How do events cause future ghosts?

Mr Rivers

Watchin Most Haunted and they were describing a fight in a room and how they could sense it now, well, how does such a small event of a few minutes echo forever? Would more not have happened there to have drowned it out?

Same with knowing something was a children's room, would more people have stayed of more importance?

Will a fight in my own home be felt by someone in the future?

solas

Not unless it was such a traumatic event which caused an individual to disassociate with a part of their life, as often happens in sever cases of abuse etc.
There would be few who haven'tt had arguments or disagreements with others, most folk can let these things go in time.
or at least thats my take on it.

stevenmu

Some people think that all events and feelings are recorded where they happen. This is the principle behind psychometry. If that is the case then it would imply it's potentially possible for someone to come into your house years down the road and 'read' literally anything that happened there, right down to what you had for breakfast at a particular date. As a practicall matter someone isn't likely to actually 'read' information like that, only very strong events like solas mentioned would stand out. I'm not sure why it always seems to be very negative events or feelings that people sense. I guess they're more likely to trigger some noticeable response in someone sensitive whereas happy or trivial events would be passed over unnoticed.

Of course that only covers recording style hauntings, not the type where there is an actual spirit present. There's two seperate reasons this is supposed to happen. One is that the spirit doesn't actually realise or accept that it has crossed over and tries to carry on living, acting in denial. The other is that for some reason the spirit isn't ready to leave the physical world, perhaps they have some unfinished business or are perhaps afraid of how they'll be judged on the 'other side'. In both these cases it seems to be more about how a person died and generally psychics/sensitives seem to pick up on aspects of the ghosts actuall death or possibly something to do with their unfinished business.

solas

I'm not sure why it always seems to be very negative events or feelings that people sense. I guess they're more likely to trigger some noticeable response in someone sensitive whereas happy or trivial events would be passed over unnoticed.

I remember discussing a few years ago about some shamanic events I experienced. Part of the process involved releasing "energy" that I had picked up a week or so previously. It was my first encounter with "spirit" on a level that was less than "whole"..in Paranormal terms earthbound.
Once you experience how it is to be whole, even for a second anything that is less than becomes greatly apparant.

Of course that only covers recording style hauntings, not the type where there is an actual spirit present. There's two seperate reasons this is supposed to happen. One is that the spirit doesn't actually realise or accept that it has crossed over and tries to carry on living, acting in denial. The other is that for some reason the spirit isn't ready to leave the physical world, perhaps they have some unfinished business or are perhaps afraid of how they'll be judged on the 'other side'. In both these cases it seems to be more about how a person died and generally psychics/sensitives seem to pick up on aspects of the ghosts actuall death or possibly something to do with their unfinished business.

I think they are connected in some ways. The theory of disassociated consciousness would account for earthbound spirit, like a fragments of energy which are "lodged" either with people or places. Soul retrieval accounts for a lot.

6th

Unquestionably one of the most interestign threads in a while!

Steven hit it on the head with regards to recordings as far as i'm concern. But with "entities" I thik they exist along side us to a large extent, just that some people are more aware of their energies than others.

Its my belief we are co-habitating with them from day to day, the ones i notice are probably on a similar wavelenght to me?

As to how we create ghosts? .... thats a tricky one because people have reported seeing "ghosts" of people who are still alive, most reports are in times of crisis and its been discussed on a thread here before with regards to paternal and maternal bonds.

kshiel

Yes I agree with stevenmu on this mostly. I think psychic/sensitive we all have the ability to do it. For example if you are buying a house new or old i find if you walk in the door you almost get a sense of the place nice, bad, yes or no. It can be homely or cold. or even just visiting a house when you walk in you can feel tension if there has been a fight or light and happy when its just a good day or good newes arrived or special occassion. The memories most strong to the person are the ones that remain imprinted the strongest i believe.

Spirits while they may be trapped or just not ready to move on there are some who just visit from time to time. While the first two seem to leave a strong imprint or recording I wounder does the one just visiting leave their imprint each time they visit or would it just be apparant while they are actually there.:

stevenmu

solas wrote:

I remember discussing a few years ago about some shamanic events I experienced. Part of the process involved releasing "energy" that I had picked up a week or so previously. It was my first encounter with "spirit" on a level that was less than "whole"..in Paranormal terms earthbound.
Once you experience how it is to be whole, even for a second anything that is less than becomes greatly apparant.

Ok, I think I see what you're talking about here. I remember hearing about a type of shamanic healing ritual that sounds similar to this. They believed that problems in later life were often caused during childhood when a traumatic event could cause a persons inner child or various aspects of their personality to leave a person for their own protection. The healing involved the shaman travelling back, or sending the person themselves back, to reunite the person with the aspects they lost, making them whole again. Are you saying so that you think it's these parts that have been left behind which become 'ghosts' (presumably only when they're not integrated back in to the person) ?

6th

Obviously I know what your saying Steven (well obvious to us), its a very interesting theory from a spiritual point of view. This is the closest I get to the idea of "trapped" souls.

6th

Very interesting an relevant ideas on this thread in Spirituality Forum.

Shamanic wrote:

Quote from Spirituality Forum:
Soul loss can occur through an emotional or physical trauma such as death of a loved one, abuse, the breakdown of a relationship, invasive surgery or any other traumatic event. When ones body goes through such a trauma part of the soul may leave in a survival effort so the person is not set too deeply in shock.The results of soul loss can lead to dissociation, depression, addictions, post-traumatic stress syndrome and immune deficiency problems. All of which can prevent us from living the life we want and hold us back from creating happy and healthy relationships.The role of a Shamanic Practitioner is to perform Soul Retrieval to track down and return the lost soul parts to the client through journeying and Shamanic counselling.

If this is the case and no action (Soul Retrieval) takes place, then is it possible that that shard of soul could be encountered at a later date as a "ghost"? Also would this spirit be a conscious entity?

Now one more thing, could this account for experiences when a person sees the "spirit" of a living person but they appear younger?

Interesting stuff IMO.

Shamanic

not so much as a ghost but yes to a living entity. i also believe that they may come forth in order to try give a message that it wants to return.

6th

Yeah ghost was the wrong term but i think "conscious entity" might go down better than living entity.

As for giving the message that it wants to return, i take it you mean in the case where the person is still alive. Or in the case where the person has passed could they be looking for acknowledgement of the event which caused the split such as, say sexual abuse? This could be seen as the common idea of "unfinished business"?

Shamanic

yeah i see it as a lost soul part trying to show that they want to return to the conscious entity if that makes sense? i mean sometimes a Shaman can journey to find a lost soul part and the soul part can be hesitant to return as they are "frightened" that they reason they left, say sexual abuse, is still going on as they have left the conscious entity. but in cases where they "show" themselves i believe it is where they are ready to return but the conscious entity has not taken the steps to reconnect.

6th

And do you think its possible for the shard to remain after the death of the phsyical person? I imagine this could be the case as some Past Life Regressionist would do soul retrieval on past lives too?

Shamanic

i see your point, but i think its getting very complicated doing soul retrivels on somebodies past life? i mean as a past life of somebody i believe that they have left that life behind and started a new existence and in doing that can live peacefully without that soul part from a previous life? im not disputing or trying to invalidate your view in any way, ive never thought about this to this extent so im very interested in the points you're raising and i believe it is very possible but what would be the gain? i know from my own work that in doing soul retrivals memories are returned to the client but wud past life memories be beneficial an all cases? esp in cases of sexual abuse

6th

I juWith regards to past lives i just believe that people can carry baggage with them that they didnt deal with and it can effect the quality of this life.

As for disputing my claims, dont even have to mention it, challenging here is all part of the fun

Shamanic

that is a very good point 6th actually coz i know myself people who have carried over baggage. Thank u so much for bringing this to light!

6th

lol know problem, sharing ideas is what we do here

marlena

http://elevated.freeyellow.com/page21.html


Here is a small article on Soul Retrieval


Kelly

Ziycon

Could just be to do with the memory of the materials in the house, as in the walls the floor etc..

For example there was an experiment done a few years ago after a mtyh story came up, where a person got a transplant from a dying donor, when the transplant was completed everything had gone perfect, but the person started to remember new thoughts that they had never experianced, turned out in the end that they were memories of the donor!

Doctors say now that organs(cells) may be able to hold onto memories of a person so when an organ is transplaneted those memories are also transplanted into the person recieving the organ!

So this brings some people to the conclusion that if organic matter can hold memories then non-organic matter must be able to aswell, which would explain a lot!?

solas

steven wrote:

Ok, I think I see what you're talking about here. I remember hearing about a type of shamanic healing ritual that sounds similar to this. They believed that problems in later life were often caused during childhood when a traumatic event could cause a persons inner child or various aspects of their personality to leave a person for their own protection. The healing involved the shaman travelling back, or sending the person themselves back, to reunite the person with the aspects they lost, making them whole again. Are you saying so that you think it's these parts that have been left behind which become 'ghosts' (presumably only when they're not integrated back in to the person) ?

eh..yes, basically. sorry I never got around to responding to this thread, been a bit busy.

Soul retrieval works can be a two fold process, retrieving elements that may have been dis-located or have become disassociated and removing elements that may have become embedded. (discolated /disassociated).
The situation I was referring to, I met a woman who had been abused by a relative as a child, the abuser had since passed and that energy still seemed to be "lodged" with her (like a haunting) and naturally she had also disassociated with her own child aspect as a result of her traumatic years. I think she was able to reintegrate the latter, although the energy of the abuser seemed to linger around her husband. (very volatile man)


this is why I tend to stay away from haunted things, don't fancy having wandering rapist energies lodging with me for any length of time.


(maybe I should add for closure to the story, in my understanding the woman was able to love her husband for all he was and perhaps it is only through her understanding and forgiveness could she assist in releasing those energies, figure thats how it was suposed to be and my guess is it was a process which became easier once she became more whole within herself .)

Shamanic

when energy like that is lodged in somebody a Shamanic Practitioner would not do a soul retreival straight away, first they would do extraction work which is to remove the energy thats lodged. Then work from there.

solas

as far as I know that's what they did. Both "energies" were interlinked, so in bringing to light the issues which caused the wound in the first place, certain aspects had to be confronted.

solas

[-just for clarity, this isn't a personal case.]

6th

*noted

solas

ya, y'know how paranoid minds can get lol
Was an american lass I met, but going back to the original topic, thats how I used to sense energies to begin with and it was the understanding brought about through shamanic nature which helped give me clarity with regard to hauntings and the like. Some people see ghosts, I sense energies and there was a time when I was able to assist in releasing these energies but I don't have the eh..energy for it anymore.

6th

solas wrote:

Some people see ghosts, I sense energies and there was a time when I was able to assist in releasing these energies but I don't have the eh..energy for it anymore.

I've seen/felt/heard/smelt ghost & spirits but i've also felt energies from places, objects and living people too.

Thing is when it comes to spirits and ghosts I have never come across one that needed the energies released as you put it.

solas

either did I until I met americans funnily enough

stevenmu

solas wrote:

eh..yes, basically. sorry I never got around to responding to this thread, been a bit busy.

Soul retrieval works can be a two fold process, retrieving elements that may have been dis-located or have become disassociated and removing elements that may have become embedded. (discolated /disassociated).
The situation I was referring to, I met a woman who had been abused by a relative as a child, the abuser had since passed and that energy still seemed to be "lodged" with her (like a haunting) and naturally she had also disassociated with her own child aspect as a result of her traumatic years. I think she was able to reintegrate the latter, although the energy of the abuser seemed to linger around her husband. (very volatile man)

Have to admit I'm completely confused by this (even more so than usuall ). What confuses me is that you seem to be saying that a part of his energy literally remained with her ? I just can't seem to wrap my head around how this could actually happen. Is it possible that it's her energy which has been changed by the event(s), and that these changes, which were associated with him were what remained with her ?

Actually come to think of it, that's almost the exact same as something I was about to post somewhere else... edit: link

solas

guess so, like an exchange of energies? Maybe like memories, which can be healed and released.
on another level (shamanic) these energies are perceved as an intrusion, a form of energy (even just a thought form) which had become embedded for want of a better word within her energy field.

Pet

There's a concept I've heard of (which goes back to people's souls being fragmented/dissociated) whereby somebody does something so terrible that they lose not just part of their soul, but most or all of it, and become walking "shells"..does anyone know what I'm talking about?