Is it dirty?

backflip

Ok, lets jus say you were in a street fight, wud u resort to eye gaughing, biting, grabbing balls, kicking on the ground etc? Or do you think there are barriers? Or is it just do whatever it takes 2 win as quickly as possible?

Thomas_S_Hunterson

Never be the first to resort to such dirty tactics. However if your opponent pulls a knife or other weapon or resorts to these tactics themselves , you are fully justified in usingthem also

pma-ire

backflip wrote:

Ok, lets jus say you were in a street fight, wud u resort to eye gaughing, biting, grabbing balls, kicking on the ground etc? Or do you think there are barriers? Or is it just do whatever it takes 2 win as quickly as possible?

You must defend yourself with reasonable and necessary force to remove yourself from the situation.

What that is depends on what you deem to be a threat to your welbeing at that time!

"I was in fear of my life Garda"

There is no winning just getting out safe. But you could loose big so do you want to take the chance to be fair??

dlofnep

If you're in danger, worry about your safety first, the attackers second.

backflip

Well i personally would 1st of all try avoid fighting in the first place but if in danger i'd try finish it as quick as possible so d balls n throat would be my first targets then turn and run. But once i got in a fight with a loada travvelers at a disco. One of them wanted to fight 1 on 1 and they just wouldn't stop hassling me. Eventually they followed me outside and made a ring(the ****ers hang around in groups of 30!) And me and him were in the middle. I thoght the best ting 2 do would be to jus stand up and trade boxes because i didn't want 2 grapple and piss dem off as i was seriously out numbered. And i wasn't even so sure i should try and win because then dey'd all jump me. But afta bout a min off pretty even boxin they all jus jumped me neway. So that plan really didn't work 2 well. I got away though handy enough in the end! But my mam didn't see it lik that! What wud u reccomend in that type of situation??

fianna.5u.com

Firstly, no I wouldn't resort to those tactics.

Second, if I was you I'd start hanging around in different places, avoid fights, and maybe enjoy the finer things in life. Oh yeah and maybe call the cops when a bunch of 30 people decide to fight you, their number is 999, put that on speed dial if you intend to keep doing the things your doing.

Peace

Le Rack

backflip wrote:

Ok, lets jus say you were in a street fight, wud u resort to eye gaughing, biting, grabbing balls, kicking on the ground etc? Or do you think there are barriers? Or is it just do whatever it takes 2 win as quickly as possible?

It depends on the fight. If Iw as fighting another girl, I wouldn't box her, I'd slap scratch, pull hair, maybe a few light punches, but if I was fighting a fella I'd be punching and throwin round houses all the way! Then if it was a fight of self defence, then, take out the knees, eyes, and nuts. Run. That's how we're trained in self defence, if they can't see you they can't harm you, if they can't chase after you they can't harm you.

Gaillimhtaibhse

backflip wrote:

Ok, lets jus say you were in a street fight, wud u resort to eye gaughing, biting, grabbing balls, kicking on the ground etc? Or do you think there are barriers? Or is it just do whatever it takes 2 win as quickly as possible?

If a lass, then whatever it takes to defend yourself. Master instructor told women to: (1) first, try to talk your way out; (2) if that doesn't work, then "hit fast and hard, then run!" I will not mention where he suggested hiting the lads...

Hagar

At the end of any fight there are two people, the victor and the vanquished.
Nobody ever asks the victor how he won.

Le Rack

In a street fight, the "how" will determine whether or not the victor is going to jail.

Hagar

Le Rack wrote:

In a street fight, the "how" will determine whether or not the victor is going to jail.

As opposed to hospital or the morgue.

"I would rather be tried by twelve men than be carried by six"

Le Rack

Hagar wrote:

As opposed to hospital or the morgue.

"I would rather be tried by twelve men than be carried by six"

Yeah but they're is self defence and there is murder, get the guy off you and "disarm" him so to speak, never upon never kill. And atop that, if you did get into that situation you will be tried under much stricter laws because you area trained martial artist you should be able to get yourself out of that sort of situation without doing too much damage to yourself or others.

Cabelo

I'd say it's been pretty securely summed up by now but I'd like to say "Yes, it is dirty," and add that there's nothing wrong with that. Fighting dirty is a perfectly beautiful thing. I think people could enjoy it. I'd not go for the balls (I like to think) because I've felt that. It doesn't seem so much an immediate deterent. You'd have a VERY angry and fully able man for a minute or so.

Also (smee targets Le Rack), why in the name of God would you fight a woman differently? "Oh I'll disregard all training in favour of a good bitch fight!" That is the dumbest thing I have ever heard. Well... it's close enough. I also like the idea that you'd throw roundhouses all over the place fighting a guy...Sweetheart... I hate to say it but I don't think it'd work so well.

Also, great for a laugh;

Le Rack wrote:

... never upon never kill.

pma-ire

fianna.5u.com wrote:

Firstly, no I wouldn't resort to those tactics.

Second, if I was you I'd start hanging around in different places, avoid fights, and maybe enjoy the finer things in life. Oh yeah and maybe call the cops when a bunch of 30 people decide to fight you, their number is 999, put that on speed dial if you intend to keep doing the things your doing.

Due to the fact that meself and the Mrs don't go out in town anymore, and I hav'int worked in the hostile environment of the "Hospitality Industry" for some years now! I have not been in a real situation in quite a while.

But sometimes people end up in sh!tty places that they can't remove themselves from without something sparking off!

Millionaire

Yes, if the attack is serious enough or so violent...

Use these technqiues.

Than means for example, multiple attackers, attacker has weapon, or is such a big violent Mother Effer and is pounding your head into the footpath, use do it and do it First, do it Fast and do it Fookin Ferocious.

The 3 examples I give, have happened me, very violent and very real attacks,and I had to use the afore mentioned tactics to survive.

if someone spills a pint on you my accident and gives you a bit of lip, and if you use techniques like that...your no better than a criminal.

In perspective...they have their place. and if I was in the situation again I would use them again in a heart beat!

anyway if you examine traditional martial arts..be it karate or kung fu and their kata or forms,,you will find all these techniques in there.

padraigcarroll

only good thing i ever got from kenpo was eye strikes.

i've stopped 3 fights with eye gouging.

3 important things for fighting, head buts, eye gouge, throw the first punch/strike.

if someone is attacking u, they are trying to kill you, even if its over a pint, so.....f 'em.

Cabelo

padraigcarroll wrote:

if someone is attacking u, they are trying to kill you

Maybe they just thought you needed a good hiding...

Mikel

And atop that, if you did get into that situation you will be tried under much stricter laws because you area trained martial artist you should be able to get yourself out of that sort of situation without doing too much damage to yourself or others.

haha, what rubbish! As a "trained" martial artist you are of course invincible. The fact that you spend a couple of hours a week in the local club learning "roundhouses" means that different laws apply to you do they? What is it like being a lethal weapon?
You do what you can to get away, simple.

Hagar

Le Rack wrote:

you will be tried under much stricter laws because you area trained martial artist

What makes you think I have any training? Apart from Army un-armed combat training many many years ago I have no training whatsoever. The very few fights I was ever in were brought to swift ends by so called dirty moves. I'm glad to say I walked away afterwards every time.

Exon

If you start trouble with me i'll do anything, i'd hit someone 3 foot smaller than me with a bottle even if I was winning. I might sound like a coward but i've never started a fight in my life and if you start one you're going to get it

If someone attacks you just hit them as hard as possible in the head/chest area with something and **** the consequences!

And for anyone who's concerned about killing someone unintentionally who attacks you you'd be out in less than two years. Would you rather go to prison for two years or spend the rest of your life brain damaged/dead?

The graveyard's full of heroes.

rubadub

padraigcarroll wrote:

3 important things for fighting, head buts, eye gouge, throw the first punch/strike.

Gardai & judges do not look favourably on headbutts. And "throw the first strike", so you are starting a fight just on verbal abuse? if so then I would consider you the scumbag, and if you were to headbutt somebody who has not laid a finger on you then you could be doing time.

I remember being caught by a gang of lads who wrongly thought I had done something. They cornered me and started to beat me, I was pissed and was seriously not feeling much pain, but I ovbviously wanted them to stop before they did real damage. One kicked me in the face fairly lightly so I just started screaming "MY F**KING EYE", and "I CANT F**KING SEE". They all ran off thinking they may have blinded me, I knew some of their names, and they knew this so would be worried I would go to the law.

"If an injury has to be done to a man it should be so severe that his vengeance need not be feared" - Machiavelli

Sangre

Throwing the first punch can be considered self defense. Judges aren't stupid people, they know how the world works. Especially if the other guy is a known scumbag.

padraigcarroll

Cabelo: mmm hmmm, dya reckon??? seriously???? not quite what i was getting at. My point is that when they give you that good ould hiding u deserved, what happens when they fracture your skull? or you fall down and hit your head and die, or maybe you just get off lightly and lose your motor skills, speech or sight etc etc?! ah sure feck it man, let them beat the bejaysus out of ya, maybe all the gay byrne ould ones from the radio will jump in and save you before that gentle hiding escallates to murder accidental, directly, indirectly or otherwise.

Sorry guy, but when someone tries to end your life maybe you'll have a different view?!

Rubadub: nah, obviously we're not talking about a verbal discussion here, we're talking about defending yourself from impending/current physical violence. ie.when you know your about to take a smack or whatnot, not when your having an intellectual discussion with a person who just doesnt agree with your opinions on epigrammatic poetry!
Seriously though, we could give a million case scenarios where it is or isnt neccecary to use violence/strike first, but i think realistically most people know when it's about to kick off, these are the scenarios I refer to.

Fact is those guys that gave you, your beating were in a process that could/would kill you, whether or not they knew it. It's my opinion that you do anything you can to get out of that situation, anything. You did something that worked well, and you got out of it. I believe there is no difference between what you did and if there was a rock on the ground, picking it up and cracking one of their faces with it - whether or not the guy dies as a result from it.
But what u did worked for you, so, kudos.

Colm_OReilly

To quote Cobra-Kai - Strike First, Strike Hard, Show No Mercy. If a Man attacks you he is the enemy, in the street, in the ring, in the dojo.

Most psychotic thread we've seen in a while...

Clive

"We do not train to be merciful here, mercy is for the weak. A man confronts you in the street he is your enemy. An enemy deserves no mercy. "

john kavanagh

most men have 2 common fantasies

1. beating up the guy/s in front of your beautiful girlfriend

2. what you do later to your girlfriend;)

stick to the second fantasy, its a lot healthier:D

- karl tanswell

dlofnep

To be honest, regardless of what you say on here.. I reckon when it comes down to it, on the spur of the moment, you'll do whatever is instinctive of you at that moment.

rubadub

padraigcarroll wrote:

Fact is those guys that gave you, your beating were in a process that could/would kill you, whether or not they knew it. It's my opinion that you do anything you can to get out of that situation, anything. You did something that worked well, and you got out of it. I believe there is no difference between what you did and if there was a rock on the ground, picking it up and cracking one of their faces with it - whether or not the guy dies as a result from it.
But what u did worked for you, so, kudos.

Well these guys were after me for months. I knew who they were, I was chased while walking with a mate, so they knew that he knew. They were not going to kill me, and I do not think most fights have the intention of death. But yes I could have been severely beaten and possibly killed, albeit by accident. If they want to kill then pick up a rock like you say. If I had fought back they would have beat me harder, certainly if I smashed a guys face they would have done the same thing back to be ten fold. And probably would still be running from them to this day.

End result, I came off unharmed, they went away thinking they gave me the beating of a lifetime, scared they may have blinded me and in fear that I may go to the law. I see them the odd time now and there are not even bad stares.

Dragan

It's a bit of a bigger question than the one that was asked in my mind. Look at the three main soft spots on the body. Eyes ( go for these and you can blind them ) , throat ( go for this and you can kill them ) balls ( attack here with enough vigour and you may be affecting someone life is all sorts of ways ).

Anyone who has every been around violence in more than the drunken stupid childish way that half this country goes for on a Saturday night out knows that things can go badly , badly wrong without anyone meaning it to. A simply fight can turn into a riot, a punch in a pub can turn into a bitter fued, a drunken argument can turn into a glassing. You can be walking the road and someone who wants what you have can come and try and get it. Thats just the way the world is.

Lets not try and sugar coat things at all , i reckon 70% of us here could be lined up against a wall and no one would know that a lot of us do martial arts or "know how to handle ourselves" and i had to break it to many of the more experienced practitioners here but there are MANY people out there perfectly capable of defending themselves with no experience of martial arts at all. I was going through wars and tough times long before i had done martial arts.

But what has some experience with martial arts given me? If anything it has made me more likely to walk away should the opportuinity present itself. In the drunken argument i will simply walk off, in the fight in the pub i wil simply restrain if i can.

Sure i know that there are always and will always be times when i need to go, and i will, and i will do what it takes. But due to martial arts those times and much fewer and very far between and no longer of my own making.

People always act as if martial arts somehow makes them more dangerous. If anything it has made me much less so.

fianna.5u.com

Get a poster of me (€25 signed!) and every night before you go out, look at the poster, feel, touch and caress the poster. Your looking at a poster of the hardest mo fo on the planet. Through contagious magic (and a little captain planet love) you too will grow strong. You will no longer be one of the 70% unidentifiablly "able to handle themselves" (which of course leads to more attacks) and instead you will strike fear in all of those that oppose you!

Shave your head, do some roids, get loads of tattoos, do some more roids, go around with a scowl on your face. Train really hard, show no me-r-cy (is that how you say it? sorry that word aint in my vocabulary)

By doing the above you will no longer be a target, you wont be the prey you will be the hunter! Go for the eyes, the throught and the balls, so he can't live to not see the children he can't have!

Peace
P.S. wreck the place!!

Dragan

Yeah but do i have to scowl????

My face gets kinda sore doing that! :mad:

Degsy

Le Rack wrote:

It depends on the fight. If Iw as fighting another girl, I wouldn't box her, I'd slap scratch, pull hair, maybe a few light punches, but if I was fighting a fella I'd be punching and throwin round houses all the way! Then if it was a fight of self defence, then, take out the knees, eyes, and nuts. Run. That's how we're trained in self defence, if they can't see you they can't harm you, if they can't chase after you they can't harm you.

That sounds like something out of Sex in The City!

Millionaire

fianna.5u.com wrote:

!

Shave your head, do some roids, get loads of tattoos, do some more roids, go around with a scowl on your face. Train really hard, show no me-r-cy (is that how you say it? sorry that word aint in my vocabulary)

By doing the above you will no longer be a target, you wont be the prey you will be the hunter! Go for the eyes, the throught and the balls, so he can't live to not see the children he can't have!

Peace
P.S. wreck the place!!

Good idea! Scowl even more. and get a job on a nightclub door, and exert a massive power trip and show everyone what a tough MFer you are, by turning away small nerdy computer types who wear glasses.

Dragan

Millionaire wrote:

show everyone what a tough MFer you are, by turning away small nerdy computer types who wear glasses.

I assume you have been turned away from doors in the past then????

Millionaire

when I got contact lens I was let in !!!! ;-)

Cabelo

padraigcarroll wrote:

Cabelo: mmm hmmm, dya reckon??? seriously???? not quite what i was getting at. My point is that when they give you that good ould hiding u deserved, what happens when they fracture your skull? or you fall down and hit your head and die, or maybe you just get off lightly and lose your motor skills, speech or sight etc etc?! ah sure feck it man, let them beat the bejaysus out of ya, maybe all the gay byrne ould ones from the radio will jump in and save you before that gentle hiding escallates to murder accidental, directly, indirectly or otherwise.

Sorry guy, but when someone tries to end your life maybe you'll have a different view?!

Calm down sweetheart. I've been in fights. It's not as serious as all that love and you know it. Otherwise you're living in a magical fantasy world. Personally if you think people are trying to end your life then you should just stay indoors and drink unicorn giggles.

Dragan

Cabelo wrote:

then you should just stay indoors and drink unicorn giggles.

Dear god but i can't stop laughing at this.

Valmont

I think if a street fight can be avoided, every attempt must be made to stop it happening, even if it means running away. But if I was backed into a corner, I would bite, kick and give low blows until I could run away.

Cake Fiend

Dragan wrote:

Anyone who has every been around violence in more than the drunken stupid childish way that half this country goes for on a Saturday night out knows that things can go badly , badly wrong without anyone meaning it to. A simply fight can turn into a riot, a punch in a pub can turn into a bitter fued, a drunken argument can turn into a glassing. You can be walking the road and someone who wants what you have can come and try and get it. Thats just the way the world is.

Yup, and I for one have no intention of ending up like that poor lad outside Annabels. Whether your attacker (or indeed attackers) is meaning to do serious harm or not, he might very well do - so maybe you should assume he will to err on the side of caution.

Of course, avoid the situation in the first place if possible.

Le Rack

Mikel wrote:

haha, what rubbish! As a "trained" martial artist you are of course invincible. The fact that you spend a couple of hours a week in the local club learning "roundhouses" means that different laws apply to you do they? What is it like being a lethal weapon?
You do what you can to get away, simple.

I'm saying if a death did occur at the hands of a martial artist, then they would be looked upon differently than some average joe. The fact that someone has martial arts training will not be hidden like, and they would be tried harder. It's happened.

I never said I was invincible lethal weapon. I fight a lot and I do well for myself but I'm far from invincible. I was at a squad yesterday and I have a sling now and a dodgy eye. All I meant about the difference from male to female was that on the most part a fella attacks a girl for rape or money or both, and in that case I would do anything to get away. with a girl it's most likely some stupid thing and I'd just give her a slap away like. I'm not going to use specific martial arts outside the ring if I don't have to.

padraigcarroll

cabelo: ummmmmmkay! wharevaaaah!

Cabelo

Constructive and convincing argument there. Good to see you're keeping it alive chief.

Degsy

Le Rack wrote:

I'm saying if a death did occur at the hands of a martial artist, then they would be looked upon differently than some average joe. The fact that someone has martial arts training will not be hidden like, and they would be tried harder. It's happened.

I never said I was invincible lethal weapon. I fight a lot and I do well for myself but I'm far from invincible. I was at a squad yesterday and I have a sling now and a dodgy eye. All I meant about the difference from male to female was that on the most part a fella attacks a girl for rape or money or both, and in that case I would do anything to get away. with a girl it's most likely some stupid thing and I'd just give her a slap away like. I'm not going to use specific martial arts outside the ring if I don't have to.

I dont believe for one second that you have ANY martial arts training:rolleyes:

Cabelo

Degsy wrote:

I dont believe for one second that you have ANY martial arts training:rolleyes:

Degsy... I love you.

dlofnep

There will be no love on the martial arts forum. Only pain and discipline!

Dragan

Le Rack wrote:

I was at a squad yesterday and I have a sling now and a dodgy eye.

Must be pretty bad if your eye is in a sling! Or am i misinterpreting what your are talk(bull****ting)ing about?

Degsy

"ah so...we forge our bodies in the fire of our will!":D

Cabelo

dlofnep wrote:

There will be no love on the martial arts forum. Only pain and discipline!

Fact: Someone once loved Dlof but he was afraid it might get "dirty" so he kicked him in the nadgers, smashed a bottle over his head and pressure pointed the lad right in his eye gouges.

Dragan

Cabelo wrote:

Fact: Someone once loved Dlof but he was afraid it might get "dirty" so he kicked him in the nadgers, smashed a bottle over his head and pressure pointed the lad right in his eye gouges.

I heard it was a girl he messed up. Only a truly invincible martial artist could kick a girl in the nadgers!

Degsy

But surely the best winning technique is to throw roundhouses and plenty of them!