cannabis smokers

ronbyrne2005

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/newspaper/0,,176-1920069,00.html

will be avoiding this crap from now on,you cant know if your genetically susceptible to its detrimental effects

Piste

You can have fair idea. I know there's a history of Schizophrenia and depression in my family. Doesn't stop me mind you

Cabaal

Piste wrote:

You can have fair idea. I know there's a history of Schizophrenia and depression in my family. Doesn't stop me mind you

Good for you, hope that works out well for you in a few years :rolleyes:

Mossy Monk

Piste wrote:

You can have fair idea. I know there's a history of Schizophrenia and depression in my family. Doesn't stop me mind you

at 14 you should be drinking cheap sparkling cider

turbot

As far as I can tell, one of the issues with marijuana and hashish is that any experienced smokers I know simply say most of the stuff available in Ireland is totally crap, compared to what smokers get in the states / other parts of the World.

That means:
- It barely gets them high, and not for very long
- They don't feel so good the day after - think of low quality drugs as being like cheap alcopops; they have hangovers attacted.

Hugh Hefner

Piste wrote:

You can have fair idea. I know there's a history of Schizophrenia and depression in my family. Doesn't stop me mind you

Oh Elizabeth. Tut tut tut. Tut. Tut. Tut.

Placebo

w0rd turbot,
**** you get in ireland is like cow poop mixed with bits of hash seeds.
Its horrible, it doesnt get you high properly and most of all, its horrible.

quite sad, you see those stashes of green all over tv on abroad tv shows and here we are .....

amazingemmet

Also what the sudy fails to mention is that all these effects disappear when your system is clear of the drug. You just gotta love propaganda

edanto

amazingemmet wrote:

Also what the sudy fails to mention is that all these effects disappear when your system is clear of the drug. You just gotta love propaganda

I don't know about that - the kids in this study hadn't smoked in the month before the brain scans; previous to that they had been smoking steady for about a year.

This is yet another reason not to smoke; I don't need much more convincing.

danniemcq

i am starting to get realy sick of all this sh!te, one day one group will say that marijuana isn't as bad as alcoholor normal cigs and then another reprt comes out sayin that it increases your risk of whatever while also turning your brain to mush.

in my opinion alcohol is far worse to a body/mind/family than marijuana ever could be, and no i haven't any big 5 billion page report on the subject or 20 different pairs of letters after my name in order to prove it i just look at my family and if you want proof of the damage it does just look at pubs and clubs on pretty much any night of the week.

how many stoners have you ever seen having fights splitting each other with bottles and glasses?

It's all about moderation as my ma says, to much of anything is bad for you

Royale with Cheese

Hormone replacement, that's what I need
I started to grow tits after smoking too much weed.

Ruaidhri

danniemcq wrote:

i am starting to get realy sick of all this sh!te, one day one group will say that marijuana isn't as bad as alcoholor normal cigs and then another reprt comes out sayin that it increases your risk of whatever while also turning your brain to mush.

in my opinion alcohol is far worse to a body/mind/family than marijuana ever could be, and no i haven't any big 5 billion page report on the subject or 20 different pairs of letters after my name in order to prove it i just look at my family and if you want proof of the damage it does just look at pubs and clubs on pretty much any night of the week.

how many stoners have you ever seen having fights splitting each other with bottles and glasses?

It's all about moderation as my ma says, to much of anything is bad for you

Voice of reason!
Anyway,who cares what all these studies find? Would studies on alcohol's adverse effects on your body and mind keep you from drinking? Cannabis is non-toxic and nowhere near as evil as it's made out to be.

Royale with Cheese

Ruaidhri wrote:

Voice of reason!
Anyway,who cares what all these studies find? Would studies on alcohol's adverse effects on your body and mind keep you from drinking? Cannabis is non-toxic and nowhere near as evil as it's made out to be.

There's a very long thread about this in Humanities. Some people just have it imbedded in their brain that Cannabis is the source of all evil. I can't help but feel these people were too affected by something they were told when they were young... and use studies like these to try and prove they're right when like another poster pointed out there's a million studies that say the exact opposite.

Edit: Do not ask me to link to one of these studies because I'm not going to bother. Look for them yourself.

edanto

there's a million studies that say the exact opposite

Where? Can you link to even one?

It's only experience that shows people, including me, that cannabis isn't that harmful. I enjoy smoking it.

But a thorough study like the one above gives me pause - is the pleasure I get from smoking worth damage down the road?

amazingemmet

One more thing i just noticed in that study the sample grouping is only 15, far too small a group to base a scientific opinion on, also it mentions no reason as to why the smokers gave up smoking they could of been of the type of person already predisposed to scizophrenia and had given up smoking for that reason hence the study found the results it was looking for.

If they can get the same results under double blind conditions on a much larger sample group then it might be cause for concern

Ruaidhri

Royale with Cheese wrote:

There's a very long thread about this in Humanities. Some people just have it imbedded in their brain that Cannabis is the source of all evil. I can't help but feel these people were too affected by something they were told when they were young... and use studies like these to try and prove they're right when like another poster pointed out there's a million studies that say the exact opposite.

Edit: Do not ask me to link to one of these studies because I'm not going to bother. Look for them yourself.

Actually i've a few of the pro-cannabis stories saved as PDF's. i'll upload one which contradicts the above linked story.

I'm totally aware that people have this fear of "drugs" hardwired into their brains,it's sad that there are smart people out there who get unreasonable when it comes to drugs (both pro and anti).

edanto

There's a big difference between scanning the brains of human teenagers that smoke cannabis to look for physical changes associated with schizophrenia and giving a potent chemical (not even THC!) to some rats for ten days.

Which study would you expect to give results that are more relevant to the effects of cannabis smoking on people?

amazingemmet wrote:

the sample grouping is only 15, far too small a group to base a scientific opinion

Dead right, the size of the sample group is not conclusive. It is indicative, though.

As regards the reasons for them not smoking - I would guess they were asked not to smoke for the month before the study to make sure the drug was below detectable levels before they scanned their brains.

danniemcq

i know it's not the best/most official source but in System Of A Down's self titled album, in the booklet with the lyrics under one (can't remember which so insert usual memory gone because of drugs phrase here) but they say that an isuue of New Scientist (febuary 2002 if i remember correctly) had an article in it that proved that cannabis was "better" for you than both tabacco and alcohol but it didn't publish it due to goverment pressure

bbc page sayin cannabis may reduce the risk of cancer

seen that link here on the thread in Humanities

ronbyrne2005

another story in another of todays newspapers
"Tony Blair is planning a controversial U-turn on cannabis laws and the reintroduction of tough penalties after an official government review found a definitive link between use of the drug and mental illness. "

http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/politics/article332383.ece

there is definitive evidence that cannabis DOES cause mental health issues and not just in the predisposed,most people wont get ill but a significant minority will, ask any psychiatrist and they will testify to this.
p.s im not anti drugs,if you can take drugs with no ill effects i think its your choice and if i could take drugs with no ill effects.
im just urging young people to be careful and make informed descision and dont listen to anecdotal evidence like "never did me any harm" or " a litle bit of this never hurt anyone".
alcohol might cause violence etc but when you sober up your fine whereas cannabis can leave you with permanent brain abnormalities-FACT

Big Knox

Too much of anything is bad for you.

Weed, i have always used in moderation, some might call it heavy. I'd smoke on certain days after work while watchin a dvd or tele and it does me the world of good. I ain't gonna explain why it does, alot of people will already know.

It's relaxing.

Fair enough we don't know the full extent of medical research into cannabis but I know enough to realise the only danger im putting myself in is exactly the same as somone who smokes heavily and nothing more.

I'm not psychotic and nor do i plan to be :eek:

ronbyrne2005

latest large scale peer reviewed study into cannabis use and psychosis shows definitive link . this is only relating to psychosis and not any other mental illnesses like depression which cannabis is also linked to.


The Marijuana-Psychosis Connection Revisited
Some studies have suggested cannabis use as a risk factor for psychosis, but these studies failed to control for predisposition to psychosis and other confounders. In a German population-based study, researchers used personal interviews at baseline and 4 years later to examine the effects of marijuana use in 2437 young subjects (age range, 14-24). Prevalence of lifetime cannabis use (at least 5 times) was 13% at baseline and 15% at follow-up. Lifetime incidence of one psychotic symptom (based on the Composite International Diagnostic Interview) at follow-up was 17% and incidence of at least two symptoms was 7%. Researchers adjusted results for self-reported psychoticism and paranoia scores at baseline ("psychotic predisposition"), demographics, head-trauma history, and use of other drugs and alcohol.
In a logistic-regression analysis, cannabis use significantly increased risk for any psychotic symptom, with a clear dose-response effect. Psychotic predisposition significantly increased this risk, which was greater in subjects with at least two psychosis symptoms than in those with one symptom. The population-attributable risk (proportion of cases that could be avoided by eliminating the risk factor) was 6% overall and 14% for participants with psychotic predisposition.

Comment: Cannabis use clearly increased the risk for any psychotic symptom; having more symptoms, psychotic predisposition, or more frequent cannabis use strengthened this association. These findings are consistent with cannabis effects on increasing dopamine release in the frontal lobe, with the increase in cannabinoid receptors in schizophrenic brains, and with increased levels of endogenous cannabinoids in the spinal fluid of schizophrenic individuals. Given the minimal level of psychotic symptoms examined in this study, its findings may pertain more to schizophrenic-spectrum and atypical-psychotic conditions than to more narrowly defined schizophrenia.

— Peter Roy-Byrne, MD

Published in Journal Watch Psychiatry January 27, 2005

Source

Henquet C et al. Prospective cohort study of cannabis use, predisposition for psychosis, and psychotic symptoms in young people. BMJ 2005 Jan 1; 330:11.

Blisterman

I don't smoke weed, but my alter ego does.

Endurance Man

The weed in Ireland is really not very good (of course i heard that through the grapevine).

Andy-Pandy

Endurance Man wrote:

The weed in Ireland is really not very good (of course i heard that through the grapevine).

You just dont know the right people:v: . Skunk and widow is avaiable, pricy though.

Endurance Man

Andy-Pandy wrote:

You just dont know the right people:v: . Skunk and widow is avaiable, pricy though.

Oh, im sure there is good stuff to be had, but back home even the bad stuff is much better than some of the stuff here. I think they dip it in something, benzine perhaps .

Dave!

Blisterman wrote:

I don't smoke weed, but my alter ego does.

What a selfish b*astard -- he's gonna f*ck up your head!

spiderlegs

Stuff here is bad..when you're used to having good pure grass if you buy any grass it always tastes nasty and doesn't leave you feelin' as "nice" as your own grass.

However I don't think that cannabis and mental illness would have an obvious link, most medical studies just want to disuade people from taking drugs, they do the same with alcohol.
I think that grass in moderation is good, however I regret to say that taking a lot of grass does affect people and as corny as you may think this sounds it does change peoples personalities...I knew two lovely funny intelligent people
who took grass on a regular basis and they have both changed...and not for the best , they're not the same people they used to be and it is upsetting to see them now. It's like everything you have to be sensible with what you're doing.
Everything in moderation!!

alantc

Endurance Man wrote:

Oh, im sure there is good stuff to be had, but back home even the bad stuff is much better than some of the stuff here. I think they dip it in something, benzine perhaps .

Where do people get ideas like this??

slipss

I agree that the cross over between cannibas use and mental ilness is unusually high (the same has been said about alcohol many times) but wouldn't ppl with mental illness tendencies be more likely to smoke more cannibas because of its calming/relaxing qualities. Chickens and eggs. Sorry bout the bad spelling I'm pretty stoned

Sweetness!

My mate got hash a few weeks ago and it tasted like it had been dipped in fairy liquid twas nasty. I much prefer pure grass when I smoke it, can't stand hash

Amazotheamazing

I've asked this before, and I don't think it was answered, why did the government prohibit cannabis in the first place? (Don't give me the hemp was too super fantastic for industry to allow be used argument).

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

the americans politely asked the europeans, and the europeans politely licked the americans assholes and said "certainly sirs"

slipss

I think the official line is its prohibited because its addictive and it didn't have the kind of money behind it at the time that alcohol and nicotine had so there was no one buying its legality, in the USA, and most nations follow Americas example.

Amazotheamazing

Why? Please don't re-iterate the hemp was a wonder substance thing, coal-mine owners didn't stand in the way of electricity, horse breeders didn't suppress motorcars, i know the theory and it simply isn't credible.

Cheers slipss, while that's probably true, I wonder why they'd re-legalise alcohol but ban cannabis.

Dave!

http://blogs.salon.com/0002762/stories/2003/12/22/whyIsMarijuanaIllegal.html

grumpy 'ol man

why did they decide to test these 15 year old kids??? why not take a look at eastern cultures, in regions where hashish is a staple part of their culture?? i dare speculate that there is not a lot of schizo's in such places, more so than anywhere else i mean. indeed, weed like anything, is only beneficial in moderation. Particular individuals are more susceptible to its benefits( people undergoing chemo) while others are perhaps more susceptible to the nasty side effects it can have( those of us unfortunate enough to be "disturbed, menatlly ill" etc. disregard the hoopla of "latest research findings" etc...thats been going on for the past 80 years or so....smoke it, if it works for you, keep on smokin...............

drdre

why even smoke hash, pay abit extra and get pure weed like white widow or purple haze.i have not smoke hash in ages now cause grass is much better:D

HashSlinging

slipss wrote:

I think the official line is its prohibited because its addictive and it didn't have the kind of money behind it at the time that alcohol and nicotine had so there was no one buying its legality, in the USA, and most nations follow Americas example.

Not true, most of the major nicotine manufacturers had already designed cigarettes that contained cannabis, it was about to be legalised and congress voted against. I "think" thats what happend. memory sort of a blur.

grumpy 'ol man

And as to the history of our prohibition, our drug laws are largely second hand american laws...from the 30's to the present the us has had a stranglehold on the WHO and the UN....they basically control international drug laws....Cannabis was a victim of racial and financial issues etc. A great big chunk of good 'ol usa morality played its part too.....

slipss

just one thing, I have a friend of a friend that has been selling home grown weed that he grows on the window sills in his flat, as white widow and skunk and purple haze for years and charging crazy prices, at least with hash theres not much difference in quality. theres less chance you will get ripped off, and I know there will be people that are going to post saying they can always tell wether they have good weed or not. Well if you tell someone you have the finest white widow flown in from holland and give it the big sell, they will almost always be back with there friends saying it was ****ingg amazing and could they please have some more. or so the friend of a friend told me.

Amazotheamazing

UN is a post WW2 invention, not sure about WHO. Why would Russia or Germany agree to American laws in the 1930's? Why would the UK, seeing as they don't agree to plenty of US laws as it is.

slipss

drdre wrote:

why even smoke hash, pay abit extra and get pure weed like white widow or purple haze.i have not smoke hash in ages now cause grass is much better:D

see above

HashSlinging

Eh hello? a good dutch friend of mine grows for the shops in Amsterdam, he grows basic weed (forget the name) and they sell it on as "brand ABC".

Endurance Man

slipss wrote:

just one thing, I have a friend of a friend that has been selling home grown weed that he grows on the window sills in his flat, as white widow and skunk and purple haze for years and charging crazy prices, at least with hash theres not much difference in quality. theres less chance you will get ripped off, and I know there will be people that are going to post saying they can always tell wether they have good weed or not. Well if you tell someone you have the finest white widow flown in from holland and give it the big sell, they will almost always be back with there friends saying it was ****ingg amazing and could they please have some more. or so the friend of a friend told me.

Hash is ****! Seriously, its poo, save up and buy the real stuff, its worth it. Its like buying that cheap knock off coke that lidl sell, not even close to the real stuff.

grumpy 'ol man

funny thing is slipss, there is a fair bit of dutch weed floating about! and yes there is middle of the road weed floating about too....

grumpy 'ol man

amazo, the us, while having this grip on the UN and who, where the only one's to claim to have definitive scientific evidence that backed up their prohibitive stance-harry anslinger etc. drugs were also claimed as being dangerous for society as a whole....

Amazotheamazing

And cannabis was made illegal before the UN existed.

drdre

theres loadz of orange bud going around.anyway the point of this thread is that all this stuff is bad for you so we should not be naming the types etc.its serious topic:D

slipss

ok just one more thing for this thread hash is stronger than weed

slipss

botanicaly and chemicaly speaking of course

grumpy 'ol man

the cornerstone of all drug prohibition is the harrisson act in 1914 (US) again this was informed by fears of the degardation of society..the blackman using cocaine and raping white women etc. these where widespread, "genuine" fears back then.....the harrison act was informed by a prominent medical man who lobbied intensely with this racial degeneracy crap.....subsequently anslinger promoted such beliefs and we are living their legacy now......