Interesting Hand with John Juanda

loosecannon

Full Tilt Poker Game #497005535: Table Butternut (6 max) - $10/$20 - No Limit Hold'em - 19:00:00 ET - 2006/03/13 (partial)
John Juanda raises to $60
lollylu calls $40
*** FLOP *** [2s 8s 7h]
lollylu checks
John Juanda bets $100
lollylu calls $100
*** TURN *** [2s 8s 7h] [Jc]
lollylu bets $185
John Juanda raises to $425
lollylu raises to $1,400
John Juanda has 15 seconds left to act
John Juanda calls $975



*** RIVER *** [2s 8s 7h Jc] [8d]
lollylu bets $1,638.50, and is all in
John Juanda calls $1,638.50


So what do u think that they both have? bear in mind that JJ thought long and hard before calling the re-raise on the turn, with the straight out there and a flush draw as well

if u were JJ what would be the minimum hand that you would want to be calling with on the turn after the big re-raise?

will post the result here in a bit, thought it was a very interesting hand

Sangre

JJ has 88 and lollylu has jj?

shoutman

Was a headsup game yea?
Its a confusing one for me on first glances.

I think it looks like it could be just a terrible play from lollylu, he might of felt that because JJ took so long to call on the turn and the fact that the river didnt catch if he was on a flush or a striaght draw that lolly might of thought an all in could steal it.

But I'm thinking JJ has possibly made quad eights by the river.
But if he has his trips by the turn its an instant call from me unless he was playing for the online hesitating a call play....

Hectorjelly

Is this heads up? I think its impossible to know without knowing how the game has been running. Against an unknown I would probably need a set to continue on the turn, the way some hu games go i would treat AJ as the nuts.

loosecannon

sorry it was a 6 player NL cash game but there was just the two of them sitting, so yes it was head's up

i don't know how either of them were running

is the general consensus that two pair or a set should call or fold to the re-raise?

shoutman

I think that it was such a big reraise it looked like maybe he didnt want a call, so a two pair or set would be a call for me.

Hectorjelly

loosecannon wrote:

sorry it was a 6 player NL cash game but there was just the two of them sitting, so yes it was head's up

i don't know how either of them were running

is the general consensus that two pair or a set should call or fold to the re-raise?

that depends on what a lead/3bet all in on the turn means in a raised pot for that player, but in general its a big hand. I dont think I could fold the turn if I had top set but against some players I would fold everything bar the nuts.

But that said in some hu matches (and not against donks, just aggro players) I go broke here with an overpair. I doubt this is the case here though

loosecannon

just to let you know what happened in that hand, JJ was facing the $1,000 re-raise on the turn and was actually miles ahead with the other guy drawing only to the 7

maybe even more interestingly, despite the 8 coming on the river filling JJ's boat and negating the other guy's two pair, he pushed anyway on the river (first to speak) for $1,638.50

what does everyone think of that play? is he so far pot commited that he's done for either way or would u check it and hope to call a smaller bet from JJ or throw it away despite already having put over $2k into the pot

any thoughts?





*** SHOW DOWN ***
lollylu shows [Jd 7d] (two pair, Jacks and Eights)
John Juanda shows [Jh 8c] (a full house, Eights full of Jacks)
John Juanda wins the pot ($6,396.50) with a full house, Eights full of Jacks
lollylu is sitting out
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $6,397 | Rake $0.50
Board: [2s 8s 7h Jc 8d]
Seat 1: John Juanda (small blind) showed [Jh 8c] and won ($6,396.50) with a full house, Eights full of Jacks
Seat 6: lollylu (big blind) showed [Jd 7d] and lost with two pair, Jacks and Eights

Hectorjelly

i think the river is a check fold, what hand does he beat? pushing there is only worthwhile if JJ can fold an overpair, and given the turn call I doubt he is.