from lest years points. And with all this 'dropping' talk he reckoned he was sorted. This CAO thing can be so cruel.

GavMan

Gy309 = 365

chairs

doin product design too. i know one guy who is but have heard of noone else.