Volvo SE 2.0D or toyota avensis 2.0 D4D

EIN

hi
i have a choice of either of
Volvo S40 SE 2.0D or toyota avensis 2.0 D4D Luna

which is best, whats the s40 like for resale?

is the s40 any good

AlanD

The S40 is just a fabulous car. It's based on the new Ford Focus so it handles well. The engine is a Ford/PSA joint venture so it's a very reliable, quiet and powerful diesel that really is a pleasure to drive. Spec levels in the Volvo are also excellent. The SE will include leather heater seats, cruise control, dual climate contro and more. The seats are comfortable too. It holds it's value really well since this latest S40 was launched. Volvo are on the up. And check out that interior....the dash is truly amazing.

The Avensis.....personally, I hate them. Very boring, unimpressive diesels, average handling, poor interior. I just don't rate them, but it's personal choice.

Henry Ford III

New?

S40 is smaller, but well built. Residuals are predicted to be quite good.

Toyota will be reliable but mind numbingly boring. Like driving a kitchen appliance, like a fridge perhaps?

maidhc

I really will have to learn how to know if a car is "boring", or precisely what a volvo has that can possibly make it exciting (apart from being a focus with a strange dash...). They are really just two repmobiles, the nicer of which IMO is the Avensis.

I have never driven the new model, but the d4d in the old shape cannot be considered "unimpressive", although I can imagine the size of the new one takes from the performance a bit.

The volvo is a focus, and unlike the old s40 which didnt look like a mitsubishi, the new volvo makes no effort to hide its underpinnings. I cant imagine it will hold its value as well as the avensis, but I stand to be corrected.

colm_mcm

but the Volvo is more expensive at €34,465 wx works, and won't be as sought after second hand as the 1.6 Diesel s40.
If you're gonna spend €35,000 al told, why not go for the excellent Avensis 2.2 D-4D 150. absolutely superb drive, buckets of pulling power.

Why would you spend 35 grand on a "Focus"?
The Avensis has the same crash score as the S40 (34 points)

Safety is volvos only selling point

bazz26

EIN wrote:

hi
i have a choice of either of
Volvo S40 SE 2.0D or toyota avensis 2.0 D4D Luna

which is best, whats the s40 like for resale?

is the s40 any good

Every person has different opinions on cars. The best thing to do is test drive both cars rather than listening to comments probably only overheard that were made by J Clarkson one Sunday evening. This "it will bore you" comment really makes me laugh. I have not driven the Volvo so I will not comment directly on it. I have been driving an Avensis petrol for the last three years and find it a grand car, it is safe, comfortable, reliable, well equipped for the price and has plenty of poke. It suits my needs perfectly. You need to decide what you want from a car and which of these suits those needs best.

Best of luck in making your choice.

colm_mcm

Theres a lot of Avensis bashing done by the motoring journalists. unless a car has masses of lift-off oversteer, it's described as a "dull handler"

Funny that the Avensis has a 30% market share of it's segment then......

Henry Ford III

Only in Ireland however.

In Europe you usually only see an Avensis driven as a mini cab. They are thoroughly competant but dull beyond belief.

This hang up some of you guys have about shared chassis technology puzzles me. Is a Jaguar X Type a Mondeo in drag for example? It shares the same chassis and some engines. Is a Saab 9-3 the same as a Vectra?

An S40/V50 and a Focus are cousins, and nothing more.

Just my 2p worth.

colm_mcm

Henry Ford III wrote:

In Europe you usually only see an Avensis driven as a mini cab. They are thoroughly competant but dull beyond belief.

This hang up some of you guys have about shared chassis technology puzzles me. Is a Jaguar X Type a Mondeo in drag for example? It shares the same chassis and some engines. Is a Saab 9-3 the same as a Vectra?

Just my 2p worth.

Firstly on Toyota only being popular in Ireland, they will produce more cars this year than anyone else! Minicab drivers drive Toyotas because they're comfortable and rarely break down!

Why would you buy a Volvo that shares most components with a humble Focus, Badge engineering is making idiots out of people

People will pay 35k + for an A4 with poverty spec, when the Passat is newer, bigger and better equipped.

And as for the 9-3 being the same as a Vectra, It's like the Vectra, only less reliable!

bazz26

Henry Ford III wrote:

Only in Ireland however.

In Europe you usually only see an Avensis driven as a mini cab. They are thoroughly competant but dull beyond belief.

Over in the UK all you see is Focus and Mondeos up and down the motorways all day long, doesn't mean they are dull repmobiles does it?

There are alot of Mercs going around as taxis across Europe also, does this mean they are dull?

Again unless one has actually driven any of these cars it doesn't make sense to make generalisations on them.

Lex Luthor

AlanD wrote:

....the dash is truly amazing.

I was actually considering a V50 until I saw the dash on the S40 and nearly puked. It's horrible. There's no hiding the Ford interior here in the buttons & switchgear and I thought the centre console was ridiculous. The dials aswell were very Mitsibushi.

Then again I'm coming from a 156, where no interior comes close to...:D

But the owner loves it and he had the previous S40 and he loved that, but reckons this one's even better, but he drove a Carisma for years so he has no taste.

colm_mcm

Lex Luthor wrote:

but he drove a Carisma for years so he has no taste.

what a daft name for a car devoid of charisma!

EIN

well i had ordered an avensis last october, but i couldnt get a definate delivery date. the S40 2.0D has a good spec and 136 bhp i think it has plenty of poke...

the s40 doesent in the slightest look like or feel like a focus.. and besides its much more up market than a focus..

most of the reviews i have read say that this is a good car..

http://www.ciao.co.uk/Volvo_S40_2005__Review_5523339

"Summing up, the S40 2.0D SE is a super motor, handsome, excellent value for money and an inexpensive rival to other premium badges. "

colm_mcm

Volvo s40



Ford Focus,



more than a passing resemblance

EIN

suppose you could draw same conclusions with the new bmw 3 series
from behind it looks like the mitsubishi C...

neways,, the s40 is well spec'd for the price..

having owned about 15 new toyotas in the last 10 years or so i can say that toyotas if you want a high level of spec then its a special order... even if you only want cruise control (€400) .. 3+mths lead time. they are built well.
reliable , plain, nothing special....
but these days most new cars are built well.. and mostly reliable.

if u want a 2.2 avensis diesel its a special order at the moment.

i think the new s40 looks well, has the toys i need, and the power too.
its a solid heavy car... residual values are supposed to be good.. have a look at carzone,,

colm_mcm

I've got a 2.2 Avensis in stock. as do other dealers

maidhc

The old 3-Series looked very similar to the old avensis in many respects, but somehow the BMW always looked "classy" while the avensis was "dull" (I would hazard a guess both were equally conservative).

EIN

howya i didnt realise that there were car dealers posting here, suppose that puts a different slant on things,, yeah the 2.2 avensis is supposed to be nice,


but the vrt jacks up the price a fair bit. anyone i spoke to about a 2.2 avensis told me it was a special order.

EIN

i just read some horror stories bout servicing costs on the s40
can anyone tell me what the costs are to service the S40 2.0D se?

i have had a fairfew toyotas and never paid more than 150 euros!

it seems a bit much..

700 euro seems excessive....

Mailman

Wouldn't it be better to get a Focus and spec it up to hilt until the full allowance is exhausted. I wonder do they do a HUD for the Focus : )
forgetting about the Avensis I can't see what the S40 has got going for it when the Ford is the same car underneath.
A TDci Focus stuffed to the roof with toys wouldn't be such a bad thing.

EIN

Mailman wrote:

Wouldn't it be better to get a Focus and spec it up to hilt until the full allowance is exhausted. I wonder do they do a HUD for the Focus : )
forgetting about the Avensis I can't see what the S40 has got going for it when the Ford is the same car underneath.
A TDci Focus stuffed to the roof with toys wouldn't be such a bad thing.

an S40 is not a focus.. its aimed to compete against the 3 series.

it has a very good spec level on the SE

what other cars are an option that come with leather and cruise control?
for around 34k cash

Henry Ford III

bazz26 wrote:

Over in the UK all you see is Focus and Mondeos up and down the motorways all day long, doesn't mean they are dull repmobiles does it?

There are alot of Mercs going around as taxis across Europe also, does this mean they are dull?

Again unless one has actually driven any of these cars it doesn't make sense to make generalisations on them.

I've driven all of them so feel well qualified to express my opinion.

Motorway bashing and cab duties point to reliability and nothing else.

Focus and Mondeo are the best handling cars in their class. Toyota Corolla and Avensis are comfortable and reliable, but despertely uninvolving and uninspiring to drive.

Toyota have made some excellent drivers cars btw - Celica, MR2 etc.

Mailman

See this is the nub of the problem.
The S40 aspires to be something but it's hard to look beyond it's origins which is the same floorplan as a Focus. The focus is already a very good car; it was probably top of it's class until the new civic arrived so why bother with an S40.

EIN

well with the s40 all the toys come as standard..!!

with other makes these are extras! and u cant buy them off the shelf

suppose thats the attraction and they are readily available..

the 2.2 avensis lunas seem readily available at the moment..
but they dont have leather or cruise control

Henry Ford III

Shared technology in engines, gearboxes, & chassis is something we have to accept.

To some extent Ford = Volvo = Mazda.

and Audi = VW = Seat = Skoda.

These cars can be engineered to perform and behave very differently however.

My current C-Max for example has the same chassis as the new Focus ST, which in turn has a Volvo derived engine. The cars are as different as chalk and cheese.

bazz26

Henry Ford III wrote:

I've driven all of them so feel well qualified to express my opinion.

Motorway bashing and cab duties point to reliability and nothing else.

Focus and Mondeo are the best handling cars in their class. Toyota Corolla and Avensis are comfortable and reliable, but despertely uninvolving and uninspiring to drive.

Toyota have made some excellent drivers cars btw - Celica, MR2 etc.

I have also driven a few Focus and Mondeo rental cars over the years and my Avensis handles every bit as good as either of them. I found very little difference in the handling. The new Avensis is equally as refined to drive as the Mondeo imo.

mondeoman

ford spare parts don't cost an 'arm & a leg' ,most of the time they are cheaper than the motor factors:eek: .genuine jap parts cost a fortune:rolleyes:

Henry Ford III

bazz26 wrote:

I have also driven a few Focus and Mondeo rental cars over the years and my Avensis handles every bit as good as either of them. I found very little difference in the handling. The new Avensis is equally as refined to drive as the Mondeo imo.

Says volumes about your driving skills

Look up www.parkers.co.uk and compare Focus vs. Corolla, and Mondeo vs. Avensis in relation to handling.

I couldn't have put those conclusions better myself.

Henry Ford III

Focus gets 5 stars for handling, Corolla gets 3.5.

Mondeo gets 4.5 stars, and Avensis gets 3.

Comment on Avensis "No match for a Ford Mondeo, Mazda6 or Honda Accord. The steering feels vague at times and the car feels bulky - but it can still be rewarding. Gear changes could be a little more precise. Comfortable ride is good on all road surfaces and best on the motorway if it weren't for the noise."

PaulieC

I've just got rid of a 05 S40 SE last month (exponentially expanding family forced sale) and and had a Focus before that. While the two have similar handling traits, that's where the similarities ended. The Volvo was specced up to the gills - leather, cruise, 13-speaker 6-cd stereo, automatic everything, dual zone climate, 17in wheels - all as standard. In comparison, the Avensis has little of this kit as standard, although it is a class bigger (D-class Avensis Vs C 1/3-class s40).
I looked at both when buying the Volvo and although I really did like the Avensis, it was a bit too big and I was getting more for my money in the Volvo.

And for those who say it's just a Focus, it really isn't - it shares a chassis. The Bugatti Veyron has an engine that is made up of two passat engines...does that make it a volkswagen? And it's not just badge engineering - Volvo and Ford were individual marques for a long time before Ford took a stake in Volvo..

bazz26

Henry Ford III wrote:

Says volumes about your driving skills

Look up www.parkers.co.uk and compare Focus vs. Corolla, and Mondeo vs. Avensis in relation to handling.

I couldn't have put those conclusions better myself.

You seem to know everything :rolleyes:

Don't believe everything you read on the internet.

EIN

well i have decided to go with the s40. loads more extras for money.

imo it doesent look like a ford. it has more class.. more toys too.

its a solid car..

bazz26

EIN wrote:

well i have decided to go with the s40. loads more extras for money.

imo it doesent look like a ford. it has more class.. more toys too.

its a solid car..

Best of luck with your choice.

Henry Ford III

bazz26 wrote:

You seem to know everything :rolleyes:

Don't believe everything you read on the internet.

I'm a veritable mine of sometimes useless information

Parkers is an excellent site, with geniunely informed and impartial views.

I agree with them on the handling issues of these particular cars, but not on everything.

FuzzyZoeller

Well for what its worth, as an owner of an new S40 from sep 04, I can't fault it in any way. Service cost at 20k was €350 at main dealer.

Oh, had the pleasure of hitting a focus side on. Needless to say, I wasn't to happy having to test the volvo to that extent, but at least I wasn't the one in a ditch!

colm_mcm

As far as I can see, Ford and Peugeot can do no wrong in the eyes of the British motoring press

glynf

FuzzyZoeller wrote:

Well for what its worth, as an owner of an new S40 from sep 04, I can't fault it in any way. Service cost at 20k was €350 at main dealer.

Oh, had the pleasure of hitting a focus side on. Needless to say, I wasn't to happy having to test the volvo to that extent, but at least I wasn't the one in a ditch!

Lol. got a 2.0DSE in aug. 04, and some airhead ran into the back of me at 10-15mph while i was stopped at lights 4 months later.
She was 'looking for a rattle in her passenger door'(her words), and mangled her corsa, could'nt open her driver door properly.
My back bumper and the substructure bit was replaced, but apart from that it was perfect, no other damage, so they're well built motors in that sense.
Best of luck with yours EIN:D

lomb

nice car especially in se form, great dash, great looks,great handling, great seats, what more does anyone want?

Andy_R

I was in the market for a new car to replace my 307. I intended buying the S40 but the Diesel engine is really noisy in it compared to the 407. In the end I couldn't live with another car without a clutch footrest so struck the Volvo off the list. I had a footrest on my previous '02 Civic 3 door and while you may not miss it during the course of a test drive you will curse its absense on every journey over 30 minutes after buying!! After a lot of looking around I ordered a new Civic 1.8 petrol.

If it was me I'd look at the 407 or Mazda 6... The Mazda might be getting on in years but its a class car, my mother managed to kill a 95 Carina E and 00 Avensis but her current 03 Mazda 6 is still like a new car. Apart from its durability its a brilliant car to drive!

Henry Ford III

Andy_R wrote:

I was in the market for a new car to replace my 307. I intended buying the S40 but the Diesel engine is really noisy in it compared to the 407.

That's odd. Aren't they identical engines? Ford/Peugeot developed TDCI/HDI units

bazz26

Yes, the Volvo S40/Peug 407/Citroen C5 all share the same 1.6 110bhp and 2.0 136bhp PSA HDi diesel engines. The S40 is slightly heavier than the 407/C5 but performance and economy are almost identical. The difference is noise level may be down to the level of sound proofing made by the different manufactures.

The Mondeo Ghia uses the same 2.0 136bhp engine and is not that noisy especially when it is on the move.

unkel

bazz26 wrote:

The S40 is slightly heavier than the 407/C5

The S40 is a lot lighter than 407 / C5 which is not surprising because it is a full size smaller

bazz26

unkel wrote:

The S40 is a lot lighter than 407 / C5 which is not surprising because it is a full size smaller

You are correct but there is not alot in it:

Volvo S40 2.0D SE : 1,930 KG
Peug 407 2.0 HDi SV: 2,080 KG
Citroen C5 2.0 HDi Exclusiv: 2,006 KG

unkel

bazz26 wrote:

You are correct but there is not alot in it:

Volvo S40 2.0D SE : 1,930 KG
Peug 407 2.0 HDi SV: 2,080 KG
Citroen C5 2.0 HDi Exclusiv: 2,006 KG

Lol, where did you get those figures? If they were true, than all three are heavier than my 7-series

Must be the maximum laden weight or sumfin...

bazz26

From carzone:

http://www.carzone.ie/newcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=Details&vehicle_id=75979620051101&strSpecs=SSCIRL2002

Weights: gross vehicle weight rating (kg): 2,006, gross vehicle weight rating (lbs): 4,422, kerb weight (kg): 1,486, kerb weight (lbs): 3,276, gross trailer weight braked (kg): 1,600 and gross trailer weight braked (lbs): 3,527

Maybe I should have been looking at the kerb weight.

unkel

Weights can be measured differently, e.g. with or without driver and with or without (half) a tank of petrol. I always use the weight of an empty car for comparisons:

All new and all 2.0D base models:

407 - 1480kg
C5 - 1461kg
S40 - 1363kg

The weight of the S40 is about the same as that of a Ford Focus BTW - no coincidence there

EIN

well people have different opinions bout different things, cars, women etc
they pay their money and make their choice...

mazda6, avensis, mondeo,, are very plentiful on the road, good cars , but as standard you cannot buy one fully loaded off the shelf (without a 3mth wait),, most are special order if you want leather etc etc..

a bog basic avensis looks the same as a high specd one.

the selling point of the s40 is that it comes with all these extras as standard.
mind you its a bit more expensive than the above, (cash price) but worth it.
and the 2.0D has a nice bit of power..

unkel

EIN wrote:

the selling point of the s40 is that it comes with all these extras as standard

The selling point of the s40 is that it is a big car with all these extras for about the same price as other big cars without these extras while it really only is a small car

Those marketing dudes in Ford sure deserve their bonus schemes - fair play to them

EIN

well unkel so tell us what you drive?

neways sure ill see if i like the s40... maybe next year ill go for the S80 !!!!!!!!!!...:eek: :eek: :eek:

SURE TIS ONLY MONEY


END OF THREAD,................................................:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

lomb

In all fairness unkel, it looks a lot better than any focus, it has a volvo badge which is worth something, its interior is syled by someone like bang and oulfsen, it is a focus, but then again it isnt, and its not that much more than a focus either. should keep its money better also. id definately consider one if i was in the market.

maidhc

lomb wrote:

In all fairness unkel, it looks a lot better than any focus

I would prefer the Focus saloon tbh. The s40 is a very small car in comparison to the Avensis et al. It is a lot more expensive than a focus and will be worth more at resale, but I suspect the volvo will have higher depreciation (just as the Audi A4 does have in comparison to the Passat).

The one thing you find out fast when looking for a second hand car is that "spec" doesn't affect price, and that very few people are willing to pay a cent extra on a 3yo car for air con/alloys etc.... which is great if you want a high spec car on the cheap!