Tribeca skins have different exchange rates

Shortstack

Just noticed that PPP has an exchange rate of 1.185 and Bluesquare (another tribeca site) has a rate of 1.1763. I only noticed this as I was going to withdraw from Bluesquare and put it back onto to PPP. However If I do I will lose €63.

:mad:

Culchie

I brought this up months ago, and got dogs abuse for it !!

I'll leave it to you to explain this time

ocallagh

its weird.. it actually doesn't matter. $1000 on PPP is just worth a bit more in EUR than $1000 on Blue Square..

You get the same exchange rate when you withdraw your money so makes no odds.

ocallagh

Culchie wrote:

I brought this up months ago, and got dogs abuse for it !!

I'll leave it to you to explain this time

there was quite a long post on thisif I remember!!

Culchie

Yes, and I was right

ArmaniJeanss

I dont think you lose. From memory your Euro Amount stays the same so long as both accounts have Euro selected as the 'Base' currency.
So say you have a €10000 = $11800 in one account. U withdraw and place it in the other account where €10000 = $11700. Ok, you've $100 less to play with but you havnt actually lost anything in your base currency of Euros.
Even if the 2nd exchnage rate was 1:1 you still wouldnt lose even though you would appear to be $1800 down.
AJ.

Culchie

Here we go again !

The poker sites win out here big time.

The more the higher the margin they have from the real rate of exchange, the more money they add to the bottom line.

Mikes point has proven it. If there is a difference between Poker Site A and Poker Site B with currency exchange rates then there is a difference in currency profit being taken by the sites. It's extra margin.

padser

A solution, if you dont mind the hastle, would be to open an account on the other site. Play a heads up match to transfer the money. So long as no flop is dealt there is no rake.

In fact, correct me if im wrong, and im certainly unethical, but if poker site A offers you 150 dollors for X euro and Poker site B offers 160 dollars for X euro and you deposit X euro and play heads up for 4/5 hands that are not raked. loose the money from poker site B to poker site A. Cash out from Poker site A and you would have X euro plus 10$ profit converted back into euro at site A's conversion rate.

Im sure there is a reason i cant do this if someone would like to enlighten me?

Edit *if there isnt and iv stumbled upon a dasterdly plot for making money i would like to
a)patent the idea
b)ask if anyone would like to take out a stake in me over the next couple of weeks?

Shortstack

ocallagh wrote:

its weird.. it actually doesn't matter. $1000 on PPP is just worth a bit more in EUR than $1000 on Blue Square..

You get the same exchange rate when you withdraw your money so makes no odds.

It makes no difference if you play one site exclusively. However Bluesquare have a monthly bonus which only takes 5000 action points which is easy to clear. Paddy Power have loads of freeroll & satellite tournaments that are skin exclusive so I want to be able to play both. At the moment I have no money in PPP and wanted to transfer some to play the xmas cracker and Grand slam qualifiers.

It also makes a small difference if you want to deposit money to play a specific tournament, all the tournies are in dollars so you must put more euro into PPP than bluesq to buy into the same tournament.

Culchie

Of course it makes a difference.
The international exchange rates are the same, so if one poker sites is giving you less $'s for your €uro, then

(a) You are getting poorer value for your money and
(b) The poker site is making an increased margin on currency.

and, all that rake and registration fees is charged at a certain rate, so the site that is charging the worse exchange rate is making more 'real-time' money.

ianmc38

All poker sites are ridiculous with their exchange rates. It's just a stealth rake really.

Culchie

Hooray .... vindicated !:eek:

ArmaniJeanss

Ian - so long as both withdrawls and lodgements on any skin are converted at the same rate at any given point in time, then it is all above board. If there is a spread (different) sell/buy figure then this is wrong, but none of the Tribeca skins have a spread.

Culchie

ArmaniJeanss wrote:

Ian - so long as both withdrawls and lodgements on any skin are converted at the same rate at any given point in time, then it is all above board. If there is a spread (different) sell/buy figure then this is wrong, but none of the Tribeca skins have a spread.

OK, you lodge €1000 into Poker Site A and you get $1200 ..... I lodge €100 into Poker Site B(for example) and I get $1220 ..... who did best?

Where do think that $20 is ? .... it's added to bottom line of Poker Site A

jd

Culchie wrote:

Where do think that $20 is ? .... it's added to bottom line of Poker Site A

Not necesarily if poker site A bought dollars at a different rate to Site B

Culchie

Why would they ?

anyways, they are not buying dollars....they're giving you colored pixels.

karlh

exchange rates are reviewed on an ongoing basis.

the dollar moved a cent today so the effect of a daily change is more noticable.

ppp doesn't make a penny (or cent boom boom!) from exchange rate movements. if the rate is slightly lower, or slightly higher than the market rate at a given moment, they 'buy and sell' $ at the same rate.

it is true that this results in slight discrepancies between sites and it is also true that due to this, it could cost slightly more or less to enter a tourney depending on where on the network you are registering.

FYI, rates have just been updated and are almost exact market rates. this update process will be automatic soon enough.

i remember VC being 4c out of line with market ex rates at one stage so i presume all sites are the same to a greater/lesser degree.

ocallagh

Culchie wrote:

Of course it makes a difference.
The international exchange rates are the same, so if one poker sites is giving you less $'s for your €uro, then

(a) You are getting poorer value for your money and
(b) The poker site is making an increased margin on currency.

But when you cash out you get the same exchange rate so how are you losing out?

Culchie wrote:

and, all that rake and registration fees is charged at a certain rate, so the site that is charging the worse exchange rate is making more 'real-time' money.

The rake is a percentage of your stake. Yes, if one site gives u less dollars for your € then the rake is slightly higher, but the amount of money you are staking is also proportionately higher so it makes no difference.

Tournament = $100 + 10 STT

Skin A exchange rate is 2x which means it will cost you €50 to play in it.
Skin B exchange rate is 1x which means you are staking a bit more because it costs you €100 on this skin.

You win and make 5 times your stake.

So Skin A pays out $500, and using the same exchange rate you win €250
Skin B pays out $500, and using their exhange rate you win €500..

The different exchange rates really just means you are gambling at slightly different stakes on certain Skins.. The dollars you buy are not actual US$, they are just a representation of what you are staking..

I'm not sure about moving money around, If you comove money directly from PPP to Blue Square then of course you might lose out.. but as long as you have your base cashier account in € you are fine.

ocallagh

I will fight this one to the death culchie:D

willis

Culchie wrote:

I lodge €100 into Poker Site B(for example) and I get $1220

Have you a link to this site

Ste05

Long maybe just read last paragraph first to see if it's worth reading the rest??

I think all this is assuming that you will get the same rate when you withdraw, as you did when you deposit. This is simply not the case.

Exchange rates fluctuate on daily/ hourly/ minute rate. I don't know whether all sites use the same system that PPP use (as Karl says) buy and selling at the same rate. I know we had a long discussion about this a good while ago, and discussed the exchange rate spread when talking about Neteller and whether to have it based in $ or in €. And this spilled over into Poker site exchange rates I think.

But if say the market rate is €1:$1.10 (for ease) and PPP are converting your € into $ at this rate. So you get $1,100 for €1,000. And Blue Square are converting it at €1:$1.05 even though the current rate is €1:$1.10, you get $1,050 for your €1,000. Blue Square then take your €1,000 and convert it on the open market and get $1,100. there's $50 missing somewhere - there's loads of possible explanations, I'm not saying BlueSquare are pocketing the money, but it's gone somewhere.

Now if we look at withdrawing your money. PPP assure us we get the going market rate. So whatever the markets have been doing over the period our money has been in $ is neither here nor there, but the rate is very unlikely to still be €1:$1.1, but that's noone's fault and just one of the drawbacks to us of the Poker world being a $ market.

However if we look at BlueSquare they now, have to go onto the market and (just to keep it simple lets assume we've tripled our money and we're withdrawing the same amount we deposited $1,050 and the FX rates are the same i.e. €1:$1.10).

So we withdraw $1,050 from BlueSquare and expect to get €1,000, Right?? Well BlueSquare now have to go to the market with your $1,050, but unfortunately they'll only get €954 and they then need to add in another €46 from somewhere to keep us even?? But where does this money come from???? Their own pocket?? Or do they have some magic place where they can sell €1,050 and get €1,000, if they do then they are in the wrong business!!!!!

NickyOD

Another good reason for these sites to get the finger out and enable neteller deposits so we can deal exclusively in dollars.

karlh

NickyOD wrote:

Another good reason for these sites to get the finger out and enable neteller deposits so we can deal exclusively in dollars.

agreed.

neteller available very shortly.

NickyOD

karlh wrote:

agreed.

neteller available very shortly.

Good Work Karl. I think you deserve a raise.

ArmaniJeanss

Warning - Economics post !.

I'd urge caution on anyone who rushes to open a $ account purely because they get annoyed with variances on the Euro->$ rate.

Having an account with base currency € means that inflation in the US is of no consequence, your € balance will stay the same regardless of currency fluctuations, with minor annoyances that winning $500 one day can be slightly different to winning $500 the next day.

Having an account with base currency $ leaves you open to the vagaries of a foreign governments (i.e USA's) spending/borrowing* policies. Theres nothing to stop this or any future USA government printing extra $s by the truckload, causing decimation to anyone with a $ account.

Having a large amount of money in $ base accounts effectively makes one a currency trader as well as a poker player, and currency trading is not a recommended hobby for a novice.
AJ.

* I'm implying no opinions myself on any US governments policies.

Amaru

Instead of starting a new thread, i'll just ask here, does anybody know how long it takes to receive cheques from VC?

jd

I think what i was trying to day earlier is that companies who do a lot of currency transfers tend to buy say dollars at a given point in time and then take a position on it for a while. Hence vc and pp may have different exchange rates.
jd

Drakar

Imagine you have €1000 and convert it in site A (@1.19) to get $1190. Lose it all to your mate Bill on Site B (which is on the same network but uses a different exchange rate) who now has $1190 and converts it back to € at Site B's rate (1.18) to get €1008.47. Woot, split the 8.47 between ye and get a nice Big Mac.