Constructive Dismissal?

Huggles

Hey all, I am asking this question for my Mam. She is 58 and works full time (9-6) in an Admin position at a local GPs. She has no written contract except for a verbal agreement on wage and hours.

Now, my question is regarding her rights when it comes to dismissal, does she have any or does she have the same amount as her employer?

Basically yesterday she arrived in to a new girl starting, there are only two jobs at present, my Mam (full time) and another lady (part time). Any attempt at salary discussions where met with 'no i can't afford it', yet he goes ahead and takes on another full timer....

My reason for concern is that in the past when he wants to push someone out he hires another person, thus forcing the person he wants out, out. TYhis has happened at least 8 times.

Can he do this, is it constructive dismissal? Both my Mam and the other lady are very worried, they both work very hard and have had no problems other than him refusing to discuss salaries (My Mam is there 3 years and other lady 5 years).

Today between the two of them they decided to stick together, and refuse to budge. With no contracts what are they entitled to ect?

Help much appreciated!! Thanks

Huggles

bumpity bump

Sorry, urgently need help/advice on this one. She is talking to him tonight so has anyone got any snippets of advice/links?

Pllleeeease!

Gillo

Contact the citzens advice bureau, they are your best bet.

I don't see how taking someone else on could be used to force someone out, but obviously you know more about the particular situation. AFAIK, an employer must provide you with a contract of employment withing a certain period of time, I'm not sure what it is, but we are talking weeks not years. if the GP tried to do anything, you mother could try using this against him- but it may well backfire.

CAB is your best bet, but I don't know if they work that quickly.

Wishbone Ash

gillo wrote:

AFAIK, an employer must provide you with a contract of employment withing a certain period of time,

No, under the Terms of Employment (Information) Act 1994 an employer must give an employee a copy of the terms of employment within 2 months of commencing work. Contrary to popular belief, an employee is not legally entitled to a written contract of employment.

Section 3 - Terms of Employment (Information) Act 1994.

3.—(1) An employer shall, not later than 2 months after the commencement of an employee's employment with the employer, give or cause to be given to the employee a statement in writing containing the following particulars of the terms of the employee's employment, that is to say—

( a ) the full names of the employer and the employee,
( b ) the address of the employer in the State or, where appropriate, the address of the principal place of the relevant business of the employer in the State or the registered office (within the meaning of the Companies Act, 1963),
( c ) the place of work or, where there is no fixed or main place of work, a statement specifying that the employee is required or permitted to work at various places,
( d ) the title of the job or nature of the work for which the employee is employed,
( e ) the date of commencement of the employee's contract of employment,
( f ) in the case of a temporary contract of employment, the expected duration thereof or, if the contract of employment is for a fixed term, the date on which the contract expires,
( g ) the rate or method of calculation of the employee's remuneration,
( h ) the length of the intervals between the times at which remuneration is paid, whether a week, a month or any other interval,
( i ) any terms or conditions relating to hours of work (including overtime),
( j ) any terms or conditions relating to paid leave (other than paid sick leave),
( k ) any terms or conditions relating to—
(i) incapacity for work due to sickness or injury and paid sick leave, and
(ii) pensions and pension schemes,
( l ) the period of notice which the employee is required to give and entitled to receive (whether by or under statute or under the terms of the employee's contract of employment) to determine the employee's contract of employment or, where this cannot be indicated when the information is given, the method for determining such periods of notice,
( m ) a reference to any collective agreements which directly affect the terms and conditions of the employee's employment including, where the employer is not a party to such agreements, particulars of the bodies or institutions by whom they were made.

Hitchhiker's Guide to...

First off, this is a terrible situation for your mum to be put in.

Wish the doctor who runs the surgery had the common courtesy to tell his long-term staff about their futures.

AFAIK:

There is an implied job contract because of the length of time they have been working. Thus, they will possibly have a case for unfair dismissal if he let's them go without due warning or justification.

They will also be entitled to redundancy payment (once again AFAIK) if they are let go.

The key thing IMO is not to push the issue immediately, and instead very quickly and quietly join a union. Unions are the trained experts in these matters, and the dues they charge are not an unreasonable amount of money.

I don't know what an appropriate union would be, but maybe you could start by ringing SIPTU? They look after a lot of admin staff.

It would obviously be best for your mum to not make too much of an issue about the current situation until she has union backing.

Another positive thing, is that the union would be able to push for future pay rises, which the employer has been ignoring so far (for example, the required national pay increases under the "programme for pay and prosperity" and the new national pay agreement).

Good luck with the resolution of this.

Wishbone Ash

Roundtower2 wrote:

very quickly and quietly join a union.

It's worth a try but they generally dislike when people do this as it's unfair to those members who have paid their subscriptions all along. It's a bit like trying to get health insurance after discovering that you have a particular condition.

Hitchhiker's Guide to...

I was kind of thinking that as well Wishbone (after i wrote the post), but as you say it is worth a try.