The Mindset of a Pub Tournament Player

Ste05

OK, I was writing this Post for the BB thread, but as I was venting a couple of things came to mind that I thought might actually be worthy of a discussion, it's regarding the mindset of a Pub tournament player and it comes in 2 parts. (1) Are they learning that Slow Rolling is OK; and (2) an insight into why these tournaments might be doing so well.

(1) To begin with I'll outline where this post started. I just got home from a home game, it was a €100 FO, 11 players started, and we were down to the last 4, (the bubble). (€550/ €350/ €200)

The hand in question isn't important but basically on the turn I lead out, the button (pre-flop limper) thinks about it for a while and re-raises me, after thinking about it for a while, I re-re-raise all-in, (reasoning not important to this post, but I'm happy with my play, bar the result) so the guy lets out a huge groan, leans back, rubs his head, really makes it look like he's been caught out, then has a long look at my stack and we count them out, I have him covered by 1 SB, then he goes back into the box and thinks again, I now want the call and hope he makes it, finally after about 5 minutes (no messing) he says call and asks what I have, so I immediately say my hand then he shows the Stone Cold Nuts and smiles!!!!!!!! :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

After the hand I said "What's the story with that slow roll", and he says, "Hey that's Poker, I got you all in, didn't I!" I tried to calmly explain that I was already all in and there was nothing else to do. But he just kept saying, you have to be able to lose in Poker. I tell you I nearly threw him through the fcuking window, not only was it a savage slow roll, but it was also done on the Bubble, it was really hard to take, I didn't really know the lads who were left in the tourney, (I had been invited to the game by my brother), and they were all picking my brains during smoke breaks about particular hands in the tournament, it was a nice friendly game, and then this, he then went to the toilet and I just said to the rest of the lads left that it's bad enough to get knocked out and there's no need to rub it in (they didn't know what a "Slow Roll" was, and that is why I was annoyed and not the losing, I didn't want to get a reputation for being a bad loser (as I want to play in this game again :rolleyes: ) so I just bit my lip and waited until my 1 SB was beaten. (thank god I got 73o in the SB next hand) It left a really sour taste in my mouth. I have now started a list and he's top of it!!

So my question is: Is this kind of thing common in pub tourneys (I never play them), or where are these players learning that this is all part of the game!

(2) During one of the smoke breaks I was talking to this same guy and he was saying that he plays alot of Pub tournaments and seems to do quite well, (according to him) and after a while of talking he tried to explain to me how the odds are great for playing in a pub tourneys, and you he gets better odds than playing in a casino. Apparently there was some €100 FO on with 49 players, the top prize is €1,000, (€2,900 paid out in total) and so his reasoning was that he's getting 10:1 if he wins and so it's a good tournament to play in, based on the fact that no really good players play in them and so he's getting better odds playing here than in a Casino. I tried explaining that he's basically paying €40 rake and his argument was that it doesn't matter what the organisers make, he's getting good odds and so it's a good tournament to play in. After a while of explaining why it's not a good tournament, I just gave up, he just wouldn't listen. But it just struck me as possibly this is the reason these cowboys are doing so well? Any thoughts?

SandyVN

Id agree that that was a very pointless slow roll, very pointless. Maybe he didn't know what he had?? This kind of slow play doesn't happen all the time & certainly not when all you have to do is call & you win.
I feel they are learning as a good lot of our players have improved 100% and now at a level to move into casinos & actually stand a chance without just relying on blind luck.

I myself started playing in pub tournaments as Casinos seemed very unwelcoming to me but with gaining confidence in your play all that goes out the window.
With out trying to sound like I'm plugging IMO pub tournaments are the best place for these players to learn the basics without being judged. New players are frequent to us & with the help of our regular players they learn fast.

In regards to his better odds comment, Yes the rake is higher in all pub tournaments compared to casinos but like i said i also played pub tournaments to start and i was winning money 1 in 2 tournaments, However when i went to a casino i was busting out all the time, my play obviousally wasn't up to the standard at the time so i felt the best odds personally (Not regarding rake or prize money just basically so id win & not lose) was pub tournaments, these players will eventually move up in standard as so many have.

It was just bad manners on his behalf to slow roll you like that & i would of threw him out the window:D

I hope some of that makes sense to you.

kincsem

Yeah I hate when people slow roll. He thinks he's a big poker player and he is into the image. Reality will intrude. To me suffering a slow roll incident is like getting cut up in traffic by an ignoramus. Instead of chasing after him (with cards or a car) and possible doing yourself damage I content myself with the certainty that he will get what's coming to him.

These guys can't dodge bullets forever.

The only drawback is that you will not be there to see it.

hotspur

Actually I think it would be a great idea if it were institutionalized as a policy all over the world that whenever a player slow rolls they get thrown out of the nearest window.
"Sorry mate club rules"
"But it's my first time I didn't know... ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh" *THUD*

BigDragon

hotspur wrote:

Actually I think it would be a great idea if it were institutionalized as a policy all over the world that whenever a player slow rolls they get thrown out of the nearest window.
"Sorry mate club rules"
"But it's my first time I didn't know... ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh" *THUD*

Hotspur gets my vote next election.

Corben Dallas

seconded!

NickyOD

****in' Slowrollers.

Cash game hand from the Macau last year. He bets into me all in on the river and I call. Final board 66A89

He waits and waits for me to show my hand. Now normally I show a monster out of turn. He shows an Ace. "and the other one!!" then after 5 seconds he shows a 6 and whole table erupts in disgust. I show and 8, and then 5 seconds later I show another one.

Bellagio

Hi STeo5,
Sorry to hear about the tourney With the slow roll.The games I play that guy would not be asked back.S.R.is not allowed in a propper run game.He is just waiting to start a fight. Good Luck.
S.H.:

Derek C.

There was an instance in December where I was on the final table in the Emporium and someone raised my big blind all-in.

Everyone else folded (8 players), and I sat back in my seat and smiled a bit. The table was good for the banter and I'm not shy when it comes to the speech play. I looked around the table and realised it was my chance to show a bit of power in front of a strong field of players so I jokingly asked for the all-in to be counted out knowing that he had about 6 times the chips i did. Everyone laughed and watched me do a little more acting for about 30 seconds in total.

I eventually called and turned over pocket Aces. The all-in guy shook his head and asked what took you so long?
I just smiled and shrugged my shoulders. I doubled up and went on to battle him a few times in future pots and took each of them without any major worries. I could swear he wanted revenge and he was only getting into pots because I was in them. I eventually knocked him out in 3rd and he shook my hand and wished me luck.

I'm not saying what I done is the same as what this guy did to you Steo but I've found that when you're down to a final table or final 3 or heads up, it pays to be a bit of a swine to finish 1st. Unfortunately in your situation he was just being an asshole at the same time.

Usually if I have the nuts like that I'll shake my head and just say "Unlucky" cause you just walked into a monster. Then turn the cards over and slap the table and shout "DOMINO MOTHER ****A".

ianmc38

Derek C. wrote:

There was an instance in December where I was on the final table in the Emporium and someone raised my big blind all-in.

Everyone else folded (8 players), and I sat back in my seat and smiled a bit. The table was good for the banter and I'm not shy when it comes to the speech play. I looked around the table and realised it was my chance to show a bit of power in front of a strong field of players so I jokingly asked for the all-in to be counted out knowing that he had about 6 times the chips i did. Everyone laughed and watched me do a little more acting for about 30 seconds in total.

I eventually called and turned over pocket Aces. The all-in guy shook his head and asked what took you so long?
I just smiled and shrugged my shoulders. I doubled up and went on to battle him a few times in future pots and took each of them without any major worries. I could swear he wanted revenge and he was only getting into pots because I was in them. I eventually knocked him out in 3rd and he shook my hand and wished me luck.

I'm not saying what I done is the same as what this guy did to you Steo but I've found that when you're down to a final table or final 3 or heads up, it pays to be a bit of a swine to finish 1st. Unfortunately in your situation he was just being an asshole at the same time.

Usually if I have the nuts like that I'll shake my head and just say "Unlucky" cause you just walked into a monster. Then turn the cards over and slap the table and shout "DOMINO MOTHER ****A".

Hopefully the next guy you slowroll against will punch you in the face. Slowrollers are scumbags regardless of whether they gain an edge by doing so.

Dub13

ianmc38 wrote:

Hopefully the next guy you slowroll against will punch you in the face. Slowrollers are scumbags regardless of whether they gain an edge by doing so.

Jesus relax....

ntlbell

Derek C. wrote:

Usually if I have the nuts like that I'll shake my head and just say "Unlucky" cause you just walked into a monster. Then turn the cards over and slap the table and shout "DOMINO MOTHER ****A".

Ok snoop dog, you got digit's etc

Throw the bulllets over and get on with it

Kimba

Derek C. wrote:

There was an instance in December where I was on the final table in the Emporium and someone raised my big blind all-in.

Everyone else folded (8 players), and I sat back in my seat and smiled a bit. The table was good for the banter and I'm not shy when it comes to the speech play. I looked around the table and realised it was my chance to show a bit of power in front of a strong field of players so I jokingly asked for the all-in to be counted out knowing that he had about 6 times the chips i did. Everyone laughed and watched me do a little more acting for about 30 seconds in total.

I eventually called and turned over pocket Aces. The all-in guy shook his head and asked what took you so long?
I just smiled and shrugged my shoulders. I doubled up and went on to battle him a few times in future pots and took each of them without any major worries. I could swear he wanted revenge and he was only getting into pots because I was in them. I eventually knocked him out in 3rd and he shook my hand and wished me luck.

I'm not saying what I done is the same as what this guy did to you Steo but I've found that when you're down to a final table or final 3 or heads up, it pays to be a bit of a swine to finish 1st. Unfortunately in your situation he was just being an asshole at the same time.

Usually if I have the nuts like that I'll shake my head and just say "Unlucky" cause you just walked into a monster. Then turn the cards over and slap the table and shout "DOMINO MOTHER ****A".

What a player! I bet you've won every single poker game you've played in since you started playing 3 months ago. No wonder the guy wished you luck, carry on like that and it wont be luck you'll be needing.

DeadParrot

my opinion is this.
As a relativley new player to game, my 1st chances to see poker (texas holdem esp) was in either;
A) the odd movie, where people always get some other sham all in, the grins with an evil leer and turns over full houses or whatever. Or blatantly cheat, obvious to all but the hero.
this is especially true of Texas Holdem, WSOP on the telly, I was living in canada and used to watch it on the rogers sportsnet afternoon telly. In these shows, they blocked out all the 'hum drum' nuts nad bolts of the game and highlighted the all ins and romantised the bast*rds of the show, 'slow rolling' (1st time hearing this expression).
Now to the first time initiiate, this is deadly, and makes you think poker is always you vs the bad guy, and you always want to lord it over, as you seen either the villian of the movie or the asshat on the telly.
sorry bout the spelling a wee bit hung over

DeadParrot

though.....since dropping in on this place, I've learned to apprieciate the finer niceties of poker...
damn spelling

sunzz

Hate the sight of them. Just hate them.

Ste a player like that will get his upcomings, just try and find some comfort in that.

Best of luck in future.

kincsem

Derek C. wrote:

...and I sat back in my seat and smiled a bit.
... I looked around the table and realised it was my chance to show a bit of power
... Everyone laughed and watched me do a little more acting
... I just smiled and shrugged my shoulders.
... if I have the nuts like that I'll shake my head and just say "Unlucky" cause you just walked into a monster. Then turn the cards over and slap the table and shout "DOMINO MOTHER ****A".

You're living in a dreamworld.

5starpool

Everywhere poker is played, there should be a cattle prod at the dealers disposal to use exclusively on slow rollers.

Derek C.

Don't get me wrong here guys, I'm not the kind of person to slow roll everything. Sometimes its just fun to mess around!

Now if the casino's bring in this cattle prod idea I think i'll have to adapt my strategy somewhat!

Kimba

Derek C. wrote:

Don't get me wrong here guys, I'm not the kind of person to slow roll everything. Sometimes its just fun mess around!

Now if the casino's bring in this cattle prod idea I think i'll have to adapt my strategy somewhat!

maybe for you but not for everyone else. learn some poker etiquette before you play again. And I wouldnt need a cattleprod!

cardshark202

Derek C. wrote:

Don't get me wrong here guys, I'm not the kind of person to slow roll everything. Sometimes its just fun mess around!

Now if the casino's bring in this cattle prod idea I think i'll have to adapt my strategy somewhat!

You are a scumbag, no question. There's having fun and there's acting the prick. You are just a sadass.

Derek C.

thanks for the love.

cardshark202

cardshark202 wrote:

You are a scumbag, no question. There's having fun and there's acting the prick. You are just a sadass.

DeVore wrote:

This is why I insist on civility as much as possible on this site. And why I hunt down people who abuse it.

Oops.....

Derek C.

Yeah, I want an apology from everyone who called me bad names, All I wanted was to make some friends and now I've blown it. I'm so stupid. I wish I were dead.

sleepypriest

Isn't slowrolling having the winning hand, knowing this, and slow playing?

Well if it is then slow playing aces pre flop isn't slowrolling as it is not the winning hand. It has a very good chance of being the winning hand and it is usually the easiest preflop hand to decided whether to go allin or not but at the end of the day there is a decision to be made and if that takes 30 seconds so be it.

I am not condonning slow rolling I think it is bad manners but I don't believe Derek's example is slow rolling.

ntlbell

sleepypriest wrote:

Isn't slowrolling having the winning hand, knowing this, and slow playing?

Well if it is then slow playing aces pre flop isn't slowrolling as it is not the winning hand. It has a very good chance of being the winning hand and it is usually the easiest preflop hand to decided whether to go allin or not but at the end of the day there is a decision to be made and if that takes 30 seconds so be it.

I am not condonning slow rolling I think it is bad manners but I don't believe Derek's example is slow rolling.

If Derek was simply thinking about the hand, players left, players paid other stacks etc, then no it's not, but he openly states he did to be an idiot.

that's a totally different situation you're talking about

Derek C.

Very good point Sleepy, its nice to know someone read it proper.
When people read that I was hesitating playing the Bullets they assume that I was one of those Slow Rolling you know whats.

In fairness I was prolonging the game for my own benefit but after getting to the final table of the 100euro buy-in event I was weighing up whether to call and double up or call and bust out of a tournament that I was assured to make the money in if I lasted 20 minutes and the small stacks got knocked out.

(these were no chumps at the table either and i look like i'm only after doing my communion so I didn't want them to think I was a pushover.)

But it crossed my mind for about a second, it just took me another 29 to get the words out of my mouth to call.

ntlbell

Derek C. wrote:

Very good point Sleepy, its nice to know someone rad it properly.
I was trying to convay that in my post but when people read that I was hesitating playing the Bullets they assume that I was one of those Slow Rolling you know whats.

In fairness I was prolonging the game for my own benefit but after getting to the final table of the 100euro buy-in event I was weighing up whether to call and double up or call and bust out of a tournament that I was assured to make the money in if I lasted 20 minutes and the small stacks got knocked
out.

Then say this in your post instead of filling it with garbage, k/thnx

e.g.

"but I've found that when you're down to a final table or final 3 or heads up, it pays to be a bit of a swine to finish 1st"

cardshark202

Derek C. wrote:

Very good point Sleepy, its nice to know someone read it proper.
When people read that I was hesitating playing the Bullets they assume that I was one of those Slow Rolling you know whats.

In fairness I was prolonging the game for my own benefit but after getting to the final table of the 100euro buy-in event I was weighing up whether to call and double up or call and bust out of a tournament that I was assured to make the money in if I lasted 20 minutes and the small stacks got knocked out.

But it crossed my mind for about a second, it just took me another 29 to get the words out of my mouth.

You are an idiot.

Derek C.

Ha, thanks Cardshark, Love you too!;)

Dub13

If you disagree with someone you can still keep it civil.

cardshark202

Dub13 wrote:

If you disagree with someone you can still keep it civil.

Can you please advise on the most civil way to call someone an idiot?:v:

DeVore

You could explain *why* you think what he says is idiotic. Thats a better way.

DeV.

cardshark202

DeVore wrote:

You could explain *why* you think what he says is idiotic. Thats a better way.

DeV.

By reading a combination of his posts in this thread, I successfully deduced that he was indeed an idiot.

jtsuited

as did i. Derek C. i really don't think it's a good idea to be boasting about immature behaviour at the table.

roryc

wheres 'infairness' been lately....


oh an Derek, you are an idiot. Reason? emmm..... due to the fact that you do idiotic things and are most likely a person of limited intelligence maybe?

If anyone slowrolls me I usually make a point of discussing it with them at the break, and letting them know that its very rude. As was mentioned already, a lot of people don't realise this, and are simply imitating what they see on TV. However, if they insist on being an arsehole then I am forced to take other measures.

I remember a lad slowrolling me in my college game when I was just starting off. I hit Ace high flush on the river, with no pair on the board. I pushed all in, and he waited a full minute or two giving it all the difficult decision bull****. Finally he turns around and says, 'ah I'm gonna have to call you'. He then jumps out of his chair and screams 'HAHA STRAIGHT FLUSH DICKHEAD!!! YESSSSS!!!'

Now normally I would just take this in my stride and bring it up with him at the break, but this lad was a right dikhead, and I knew he would just laugh it off (I had previously warned him against slowrolling another player)

So I did what comes natural to us northsiders. I got up off my chair, said good game to the rest of the players, and then chucked said chair at his head. Suffice to say I didn't play the college game again.


Oh and Derek, I hope I am at the table the next time you slowroll someone....

Derek C.

Did I upset any of you's?

God forbid I upset people who have such high standards set for themselves when I'm quite sure we all have our little bad habits when we play this game!

Thats right girls its a game!

I'm not cheating by acting, I'm not slow rollin. I'm just playing the game.

I'd hate to see you's really offended.

*Congrats on the team event Rory*

jtsuited

Derek C. wrote:

Thats right girls its a game!

So why feel the need to constantly be posting on a forum dedicated to this game which you seem to not think is that important?
Why feel the need to slowroll?
Why feel it is your duty to continue posting when you are doing nothing but annoying people and making a right fool of yourself?
"Domino *****fcuka" ? You are one hell of a sad guy!!!

Derek C.

I never said I didn't care about it, I said its a game, like Football, so dont know where your coming from with that.

Oh and just incase any of you think that Domino Mother ****a thing was true. its not. Its a Boys in the Hood quote!!

Ice Cube? Anybody?

Oh and its a good debate, didnt know it got everyone so bent out of shape so maybe I've learnt something.

5starpool

Derek C. wrote:

Thats right girls its a game!

I'm not cheating by acting, I'm not slow rollin. I'm just playing the game.

It's more than a game to an awful lot of people here, it's a living to more than a few.

I agree that you are not cheating, but you are the clamper of the poker world, except you do it for joy and to irritate people, not because you have to.

If you could grow up you would see why it is disgraceful to deliberately slowroll.

roryc

Derek C. wrote:

Did I upset any of you's?

God forbid I upset people who have such high standards set for themselves when I'm quite sure we all have our little bad habits when we play this game!

Yes we all have our bad habits, but slowrolling is not a bad habit. It's being a dickhead plain and simple. If you have the better hand, by all means do what has to be done to win the hand, but if he has the chips in, and you have the nuts, just call, show the hand and take your chips. Its bad enough losing a hand without having some smarmy git rub it in your face

Derek C. wrote:

*Congrats on the team event Rory*

Thanks

Derek C.

Point taken lads.
You's hate slow rolling.
I get it.
But generalising me on a post I posted when I was being honest is quite sad. Don't think I've shamed myself on this thread by the way as someone wrote previously. I thought this was what the forums were for? The Faceless slagging off is quite unnecessary.

Well I'm up in the Anglers almost every Friday and I'd be glad to discuss it face to face. You'd be suprised what a little communication does to prevent these kind of things.

It was good to know the reaction tho, we can't all know everything right away can we!

roryc

thats fair enough, we're all here to learn. It just so happens that the one bad post you seem to have written, was about something that most poker players hate. Slowrolling cannot be tolerated, and the next person I see doing it is getting an icepick up the arse...

Derek C.

roryc wrote:

Slowrolling cannot be tolerated, and the next person I see doing it is getting an icepick up the arse...

Promise?

Ah well I think we should let this Thread drop down the pecking order before anyone else takes offence. Its been like I said I go around killing Puppies!!

I'll have the Vidgo's at the gaff screaming SlowRollers SlowRollers SlowRollers, out out out!

Lets all agree I've learned a valuable lesson!

Lafortezza

The next personal abuse that gets posted gets a weeks ban. Threats and personal insults have no place on the forum.
Derek C, I'm assuming that alot of what you've posted has been to get a reaction and it's all one big joke. You're new to the forum so maybe relax and see how things work for a while before putting feet in mouth.

califano

roryc wrote:

. He then jumps out of his chair and screams 'HAHA STRAIGHT FLUSH DICKHEAD!!! YESSSSS!!!'

One of the most shocking things i have read on this board.

roryc wrote:

So I did what comes natural to us northsiders. I got up off my chair, said good game to the rest of the players, and then chucked said chair at his head.

One of the most heroic things i have read on this board.



Derek C.
You seem to be repentant about this so dont worry about it, as long as you know its wrong and how much it angers players and dont plan on doing it as a practice thats fine.
forgetaboutit

Derek C.

Seriously, what is the problem with telling the truth on this site? Did you hear me slag anyone off. Of course I said what I said to get a reaction but not to annoy people in a childish way, it was to see why people thought it was so bad to slow the game up for personal benefit.

I've been nothing but civil in this thread. And for the record I don't post here that much because of the needless abuse that goes on but I'm not new to the forums or here to **** people over.

I think its the senior boarders that have let the side down on this one IMHO.

SlowRolling bad - I get it.

*Sorry Rounders, posted without reading your reply*

Lafortezza

Nothing wrong with being civil or honest on the forum. Letting people know that you take pleasure in occasionally slow-rolling gives them an insight into the type of person and poker player you are. Your comments and replies following this also create an image and impression of the type of person you are.

I agree that alot of the abuse from forum regulars that followed was not on, they've been warned and will be banned if it continues.
If you've any problems with anything that's said on the forum feel free to pm me or Muso, or click the report post button on the right side of every post.

cardshark202

lafortezza wrote:

Nothing wrong with being civil or honest on the forum. Letting people know that you take pleasure in occasionally slow-rolling gives them an insight into the type of person and poker player you are. Your comments and replies following this also create an image and impression of the type of person you are.

I agree that alot of the abuse from forum regulars that followed was not on, they've been warned and will be banned if it continues.
If you've any problems with anything that's said on the forum feel free to pm me or Muso, or click the report post button on the right side of every post.

Sorry but deliberate slow-rolling really grinds my gears so its pretty hard to resist having a pop.

kinaldo

I kinda slowrolled quads in a cash game last Thursday, but I think my misdemeanour went almost unnoticed amidst the show one show all controversy. Not that I condone such activity or anything. Im sure RMcG remembers the guy in question and why I did it...

cardshark202

kinaldo wrote:

I kinda slowrolled quads in a cash game last Thursday, but I think my misdemeanour went almost unnoticed amidst the show one show all controversy. Not that I condone such activity or anything. Im sure RMcG remembers the guy in question and why I did it...

Yeah that was a sick hand, ur slowroll went unnoticed because the guy had ace high in fairness so any bloody pair had him beat. If he had a house there, no matter how much of a prick he was, he doesn't deserve to be slowrolled.