flying jets after 1.2

IG-Calibre

well things just got a whole lot interesting in the air!!

When ground AA locks you it pretty much hit's every time as does air-2-air missiles on the plus side then also always hit choppers when fired at them too

when you fly over the air field you only get health replenished by 2 bars per pass, even if you go really slow, however if you land you are repaired to full health almost instantly!!

Vegeta

oh finally a bit of fun to be had for all. i personally stayed away from maps with planes cos I like playing as infintary and was just being nailed continually by bombing. Now i might play those maps again and see if i can take out a plane or two

good idea about the repairing of the planes

December Son

thank god. planes were almost invincible from the ground and AA missiles had zero effect. nice to finally have some defence

projectmayhem

wake island will be interesting as planes/choppers were the best means of attack there

spooky donkey

I dont think I ever took out a plane before and it wasent from the lack of trying, I always thought the ease of repair a little mad even when I did damage them they got the helth back really easy.

AnCapaillMor

I've a funny feeling they're going to make AA too good in this patch. It was a joke before to take down aircraft, now it seems it'll be too easy. Typical irishman never happy.

ambro25

Best map and place for AA I've always found is in Op Cleansweep, forward MEC base (closest to US start point): wide FOV, fairly flat ground, good vis on about 270 degs but remaining 90 degs is steep embankment right behind the AA post (so no bombings from behind) - I've taken down my fair share of F15s (2 + an assist), AH1s (at least 3) and UH60s (at least 5, 3 of which full ) in that one, never elsewhere though... well, bar a few on Wake Island'07 (which also has nice open FOVs).

IG-Calibre

spooky donkey wrote:

I dont think I ever took out a plane before and it wasent from the lack of trying, I always thought the ease of repair a little mad even when I did damage them they got the helth back really easy.

Now c'mon it was never really easy - after 2 solid hit's you needed to fly 4 maybe 5 passes to restore your health & that takes at least dbl the time it would take to repair a helo with the same damage. As it is now you'd need to flly 8 maybe more passovers..

stag39

IG-Calibre wrote:

Now c'mon it was never really easy - after 2 solid hit's you needed to fly 4 maybe 5 passes to restore your health & that takes at least dbl the time it would take to repair a helo with the same damage. As it is now you'd need to flly 8 maybe more passovers..

yes u skyjockeys arnt holy or jewish enough:p

yankinlk

RopeDrink wrote:

Invincible planes? Not on your nelly, chum.

Taken down planes with nothing more than a shotgun before...

I doubt that. you got credit for being the last to fire at the plane that got destroyed more like.

Zen 2nd

Well actually if you hit the missiles under the wings of the planes they can explode.

AnCapaillMor

It's possible alrite, never did it with a plane, but for the luagh i fired one round from an SVD into a blackhawk and got credit for it, a blackhawk has waay more armour and hp. I'd say there was some damage on the plane.

R0ot

projectmayhem wrote:

wake island will be interesting as planes/choppers were the best means of attack there

Played wake with a few other nrg members tonight, was the first game i had with the new patch, first kill was a blackhawk. Easist kill of an air vehicle ive ever had in BF2. Tried out the new sniper rifle, its nice. Saw the p90 but havent tried it, unfortunately i have to hope for a pick up of these weapons as im 8000 points off my next rank increase so no 2 free unlocks for me just yet. But im quite content to stick with my m24 or equivilant. As for flying heli's i have to say there were alot less kills happening on wake from heli attacks, planes were still a bit of a pain in the a$$ though. Only got in the gunner of a heli so far, and thats all ill probably try, im really prefering infantry atm so ill keep my feet on the ground for now. Any comfirmed dates for Euro force yet?

RopeDrink wrote:

You weren't there, chummy. Nobody was... I can't prove it at all, so believe what you like but I managed to pump the full clip of auto-shotgun shells from the MEC shotgun into a low flying plane that attempted to swoop / gun me down and though twice when it got a little low. As it pulled up and sailed overhead, I flayed it and it went booyakasha. The debris nearly kicked my ass, however.

Ive seen stuff like that happen before, its a rare occurance to have a pilot stupid enough to do it but that doesn't mean there are stupid pilots out there. wd Rope man

Tempus Fugit

IG-Calibre wrote:

well things just got a whole lot interesting in the air!!

When ground AA locks you it pretty much hit's every time as does air-2-air missiles on the plus side then also always hit choppers when fired at them too

You have no idea how happy that makes me

AnCapaillMor

RopeDrink wrote:

Anyways, it doesn't matter anymore... Twas the most flukey kill I executed at the start of my BF2 career. I've pulled off far superior in the meantime

Go on then....

][cEMAN**

More problems with the patch. AA missiles are TOO good.
You catch someone on a turn in a plane and they're dead. Means flares are useless now - why bother? They'll just wait another half a second and then fire off 2 missiles - both will hit.

Linebackers are now god in maps like Kubra - you can't get close enough to them to shoot them down, unless they're distracted. You can't get away from them fast enough, and even if you do, they'll still have missiles chasing you till you're dead.

Forget that - the GUNS on them are rediculous now. Infact I don't even think it's the guns. This game has just killed the air factor.

I've shot down 2 planes so far tonight with the regular BF2 sniper unlock. I've shot a pilot out of a chopper and made the chopper crash causing the other guy to die - with that sniper rifle. I hate to see what the MORE accurate one will be like.

I've shot down a Blackhawk with the sniper rifle tonight - the armour is TOO WEAK! OK I agree it used to be rediculous - 3+ SRAWs to take a blackhawk down. OK - it takes 3 to kill a tank, and you can't fly a tank with those size of chopper blades!! But reducing it to about the same armour capacity as a vodnik? They should have at least brought it down to APC capacity - right now a DPV can take you down before its guns even heat up, and you can NOT fly fast enough to get behind cover or out of the way. In a transport chopper you can't repair fast enough even with 2 engineers to stay alive and get out of there, nevermind hang about and rattle the ground like you used to.

Less chopper missiles - i'm cool with that so far. Seen no problem, but the fact that ground troops with RIFLES can take out airborn armoured vehicles - WTFlyingFeck?!?!

They're gonna have to get another patch out and fix that fast or it won't be worth going into the air....

...oh and another thing - AA turrets don't always show up now when targeting ground defense. Means you can be shot (missiles are so fast you don't see them coming) and you can't work out even after 3/4 passes where you're being shot from, so you can't do anything about it.

The more companies try to fix games based on what little kids whine about, without REAL testing, then the more they're going to **** up and kill the game.

Zillah

I got a very angry complaint.

A few of you will remember when we spotted a rocket going through a jeep? Well its happened me three times just tonight. Once, at point blank range as it was about to run me down, I think "Chicken is it?!", because its a light jeep, one hit kill. About fifteen feet from me I fire at it, and it passes right through the bonet and explodes on the ground and I get run over.

It also happened with the grenade launcher. I was trying to sieze the centre hill in zatar, and I hear a jeep coming. I duck and wait for it to park. Then I pop up and BANG grenade passes right through the jeep and explodes behind it.

Wtf did they do to Bf with this new patch...

stag39

saw a transport chopper passing by pumped 3 shots into it from a shotgun (engineer i was)... down it goes....3 kills...:p

jonski

' wrote:

[cEMAN**']More problems with the patch. AA missiles are TOO good.
You catch someone on a turn in a plane and they're dead. Means flares are useless now - why bother? They'll just wait another half a second and then fire off 2 missiles - both will hit.

Thought this too after my first few maps after the patch , took down a few planes and choppers easily , but then today on 64 player gulf of oman , the jets were back on it again , using new tactics , flying faster and lower , targeting the AA first ,( although to me it looked more like always ) . So I do think that the pilots will adapt , don't think they will dominate like the used to though .

Zillah wrote:

I got a very angry complaint.

A few of you will remember when we spotted a rocket going through a jeep? Well its happened me three times just tonight.

Normally I write this one off as the old "through the windscreen but you didn't realise" , but I know you have more experience than that , PLUS , both myself and another clan member today had what seemed like AT rockets pass through APC's ( not at the same time ) . Side on target , and at close to medium range . Maybe it's a graphics bug ? the target not being exactly where we think it is .?


Edit: just came off the EA forums where the admin there was saying that they have had reports of AT rockets seeming to pass through vehicals............so i am not going mad , well maybe , but not because of that .

Pyr0

' wrote:

[cEMAN**']
I've shot down a Blackhawk with the sniper rifle tonight - the armour is TOO WEAK! OK I agree it used to be rediculous - 3+ SRAWs to take a blackhawk down. OK - it takes 3 to kill a tank, and you can't fly a tank with those size of chopper blades!! But reducing it to about the same armour capacity as a vodnik? They should have at least brought it down to APC capacity - right now a DPV can take you down before its guns even heat up, and you can NOT fly fast enough to get behind cover or out of the way. In a transport chopper you can't repair fast enough even with 2 engineers to stay alive and get out of there, nevermind hang about and rattle the ground like you used to..

Have you ever imagined how much punishment a Blackhawk in real life could take ? I'm sure it wouldn't be much. I think they're trying to make the game a little more realistic when it comes to damage and targeting, which doesn't bother me at all, adds a bit more skill trying to avoid the missles. The blackhawk now would be used as a rush tactic I'd say rather than wiping a map clean of infantry.

Zillah

Pyr0 wrote:

Have you ever imagined how much punishment a Blackhawk in real life could take ?

I'd say that unless a rotor was hit, a blackhawk would take quite a pounding.

Edit: just came off the EA forums where the admin there was saying that they have had reports of AT rockets seeming to pass through vehicals............so i am not going mad , well maybe , but not because of that .

Worrying this is...a disturbance in the net I sense...go to these forums I will.

Jumpy

Zillah wrote:

I'd say that unless a rotor was hit, a blackhawk would take quite a pounding.



Worrying this is...a disturbance in the net I sense...go to these forums I will.

Its a flying vehicle, a rocket would put it on the ground easily. A shotgun would barely scratch it though.

Tempus Fugit

Seems to me the only people moaning are plane and helo wh*res :P

Pyr0

Jumpy wrote:

Its a flying vehicle, a rocket would put it on the ground easily. A shotgun would barely scratch it though.

Well I wasn't really talking about a shotgun, more a couple of .50 cal rounds really.

Vegeta

Pyr0 wrote:

Well I wasn't really talking about a shotgun, more a couple of .50 cal rounds really.

Yeah if you're firing .50 cal rounds at the blackhawk she's comin down, it may take a few but twud defo come down.

Was also thinking about the sniper rifle system in the game. I think one shot from the .50 cal rifle should critically wound you for about 60 seconds giving the medics lots of time to help you but also give you the option of just clickin a button to accept the death. Cos if you got hit anywhere with one of those rounds say goodbye

Zillah

Tempus Fugit wrote:

Seems to me the only people moaning are plane and helo wh*res :P

Seems to me that you havn't been paying much attention.

uberpixie

Vegeta wrote:

Yeah if you're firing .50 cal rounds at the blackhawk she's comin down, it may take a few but twud defo come down.

Was also thinking about the sniper rifle system in the game. I think one shot from the .50 cal rifle should critically wound you for about 60 seconds giving the medics lots of time to help you but also give you the option of just clickin a button to accept the death. Cos if you got hit anywhere with one of those rounds say goodbye

I think the current system is fair for the .50 cal.

1 shot beats you to within an inch of your life, if you already have a bit of health off you die. Thats fair. The gun remains very powerful but still gives you a small chance (if you have full health).


With your system if a medic did show up to save you, he would just get killed in one shot too :-)

uberpixie

Zillah wrote:

Seems to me that you havn't been paying much attention.

Post patch helis can still dominate, patch just gives the grunts on the ground a fighting chance when some base raping wh ore comes in.

A good pilot in a heli is still a pain to kill.

Zillah

Sure blackhawks are flying vehicles, but that doesn't mean that they're made of paper. There is a good reason that they're the premiere US transport chopper. Helicopters are flying tanks. I'd say we might all be suprised at just how much punishment one could take.

uberpixie

Zillah wrote:

Sure blackhawks are flying vehicles, but that doesn't mean that they're made of paper. There is a good reason that they're the premiere US transport chopper. Helicopters are flying tanks. I'd say we might all be suprised at just how much punishment one could take.

People in iraq have taken down black hawks with 1 rpg.
(they get under the black hawks flight path as they are coming in for a land or have just taken off)

Blackhawks aren't the most heavily armoured chopper. They aren't made of paper, but they ain't tanks either.

Only 2 choppers that come close to that description are the mi24 hind or the apache.

Granted I'm sure choppers take much more punishment than we would believe, a good missile/rpg is enough to mess em up good.

Considering RPGs could maim the old school tanks with metal armour imagine what they do to a chopper which has much less.....

god bless google.
" The UH-60A can lift an entire 11-man fully-equipped infantry squad in most weather conditions. Both the pilot and co-pilot are provided with armor-protective seats. Protective armor on the Black Hawk can withstand hits from 23mm shells"

Zillah

uberpixie wrote:

People in iraq have taken down black hawks with 1 rpg.
(they get under the black hawks flight path as they are coming in for a land or have just taken off)

Like I said, it probably hit a rotor or a weakspot. BF doesn't account for weakspots.

Protective armor on the Black Hawk can withstand hits from 23mm shells

:cool:

EDIT:

hey aren't made of paper, but they ain't tanks either.

I mentioned flying tanks because most people think "flying craft", meaning planes and helicopters. A helicopter is closer to a tank than a plane in many ways. One way is their capacity for armor. Jets don't really get armor, helicopters do.

AnCapaillMor

Big difference on Air to air, doing daging oilfields just now and shot down 8 copters in a fairly quick round in the SU-34 then F-18(server made me swap teams halfways hate that), 3 is the most i ever managed before, it was pretty easy to take them down too. did'nt get much air to air combat or AA fire, one thing that has'nt changed is i'm my one worst enemy in planes, ran up the ass of a blownup blawkhawk and crashed into trees the others.

uberpixie

Zillah wrote:

Like I said, it probably hit a rotor or a weakspot. BF doesn't account for weakspots.

:cool:

EDIT:

I mentioned flying tanks because most people think "flying craft", meaning planes and helicopters. A helicopter is closer to a tank than a plane in many ways. One way is their capacity for armor. Jets don't really get armor, helicopters do.

An rpg that can maim old school tanks with over a ton of steel armour, will eat a heli that has much less armour, regardless of where it hits it.

A blackhawk will not have half as much armour as an old school tank.

It's not designed to tank shells, direct rpgs etc...

It's main goal in life is carrying men: carrying men and lots of kit means less armour. Not taking on tanks or people with rpgs.

Armour on a plane/heli depends on it's role.

Jets in general don't get armour as they fly high above the battle field and rely on their counter measures and speed to get out of trouble.

However you do have jets such as the AH-10 warthog and the russain SU frogfoot that are geared to attacking land targets low over the battle field and are very heavily armoured at the expense of speed.

All in all the damage model in BF2 is unrealistic, but then again it's a game.

Thats why a heli can take 3 anti tank rockets and get damaged by HMG's.

We could argue round in circles about this all day :-)