Canon Pricing Policy - Open Letter to Canon Ireland: Progress

leinsterman

OK ... I have had enough of this!!

I really would like to buy my equipment here in Ireland. Currently I buy everything from Germany or USA.

I am in the process of buying a Canon 100-400 IS L zoom, some prices -

Ireland's best -
Gunns - €1850
Conns - €2050

The Rest -
www.ac-foto.com (Germany) - €1,420
www.bhphotovideo.com - €1240 approx depending on exchange rates (this is the non grey market verison)

Compare this to the Nikon D200 body at €1,940 from Gunns and €1,700 from ac-foto. Apparently the problem affects Nikon to a much lessor extent.

My conclusion - This problem is not created by Gunns or Conns or other Irish retailers. It is created by Canon Ireland and their pricing strategy to the retailers. This is in not in the anyone's interest since is forces us to risk buying gear overseas and takes local business out of the country. I'm sure it would be interesting to see how European law deals with this situation too. Is Canon policy in fact legal under EU law ?

My solution. Lets let Canon know how we feel about this situation. we can vote with our feet. In fact I already have in buying Sigma lenses.

The person you need to write to is -

Philip Brady
Canon Ireland Limited
Arena Road
Sandyford Industrial Estate
Dublin 18

It is in your interest to participate the more of us that do the better the chance that Canon might respond.

Morlar

Good call - theres no point whinging about it and doing nothing - their prices are ridiculous alright, and yes I would have thought that there was eu legislation in place to cover this sort of scalping.

I read somewhere the other day that the taxation on camera gear is about 5 % different from germany - so with that in mind somone somewhere is taking the piss. Roll on europe wide common pricing !

limbovski

I recently was looking to purchase a case for my ultra compact camera the most appropriate 'pouch' was a canon for €35. The next most expensive case was €25.99.

The canon however was simply two pieces of material joined together the 25.99 job was a huge case with padding, pockets, zips, clips and everything else....

i know the canon case was probably custom made for an ixus or whatever but still. similar cases from other manufactures (also custom made) were between €6 and €10.

Smokeyskelton

Hi

For the record, I am buying a Nikon D200 from Gunn's and it is €1,700 (I assume you are talking body only, no lens). I decided not to buy in B&H despite going there shortly, (I've never been to New York before, so will definitely go to B&H to have a look). As I said in another post I was going to buy abroad, but for the sake of the hassle with warranties and customs the difference was only 7% or so in price.

However, in general I am with you 100%, we do get ripped off compared to America, they also have to import the stuff from Asia, what gives? This goes for all the manufacturers not just Canon.

Smokey

eas

Smokeyskelton wrote:

For the record, I am buying a Nikon D200 from Gunn's and it is €1,700
Smokey

that's quite a good price for a "Bricks and Morter" shop. Did you haggle them down to that?

leinsterman

Hi,

Here is a draft extract from the (rather long... sorry) letter I will be sending to Canon Ireland. I have removed some parts to protect my privacy -

Firstly let me say I am the owner of a Canon EOS 20d SLR and an assortment of other Canon products. (including 50mm F1.8 lens, Speedlight 420EX, iP8500 printer, 75-300mm USM lens, Powershot S400, EOS 500 SLR, Battery grip BG-E2). I purchased all of my Canon equipment overseas despite wanting to buy here in Ireland, keeping money and jobs in Ireland. The EOS range of camera equipment is excellent; the EOS 20d body is by far the best imaging product I have ever purchased.

As an amateur photography enthusiast, I have advanced to the point where I want to start to acquire better Camera equipment and build a good collection of quality lenses. I am currently considering the purchase of the Canon 100-400mm IS L lens for my first purchase (hopefully of many) in the “L” range. I have investigated pricing of this lens here, in Germany, the UK and in the USA. My findings lead me to believe that Canon Ireland’s pricing policy towards retailers is causing a problem that is against the interests of consumers, the Irish camera retail business, the Irish economy and the Canon Corporation itself.

Let me illustrate this point by making a comparison of the retail pricing on the 100-400mm IS L lens to the Nikon D200 body. I have had occasion to do business with all of the retailers below, they are all reputable and none of these items are grey market –
• Irish Retailer 1 - €2,050 / net of Irish VAT - €1,694
• Irish Retailer 2 - €1,850 / net of Irish VAT - €1,529
• German Retailer 1 - €1,420 / net of German VAT - €1,224 (Note: This is less than retailer’s cost in Ireland!!)
• UK Retailer 1 - €1,745 / net of UK VAT - €1,442
• USA Retailer 1 - €1,200 / net of New York State tax - €1,105

Let me compare this to the pricing of the Nikon D200 body as follows (same retailers) –
• Irish Retailer 1 - €1,940 / net of Irish VAT - €1,603
• Irish Retailer 2 - €1,700 / net of Irish VAT - €1,405
• German Retailer 1 - €1,700 / net of German VAT - €1,465
• UK retailer 1 - €1,670 / net of UK VAT - €1,421
• USA Retailer 1 - €1,460 / net of New York State Tax - €1,341

As you can see, for the same outlets, Nikon pricing is far more consistent. This makes Nikon a more attractive option to Irish consumers wanting to buy Irish and have local support / warranty. I have no doubt this will hurt Canon business interests in Ireland now that Nikon have released the excellent D200.

I appreciate that one can expect a variation from retailer to retailer in a free market. I also appreciate that distribution cost, local VAT rates etc. can lead to significant variation between markets.....

.... I have shared this information with others in the photography forum of www.boards.ie. You can clearly see in this forum an indication of an overwhelming trend for Irish photography enthusiasts either to purchase their camera equipment overseas or buy from Nikon and others.

It appears we have all come to the same conclusion: Someone, somewhere in the Canon Ireland supply chain is overpricing. In my opinion it is not the retailers, the finger of suspicion points directly at Canon Ireland. There can be no justification for such wide variation within the EU zone. I would be interested to see how this lines up under EU law. It appears to be the application of outdated pricing policies long overdue for review in the light of a new global economy and the emergence of online retailing.

Whoever is at the centre of this problem is hurting the entire supply chain including Canon Ireland. It is stifling local business growth in the sector and forcing money directly out of the Irish economy. Something has to give here, Canon cannot expect local retailers to continue act as their showroom while overseas and online retailers reap the benefits of the sale.

I would be grateful if you could review this situation and let me know what, if anything, Canon intends to do in the short term to address it.

It is unfortunate that I am now forced to consider if it is in my interest to write off my losses with Canon and move to Nikon. I am willing to be patient to give Canon the opportunity to respond, but my patience is beginning to run out. In the interim I am without a suitable long lens which is not making me very happy with Canon.

Smokeyskelton

Hi eas

No, I didn't haggle at all. I ordered one a couple of weeks ago, and one happened to come in stock the next day. (They has previously been waiting a couple of months for a delivery I think). As it happened I didn't have the money at the time so getting it on Saturday (all things going well), so hopefully they don't give me a horrible shock when I go in.

I never thought that a small old fashioned shop likes Gunn would be aggresive/progressive on price, but read about them on this forum and was pleasantly surprised when I rang. As I say, it is still a bit dearer then the US, but with customs and warranty issues it was not worth the difference in price.

Still, fingers crossed for Saturday that they don't say "sorry about that, but it is actually €2,000"!

Smokey

Fenster

I've worked in retail for years and every retailer has to make their margin somehow - for photo stores its accessories, although there always comes the point when they're taking the piss with prices. Take the lens hood for the Canon kit lens, which is 30 euro. Its a bit of plastic that probably cost 50 cents. Also, the markup on a lot of lenses can be scary, no matter where you purchase.

sdssarah

of course you could always go to a place like the camera exchange on georges st, they do second hadn stuff there as well as new stuff, and they give good discounts!

but if you want to fight the man, then go right ahead, personally i love my eos 350d and all its accessories and has been nothing but an absolute treat to me

rymus

Definately a cause worthy of support. It cant just be down to "good old rip off Ireland" that this stuff is unjustifyably expensive.

I find myself buying in Hong Kong because of the prices in Ireland. I'd love to buy locally, if prices were a little more realistic that is. Until such time as that happens, Hong Kong and Sigma have my business.

mloc

seems very odd alright.

statistically, the co-efficient of variation in prices for the canon lens is about 0.2, whilst for the nikon camera it is 0.1. this indicates around twice the variation in price between the two products.

i wonder how they'll try and justify it.

rymus

I wonder if they'll bother trying to justify it. If any satisfactory reply is given to the question I'll be amazed.

311

UK Retailer

I was always putting down the large canon prices here ,to the small market we have and the cost of having service for their products ,But

Sigma has a service centre in cork and unfortunately I've had to use it already ,there was no problems or time delays and sigma products are the same price here on the high street as they are on technikdirect.

I'm sure high street shops are making money from selling sigmas here and the rent on shops here is dearer than a net warehouse.

leinsterman

_Brian_ wrote:

I'm sure high street shops are making money from selling sigmas here and the rent on shops here is dearer than a net warehouse.

This is going to sound as if I work in the industry but I can assure you I am merely a concerned amateur.

Having had the opportunity to discuss with some of the high street shops I can say that many are making margins in the single digit area (between 0 and 10%). This varies from shop to shop but you would be surprised how little some are making from equipment. Many rely on other items they sell to make money and use camera bodies and lenses as loss leaders.

By way of example, the costs of a Canon 100-400mm IS L to the retailer is about €1,375. When you add and margin of about 5% and VAT at 21% this give s a price of around €1,800. But you have to remember that Irish retailers are already at a disadvantage here since VAT in Germany (16%) and UK (17.5%) is less.

rymus wrote:

I wonder if they'll bother trying to justify it. If any satisfactory reply is given to the question I'll be amazed.

Thanks very much Rymus for making this thread sticky. We need to get as much people behind this as possible.

If you are behind me on this, and you cannot find the time to write to Canon yourself, then at least post your feelings in this thread. Let us know if you have bought overseas (you don't need to say where). I will make sure Canon Ireland get to see your comments.

We can use this thread as a kind of petition.

leinsterman

mloc wrote:

seems very odd alright.

statistically, the co-efficient of variation in prices for the canon lens is about 0.2, whilst for the nikon camera it is 0.1. this indicates around twice the variation in price between the two products.

i wonder how they'll try and justify it.

I'm no statistician but the variance problem may be worse when you net everything of local VAT rates, see below -

Canon 100-400mm IS L Lens -
• Conns net of Irish VAT - €1,694
• Gunns net of Irish VAT - €1,529
• AC-foto net of German VAT - €1,224 (Note: This is less than retailer's cost in Ireland!!)
• Jessups net of UK VAT - €1,442
• B&H net of New York State tax - €1,105

Nikon D200 body –
• Conns net of Irish VAT - €1,603
• Gunns net of Irish VAT - €1,405
• AC-foto net of German VAT - €1,465
• Jessups net of UK VAT - €1,421
• B&H net of New York State Tax - €1,341

If we ignore Conns and use Gunns as the Irish market reference price then the variance for Canon is huge compared to Nikon!!!

As a life long Canon fan ... I am starting to have second thoughts!!

eas

If we ignore Conns and use Gunns as the Irish market reference price then the variance for Canon is huge compared to Nikon!!!

If you look at it my way, that's not a good thing. Nikon are experiancing HUGE supply problems at the moment. When demand outstrips supply....we know what happens, prices stay high.

As an example, the nikkor 18-200 VR has a waiting list of months for most shops. I looked and looked and could'nt find anywhere that had them in stock. I've had my name on at both Adorama and BnH for 8 weeks now, no word yet. The ebay (hong kong) prices are actually HIGHER than the local high street price.

The D200 is the same thing to a lesser degree, huge demand/low supply.

Anyhow, not trying to take away from the focus of the thread, just something to consider when making your comparisions.

punchdrunk

the problem here is that you have to buy from canon ireland (united drug),which are sourced from canon u.k which inturn have bought the goods from germany etc... we're too far down the food chain to compete
margins on cameras were i work are usually 10% or less though some things like fuji's are slightly better

it's canons fault

311

UK Retailer

I think Nikkon have stopped making film cameras ??
Would it be not fair to consider the american market is so big ,that the logistics of shipping goods would cost a lot less.
Maybe nikkons are overpriced in the american market.

I cannot stand the high pricing of canon lenses ,there maybe more to their pricing than simply ripping people off though. Would I be right in saying that canon are heavily involved in the imaging industry ,wereas nikkon is not.Maybe canon could drop their prices a little ,but I wonder exactly how much it would be .

Roen

Voted non-European retailer. The only way to fly atm.

leinsterman

rymus wrote:

I wonder if they'll bother trying to justify it. If any satisfactory reply is given to the question I'll be amazed.

Hi ... just a quick update on this.... Cathy from Gunns rang me today ... she had spoken to the Canon rep who was aware of my letter. The letter appears to have caused quite a stir. It seems that there are now plans by Canon Ireland to harmonise with their EU pricing. What this means in practice is as yet unclear (hopefully they will not be too stupid and raise it everywhere pushing even more money out of the EU) ... You can expect some country to country variation but not on the scale previously seen. Plus there are significant differences in VAT across the EU, Ireland being one of the higest.

The bad news (at least for me) is this will not happen until the new year ...

I have still no official response form Canon yet. When I receive it I will be sure to post it here.

It is important we continue to encourage boards.ie photography posters to post their views in this thread and participate in the survey above. This information can be used later to demonstrate to Canon that they are losing business. I have to admit I am little dissappointed with the level of response thus far ... but here's hoping people will eventually get around to it.

masteroftherealm

UK Retailer

Sorry for not replying.
Ive written a letter to the above address as I agree fully with you.
I buy in ireland as much as I can but Im getting ripped off for doing so!

5uspect

Other European Union Retailer

I have to say well done for getting up and doing something about rip off prices.
Eddie Hobbs award for you!
I bought my 350d (with 18-55 and 55-200mm lenses) from amazon.co.uk as it was €400 cheaper. My next canon purchase will be the EF-S 60mm Macro which i saw in germany a few days ago for €380. I haven't even considered looking at prices here.

GASUN

Good campaign which must continue. However, having just purchased a Canon 70-200 IS f2.8L from USA (saved close to €1000) and now looking at Canon 5D ......

.... will write the letter to them anyway to support what has been started.

leinsterman

GASUN wrote:

Good campaign which must continue. However, having just purchased a Canon 70-200 IS f2.8L from USA (saved close to €1000) and now looking at Canon 5D ......

.... will write the letter to them anyway to support what has been started.

My letter is nearly two weeks old now and I still await a response. My next course of action is to go one more step up the chain ... but I need to find out who this person might be, probably someone from their European HQ ... I am beginning to think Canon just don't give damn ... after all they have our money now, why should they ? :mad:

That D200 is looking to me to be a better way to invest my money!!

kjt

UK Retailer

Fairplay to everybody that's written to Canon about this.
I'm thinking of getting a 350d also and I'd love to get it
from Gunns as their a great store and SO helpful....but
a few hundred euro in the difference doesnt leave much choice.

I'll try make some time to write to Canon also.

punchdrunk

but folks like i said above canon ireland is a very small branch on a very big tree,we're being fleeced before the camera's are even in the country!

better off going straight to the source

Redundo

Other European Union Retailer

I've also had to buy my camera gear in from abroad. I say 'had to' because I simply could not afford to get involved in photography unless foreign markets had been available to me. To be quite honest I don't even buy film here in Ireland, it is just not worth it.

While I do believe Canon should shoulder most of the blame on the price discrepancies, I also firmly believe that the government should share some of the blame too, tax adds quite a bit to the price we get charged. 16% in Germany, 17.5% in the UK and there VAT is exempt on orders under £18 - film, paper and print cartridges, etc. Why are we so different at 21%?

We get done twice for buying within Ireland; first Canon ups the price, then the Government taxes the inflated price. Even if retailers were on break-even margins, we would still be charged more then most of our EU neighbours.

Alun

Redundo wrote:

16% in Germany, 17.5% in the UK and there VAT is exempt on orders under £18 - film, paper and print cartridges, etc. Why are we so different at 21%?

FYI German VAT is going up to 19% soon. There's a big uproar about it there. Although our VAT rates are higher we pay less in income tax and social security payments than many other EU countries. Swings and roundabouts.

311

UK Retailer

Leinsterman ,I'm glad this thread is here and is a sticky .It will come up in a search in google all the time and I'm sure canon knows of this thread.
I completely agree with you ,I've no problem selling my stuff and going to nikon if thats what it takes also.
With the addition of sony to the market and the excellence of Carl Zeiss glass I don't think canon can afford to treat punters like fools for much longer.

leinsterman

Hi,

Having not received a response from Canon yet I have decided to escalate the campaign a little.

What I have done is written to as many of the camera clubs around the country as I can to ask them to encourage their membership post here, write to canon and/or vote in the poll.

So far I have received responses from Dublin, Arklow and Malahide.

Please make sure you pass on the information about this thread and the campaign to as many others as you can. We need to show the guys at Canon Ireland that they are losing out by ignoring us.

CONMIKE12

Other European Union Retailer

Well done leinsterman for getting the ball rolling on this one.When i decided a few months ago to get serious and buy a dslr,there was simply no way i could afford to buy in ireland and saved myself a few hundread euro by getting my 20d from Amazon.co.uk. I'm saving for lenses and the same thing applies,there's no way i can afford them here and it looks like Germany will be where i give my business.I wouldn't mind paying a little bit extra to buy in ireland,but the difference is too great to make that possible.Good luck with the campaign,hopefully when we all get behind it ,it might make some difference.

aFlabbyPanda

Other European Union Retailer

I would always hav bought my gear be it camera, phone, gadgets, etc from abroad as the prices in this country are a rip off. However since I went to buy a new Canon 17-85mm Lens recently I realised just how much. Even when compared to the UK its was at least 150€ dearer here (it got as far as 300€ from one reatiler)

So I've put pen to paper and sent my copy.

(ps maybe this is completly off the wall but does Nikon stuff appear to be cheaper when comparing like for like?)

bloke

Non European Union Retailer

Just to add to the comments here rather than just lurk:

I bought my 350D from pixmania (France?) and 420ex from 7dayshop (UK) last year. The saving over retail prices at the time was of the order of 300-400 euro. (~25%)

Will hopefully be purchasing a 17-85 lens soon and haven't even considered using an Irish retailer because of high prices. I bought my 50mm 1.8 lens from an Irish retailer for ~e150 because I needed it urgently - and have been trying to avert my eyes from the <e100 prices on European sites ever since!

As others have said - I would prefer to use an Irish retailer if there was a *reasonable* premium, rather than the huge difference currently!

Well done for the effort on this so far - I hope it bears fruit for everyone's sake!

Owenw

Other European Union Retailer

With the exception of my dSLR I have bought all my gear from Germany. The SLR was bought locally as it was my 1st experience with these cameras and I wanted peace of mind in case things went wrong. Needless to say, the replacement will also be bought abroad, unless the pricing is brought in line with the rest of Europe.

From my work in the IT industry sometimes we get trade pricing for the odd canon SLR and the margins are slim indeed. Blame definitely rests higher up the distribution chain.

DotOrg

i've spent approx €9000 on canon equipment, all from the US, i'd never buy in Ireland even though I could buy directly from wholesale if I wanted

Fionn

Other European Union Retailer

does Canon give two hoots where users buy their gear?
it all filters back to Canon in the long term.
I think the people who should be kicking up an almighty stink about this moreso than the users is the local dealers they are the ones that are losing out big time. I'm sure they must know when someone comes into their shop and asks about a Canon EOS 20 D and holds it and whatever and says thanks and walks out that they're off to order it from Germany or elsewhere!

I've a Canon with two decent lens so it wouldn't take much to change over to Nikon or some other brand. perhaps it might be good to wait and see what Sony and Konica Minolta come up with?


Anyway the point i'm making is if we the user base do not buy stuff in Ireland and buy from abroad it really doesn't impact on Canon at all just the irish dealers. If we change brand tho, thats a different matter!

Anyway i'm sending my letter this evening!
I do hope if there is a change in Canon's attitude(which is doubtful) that the irish dealers would reflect this and not just jump on the rip-off bandwagon anyway!!

leinsterman

Hi,

Another update on this thread (also bumping it since it is no longer sticky).

I received a call two days ago from the Managing Director of Canon Ireland. I was away on vacation so I missed his call but he left me his mobile number.

I will call him tomorrow and post any information he tells me in this thread.

Oriel

()

Valentia

Fair play Leinsterman. It will be interesting to hear what he has to say.

paudie

Non European Union Retailer

Just adding my 2c, bought a 20d and a 70-200 L from the same guy on ebay, he had good feedback and had sold a lot of stuff as far as I could see. I'd say I saved close to €900 on this deal. I'm saving at the moment to buy a 400mm L prime from him again as this will save me anoth €500-600 on Irish prices.

Point to add, I did buy a sigma in the Camera center because the difference in price was the postage so it made sense to buy here. If Sigma can do it why can't Canon?

Roen

Well done Leinsterman, you'll be on Watchdog yet

440Hz

paudie wrote:

Just adding my 2c, bought a 20d and a 70-200 L from the same guy on ebay, he had good feedback and had sold a lot of stuff as far as I could see. I'd say I saved close to €900 on this deal. I'm saving at the moment to buy a 400mm L prime from him again as this will save me anoth €500-600 on Irish prices.

Point to add, I did buy a sigma in the Camera center because the difference in price was the postage so it made sense to buy here. If Sigma can do it why can't Canon?

When you first told me that you were ordering a 20D and 70-200 on ebay paudie i thought you had lost the plot! But it all really turned out well didnt it, fast delivery, excellent savings... it sure convinced me that tis the way to go.

rymus

shur theres no reason not to order everything from ebay now... In fact the only thing I bought locally (apart from some of the small stuff like filters) has been my sigma 10-20. That'll also include an upcoming 70-200L IS, possibly a 30D and maybe even a 100-400L

Valentia

I bought all my gear on EBay too. Camers (10D) from the US and lenses from Hong Kong. A small bit of duty but still way cheaper. I'd much prefer to have bought it from Gunns though but the difference is so big I couldn't afford it.

leinsterman

Hi,

At last progress !!!

Ok so here's the scoop.

I spoke to Philip Brady at Canon Ireland today. He agrees with the sentiment of my letter and has been pushing his masters in Japan and Europe along the same lines.

He informs me that there will be some progress on this matter upon which he can inform us in a few weeks. He wants to keep the specific details from us for the moment (he is not allowed to reveal the specifics for commercial reasons). He promised to get back to me in a few weeks and I believe him.... so watch this space!!

In my opinion he is a likeable sincere chap ... seems on our side ... remember his sales bonus is made from Irish sales only so this backs up the point ... so I recommend we give him a chance.

He is following this thread and really wants to hear your comments. So please keep em coming.

Thats it for now ... keep it up ... you are his customers he seems to be listening to you ... your posts may help him make our case internally in Canon.

5uspect

Other European Union Retailer

Thats great news. I'm planning on getting the 60mm EF-S Macro towards the end of the year when I'm over in Germany for xmas, tho if prices drop here that would make things so much better.

paudie

Non European Union Retailer

Thats great, I'd definitely buy here if it was brought just a little more within my reach. Being able to test the lens, and having a definite place to go back to would push me towards buying at home.


Like a previous poster said though, Canon is getting the money either way, so maybe we should let Gunss/Conns/Camera Centre know about this thread then they may feel more inclined to push with us for Canon to drop the prices?

peter1892

leinsterman wrote:

Hi,

He informs me that there will be some progress on this matter upon which he can inform us in a few weeks. He wants to keep the specific details from us for the moment (he is not allowed to reveal the specifics for commercial reasons). He promised to get back to me in a few weeks and I believe him.... so watch this space!!

Standardising prices across the Euro zone would be nice. Base it on Germany's prices & we'll be away!

Better still, base it on Japanese prices... (a mate paid €500 for a 350d & 18-55 USM lens in Tokyo).

FinoBlad

Other European Union Retailer

leinsterman wrote:

your posts may help him make our case internally in Canon.

So basically what you are saying is that Canon have decided to sell their cameras in Ireland at a higher price than in other countries in the EU?

Is that what he is saying?

Fionn

Other European Union Retailer

well it's a start
It would be interesting to hear from some of the Irish dealers on this because as I’ve previously stated they are the biggest stakeholders in this!
and it does seem to be just Canon's products that are marked up here in Ireland, which I think both ourselves and the dealers should strongly resent, to illustrate this - I was researching two lenses recently, see the details below


Canon EF 17-40mm f/4.0 L USM

US $640 €503
UK £560 €830
Germany €704
Ireland €980

Sigma 10-20mm F4-5.6 EX DC HSM

US $403 €317
UK £319 €473
Germany €477
Ireland €475

Fajitas!

Hopefully this'll work


Anyways, I'm hoping to buy a 30D with grip...as it stands, not a hope in hell of buying it in Ireland, and I'm not the biggest fan of buying online... There's a huge price difference, going from 2000 for the camera with 18-55 in a shop to 1288 for the camera with grip...

I'm a lowly art student, who needs a camera, and a good one... Come on Canon!