what is my ideal weight?

cormac30

I don't really expect anyone to answer this but thank you in advance if you do.
I would really love to know what my perfect/ideal body weight should be .
I am male, 32 yrd old, 11 stone 10 pounds (on average) and 5ft 10 inches.
I go to the gym on average 2/3 times a week, doing variation of cardio & weights.

I've come across a few web sites but the answer they come up with usually ranges from 10 st. 9 lb to 12 st.1 lb.

anyone got any idea?
Cormac

cousin_borat

I wouldnt worry about your weight. what is your % body fat, get a pair of calipers. Really you need to be more specific about what your goals are of going to the gym. People will be able to better help you out with what your goals should be then

Dudess

Yeah, ok I'm not an expert but I would think once you don't have any excess body fat and you're not underweight, then that's your correct weight. It varies according to BMI. I'm 28, 5 foot 5" and according to some chart I was looking at, my ideal weight would be anywhere between 8 and 10 stone. If I went down to 8 stone, I'd vanish, but some women in a similar bracket would be fine at 8 stone (I think).

DubNside

Ignore BMI, its by no means a good way to judge how over/under weight you are.
How can someone say a rugby player for example who is 6ft tall and 18 stone(of muscle) is unhealthy!?

5ft10 and 11st10lbs sounds a little on the light side for a guy, but it depends on your body fat %, you may want to increase the amount of weights you do and increase protein intake.

Doctor Fell

How do you calculate % body fat? How do you know some of the "fat" isn't muscle?

Dragan

DubNside wrote:

How can someone say a rugby player for example who is 6ft tall and 18 stone(of muscle) is unhealthy!?

Because maybe he doesn't eat a balanced diet, maybe he smokes when no ones looking and down 12 pints after a win, 20 after a lose and 10 every Saturday and Sunday night???? :eek:

In all seriousness, the BMI is a load of ****, it means nothing as it doesn't take into account you Body Composition which is the all important factor at the end of the day!!

As previously said the % Bodyfat is a very telling factor.

I find the greatest thing is to stop training for aesthetic and start training for performance. Your body is a delicate machine, and it will discard what it does not need, so as long as you give it a reason to discard bodyfat then it will do so.

incisor71

It's surprising how many underexperienced gym staff and GPs still use BMI as a means of stipulating "your "ideal weight".

I could see its applicability to someone who is seriously underactive, smokes like a coal-fired power station and generally pays no attention to their health {or what kind of food gets stuffed into their mouth}. But for those who are training regularly and fitting well into their clothes with just one or two fatty bulges, I can't put faith in the BMI. Furthermore, muscle weighs more than fat and is far more compact, so depending on your build, the notion of an ideal overall weight for all men, or women, of the same height is pretty nonsensical.

In my own case, my weight has stayed stable at 13st over the past 12 months (since I started training in a prescribed, focussed manner) but my body fat has gone from 22.5% to 16%. That to me is the determining factor, not my overall mass.

Lothaar

My friend's dad is a doctor in Beaumont Hospital. I was talking to him about BMI and he said that altough BMI is not a good indicator of 'fatness', "it doesn't lie from a clinical point of view". If your BMI says you're obese then your heart will have problems coping with your mass, regardless of your bf%.

Dragan

Lothaar wrote:

If your BMI says you're obese then your heart will have problems coping with your mass, regardless of your bf%.

Bollocks.

Your heart like anything else will adapt, and once you are training that, your lungs and everything else ,your fine.

Strange how NFL players aren't falling over mid game as there heart gives out about having to power 220 to 300+ pounds of weight around the place!!! :rolleyes:

t-ha

Doctor Fell wrote:

How do you calculate % body fat? How do you know some of the "fat" isn't muscle?

An experienced instructor with a calipers is a pretty accurate and accessable way of getting this figure. It's done by pinching out a skinfold, you can do it with your fingers, you'll see how there's no muscle pinched out, only your skin and subcutaneous tissue. Measuring the thickness of this gives a reliable account of how fat you are. I think it's not a bad idea to have it done - it cuts out all the messing about 'having heavy bones' or 'it's all muscle' and just tells you objectively(harshly?) if you need to cut back on the pies or not.

quickbeam

BMI doesn't make sense to me.

I lost a good bit of weight but never got to my goal. I was in size 10 clothes, but my BMI still had me as (just) overweight. I was quite fit, but not at all muscelly.

And now I've put on about three stone I'm still fitting in to size 12, when most people of my height and weight would be in size 16 or 18.

I don't understand it to be honest. Once I'm back down to size 10 I won't worry too much.

incisor71

t-ha wrote:

An experienced instructor with a calipers is a pretty accurate and accessable way of getting this figure.

Some gyms I've been to in the past refused to measure body fat with a calipers, citing it as "too invasive" ; instead they use a bioelectrical impedance measurement instead (i.e., grip two electrodes with your hands for 10 seconds). But too many factors can influence that - the surface area of skin making contact with the electrodes, how much water you've drunk beforehand, etc.

Me, I prefer the calipers method - being able to physically and visually "pinch an inch", or just a couple of millimetres, is a much more immediate and intuitive guide to your level of subcutaneous fat.

Doctor Fell

OK thx, but I won't be in a gym for a while - genuinely don't have time between work and baby at home!
But if I pinch my tummy for example, I get at least 2 inches of FAT bulging between my fingers: any guess of my % fat???

t-ha

27.48593022737389%

seriously though, it's really impossible for me to say (you could be sitting or standing, using a different site to the one I think you are, your 2 inches might not be my two inches and so on...). I don't see the point of giving you this info anyway - if you're heavier than you'ld like to be then lose weight, regardless of the precise bodyfat figure.

Where measuring bodyfat comes into it's own is when it is combined with bodyweight as a record of your poverall rogress. For this you need accurate measurements anyway so there is no point in someone guessing it for you over the internet.

If you want you can see where you might fit in with these guys;

Fat - BBers will mostly not exceed this level ever.
20% BF

Hard - abdominals just short of being visible except under overhead lighting.
15%

Cut - starting to look pretty lean, many amateur sports players are around this level.
12%

Defined - some good muscle seperation when flexing.
10%

Ripped - fitness models often aim for this range. This is as lean as most people will bother getting unless they're actually going to compete in a show.
7-9%

Shredded - widespread vascularity, striations visible in most muscle groups when flexed. Pro bodybuilders often aim for this range shows.
5%

Sliced - vascularity and striations everywhere. Virtually no subcutaneous water held. Muscles and tendons visible in the face, especially when chewing. Conition can only be held for a few hours without doing permanent damage and only nut-bags do this as it looks gross.
3%

That should help just give you a visual idea.

Dudess

Actually, mucho mucho apolojeez for recommending BMI as an indicator. I meant body composition. *feels stupid*:o

Doctor Fell

Thx for that, I was afraid how high the % might be, but it's unlikely to be in the 20% range - I look nothing like that guy luckily enough.
Maybe the 15% is closer, anyway I'm working on it!

t-ha

OK, but just before I let you off on your way, just be aware that that guy at 20% is very heavily muscles which gives him most of that size. You could look different to him but still be 20% if you're not carrying so much muscle as him - not saying you're wrong or anything, but just making sure that you're looking at how much fat he has rather than just his overall size.

cormac30

Cheers guys,
I honestly wasn't expecting such a good reply to my post.
was more expecting an 'f off' or something.

I guess really i will have to go for a review at my gym at and ask them, as suggest, to get the calipers out and measure my body fat.

on a side note, 3 years ago i was in a pretty nasty car crash, in coma etc, smashed bones and so on. terrible and so on. (bloody drunk driver driving n the wrong side of the road). however when i came out of hospital, I must have lost 2 stone. This sounds so so ridiculous but i was (to myself i hasten to add) secretly chuffed that I had lost every trace of body fat and had a really flat stomach. of course it wasn't long before i piled on the weight again as i was on crutches for a long time. but really and truely, and i know i will be shot here but if one wants to loose the fat, the easiest way is a strict diet. however on that note it is incredibly important to be fit and strong (as i was prior to the accident). and also it is importnt to have a little reserve of fat on your body, as you never know when you may need it!

i wan't bore you anymore, but Thanks again. will keep you posted on what my instructor tells me is my current/ideal weight and body fat.

Cormac

p.s. be truely truely grateful for your health . (cheesy I know)

t-ha

Out of curiosity Cormac, did you come out underweight? Do you think it was due to meds or the hospital food?

I only ask because I've known people with spotty skin, weight issues and other problems to come out of a hospital visit looking better than ever - simply because they were fed better food than they usually eat! Shows you the power of diet.

incisor71

Very good point t-ha, even after just a couple of weeks on a strict diet a visible improvement to one's skin (which is surely the largest excretory organ in the body) can be noticed- I can attest to this.

And yes cormac, I'm very grateful for my health - Göthe expressed it well when he said Gesundheit ist nicht alles, aber ohne Gesundheit ist alles nichts - roughly translated, "health isn't everything, but without health everything else is nothing".

GerryRyan

DubNside wrote:

5ft10 and 11st10lbs sounds a little on the light side for a guy, but it depends on your body fat %, you may want to increase the amount of weights you do and increase protein intake.

I wouldn't say that's on the light side tbh - I'm 6ft1 nd just over 11stone - low body fat nd the like (bulking at the minute tho). Depends on the person.

DubNside wrote:

increase protein intake.

May aswell ask it here instead of starting another thread - these protein shakes - good or bad idea? Or is it better to eat meats/tuna/pasta etc etc to bulk.

Ph3n0m

think its time I got the old callipers out - very concerned about my weight/height/build compared to my initial BMI - which was +30 (and no, I am not a giant)

cormac30

To follow up on T-ha and Incisor's comments.

I can't really say the hospital food made any noticeable difference but one thing did make a massive difference.
When i came out of hospital and was recovering, every morning my dad used to make a pint of pure vegetable juice for me (carrots, spinach, celery etc). It was incredible how it helped me recover. pure nutrients and vitamins going straight into my blood stream and helping repair my smashed bones and torn tissue and so on. I am convinced that without this juice i wouln't have recovered so well.
and i must say my hair and skin looked fantastic. and energy levels and mental strength benefited also.

i really recommend getting Jason Vale's book "The Juice Master's Ultimate Fast Food: Dicover the Power of Raw Juice" and of course buy a juicer. an invaluable investment for your body. (some people complain about cleaning the machines, but if you buy a small one you have it washed in 2 minutes flat, just in time for the juice to cool nicely with a few icecubes thrown in)

all the best,
cormac

DubNside

ThatGuy wrote:

I wouldn't say that's on the light side tbh - I'm 6ft1 nd just over 11stone - low body fat nd the like (bulking at the minute tho). Depends on the person.
May aswell ask it here instead of starting another thread - these protein shakes - good or bad idea? Or is it better to eat meats/tuna/pasta etc etc to bulk.

6ft1 and just over 11stone is fairly light, i would say you dont carry much muscle/fat.

If you want to bulk up certainly you should supplement your protein intake in line with your weights program. Try spilt your diet into a 65/30/5 ratio of carbs/protein/fats.(although I will stand to be corrected on that ratio)
Take a protein shake prior to your workout and post-workout, also before you go to bed mix a protein shake with Skimmed milk so you will get a slow release of protein during the night.
You should start to bulk up then.

g'em

DubNside wrote:

Try spilt your diet into a 65/30/5 ratio of carbs/protein/fats.(although I will stand to be corrected on that ratio)

fair enough, I'll go ahead then. there's nowhere near enough fat in that diet. Good fats (monounsaturated and polyunsaturated fats) play an extremely important role in the body, like the ones found in fish, nuts, avocados, seeds and fresh butter. Monounsat fats promote healthy cardiac function and polyunsat are an integral part of cecll structure among other things. It sthe saturated fat and trans-fatty acids you want to steer clear of (i.e. avoid processed foods).

Now this may not be in relation to the OP, being completely honest I haven't read the whole thread, but for weight gain a macronutrient ratio of around 30% protein, 55% carbs and 15% fats is good and a general guideline of 40% protein, 40% carbs, 20% fats is often promoted for anyone who trains.

Lothaar

Dragan wrote:

Strange how NFL players aren't falling over mid game as there heart gives out about having to power 220 to 300+ pounds of weight around the place!!! :rolleyes:

True, but they have an increased risk of various problems in later life, such as sleep apnea (http://sleepdisorders.about.com/od/obesity/a/NFL.htm). It's not just the heart that struggles - I don't remember exactly what the doctor said but he did say that, clinically, BMI doesn't lie.

justsomebloke

Lothaar wrote:

True, but they have an increased risk of various problems in later life, such as sleep apnea (http://sleepdisorders.about.com/od/obesity/a/NFL.htm). It's not just the heart that struggles - I don't remember exactly what the doctor said but he did say that, clinically, BMI doesn't lie.

i am not fully sure if the sympthons of sleep apnea can some from muscular necks as oppose to just fat in the neck constricting the air ways (anyone know) however a lot of the big american footballers may suffer from this later in life as they are big guys who probably don't cut back on their eating sufficently when they stop playing football causing them to put on the fat that may cause sleep apnea.
One of the reasons more football players in america suffer from it as oppose to the general population is that they generally don't pick average people to play american football as they would pick a large percentage of people who by their natural size may suffer from this condition anyway so of course those findings are going to be slightly screwed

DubNside

g'em wrote:

Now this may not be in relation to the OP, being completely honest I haven't read the whole thread, but for weight gain a macronutrient ratio of around 30% protein, 55% carbs and 15% fats is good and a general guideline of 40% protein, 40% carbs, 20% fats is often promoted for anyone who trains.

That sounds good, most people forget that you still have to include Good Fats as part of your diet.
I usually take x3 tablets each day to supplement, with Omega 3, 6 and 9 fats in them.You can get them cheap from Natures Way.

Lothaar

jsb wrote:

i am not fully sure if the sympthons of sleep apnea can some from muscular necks as oppose to just fat in the neck constricting the air ways

That's the point. They might have 1% bodyfat and be lumps of pure muscle but if their BMI says they are obese then they are at risk of suffering from a variety of conditions associated with obesity. Sure, they're much better off than really fat people but they can still be 'too big'.

The doctor who mentioned all this said that lots of NFL players get sleep apnea because their necks are too big, btw.