Are People in Dublin less patriotic than others?

KieranusTyranus

If you did a poll of people in my community almost everyone would be in favour of an united Ireland except for a few die hard Fine Gaelers and the crazy guy who walks around town all day carrying a sign that says "Jesus is my friend"
However in Dublin people take a more Westbrit approach. Maybe its just in posh areas im not sure i dont which are posh and which are drugland.

Royale with Cheese

In 'drugland' I think you will find many people in favour of a united Ireland, and a few people who vote for Sinn Féin. I don't live in a hugely posh area but I did attend a private school so many would consider me to be relatively posh. Personally I think the quest for a united Ireland will cause too much suffering and I have washed my hands of the situation. I don't particularly care and I know many who feel the same way.

Sand

A lot of "posh" people in Dublin actually have jobs, so they pay taxes as opposed to receiving farm subsidies. Pehaps theyre understandbly uncertain about a costly scheme with no real rational argument behind it, seeing as theyll be paying for it.

giveth

Why do you associate wanting a united Ireland with patriotism? I would regard myself as patriotic - I'm very proud to be Irish, etc, but I dont want a united Ireland as I think it's in the best interests of this country. Terrorism could spread to the south and it would be financially very expensive to support the north.

pickarooney

Not being a thousand years old, I don't remember a united Ireland, so I have a hard time wanting it back.

KieranusTyranus

Sand your comments about farm subsidies just shows your ignorance. You seem to be under the illusion everyone in the countryside is a farmer which is obviously not true. The vast majority are not. I found that comment offensive and I hope the mods take note of it. Also farmers still pay taxes. Where did you get the idea they dont??

Moral of the story: Before you make comments on rural Ireland please get the facts right.

Sand

Sand your comments about farm subsidies just shows your ignorance. You seem to be under the illusion everyone in the countryside is a farmer which is obviously not true. The vast majority are not. Building is probably the dominant trade in rural areas. I found that comment offensive and I hope the mods take note of it. Also farmers still pay taxes. Where did you get the idea they dont??

*My* ignorance? As opposed to the post being ignorant? So youre saying Im ignorant? Sounds like a personal attack on my good self. Quick if you hurry you can edit it...

Maybe whilst youre busy climbing onto the high moral ground you could point out where I said anything about "everyone in the countryside"? Maybe whilst wailing about your offence and opposition to generalised slurs you might re-examine your use of posh west brits as a description for Dubliners who dont agree with you?

Laguna

What do you regard as *Irish patriotism*?, I'm guessing from your comments on a 'united ireland' you're wondering why on average less people in Dublin go to see Wolfe Tone concerts?.

People often say, what benefit would the republic gain in gaining control over the north?, my main belief is, what would anyone in the north, Catholics included, have to gain from joining the south?

KieranusTyranus

You phrased your ost in a way that suggested people in rural areas are all farmers who receive subsidies and pay little or no taxes. If that is not an ignorant opinion i dont know what is.

ratboy

i'd say many people are republican and believe in a united ireland ideally but the sinn fein/IRA method of achieving as smeared **** on the whole idea, for me anyway.

I suppose I wouldn't object, as long as it doesn't end up costing me too much.

therecklessone

KieranusTyranus wrote:

You phrased your ost in a way that suggested people in rural areas are all farmers who receive subsidies and pay little or no taxes. If that is not an ignorant opinion i dont know what is.

I know what's an ignorant opinion.

KieranusTyranus wrote:

However in Dublin people take a more Westbrit approach. Maybe its just in posh areas im not sure i dont which are posh and which are drugland.

Thats an ignorant opinion.

Diorraing

giveth wrote:

Why do you associate wanting a united Ireland with patriotism? I would regard myself as patriotic - I'm very proud to be Irish, etc, but I dont want a united Ireland as I think it's in the best interests of this country. Terrorism could spread to the south and it would be financially very expensive to support the north.

W.B. Yeats studied patriotism as a concept and came to regard people such as Wolfe Tone and Emmet to be patriots - because they wanted to end British Rule in Ireland. Wanting a United Ireland means wanting to end British Rule in Ireland. Therefore wanting a United Ireland makes one patriotic.

oscarBravo

What a strange thought. If a Frenchman wants a united Ireland, does that make him patriotic?

"Patriot: One who loves, supports and defends one's country." Frankly, I find that definition hard to reconcile with Irish "republicanism".

bonkey

KieranusTyranus wrote:

However in Dublin people take a more Westbrit approach.

...
I found that comment offensive and I hope the mods take note of it.
...
Moral of the story: Before you make comments on rural Ireland please get the facts right.

As opposed to when making comments about urban ireland, clearly.

Zombrex

KieranusTyranus, you should work for George Bush ... the tactic of stating a goal (e.g. United Ireland, invading Iraq etc) and then stating that people who don't believe in, or support that goal are unpatriotic, is a common tactic used by the Republicans in the USA

In reality, if there is really a higher number of people in Dublin who don't support a united Ireland, I would conclude not that they are unpatriotic, but more that they are being more realistic. Rather than allowing an irrational emotional response ("up da 'ra!") to dictate their opinions to serious economic and social ideas, they are looking at the reality of situation and have realised that uniting Ireland and Northern Ireland would be a really bad idea

The Corinthian

KieranusTyranus wrote:

If you did a poll of people in my community almost everyone would be in favour of an united Ireland except for a few die hard Fine Gaelers and the crazy guy who walks around town all day carrying a sign that says "Jesus is my friend"

I take it this is a scientifically derived poll :rolleyes:

I think one of the things that many of the “I’ll stand behind the man, behind the man, behind the wire” (typically in an armchair, I may add) republicans do is that they seem to confuse jingoism for patriotism.

It seems pretty obvious, even to the untrained eye, that unification would be economically catastrophic. Northern Ireland’s economy is simply not viable without the vast quantities of cash that the UK is pumping into it - do you think we can match that? And that’s even before we consider the Unionist community and how we would have to change in a united Ireland to keep them happy. Assuming they don’t take up arms against Dublin. Hell, assuming the Nationalists don’t take up arms against Dublin, either.

The problem with jingoism is that it makes light of the real cost of such policies and attempts to stifle debate with the threat of branding dissenters as unpatriotic. But, let’s be honest, if a policy results in economic ruin and civil war, what is that but unpatriotic.

seedot

This thread is a good illustration of why we should cast the rest of the country adrift, put checkpoints on the M50 and stop subsidising the other 25 layabout counties.

First they came for the farm subsidies, then they came for the civil servants..........

Lemming

"Patriotism is the virtue of the vicious"

- Oscar Wilde



Now, quotation aside, I find the the language used in the opening post to be highly offensive. I am not in favour of a united Ireland at present because I believe that it would not serve the greater good of this country. Economically it would be suicide for this country and there is the whole issue of civil unrest being easily spread due to a lack of borders. Therefore I am labelled "posh" or a "west brit", a phrase that is synonomous 'in its use with those who are closed minded, terrorist-supporting ludites.

Exactly what the f*ck is a "west brit", other than Ireland's equivalent of the term "liberal" in the United States? It's a phrase with no meaning other than to sling mud. Grow up.

Apart from 2 or 3 contributions here, this thread is disappointing me for its gibberish.

It would want to improve radically or it will be closed...

HelterSkelter

KieranusTyranus wrote:

Maybe its just in posh areas im not sure i dont which are posh and which are drugland.

By drugland I presume you are referring to working class areas. I find that very offensive. You have the typical small country town ignorant attitude. I work with a lot of people like that, young country lads who recently moved to Dublin to get a job. They think everyone in Dublin is either "posh" or drugy scum, there is no in between. Their attitude soon changes though when the've been living here for a while and find that the majority of working class are honest hard working people who don't do drugs.

Zebra3

pickarooney wrote:

Not being a thousand years old, I don't remember a united Ireland, so I have a hard time wanting it back.

There are plenty of people alive today who can remember a united Ireland. You don't need to be a thousand years old. :rolleyes:

gandalf

Shutting down this utter tripe, I have also marked a couple of peoples cards who posted on this thread. If they come to my attention again there will be bannings!