Xbox 360... underwhelmed...

Bluehair

Well I finally got my hands on one this afternoon, Premium pack plus extra wireless controller and Project Dark Zero / PGR3. Got it the lot via ebay from a Dublin seller for only about 40 quid more than it would have cost in the shops (if it was in the shops!).

So far though I'll admit to being completely underwhelmed. The 360 itself is still a tank and the dvd drawer is very flimsy. Wireless controllers are handy but you can get them for anything now plus the top trigger button is very badly placed (i kept hitting viewchange accidently when trying to brake in PGR3). Plus christ is it noisy! When you're playing a game it's fine but otherwise there's no mistaking that it's switched on and running! (Jesus that power supply is a brick too!!)

PGR3 then. Well lets get this out of the way; the graphics are amazing, but then I would have been very disappointed if they were anything but given the hardware involved. Hi-Def is without question the future of games..

However I'm astonished that they still have a really crap ai in this game now it's the fourth in the series. Nothings more annoying than baling past a computer controlled car on a straight than finding him swerving into your back end for no reason other than to cause a crash, same with corners, Christ it's like bumping cars not a racing simulator. Bear in mind I've played the previous 3 games and clocked the last one and although this problem was always there it's a shame to see it still present.

Whoever thought 170+mph cars was a good idea should be shot. One of the great things about the previous games was the learning curve and sense of achievment gained from progressing. Going back to the earlier cars later on and nailing platinum on everything was great and only done with the skills gained later on. Now you get handed a Noble to you on a plate from race 1 :rolleyes: Whats the point?? It was great having such a range of cars in the old games and toying with things you might have actually driven in real life... What a waste...

I haven't jacked into Live yet nor have I played Project Dark Zero but so far I'm definately very underwhelmed by the whole package. Definately not what i was expecting from 'next-gen'...

00sully

haha then you're not gonna be happy with prefect dark 0 to be sure! I have mine since launch and only got PD0 but brought it back and now waiting for PGR, condemned, COD2 and Kameo. I will also buy a HD tv after xmas - hopefully be a bit cheaper by then.

Im not overly impressed either, but have to say remembering back to ps2 launch - things were a lot worse and even more expensive (relatively)

I dont think its too loud while its idle to be honest, but the DVD drive is very noisy when playing a game which doesnt matter much except for quite parts of games (gonna be real bad when stealth games are released)

the dash and live are excellent tho and connectivity is top notch too, connected my nano to it and its pretty sweet playin all my music from there.

I dont know what i was expecting from 'next-gen' but surely its way to early to be passing judgement? Im really looking forward to Ghost Recon Advanced War Fighter and Full auto so roll on Feb & March

with PS3 not being released here at earliest the end of 2006, its a safe bet to say there'll be a fair few quality next gen games out to tide us over until the 'next big thing' is released!

also, with each new generation, I think you will find the technological leaps becoming smaller - never will we see a leap from say snes to n64 in one go again unless someone smashes moores law and other technologies other than static 2d tv displays are produced

just my 2c!

Jammer

Bluehair wrote:

So far though I'll admit to being completely underwhelmed. The 360 itself is still a tank and the dvd drawer is very flimsy.

No different to any other DVD Drawer, you always have to be careful with them. You could always mod it to be aluminium if you need it to be.

Bluehair wrote:

Wireless controllers are handy but you can get them for anything now plus the top trigger button is very badly placed (i kept hitting viewchange accidently when trying to brake in PGR3).

Maybe so, it always depends on the size of people's hands wether or not they like a particular joypad. I've played about 3 hours collectively of PGR3, and it hasn't happened me once.

Bluehair wrote:

Plus christ is it noisy! When you're playing a game it's fine but otherwise there's no mistaking that it's switched on and running! (Jesus that power supply is a brick too!!)

It is noisey, but does that really matter? Don't you play with the sound on?

The power supply being a brick shouldn't really concern your opinion on the console, so what if it's 2 foot long? You'll still put it behind the TVT.

Bluehair wrote:

PGR3 then. Well lets get this out of the way; the graphics are amazing, but then I would have been very disappointed if they were anything but given the hardware involved. Hi-Def is without question the future of games..

:rolleyes:

Bluehair wrote:

However I'm astonished that they still have a really crap ai in this game now it's the fourth in the series. Nothings more annoying than baling past a computer controlled car on a straight than finding him swerving into your back end for no reason other than to cause a crash, same with corners, Christ it's like bumping cars not a racing simulator. Bear in mind I've played the previous 3 games and clocked the last one and although this problem was always there it's a shame to see it still present.

This, again, shouldn't sway your judgement on the console, more so the developers of the game.

Bluehair wrote:

I haven't jacked into Live yet nor have I played Project Dark Zero but so far I'm definately very underwhelmed by the whole package. Definately not what i was expecting from 'next-gen'...

Live is fantastic on the 360. Play COD2 on it, and you'll be hooked for hours!

Project Dark is a quality game. Give it a go.

What were you expecting? The hollodeck isn't due till 2010!!

Bluehair

Jammer wrote:

What were you expecting? The hollodeck isn't due till 2010!!

I dunno but maybe this is it;

00sully wrote:

with each new generation, I think you will find the technological leaps becoming smaller - never will we see a leap from say snes to n64 in one go again

Just been playing PD0 since I posted last and it's much better than i thought it would be so perhaps there's a lot to do with expectations here. I really expected PGR3 to be a lot better than it is so I guess it is the developer rather than the hardware per se thats the problem. I'll pick up COD tomorrow and see what it's like.

I think 00sully may have hit the nail on the head though. Maybe i was expecting too much but i suppose the 360 is evolution rather than revolution (pun intended i'm looking forward to what Nintendo have to offer with the new controller).

MS and probably Sony are giving us more of the same only prettier. Thats grand I suppose and I'm not saying I regret buying it but it's definately not the big deal i thought it would be.

Laguna

Jammer wrote:

Project Dark is a quality game. Give it a go.

I guess you're referring to Perfect Dark Zero here... we have obviously played different games, PDZ is anything but quality, it's Perfect Dark with new graphics.

Jammer

Laguna wrote:

I guess you're referring to Perfect Dark Zero here... we have obviously played different games, PDZ is anything but quality, it's Perfect Dark with new graphics.

yeah, sorry, mixed up.

I've never played the original. I think its good. Fair bit into it, and i'm still interested in playing it! Multiplayer is good, Co-Op and otherwise!

Laguna

Jammer wrote:

yeah, sorry, mixed up.

I've never played the original. I think its good. Fair bit into it, and i'm still interested in playing it! Multiplayer is good, Co-Op and otherwise!

PDZ would be a quality game if it had been released maybe three or four years ago, but in the advent of quality FPS like Half Life 2 and Halo, it's just pale in comparison.

00sully

PD0 is a good game, just not great at all, half life 2 on xbox is streets ahead of it in everyway except graphics. I agree tho, PD0 is a laf over live but single player is a snooze fest with atrocious AI.

valve should have waited and developed HL2 for 360 instead of squeezing it on the xbox, woulda been the perfect launch title.

ah this reminds me, my white box has been sittin idle since launch, cdwow better hurry with my delivery already

^ exactly what i was thinkin laguna, you beat me to it!!

steviec

Bluehair wrote:

Whoever thought 170+mph cars was a good idea should be shot. One of the great things about the previous games was the learning curve and sense of achievment gained from progressing. Going back to the earlier cars later on and nailing platinum on everything was great and only done with the skills gained later on. Now you get handed a Noble to you on a plate from race 1 :rolleyes: Whats the point?? It was great having such a range of cars in the old games and toying with things you might have actually driven in real life... What a waste...

I'll agree with that, I've stopped bothering with single player career now because I have all the cars I could want. There's very little sense of progression.

Fortunately the online play makes up for that tenfold so I still love the game, but it would be nice to have both!

Dont be at yourself

Jammer wrote:

No different to any other DVD Drawer, you always have to be careful with them. You could always mod it to be aluminium if you need it to be.

What, the consumer is supposed to fix any shoddy design or workmanship on behalf of Microsoft? That's a ridiculous statement, akin to saying "Sure, this Fiat 500 can't make it up a hill, but you can always throw a supercharged V8 in there"

It is noisey, but does that really matter? Don't you play with the sound on?

One of the reasons I don't watch DVDs on a Playstation is because of the noise of it. Hearing a noisy fan constantly whirring will not only destroy any sense of immersion, but also slowly drive you insane.

This, again, shouldn't sway your judgement on the console, more so the developers of the game.

So what should you judge the console on if not the games that you play on it? In the end, isn't that what matters?

ianmc38

Laguna wrote:

I guess you're referring to Perfect Dark Zero here... we have obviously played different games, PDZ is anything but quality, it's Perfect Dark with new graphics.

Agreed. Huge disappointment for me. COD2 on the other hand is a gem IMHO. Bought quake 4 off ebay yesterday, so waiting to receive that.

Jammer

NekkidBibleMan wrote:

What, the consumer is supposed to fix any shoddy design or workmanship on behalf of Microsoft? That's a ridiculous statement, akin to saying "Sure, this Fiat 500 can't make it up a hill, but you can always throw a supercharged V8 in there"

My point was (although i think it was quite clear), that it is no different to any other DVD Drawer out there, on the planet.

NekkidBibleMan wrote:

One of the reasons I don't watch DVDs on a Playstation is because of the noise of it. Hearing a noisy fan constantly whirring will not only destroy any sense of immersion, but also slowly drive you insane.

Thats fair enough. But anytime i've watched a DVD on it, i've been sitting 8 or 9 ft away from it, and i can't hear it over the sound on the TV.

NekkidBibleMan wrote:

So what should you judge the console on if not the games that you play on it? In the end, isn't that what matters?

No. Think about it. The graphics, AI and physics on Call of Duty 2 is top drawer. Therefore we can tell that the console is a capable machine. If PGR3 AI is ****, then thats down to the developer and bares no responsibility on the 360. It just plays what the developers tell it to play, and if its told to play bad, it will. Thats all i was saying.

ianmc38

Jammer wrote:

If PGR3 AI is ****, then thats down to the developer and bares no responsibility on the 360.

That is the point that should close this thread.

As for the noise, i wan't expecting it to be silent were you? And in all fairness, i can honestly say i havn't noticed the sound once when i'm playing a game.

Ri_Nollaig

Bluehair wrote:

Plus christ is it noisy!

well this was to be expected with a triple cored cpu... its basicly the same as any high end gaming PC.
only soloution as with a PC wud be some huge heatsinks and silent fans or even watercooling
also id assume the ps3 will be just as loud

gamer

ill wait til theres 30 very good games i want to play on it say 2006,til i get a 360,for 500e i cud build a very fast pc with a fast graphics card with tv and dvi output.the 360 games are like 25e more than the average pc game,after all its a souped up pc with hd output and xbox live,,if u dont have broadband and dont have 2grand to buy a hd tv all u,ve got is single player mode in games to play,and theres loads of good single player games on the pc.i think it,ll take another 7 months for developers to get to use the full graphics and processing power of the 360, alll i,m impressed with a the moment is cod2 and pd 0.if u have a standard tv obviously u will have to play games in lores mode,i wont get any console to play 2games as i,m mainly interested in fps games like quake or call of duty.only 5percent of xbox users have xbox live,i think theres only a minority at present that will buy a hdtv in order to play 360 games,since theres no hd dvds out at the moment.

FranchisePlayer

I got my xbox 360 on launch day and I am very dissapointed with PDZ.The only game I am looking forward to is elder scrolls 4 oblivion.

Jammer

gamer wrote:

ill wait til theres 30 very good games i want to play on it say 2006,til i get a 360,for 500e i cud build a very fast pc with a fast graphics card with tv and dvi output.

My €2,500 PC can barely output the graphics that the 360 does.

Where can you buy €500 PC's with a graphics card? Havent seen many around. For €500 you will get a piece of crap. End of story.

Microsoft sell these at a considerable loss, so obviously, even at manufacturing level they are costing a huge amount.

gamer wrote:

only 5percent of xbox users have xbox live,i think theres only a minority at present that will buy a hdtv in order to play 360 games,since theres no hd dvds out at the moment.

The words 'talking,' 'ar$e' and 'through' come to mind.

5% ? Link me please???

Dont be at yourself

Jammer wrote:

My point was (although i think it was quite clear), that it is no different to any other DVD Drawer out there, on the planet.

Nonsense, there are plenty of perfectly sturdy disc drawers out there. And you did say "You could always mod it to be aluminium if you need it to be.", so my previous rebuttal still stands. The consumer is paying a lot of money for this hardware, why should they have to put up with substandard parts?

Thats fair enough. But anytime i've watched a DVD on it, i've been sitting 8 or 9 ft away from it, and i can't hear it over the sound on the TV.

That's fine when you're sitting across the living room watching the latest explosion-filled blockbuster, but what about sitting in a small bedroom watching a tense horror? That fan will drive you nuts.

No. Think about it. The graphics, AI and physics on Call of Duty 2 is top drawer. Therefore we can tell that the console is a capable machine. If PGR3 AI is ****, then thats down to the developer and bares no responsibility on the 360. It just plays what the developers tell it to play, and if its told to play bad, it will. Thats all i was saying.

I totally agree that the XBox360 is capable of producing top quality games. But so is every console. Some of the best games around today are from the PSOne era and before. As such, the console must be judged on what *is* being done with it, rather than what *can* be done with it. You spend €400+ on a console to play games, not to imagine what wonderous games could be created for it.

GrumPy

Jammer wrote:

My €2,500 PC can barely output the graphics that the 360 does.

i love this sentence, proves many an argument.

ninja 101

Irish GrumPy wrote:

i love this sentence, proves many an argument.

Eh, so what?The dreamcat had graphics that were unbelieveable for its time but still flopped.The graphics don't make that much of a difference,the games do.As far as I can see there will be no real killer app. for the 360 for some time.

HomunQlus

Jammer wrote:

My €2,500 PC can barely output the graphics that the 360 does.

I have an 1,500 Euro PC (bought as second-hand machine I might add) which can do much better than the 360... and I'm proud of it

Jammer wrote:

Where can you buy €500 PC's with a graphics card? Havent seen many around. For €500 you will get a piece of crap. End of story.

OK, the 500 Euro thing is true though. You won't get a PC for 500 that can do the graphics of the 360, I give the console that.

Laguna

In the same way I disregard MGS and GTA as Sony 'exclusive' killer apps.

HomunQlus

Laguna wrote:

In the same way I disregard MGS and GTA as Sony 'exclusive' killer apps.

Well, "GTA San Andreas" is a killer-app - you have to play it in all details.

Laguna

HomunQlus wrote:

Well, "GTA San Andreas" is a killer-app - you have to play it in all details.

And when exactly did this 'killer app' arrive for the PS2... when it was released?, it certainly wasn't at launch.

Killer apps are rarely available for any console at launch, so I don't see how the Sony fans think the 360 has flopped with no hope of recovery in this regard... need they be reminded of the delights of the PS2's launch?, Tekken Tag Tournament?.

HomunQlus

Laguna wrote:

And when exactly did this 'killer app' arrive for the PS2... when it was released?, it certainly wasn't at launch.

Alright, that's what you meant.... Sorry, misunderstood you there.

GrumPy

ninja 101 wrote:

Eh, so what?The dreamcat had graphics that were unbelieveable for its time but still flopped.The graphics don't make that much of a difference,the games do.As far as I can see there will be no real killer app. for the 360 for some time.

what has that got to do with my post? i simply like the post i quoted, because its a fact, and backed up - the 360 is a capable machine, if i was gonna buy something with the sole intent to play games, 360 is better option, instead of €1500+ pc :rolleyes:

Jammer

HomunQlus wrote:

I have an 1,500 Euro PC (bought as second-hand machine I might add) which can do much better than the 360... and I'm proud of it

OK, the 500 Euro thing is true though. You won't get a PC for 500 that can do the graphics of the 360, I give the console that.

Must be 2 x 7800GTX's ? And for €1,500 that would have been a bargain.

This coming from 2 x 7800GT's here, in that res, NFSMW on my PC just looks as good. Not much better.

You're all reading too much eurogamer and IGN with all this 'killer app' crap. I have 3 or 4 games which i'm really enjoying playing at the moment, and thats all that really matters IMO. If you expect every game released to match up to Halo and GTA, you're going to be dissapointed on a regular basis.

Call of Duty 2 is the best console game i've played in a long time. Besides Pro Evo 5.

kaisersose77

As someone said in a previous thread most of the negative comments are coming from ppl who are jealous they dont have a nextgen console and are going to be waiting a long time till their beloved ps3 appears, looks like these posts will carry on for another year at least. The 360 isnt even out a month! ......and I am more than happy with the games I have to play atm.

GrumPy

Jammer wrote:

Must be 2 x 7800GTX's ? And for €1,500 that would have been a bargain.

This coming from 2 x 7800GT's here, in that res, NFSMW on my PC just looks as good. Not much better.

You're all reading too much eurogamer and IGN with all this 'killer app' crap. I have 3 or 4 games which i'm really enjoying playing at the moment, and thats all that really matters IMO. If you expect every game released to match up to Halo and GTA, you're going to be dissapointed on a regular basis.

Call of Duty 2 is the best console game i've played in a long time. Besides Pro Evo 5.

Good man Jammer your wise. i share the same opinion.

Dont be at yourself

Jammer wrote:

You're all reading too much eurogamer and IGN with all this 'killer app' crap. I have 3 or 4 games which i'm really enjoying playing at the moment, and thats all that really matters IMO.

In fairness, consoles need killer apps. There are plenty of enjoyable games out for every platform, but it's the killer apps (the Halos, the GTAs, the Pro Evos...) that makes a console worth buying. Why spend €400+ on a console to play the likes of Need for Speed and Tony Hawks when there's far, far better games out for the old consoles?

Jammer

NekkidBibleMan wrote:

In fairness, consoles need killer apps. There are plenty of enjoyable games out for every platform, but it's the killer apps (the Halos, the GTAs, the Pro Evos...) that makes a console worth buying. Why spend €400+ on a console to play the likes of Need for Speed and Tony Hawks when there's far, far better games out for the old consoles?

Its all down to opinions at the end of the day.

I'm enjoying COD2 on 360 as much as i did Halo on the original xbox. And after all, whats stopping you playing at the old 'killer apps' on the 360? as well as the new stuff.

Don't buy Fifa for the 360. Trust me.

Dont be at yourself

And after all, whats stopping you playing at the old 'killer apps' on the 360? as well as the new stuff.

Nothing at all. But why bother, when you can play them without shelling out €400+?

I'm glad that COD2 is a killer app for you. I'd imagine for most, it won't be.