Obesity is the new race

Transform

So i was reading the Observer at the weekend and came across this article on why the obese people of this world have set up organisations to combat discrimination towards them for being.... well so large.

E.g. paying more for health insurance or not being able to get health insurance, being passed up for promotion etc

They were pointing out that one has a choice to be that big or not whereas you are born with a certain skin colour. Also there was lots of talk about how they are happy as larry being that weight.

So the question -

1. Do you think you are kinder and more understanding to An obese/overweight person

v's an attractive normal weight person?

2. Do you think you will lead a more fulfilled life (career, love, health etc) by being in shape than not? (please no debates on what is a fulfilled life - leave that to the philosopers).

GerryRyan

Transform wrote:

Also there was lots of talk about how they are happy as larry being that weight.

Meh. Each to their own I suppose. I couldn't see myself getting out of shape like that tbh. But I completely disagree about the whole 'discrimination' bit - you don't have a choice with your skin colour etc, but you do have one with the whole obesity issue.

^^
IMO

g'em

Transform wrote:

1. Do you think you are kinder and more understanding to An obese/overweight person

v's an attractive normal weight person?

well.. yes and no. I will have a certain amount of empathy for someone who's a little larger, but then that's probably because I've been of the larger disposition in the past. But what will tick me off is someone who's overweight and b*tches and moans about it while they're eating a McDonalds. If you're happy with your weight, fine. If you're not, do something about it. It may not be easy, no-one said it was, but it's worth it.

Transform wrote:

2. Do you think you will lead a more fulfilled life (career, love, health etc) by being in shape than not? (please no debates on what is a fulfilled life - leave that to the philosopers).

Honestly, yes. Being in shape results increased energy levels, better concentration, a great sense of achievement etc etc. The strive for self-improvement contains within it abilities that can be conferred to lots of other aspects of live- drive, determination, a hard-working ethic. You carry yourself better, you don't get ill as often, you become the best 'you' there is. Being in shape and healthy isn't an entity in itself, it spills over into virtually all other spects of life, and I would be hugely surprised if someone was to say otherwise.

SparkyLarks

ThatGuy wrote:

Meh. Each to their own I suppose. . But I completely disagree about the whole 'discrimination' bit - you don't have a choice with your skin colour etc, but you do have one with the whole obesity issue.

^^
IMO

Tell that to Michael Jackson.

Seriously, discrimination has nothing to do with wheater you choose to be something or you are born that way.

If someone who is born a Jew becomes a christian and is discriminated agaist, it is still discrimination

If someone want;s to be obese that is ther choice, by and large, ther is some genitic disposition but that can be over come to some extent IMHO.

However if somechooses to eat large quantities of fatty foods and not exercise then they should have to pay in some way for the probable increased amounts the health care system will have to pay on them. be it through higher insurance ect.

Similarly someone who smokes should have to pay more as they are more likely to have health problems in later life.

It's not discrimination it's paying their own way. though this can raise more issues too. Someone who runs alot is more likely to have probelms with their knees ect ect ect

comer_97

Not all fat people are lazy! There are genuine medical conditions out there.

But i did know a very large woman who said "i can't seem to loose any weight on this diet" as she munched on a donut!

Sangre

'Its not my fault I've a terrible metabolism!'

SHUT UP! SHUT UP! SHUT UP! SHUT UP!!

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

Smellyirishman

Transform wrote:

1. Do you think you are kinder and more understanding to An obese/overweight person ~vs~ an attractive normal weight person?

Definitly wouldn't be consciously kinder/understanding to an obese person out of pity or whatever , although , it really depends on the situation/person. I am definitly more likely to be kind to a girl I find attractive. Being understanding really depends on the situation and the dilema in question.

Transform wrote:

2. Do you think you will lead a more fulfilled life (career, love, health etc) by being in shape than not? (please no debates on what is a fulfilled life - leave that to the philosopers).

Most definitly, I doubt you could find a person that would not agree with that (and not an obese person in denial).

yomchi

I heard a terrible thing today from the Corpo gym on the north side. One of the 'gym instructors' there is very large. She had an appointment with a chinese lady for an assessment. When the chinese lady seen the instructor she ran amok! Apparantly screaming 'I am not paying money for that thing to tell me about fitness!!' :eek:

And to be honest I think she had a point, I wouldn't go to see the elephant man for a beauty consultation...not that I need one..that is..

LegacyUser

Transform wrote:

So the question -

1. Do you think you are kinder and more understanding to An obese/overweight person

v's an attractive normal weight person?

2. Do you think you will lead a more fulfilled life (career, love, health etc) by being in shape than not? (please no debates on what is a fulfilled life - leave that to the philosopers).

1) No.

2) Yes definitely.

Dragan

comer_97 wrote:

Not all fat people are lazy! There are genuine medical conditions out there.

Actually, not really. I have never been able to find a medical condition that can lead to you weight 27 stone when your natural weight is 12.


When I was overweight it was because I was lazy and I ate the wrong foods at the wrong times. When I realised that all my efforts to "lose weight" were flawed because I didn't have a clue what I was doing I educated myself, took the steps I needed and lost the weigth I wanted to lose and added the muscle I wanted to add.

I will not treat obese people different to anyone else, not because I was large, but because they are people. However, I will not put up with any **** from them. I used to work with an obese man. He was always talking about how he hated being obese, and wanted to do something about it. I did him up a diet, actually a 12 week plan to cut out all his bad foods and replace them with good choices. I offered to train with him everday in order to help him in the gym and to lose weight.

We have a gym in work and could have gone there during the day when it is deserted. No need to be shy right? He didn't last one day on the diet and he never showed up once for a workout. My general rule is if you want to change, you will change. If not….shut up. I come from a "heavy family" both my sisters and my brother would be heavy. I was heavy. Do we have "heavy genes"? Nope. We had a mother who was a chef!!!! There is no gene that makes you eat so much that you cannot move, or wash yourself, or breath without help. If you want to change, then change. It may take time, and effort, and false starts, but eventually you will get there.

Obesity has been on the rise to a huge degree for the last 30 years....how much can our genes change in 30 years?

As for part 2. I think I am just happier in myself, and this leads to improvements in other area's of my life. I think being heavy taught me humility and manners, while getting in shape has given me confidence.

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

TerrorFirmer

daveirl wrote:

This post has been deleted.

Well, what could you say really.....speaks for itself! At the end of the day, its their life....just be happy you are the man you are!

Dragan has stolen all my brilliant thoughts, basically then I will concede to just saying:

1. No

2. Yes.

Black Swan

Transform wrote:

So the question -
1. Do you think you are kinder and more understanding to An obese/overweight person

v's an attractive normal weight person?

2. Do you think you will lead a more fulfilled life (career, love, health etc) by being in shape than not? (please no debates on what is a fulfilled life - leave that to the philosopers).

1. Am I kinder and more understanding to someone over weight? To be honest, probably not. I want them to shape up.

2. I'm into daily workouts, diet, and a bit high strung, so weight has not been a problem. Perhaps when I get older, although I can't picture myself slowing down any time soon. My career is in part tied to how I look, so if I was to put on obvious weight, my career opportunities would more than likely be affected.

brown*eyed*girl

Whilst I agree with a lot of points above I think that Compulsive Over Eating is an Eating Disorder and more of a psychological problem rather than a greedy person overindulging. I think their overeating is their “coping mechanism” in life. Now I’m not saying ALL overweight people but some seriously find it hard to stop eating food that give them so much comfort. I have a friend who is overweight and she really do try so hard but gets depressed and the food comforts her. It’s a lot deeper with most overweight people on why they eat. Yes its laziness, eating wrong foods, too much foods, lack of exercise but sometimes they get caught up in a vicious cycle of depression - comfort eating – low self esteem – depression – comfort eating. I’ve never been overweight but I’m a bit underweight now and when I get depressed or stressed I actually find it hard to eat anything but I know people who’ll turn to food when they are stressed or depressed whilst some turn to alcohol or drugs. This obesity epidemic is getting scary because with life getting more and more stressful and the unreal availability of fast food and junk its easy for a person with a hectic lifestyle or mental issues to fall into the trap.

Boru.

As regards question one - it depends on the peson's personailty more so than physical apperance. I have friends on both sides of the fence - those who are obese (and in my opinion lazy as hell, others just uneducated about healthy food and diet) and those who are fitness fanatics (half of whom are equally uneducated as to helahty food choices and senisible training :rolleyes:). If they are fun, good, decent people I treat them well. If they are self indulgent, self obsessed begrudgers and whinners I won't waste my time on them.

I have found that the poeple who complain and bemoan not just their physical state but seemingly everything else are mostly overweight.

Wil I be kinder and more considerate - no.

But what if they have a medicla condition - I don't care. It has very little to do with it in my opinion. Having a medical condition or genetic predisposition to being fat is NOT an excuse. Its a motivation to train even harder. Becasue its not just about your appearance - its about your quality of life. Leading me to the second quesiton....

Will you be more fulfilled? Yes without hesitaton. If you want proof make them watch the scene in Pumping Iron when Arnie talks about how he is always coming becasue of his workouts. That man was clearly fufilled!

Seriously though - as some people on the board my be aware we have a genetic condition in my family, so far everyone has it. Uncles, nephew's nices etc. The condition is porgressive and at present incurable. We are all among other things predisposed to being fat. My family spends most of its life in and out of the hospital, getting check ups - and not one of them, has taken repsonsability for their health. Its all but we can't help it - thats Bull. Pure and Simple.

I refuse to be suffer like they do. I will not suffer the constant laboured breathing. The inability to walk form one room to another, the inability to get around the house or do daily tasks, I will not spend half the day asleep.

They do not need to be as fat as they are - they could exercise they could get fitter, they hide behind their condition. I am a fat man by birth. I am weak, and I cannot push myself...thats my familty's legacy.

My reality is I am a 6th degree black belt, level 2 RBPP Instructor, Fitness Instrutor and Perosnal Trainer, leading expert on Isometric and M.I.T. Training. I can press over 1700kg with my legs, over 400kg with my chest and lift over 500kg with my back. I weight 169lbs and have 9% body fat. This isn't good enough for me. When you put your mind to it, dedicate yourself and you can achieve the impossible.

I love every second of my life, I won't have it for long, nor will anyone else in the great scheme of things, and I cannot understand why anyone would want to move through life incapable of experiencing it fully. To me its ungrateful. Every breath can be clean, pure, and refreshing, every movement, effortless and every sensation fully expereinced - why cut yourself off from that by being over weight.

Everyone has a choice. Some choose not to experience life like that and they find fufillment elsewhere, and thats okay, but never turn around and say "but I can't have that life". If you want it bad enough you will find away.


Incidentally here's a bit of a reverse proposition - how many here have been discriminated against for being fit!

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Boru.
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Boru.

Borwn-eyed-girls post is intresting. As regards the phsycological aspects in dealing with stress etc leading to over and underindulgence in food these too can be overcome, though in many ways not as easily. I've often viewed alchohol, cigarettes, drugs and food as cruthes overly relied upon to see people through - soon they become so natural and so completely part of life that few realise they can walk without them. Much like an over reliance on back supports and belts lead to an inherent weakness of the muscle so to do these lead to an inherent weakness in of charcacter.

The nature of the mind and its porgramming has been opended up like never before. We are only learning now the incredible capabilities it has to create and destroy positive and negative habits and physcological tendancies.

If you'd like to help your friend I can think of several useful resources - the chief one being Psycho-cybernetics by Dr. Maxwell Maltz. A plastic surgeon he developed a method of reprogramming the mind to remove negative and self destructive habits using what would later be the basis for neuro associative conditioning. I'd also recommend NLP. If you like more details on the books and courses or how the process works pm. Don't want to wander too far off topic.:D

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Boru.

Irony - On tv3 Right now Rikki Lkae is doing a show about obesity titled "stop putting me down becasue I'm obese!" So far they've shown film of all these over wieght kids going around the shops with their moms kicking and screaming if they don't get the junk food and cookies they want. Then cutting to them talking about how they hate being fat, but then saying I just like my food - healthy stuff dosn't taste nice...of curse Rikki is symapthising saying its very hard...this type of coddling and denile of personal responsability will only compound the problem. They should all be made watch the episode of South Park called Weight gain 3000...when Cartman decides he's not fat, he's just big boned. Hilarious and accurate.

Update - thet've brough out Tony Little America's fitness trainer - wait for it his soloution - my super tasty high sugar protein meal replacements bars! Oh and my vitamin supplement - no hard work, exercise needed. Wow. Lots of energy, crowd loves him. The biggest guy on stage turns to him and says "You're really irritiagting me!" (I love him - causes he's right) Tony Little "be positive" - dead silence. What a solution. Eat my bars and get thin. Of course none of them will do exercise so what can you expect.

________________

Boru.
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t-ha

Transform wrote:

1. Do you think you are kinder and more understanding to An obese/overweight person

v's an attractive normal weight person?

It took me a while to realise that almost everyone who is attractive & normal weight puts effort into it. It's easy to dismiss fit people as just having gotten the best genes, and doing it effortlessly - but that's turned out to be wrong everytime I've gotten to know someone better. I can honestly say that I don't know anyone who looks good that doesn't put in the effort in in some way.

So basically my answer would now be 'no'. Like previous posters I have alot of time for positive people & less time for whiners, whatever their size.

Transform wrote:

2. Do you think you will lead a more fulfilled life (career, love, health etc) by being in shape than not? (please no debates on what is a fulfilled life - leave that to the philosopers).

Yes.

ThrownAway

I'll be honest. Today I started with a induction for a job in my local Credit Uninon. When I went upstairs I was introduced to two very overweight women in their late 20s. I feel sorry for them. I do feel sorry for very obese people. There are many reasons for being overweight so I think it's unfair for people to dismiss it all and blame it on general laziness.

Take a person who is overweight because of emotional problems and depression. If you're depressed, you're more than likely lazy. You don't care about anything anymore. You don't have the will and have given up. Depression stems from abuse. If you were sexually/physically abused as a child and told you were worthless you may turn to food to fill the emptiness. This could then turn into a life long habit. This person needs therapy, not a diet plan for the week.

Sleepy

1. Do you think you are kinder and more understanding to An obese/overweight person

v's an attractive normal weight person?

2. Do you think you will lead a more fulfilled life (career, love, health etc) by being in shape than not? (please no debates on what is a fulfilled life - leave that to the philosopers).

I'm gonna be very honest here and say I'd actually have a negative opinion of someone who's obese. My own weight fluctuates depending on my eating/exercise patterns at any given time. I've never been anywhere near the 'peak' condition I could be if I completely cut out junk food and exercised properly all the time but my weight would always be in the 'healthy' section of the BMI (limited as it is) and I know myself I'm happier when I'm in better shape.

Dermington

Transform wrote:

1. Do you think you are kinder and more understanding to an obese/overweight person v's an attractive normal weight person?

I understand how hard it is to be obese. Its f*cking crap really. I picked myself up and I did something about it.
Nobody has an obligation to be nice to anybody. I think that people can be kinder/more understanding to obese/overweight people because they see things exactly the way the obese person does, that their weight cannot be helped and its not their fault and son on.
The fact is that its as much a psychological problem as it is a physiological problem. I realised a long time ago that nobody (such as Transform) was going to knock on my door and say "lets go get you fit!" because I had never sought help or ever realised that I had to do something in order to change.

I am not more understanding or kind towards obese/overweight people because I dont think it helps. I think its a f*cking cop out if your understanding of someones obesity because I see that as being defeatist. It's hard to explain my point because I never really tried to word it before but I guess what I'm trying to say is that if people want to help at all then start by giving them a purpose as opposed to an acknowledgement of their problem and a carte blanche to continue on doing what they do because you feel sorry for them.

Transform wrote:

2. Do you think you will lead a more fulfilled life (career, love, health etc) by being in shape than not?

Obviously there is no definite answer here but being honest I can say that you are definitely putting yourself in a better position to receive all of the above fulfilling things by being healthy and in shape.
At this point in time I am relatively healthy and I can say that my mentality and my entire life is far better than it was before.

Chucky the tree

daveirl wrote:

This post has been deleted.

I am scared for life. the girl in the second post talking about trying on a bikini, good god.


I am the same as sleepy, when i see a fat person the first thing that will come into my mind is there weight and how bad it looks. There's no excuse for being fat/unfit, it just lazyness.