Consumerism and pressure on young people

jrey1981

This is in humanities as well, but it may get more responses (hopefully intelligent ones) here...hope the mods dont mind.

I am researching an article I am writing for a magazine and am interested in people's thoughts on pressures on young people (say aged 15 - 30) and how the growth of consumer society in Ireland over the past 10-15 years or so has affected people.

I will PM people who respond for their names, ages, etc., if there are some responses I can use in the piece, if that is ok. If people would prefer me not to mention names or whatever in the article, that shouldn't be a problem.

I am hoping I might be able to pose a few more questions once the debate moves on...

The magazine I am writing for is an international affairs magazine, edited in London, with a circulation of roughly 20,000 copies in various European countries. Let me know if you would like more details and I can post them up here.

I will pose a few questions or thoughts that might provoke some interesting responses.

Do you feel that the Irish society and culture is more individualised?

Do you think that there is a tendency towards insecurity and uncertainty in a rapidly developing consumer society?

How easy do you think it is for young people to find their direction in life in a mass consumer society?

Do you feel Ireland has lost anything socially or culturally during this period of economic growth?

Do you feel empowered by the huge range of consumer choices and opportunities that economic growth brings, or do you think there is a negative side to any of this?

Though the nation is on the whole materially richer, are we growing poorer in other ways?

Are any areas of life in Ireland are becoming devalued by the pace of change, urbanisation, economic growth and technological advances?

Does the education system prepares people adequately to deal with life in a rapidly growing and changing economy?

Is the growth of youth / MTV culture and the fact that the 15 - 30 age group is heavily targeted by advertisers is a good thing?

How easy do you think it is for young people who may be more emotionally vulnerable for whatever reason to cope with the various pressures of a growing and changing society?

pantar_dubh

jrey1981 wrote:

I am researching an article I am writing for a magazine and am interested in people's thoughts on pressures on young people (say aged 15 - 30) and how the growth of consumer society in Ireland over the past 10-15 years or so has affected people.

Do you feel that the Irish society and culture is more individualised?

This seems to be a general trend, although there should be differences by region, urban and rural, age cohort, gender, occupation, and national origin.

Do you think that there is a tendency towards insecurity and uncertainty in a rapidly developing consumer society?

Yes. This would seem consistent with the decline of extended families and the loss of the associated safety net historically provided by the clan.

How easy do you think it is for young people to find their direction in life in a mass consumer society?

Depends on preparation and role models. The schools seem to be falling behind the curve in terms of anticipating what knowledge and skills will be needed for future occupations.

Role models? It would seem that occupational mobility is demanded by the transition to consumer society. If parents exhibit this trait for their children, it will be easier for them. If not, then more difficult.

Do you feel Ireland has lost anything socially or culturally during this period of economic growth?

I feel that the gains have outweighed the losses. Economic growth since membership in the EU has been impressive for Ireland (for the Republic, not necessarily the North where unemployment is high). Such economic growth, while posing as a source of stress, has also improved the standard of living and the life chances for most citizens.

Do you feel empowered by the huge range of consumer choices and opportunities that economic growth brings, or do you think there is a negative side to any of this?

Empowered to some extent, but then again, there is also an element of fetish capitalism (buy things you don't need, just because your neighbor has them). The negative side has been increased consumer debt for some citizens, and the associated stress posed by such debt.

Though the nation is on the whole materially richer, are we growing poorer in other ways?

I would guess that this question speaks to someone's philosophy of life. If by becoming materially richer our standard of living improves, as well as our life chances, then I would see these outcomes as more positive than negative.

Are any areas of life in Ireland are becoming devalued by the pace of change, urbanisation, economic growth and technological advances?

The whole idea of "family" seems to be impacted. They are becoming smaller, and exhibiting less connectedness. Extended families are shrinking or disappearing. The safety net of the extended family, and before that, the clan, is disappearing over time.

The consumer culture seems to follow urbanisation, to where a sense of community declines when compared to that found in small city or rural settings. For example, the wake is in decline since the 1970's per an article I had read on the web. The wake was an extended family and community event, that linked people together. This is in decline, as is the sense of security and belongingness.

Does the education system prepares people adequately to deal with life in a rapidly growing and changing economy?

No. Lags behind (see earlier comments about school).

Is the growth of youth / MTV culture and the fact that the 15 - 30 age group is heavily targeted by advertisers is a good thing?

This is two questions? Growth of youth/MTV culture is not necessarily a bad thing. It's just different when compared to what came before. Every generation seeks its entertainment.

Advertising? When advertising goes beyond informing people of their choices and attempts to manipulate and stimulate their buying behaviour, the more this occurs, the worse I believe this is for a culture. People end up buying things that they do not need, often increasing their debt load, as well as the associated stress needlessly.

How easy do you think it is for young people who may be more emotionally vulnerable for whatever reason to cope with the various pressures of a growing and changing society?

Growing up is a challenge. My parent had more preparation to drive a car with training and licensure than to drive me.

Peers, as always pressure each other, and the increased demands of a consumer based society can add additional stress. The clothing fashion industry, for example, seems to be more influential in a consumer driven society in combination with peer pressure.

Of course, this is all my opinion, and others may agree or disagree, which is in the spirit of these boards.:cool:

jrey1981

interesting views on family and advertising pantar_dubh, thanks for taking the time to respond

Kuz_3040

Im not from ireland so i cant really answer the questions but i can offer a general opinion on the subject. So here goes:-

I think that consumerism is something young people are socialised into because of the exposure they have to media advertising. Education also plays a big part as i think it is a breeding ground for consumerism because of peer pressure within the schools and this is not blatant peer pressure students dont it but they do have a constant need to have the things other students have e.g. the latest trainers, mobile phone or mp3 player.

Regarding the pressure young people i believe that in a sense it prepares young people for the adult world but at the seem time shelters them from it which is quite odd and i still cant figure out how its. Many young people who attend higher education finish the course and are in debt of on average £25,000which regardless of the re-payment schemes is a lot of money. Another issue is that young peo.ple often have no clue as to what they wish to do with their lives whilst their parents pressure them into certain areas. thus leading young people to face the road of disappointin parents or fulfilling their dreams this is particularly with ethnic minority females who often sacrifice higher education opputunities to please their families.

Families life seems to vary between cultures and is quite difficult to comment on but with regards to economic security for working class families it is becoming difficult because many face relative poverty and earn enough to exist but not do much more.

This is purely the opinion of a college student based on personal experiences and some studying of sociology

Archeron

Do you feel that the Irish society and culture is more individualised?

I think that there is a perception that it is,but in the grander scheme of things, life generally is becoming more bland. Almost every aspect of individualisation is closely monitored by those who give us the many options. This information is then used to create new "groups" or "profiles" of the population. This information can then be used to provide more, better, more personal services again, incidentally reaping huge profit for the more inovative companies. I believe that today profit drives most options in individualisation as part of material possesions. As regards Irish society in relation to that, I think Ireland has fully become part of the so called first world, hence our percieved options have increased.
The internet has allowed people to become more individual, in that people can be whomever they want on the internet. The downside to this is the decreased actual human interaction as a result.

Do you think that there is a tendency towards insecurity and uncertainty in a rapidly developing consumer society?
Yes. I think part of the reason is that a large part of our consumer market is now infofrmation, particularly with the rollout of broadband. We can now have news whenever we want, from whatever camera angle we want. News, generally, is bad. In the days before broadband you got your daily fill of scary news at 6.01 with Anne Doyle. Now you can hear bad news in work, at break, hell, even in the airport waiting for a plane! You can barely move in todays society without hearing about a disease or a disaster or a war.
Ufortunately, the capitalism of the worlds media has led to commercial news companies vieing for your attention, sensationalising this news to the point where it does actually seem like mankind is screwed.

How easy do you think it is for young people to find their direction in life in a mass consumer society?

I find that generally a mass consumer society will allow creative and imaginitive people to flourish like no other society. Years ago, you became a plumber, or a doctor or whatever. Now only your imagination is the limit. How about opening a dog pampering parlour? Yes, it can be done. How about an online Pizza company? again, yes. The products on the shelves of a lot of shops shows that there is no end to the cheap rubbish people will buy.
.

Do you feel Ireland has lost anything socially or culturally during this period of economic growth?
Ireland has both lost and gained.
Socially, Ireland has become impersonal. 15 years ago, Dublin felt like a small city. Now it feels like an international destination. (weather excepted) People no longer have that feeling that strangers would come to their aid in an emergency, and it is sad to see that go. The air on the street for many people would be distrust.
Culturally, I think Ireland has gained and developed. The Oirishness of decades past, where the pint of guinness and the thatched cottage were the things we were proud of, has faded. What has replaced it is a confidence that this country has never befoew known. Countless reports tell us we're the nicest country on earth, happiest people, best laws, most freedoms etc. Add to that the fact that MOST of us are actually wealthy; whether we know it or not. We are healthy, free, we live in peace. Things are good, and we the Irish are proud of things. I would think that the general consensus is that we are no longer the Paddies, or the Micks. We are the innovators, bankers, architects etc. We have also become richer in culture with the integration of so many global people coming here, and integrating well with our society.

Do you feel empowered by the huge range of consumer choices and opportunities that economic growth brings, or do you think there is a negative side to any of this?
No. I am cynical of most of the choices afforded me. Last Christmas I went through almost every shop in Blanchardstown SC and Liffey Valley, and I saw no gifts that actually meant anything. Plenty of choice, plenty of needless crap. Seeing people spend hard earned money on pap does not empower me.

Though the nation is on the whole materially richer, are we growing poorer in other ways?
Yes. As above, we have lost our trust. Another sad loss appears to be faith, as interest in the church seems to wane. The church has been a massive influence on Irish history. While I frown on much of its influence, as do most people, I still think it has played a major part in who we are. Mammon appears to be the new god.

Are any areas of life in Ireland are becoming devalued by the pace of change, urbanisation, economic growth and technological advances?
The most important thing has been devalued, and that is life. Ask anybody how much they think a "hit" would cost. Most will answer with relatively accurate answers. €500, €5,000, whatever. They answer, and thats a bad sign. Our natural landscape is being lost forever through corrupt and incompetant planning, and that will never be replaced.

Does the education system prepares people adequately to deal with life in a rapidly growing and changing economy?
I think the education system teaches people the basics. Most adapt with whatever life gives them, and makes the most of it.

Is the growth of youth / MTV culture and the fact that the 15 - 30 age group is heavily targeted by advertisers is a good thing?
Its an irrelevant thing. That targetting is a product of our societies own creation. Many people know the phrase from Homer himself "I'm a white male, ages 18-45. Everybody listens to me". I think that sums it up best.

How easy do you think it is for young people who may be more emotionally vulnerable for whatever reason to cope with the various pressures of a growing and changing society?[/QUOTE]

I wouldnt feel qualified to answer this. .

JC 2K3

jrey1981 wrote:

Do you feel that the Irish society and culture is more individualised?

Well you can apply stereotypes to people and be right most of the time and there's not a diverse range of stereotypes, so yes.

jrey1981 wrote:

Do you think that there is a tendency towards insecurity and uncertainty in a rapidly developing consumer society?

Insecurity exists without people even being aware of it. Consumeristic pressure is huge, yet so accepted that it's hardly noticeable.

Do you feel empowered by the huge range of consumer choices and opportunities that economic growth brings, or do you think there is a negative side to any of this?
[/QUOTE]

It depends on how you perceive "oppertunities". More people can go to college and get a professional job, but there's so much pressure on everyone to do just that these days that it's almost like subliminal fascism. There's not many "consumer choices" really, big companies generally tell you what to buy. It's easier to waste money though and too many people have the idea that buying=happiness, which is totally wrong...

jrey1981 wrote:

Though the nation is on the whole materially richer, are we growing poorer in other ways?

A lot of the time it's impossible to have socially acceptable fun without spending money, you get nothing for free.

jrey1981 wrote:

Are any areas of life in Ireland are becoming devalued by the pace of change, urbanisation, economic growth and technological advances?

Life in general is being devalued to be honest, too many people developing obsessive compulsive disorder with earning money.

jrey1981 wrote:

Does the education system prepares people adequately to deal with life in a rapidly growing and changing economy?

It doesn't have to. Young people learn enough about the real world by living in it, the education system makes it easier for them to get a job and i believe we have a very good one.

jrey1981 wrote:

Is the growth of youth / MTV culture and the fact that the 15 - 30 age group is heavily targeted by advertisers is a good thing?

No, it's a very bad thing, pure exploitation of young people, it destroys individualistic thinking and sets them up for a consumerism-run, bleak lifestyle.

jrey1981 wrote:

How easy do you think it is for young people who may be more emotionally vulnerable for whatever reason to cope with the various pressures of a growing and changing society?

I'm 17 now, I went through 2/3 years of mild to moderate depression due to my lack of understanding and resentment towards mainstreamed society where everyone had to "fit in" etc. and I still suffer a bit occasionally, nothing massively long term, but made some of my teen years a bit more depressing than they might have been. But, as the poster above me said, growing up is indeed a challenge.

jrey1981

thanks to recent posters - some interesting points raised once again.

I promise I will be in touch in due course.

Have had some interesting contacts through pm as well.

I will try and raise a few more, less loaded questions people might respond to, when I get a minute.

cornbb

jrey1981 wrote:

Do you feel that the Irish society and culture is more individualised?

In general, yes, although not universally. I think individualisation is at its most extreme in major urban centres. I also think that this phenomenon is not as prevalent in Ireland as it is in other parts of the world, although it does seem to be more of a feature of richer/more "advanced" societies

Do you think that there is a tendency towards insecurity and uncertainty in a rapidly developing consumer society?

I don't think its so much an issue of insecurity and uncertainty a general movement towards homogenised and artificially created values. Or maybe it is insecurity and uncertainty that drive people in this direction?

How easy do you think it is for young people to find their direction in life in a mass consumer society?

Its not difficult to find your personal direction. However, consumerism/mass media offers a prepackaged and convenient means of following a certain direction (i.e. the consumerist direction) and therefore many young people are not bothering to develop their own personal set of values, their own opinions, a truly unique and personal taste in art, music etc.

Do you feel Ireland has lost anything socially or culturally during this period of economic growth?

Yes, definitely. As I said, economic prosperity tends to cause this homogenisation of society. Families are becoming more remote from each other, neighbours are less likely to communicate, maybe there's even a greater sense of paranoia around.

Do you feel empowered by the huge range of consumer choices and opportunities that economic growth brings, or do you think there is a negative side to any of this?

NO I don't feel empowered by consumer choices, I feel harrased! Consumerism is not about needs, its about wants. Granted, a greater variety of retailers is good for competition but it doesn't mean anyone is getting a bargain. "Choice" becomes meaningless when it simply means a greater amount of crap to spend your money on. It disgusts me. Where I live (Limerick) people get hugely excited by all the new shopping centres/"retail parks" springing up everywhere. Excessive spending on things you don't need is meaningless and sad.

As for "opportunities", if you mean opportunities for employment and self-improvement, then thats definitely a good thing. Yes, you could say I feel empowered. The development of a knowledge-based economy is one of the best things ever to happen to Ireland. However, a downside of this is the inherent pressure on graduates/school leavers to succeed. If a young person ended up unemployed twenty/fifty/a hundred years ago, it would almost have been the norm. Today it would be regarded as something shameful.

Though the nation is on the whole materially richer, are we growing poorer in other ways?

Yes, in the way that people are becoming more isolated, more obsessed with materialism (did you see the story in the paper recently about the guy that sued his octeganarian mother over a tiny piece of land?), more lonely and depressed. In other ways, however, we are improving. The land is becoming more culturally diverse, more detatched from the grasp of the Catholic Church and slowly but surely more liberal.

Are any areas of life in Ireland are becoming devalued by the pace of change, urbanisation, economic growth and technological advances?

This question is essentially the same as the last one

Does the education system prepares people adequately to deal with life in a rapidly growing and changing economy?

No, but thats not the purpose of the education system. Young people must learn to deal with life in their own way, by developing a set of good moral values, good money handling skills and common sense, via good parenting and socialisation

Is the growth of youth / MTV culture and the fact that the 15 - 30 age group is heavily targeted by advertisers is a good thing?

Not really, but its not the end of the world either. Any young person with any intelligence should be able to see through these things and other things which are not important.

How easy do you think it is for young people who may be more emotionally vulnerable for whatever reason to cope with the various pressures of a growing and changing society?

Thats a difficult question. As I said, intelligent and independent young people should be able to resist the pressures of "MTV society". As for the more vulnerable young people, I guess it depends on who their peers are.

Kernel

Capitalism = slavery.

Money within capitalist system = whip.

Consumerism = carrot.

Without consumerism, and the illusion of freedom to purchase all kinds of useless crap and embed ourselves in debt (thus ensuring our continuing enslavement to the capitalist) many people would think twice about why they were spending the best years of their life toiling in a factory or performing some other duty they hate just so the capitalist (who provides no labour/work) can live an opulant and decadent life.

Then again, our own standard of living depends on the oppression (to the point of starvation and death) of the poorest nations. At least we get our cheap coffee and employment.

That's why unchecked capitalism is an inherently evil system, and one which will hopefully evolve into a more socialist model as the common masses (proles) become more enlightened.

jrey1981

Thanks cornbb and kernel...I am going to dig out a few related facts/figures in a bit that people might comment on - I will just put them up here to gauge peoples thoughts, if any on them.

jrey1981

Some figures as promised...

1 in 5 people under 20 will experience psychological problems ranging from anxiety to depression to major development disorders, according to the Mental Health Foundation

Mental health has declined over the past 30 - 40 years, particularly in young men, mirroring the effect in the UK, where it is noted that behavioural problems have doubled and emotional problems like depression and anxiety have soared by 70 per cent.

Surveys in Ireland suggest a rate of 10 per cent of young people self-harming. In the UK, The Priory group puts the rate at 13 %, with 900,000 adolescents there (15%) reporting they have been so miserable that they have considered suicide.

President Mary McAleese has talked about the need to promote self-esteem and self-confidence in young people.

At the same time, advertisers, marketers use predatory tactics to target young people and children.

This is perhaps not as recognised in Ireland - it appears particularly prevalent in the USA, and to a lesser extent in the UK,but I am sure there are elements of it that are visible here.

Meanwhile, many children are being reared increasingly by minders, creches and nurseries, while their parents are at work.

Is this trend storing up emotional problems in children in the future?

Should marketers and advertisers have to abide by stricter regulation?

Sweden has a ban on advertising to the under 12s...

Are there adequate facilities in Irelands health service with adequate funding to address this in our health service?

chump

Do you feel that the Irish society and culture is more individualised?
I don't really get this question.

Do you think that there is a tendency towards insecurity and uncertainty in a rapidly developing consumer society?
I guess you're pushing the definitions

# The theory that a progressively greater consumption of goods is economically beneficial.
# Attachment to materialistic values or possessions: deplored the rampant consumerism of contemporary society.

I guess you're trying to say that having/and being all things that are 'promoted' by the various facets that push materialistic values can lead to insecurity and uncertainty amongst those that don't?
I don't see what rapid development has to do with this, and what is 'rapid' anyway.
Also consumerism creates security and greater certainty by improving economic performance and so personal wealth - which fuels greater consumerism. I see this as a good thing. I like to have things.

How easy do you think it is for young people to find their direction in life in a mass consumer society?
I haven't a balls what you mean here. Find direction in life? Are you suggesting that by 'consuming' and being targeted as 'consumers' young people don't know what direction they want to go in life? By it's very nature consumerism is a response to what people 'want', in a general sense - and there are so many angles to providing consumables and particularly with it's growth (that you go on about) every one is catered for. Think of all the difference types of music for example, and all the styles, clothing and otherwise that go with it. The choice is phenomenal. We have more choice now than ever before, allowing possibly greater scope for a chosen 'personality' that before.

Do you feel Ireland has lost anything socially or culturally during this period of economic growth?
Have to ask someone older than 23ish this one...

Do you feel empowered by the huge range of consumer choices and opportunities that economic growth brings, or do you think there is a negative side to any of this?
Positive.

Though the nation is on the whole materially richer, are we growing poorer in other ways?
Greater disparity between the rich and poor, so some people are relatively less well off. Poorer in that more people work, life is at a faster pace == less time etc. etc... It depends on what poorer means.

Are any areas of life in Ireland are becoming devalued by the pace of change, urbanisation, economic growth and technological advances?
Again probably one for the older folk to answer - but I personally think that the huge increase in house-building in recent years will create very many awfully contrived places to live and we'll regret it in years to come.

Does the education system prepares people adequately to deal with life in a rapidly growing and changing economy?
One of the best education systems in the world people say. I'm not complaining.

Is the growth of youth / MTV culture and the fact that the 15 - 30 age group is heavily targeted by advertisers is a good thing?
They're targeted because they DEMAND to be targeted. Good thing - yes. Give people what they want.

How easy do you think it is for young people who may be more emotionally vulnerable for whatever reason to cope with the various pressures of a growing and changing society?
I don't understand what you're saying here tbh.

projectmayhem

Do you feel that the Irish society and culture is more individualised?

depends on what you mean by that. i'm sure foreigners look at ireland and think we're very individual, thanks to our history and what not. but as a people, no, we're not. we all group together in our "individual" groups in this country, and have our own, uniquely irish cultures... like goths in temple bar.

Do you think that there is a tendency towards insecurity and uncertainty in a rapidly developing consumer society?

no. i think irish people, generally, are happy. i know i am. i'm broke, but i look up and there's a roof over my head, i look down and i've clothes on. but i'm in the middle classes i guess. if i was working class, struggling to feed some kids etc., i'm sure my view would be different.

How easy do you think it is for young people to find their direction in life in a mass consumer society?

as a student, i'd say difficult. not because of consumerism, and the shiny things distracting everyone... but moreso because of choice. suddenly, you're not bound into following your fathers trade. i am of one of the first new generations in ireland to grow up with real choice. i, literally, can do whatever i want in life (within reason)

Do you feel Ireland has lost anything socially or culturally during this period of economic growth?

socially we've grown, undoubtedly. culturally, we've lost a lot. we've become some sort of strange mix between french-style laté drinking eurocentrics and american-style middle of the road liberals.. most of the time. we're only irish once a year, and that's paddy's day, when the true green comes out and we riot for ireland in the good name of our patron saint, arthur guinness.

Do you feel empowered by the huge range of consumer choices and opportunities that economic growth brings, or do you think there is a negative side to any of this?

i wouldn't say empowered at all. maybe if i were a little older i may feel "empowered". to be honest, at my age (21), i'll never appreciate all of this material wealth, because i've nothing to compare it to. i've always had material wealth, and chances are, i always will to some degree.

Though the nation is on the whole materially richer, are we growing poorer in other ways?

culturally, for the reasons i said above. but we're not the only country falling into this trap.

Are any areas of life in Ireland are becoming devalued by the pace of change, urbanisation, economic growth and technological advances?

of course, look at farming, fishing, and other such great irish traditional jobs. they're going to hell. because if you own a huge farm, you're better off selling the land to intel and living the good life then keeping your cattle and working hard on a crap wage while everyone has mercs and drinks laté's in starbucks.

Does the education system prepares people adequately to deal with life in a rapidly growing and changing economy?

no, but how would it? parents should be doing that job for their kids.

Is the growth of youth / MTV culture and the fact that the 15 - 30 age group is heavily targeted by advertisers is a good thing?

15-30 year olds can deal with advertising. sure, it's probably a bad thing to think of coca-cola as soon as you're thirsty, but you should be old and wise enough to know what's good or bad for you, regardless of branding. on the same note, i challenge you to find smaller versions of monopoly's in major cities. you wont find a small fast-food restaraunt in dublin that sells great food cheap, or a nice cola drink made by a small indy company.

How easy do you think it is for young people who may be more emotionally vulnerable for whatever reason to cope with the various pressures of a growing and changing society?

not very. we're getting weaker emotionally, because when we're presented with a brick wall, we crumble, because we've always had a clear path, with no obsticles in front. but these things make you stronger, and help you grow. as a society, though, we've yet to really hit a brick wall since the celtic tiger. if we do, i don't think we would cope very well. will mr. and mrs. brown with their fancy matching mercs and social life full of engagements at the golf club cope well with a financial crash where they loose their jobs and have to sell everything to keep little timmy in private school? probably not.

jrey1981

Just wanted to say thanks again to people who have responded. I have been copying and pasting comments so I can include some excerpts in the piece I am writing.

A really wide range of comments that could see beneath the surface in places to the deeper issues of consumerism - the illusionary and the power relationship aspects of it, for example.

Will be in touch shortly with respondents when I have done a bit more work in this...still juggling writing and research with my other (business) work at the moment while trying to keep a vague structure in mind for the article.

Kernel

Well, I wrote a very long reply to this last night, and submitted at the time boards was updating, so it was all lost. I'll try to remember some of my points....

jrey1981 wrote:

Meanwhile, many children are being reared increasingly by minders, creches and nurseries, while their parents are at work.

Is this trend storing up emotional problems in children in the future?

Having watched an episode of Questions & Answers recently, the question of creches raising a generation of Irish children was raised. Most people in the panel and audience agreed that having one of the parents solely responsible for raising and teaching the child - as well as providing constant emotional support - was a much more desirable situation than the child being raised in a state sponsored communal creche. There are positive sides to such a situation, such as children learning social interaction from a young age, however, due to demands put on the ever increasing industry of child care, it is usually felt that not enough focus could be put on the individual, particularly a child with more specific needs or emotional issues.

Unfortunately, it is often not an option in todays Irish economic powerhouse, for a parent to stay at home full time. The government policy in Ireland was to steer us in a more capitalist model, such as in the US, and has resulted in a boom in investment, inflation, increased wages and spending. This economic transition was not managed correctly by the government (or in fairness, the people themselves), and has resulted in Ireland becoming a European worker state. This has brought pressures, of which mental health problems are only a polar indicator. There are also subtle changes in society and lifestyle, and in people's attitude - creating a more selfish, me fein atmosphere, and a breakdown of typical social and family groups. Is it natural for a person to sit in a factory or an office for 12 hours a day doing something they hate? No, and they don't want to spend their lives doing it, but they are forced to.

How many people know their neighbours well? How many are still as willing to help their communities as before? What about young people forced to move far away from their families and friends due to property prices spiralling out of control? All of these factors change the dynamics in a society, and greed becomes prevalent.

The question should also be asked as to who benefits from a situation of two parents working full time. I don't believe it is the parents, or the family, since in most cases, one parent would not be working full time if it was possible to have a comfortable life and remain at home - in effect this means that people are being forced to work against their will, by a system which will not allow them to exist comfortably unless both people are working full time. The term for such a situation is 'wage-slavery'. Due to Ireland's taxation policy of gaining so much revenue from taxation of PAYE workers (as opposed to their generous corporate tax rate - which concordantly attracts investment from foreign multinationals), the government actually gains from having both parents working full time. The corporations or the capitalist also gains by having a larger work force (and thus lower wage costs) and a greater consumer base to sell their products to.

To digress and answer the original question, there is no way to tell what emotional or psychological impact this situation will have on children, but we can already see that many children value themselves and others based on material possessions and economic success - making them a product of their environment (and in many cases their parents). This would logically seem to indicate an increase in pressure on children/young people to succeed in such ways - leading to stress, depression and ultimately a feeling of unfulfillment in life as many are herded through jobs they do not really want to do.

A society so selfishly focused can lead to an uncaring state - such as can be seen in the United States, where homelessness is rampant and social policy is carried out by private individuals or organisations (eg. churches) rather than by the elected government. Young people who feel of lower value based on the barometer of their society can also be prone to anti-social behaviour, self-loathing, violence and crime - after all, they will no longer feel they are a part of society, or of the system.

jrey1981 wrote:

Should marketers and advertisers have to abide by stricter regulation?

Absolutely. Advertisers are paid vast amounts by corporations or businesses to sell as much product as possible - regardless of whether the product is high quality (including healthy food/drink), affordable to the individual or required by the individual. To achieve this aim, advertisers use sophisticated methods of brain washing and conditioning - many advertising strategies are put in place for years, or even lifetimes. They have even studied subliminal advertising to attempt to bypass the brains capacity for objective reasoning! How many kids know the McDonalds jingo 'I'm loving it'? How many of those kids are going to actually equate love with McDonalds?

As mentioned in the Naomi Klein book 'No Logo', businesses moved toward a new advertising trend of brand awareness and brand establishment. This can be observed in Sony advertising - 'Buy Sony. Better.' is clearly galvanising the brand image of Sony as making higher quality products which are better than their competitors - even when this is often not the case. Many electronic goods use generic parts - even generic screens for plasma/lcd screens, and yet if a consumer is shopping for such an item and sees brand X alongside an identical specification Sony brand product (perhaps even using the same major components such as a screen) then most consumers will feel that splashing out the extra 50% in cost for the Sony brand is a wise decision. Why? Because the Sony is 'better' philosophy is engrained in their minds.

I know of corporations selling another cheap manufacturers product, and slapping their own brand logo on it, and charging the consumers much more, which they will pay because they feel that the branded product is more reliable!

Ultimately, the advertisers fill the people with desires to buy products which they may not even need, or want (!), and innovation is controlled and drip fed to the public in line with competitors, in order to ensure that a long term marketing plan is in place to secure profit margins. The problems with this are that the businesses goal is to produce the goods as cheaply as possible, pay the workers as little as possible, and charge the consumer as much as possible. This is called maximising profits. Unfortunately, the majority of consumers are workers themselves, and the massive rise in borrowing and personal debt in Ireland is indicative that we are consuming beyond our means - thus ensuring continuing enslavement in the capitalist system (wage slavery).

jrey1981 wrote:

Are there adequate facilities in Irelands health service with adequate funding to address this in our health service?

No, and it is a national disgrace that there is not, but it clearly shows the people that the government have moved away from the social (ist) model and too far into the capitalist model. The health service scandal, as well as the lack of other publicly funded services, are an indicator as to the direction of the government. Health service problems out of control, crime out of control (or at least severely underfunded), pensions etc. With a surplus in the exchequer as massive as we have seen, there is no excuse for such a situation, but it is indicative of the current 'race to the bottom' mentality of our society - which sees inadequate public funding and workers rights being brought back to pre Unionisation days.

It's not good for the majority of the workers/people, only for the select few capitalist bosses who profit from your work, while contributing no actual labour themselves.

The masses are tractable and easily distracted with new trinkets, but more and more people are being enlightened to the situation due to globalisation and are seeing their jobs disappear to countries with human rights abuses, totalitarian governments and Dickensian working conditions - all in the name of maximising profits and driving 'costs' down - the results of which are almost never passed on to the majority of the population unless you are a shareholder. Sure, third world countries get some run-off wealth from the trough, but the fat cats are the ones laughing all the way to the bank.

Kernel

I forgot to mention that in the West we tend to think of the system which produces the most wealth as the best system - and as such have thrown away many valid socialist principles. People need to realise that the system which produces the most wealth is not always the best option, if it was then the Nazi system of slave labour in concentration camps would be the model we should adopt. Slavery hasn't gone away, it's simply got more elaborate, complex and refined within a suitably complex system of economics, markets, banking and capitalism.

chump

Kernel wrote:

I forgot to mention that in the West we tend to think of the system which produces the most wealth as the best system - and as such have thrown away many valid socialist principles. People need to realise that the system which produces the most wealth is not always the best option, if it was then the Nazi system of slave labour in concentration camps would be the model we should adopt. Slavery hasn't gone away, it's simply got more elaborate, complex and refined within a suitably complex system of economics, markets, banking and capitalism.

What is the best system then?
And give one example of it functioning please...

Kernel

chump wrote:

What is the best system then?
And give one example of it functioning please...

The best system has never been implemented, and if we decide on a system being the 'best' (such as the current system) then we have a rigid inflexible system which never evolves with dynamic changes in the world. Imagine if people in Europe thought that Feudalism was the best system, and had never moved past that, we wouldn't have the republic or democracy.

I don't claim to possess the blueprint for the perfect system of politics, economics and commerce, I'm merely stating the problems with the current system and suggesting that a mixture of more socialist policy would serve to temper the global capitalist machine, which causes many problems and is grossly unfair. A start would be to bring the corporations to heel, since they have clearly become a runaway train with nobody's interests at heart - they exist now purely for profit, and the rest of the world be damned.

As an aside, an example of a cashless, and functioning socialist society would be the ancient Spartans, who excelled in arts, athletics, militarism and craftsmanship. There is some debate as to whether such a model can work on a large scale, or is more suited for smaller communities - but then again, society is made up of communities guided by a central executive.

Heyes

Do you feel that the Irish society and culture is more individualised?

To some extent i do, it depends on location, rural / urban, age, colour , race , religion there are slight differences however in the long term it all appears to blend into one, leading to a less indivdual society

Do you think that there is a tendency towards insecurity and uncertainty in a rapidly developing consumer society?

Yes absolutaly i believe that people as a whole are becoming less secure and very uncertain about certain aspects of there lives, i feel there is a lot of pressure on both young people and adults within society to act in a certain way and have certain tendancies and with the changing economics ie: divorce etc families are not really how they used to be so that stability is begining to vanish and the uncertainty is becoming more apparent.

How easy do you think it is for young people to find their direction in life in a mass consumer society?

I think it really depends on there backround, if they have been provided with some stability and a bit of direction i feel it can lead to a lot of different and some what more positive results, than if provided with none. I do however feel that this stability needs to be ad heared to and not finish when the child leaves school. I feel a lot of young people witness a massive amount of stress;s and pressure s once heading to college/ work force.

So much information can be thrown at young people that they are totally at a loss of what direction to take, leading to confusion and lowness, the provision of help and explanations / support should be widely provided and not be seen as a negative thing to ask for help.

Do you feel Ireland has lost anything socially or culturally during this period of economic growth?

I think there is a lot more pressure on individuals were not so much a relaxed culture, i feel that people are more money and "things" driven, they want to show success in a much grander scale leading to more pressure.

Do you feel empowered by the huge range of consumer choices and opportunities that economic growth brings, or do you think there is a negative side to any of this?

Economic growth has done wonders for our job sectors however it has just provided us with more rubish and more pressure for people to obtain things just to conform with the people around them.

Though the nation is on the whole materially richer, are we growing poorer in other ways?

Richer yes , more welcoming and relaxed as a nation no. There is a change people are slowely changing becoming less warm to those around them.

Are any areas of life in Ireland becoming devalued by the pace of change, urbanisation, economic growth and technological advances?

yes the small things in life are been dramatically devalued simple words between people are been devalued. People feel these god given need to provide a product or give something, or buy something for the sake of it, to be seen having it. That just irratates me, its a real sence of "keeping up with jones" approach that we as a nation always thought negatively of the amerivcans however were turning into that ourselves.

Does the education system prepares people adequately to deal with life in a rapidly growing and changing economy?

Absolutaly not, i remember when i was in school we were provided with two colleges to attend UCD or Trinity, we were never told about the other large array of colleges open to us. We were also told that the school average was 450 points,its really put a lot of pressure on everyone to succeed, and if people did not obtain this they automatically felt a sense of failer already which is so wrong.

Some colleges do provide students with help and prepare them adequately to deal with life and what pressure s they may help, however this information is far too little, and also should be obtained through out school / college not just at the end. If it was provided through the students would probable feel so much less pressure that they will be able to relax and lot more and not be so fearfull of what lies ahead. The lack of information and help is what really gets young people down through out these years and can lead to lowness etc that should not ever need to be felt.

How easy do you think it is for young people who may be more emotionally vulnerable for whatever reason to cope with the various pressures of a growing and changing society? I dont think its nessessarily easy at all, particularly given the lack of information and help provided for those. As i said above there is a pressure to conform with others around you, and i believe this kind of pressure would really target the more emotionally vulnerable people more dramatically.

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The above is just off the top of my head, and would probable alter slightly with discussion, however i do feel that all the pressure s that young people are witness to these days could be addressed and the pressure be dramatically reduced both now and in the long term.