9800pro or X800?

regeneration

Simple question the title suggests - I want to get a new gfx card, and although money is no question, I would only go for the x800 option if it had a noticeable difference in performance proportionate to cost against the 9800pro... so what is the better option? And which vendor for that matter? jes-computer.de offers the Lite version of the Sapphire 9800pro along with several flavours of x800...

My current rig is an AMD 3200+, 1gig DDR RAM, ATI 9600XT, so I want to pick up the flagging gfx card...

mayordenis

x800 is tha answer thats all you need to know, if your playing games and money isnt a problem then at this stage a 9800 would be silly

regeneration

yeah but my arguement is whether the performance gains warrents the extra cash paid out...

I am MAN

waste of money

9800 will run anything.

forbairt

to be honest ... I think it'd be a waste of money .. about 200 EUR extra ??

you'll get 10 .. maybe 20 fps .. extra ... its not gonna make that much of a difference ... for your normal games ... check out the benchmarks .. tomshardware.com ?? or one of those sites and see the differences...


edit: http://graphics.tomshardware.com/graphic/20041004/index.html

regeneration

I am MAN wrote:

waste of money

9800 will run anything.

Yeah so does my 9600xt, but i want something that runs anything perfectly and includes hl2 lol

forbairt

http://graphics.tomshardware.com/graphic/20041004/vga_charts-07.html


the doom 3 ... test....

all boils down to ... wanting the best ... if you've got the money go for it

mayordenis

i have a 9800pro and im really starting to notice performance drops now ive had it a year and if i were to buy something new it wouldnt be 9800pro because in half a years time it will only be keeping up it wont be running everything with ease

Ardent

I have a 9800, paid 218 euros for it three or four months ago. It's a kick-ass card and comfortably handles everything out there. I'm sure they're cheaper now.

I am MAN

I dont know multimedia stuff is far too powerful for alot of stuff today, It's stupid having to change cards so often its like disposable hardware,

Ardent

regeneration wrote:

Yeah so does my 9600xt, but i want something that runs anything perfectly and includes hl2 lol

If you want something that's going to be future proof (if there's ever such a thing) and money's no object as you say, then go for a GeForce 6800 Ultra.

forbairt

ah I wouldn't go for the ultra .. just the 6800 the increase with the ultra isn't really worth it ...

regeneration

@Ardent
Where did you pick it up from at that price? Oh and Im an ATI man, I dont trust or like Nvidia's products

hmmmmm the difference between the two cards is more than just 10 or 15fps it seems - there's quite a jump. The last two cards Ive bought have been a 9600xt and Gefroce3Ti200 - both have gone from comfortable performers to major chugging in the space of months - the 9600 is only 7 months old - that's insane. I have a funny feeling that in the same space of time the 9800 will e unable to handle the next generaton of engines; and that's my reason for spending the extra cash. I _dont_ want to spend 200 on an ok card now, and then get p*ssed cos it cant handle the generic ww2 shooter in 2005

I know future proofing is inpossible, but i can at least try..

naitkris

i also have a 9800 Pro and it is the best value/performance for money at the moment, but if you really want the best go for a X800 Pro or 6800GT or even better the X800XT or 6800 Ultra although i wouldn't buy any of those 4 cards unless you have one of the fastest processors and lots of fast RAM to boot as an AMD XP or even 64 3200 processor will start to become a bottle neck...

I am MAN

I wont even be buying a 9800 pro for my next card I dont need it

forbairt

205 for a 9800 pro 128 mb ...

http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.asp?sku=120304&cks=PRL

10 for shipping ...

= 215 possible cheaper out there. ..

regeneration

well that's the other thing error9, i dont want 128Mb card, I want a 256 one... jes-computer.de does the 256 version for 275... and i recall the saphirre 256 version of the x800 for 419...

forbairt

edit: jes does 256MB ATI Original Radeon 9800 Pro bulk - 259 ...

its bulk mind ... so not retail version...

komplett's got the 9800 pro .. 256 .. ultra edition for 345
http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.asp?sku=119629&cks=PRL


damn wonder if komplett wanna give me a job

if you're going up to that might as well ... go the extra hundred ... I'd get teh 6800 ... I've got a 128 mb 9800 and I'm happy enough .. but I'm a nvidia man myself

Prior Of Taize

Powercolor x800 Pro from komplett

€420...it runs anything...

To be honest its not that an immediate difference shows but when games come out in 4 or 5 months time and your 9800 can run them for **** then you see the money being well spent on an x800 or 6800...

I am MAN

but there wont be any games in 4 - 5 months that the 9800 wont run for SH*T

regeneration

compare the ability of your graphics card in handling plain ordinary quake 3 arena against Call of Duty, the most recent development of the q3 engine; the doom3 and Source engines (along with other engines like the STALKER one) will be modified and upped beyond it's original ability ...
my card cant even handle Dawn of War at the moment without seriously reducing the detail, ditto Rome: Total war...

El_MUERkO

If you decide on an X800 get an X800 Pro VIVO, they can be softmod'd to an X800 XT easily, to be honest I'd go with a 6800 GT at the moment and I'm a rabid ATI fanboi.

Ardent

regeneration wrote:

@Ardent
Where did you pick it up from at that price? Oh and Im an ATI man, I dont trust or like Nvidia's products

I got it from Komplett: http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.asp?sku=120304&cks=PRL

Trust me, it's a great card. With this and a P4 2.8 Ghz and 1 GB of RAM, I'm getting super framerates in Doom 3 at the highest resolution. Other games like Rome Total War and FarCry with all the full settings purr as well. I'm sure Half Life 2 will be happy with it as well.

MrPinK

The X800 was a big improvement over the 9800. Take a look at any benchmarks, this was a truely impressive performance boost and not just the usual 10/15 extra fps you usually get going from one generation card to the next. Definitely worth the extra money imho.

But if money isn't an option like you said, why would you want to go with an inferior card?

EDIT:

error9 wrote:

you'll get 10 .. maybe 20 fps .. extra ... its not gonna make that much of a difference ... for your normal games ... check out the benchmarks .. tomshardware.com ?? or one of those sites and see the differences...


edit: http://graphics.tomshardware.com/graphic/20041004/index.html

Did you look actually look at those benchmarks before posting them? There's a 75-115% increase (depending on resolution) with Far Cry for example. That certainly isn't small potatoes.

TacT

MrPinK wrote:

The X800 was a big improvement over the 9800. Take a look at any benchmarks, this was a truely impressive performance boost and not just the usual 10/15 extra fps you usually get going from one generation card to the next. Definitely worth the extra money imho.

But if money isn't an option like you said, why would you want to go with an inferior card?

EDIT:

Did you look actually look at those benchmarks before posting them? There's a 75-115% increase (depending on resolution) with Far Cry for example. That certainly isn't small potatoes.

I think he's trying to convince himself his outdated hardware is just as good as the new hardware that's been released so the cost of upgrading doesn't bite him in the ass

There is more than a small difference to be had going from a 9800pro to an X800 :eek:

ViperVenoM

there is indeed, im almost tempted to upgrade just from my 9800xt to an x800xt..let alone choose between the 2!...however i think im gonna wait for the new cores...combined with SLI...oooo

BloodBath

I got it from Komplett: http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.asp?sku=120304&cks=PRL

Trust me, it's a great card. With this and a P4 2.8 Ghz and 1 GB of RAM, I'm getting super framerates in Doom 3 at the highest resolution. Other games like Rome Total War and FarCry with all the full settings purr as well. I'm sure Half Life 2 will be happy with it as well.

No offence but that's complete BS. I have a 3.6ghz P4 with a 9800xt and 1gb of 500mhz ram and I can't play Doom3 on maximum resolution and high detail and get a good frame rate. Now either your highest resolution is 640x480 or else your idea of super frame rates is an average of 20-30. I play on 1024x768 with ultra detail and get an avergae of about 30-40fps. This is with a better rig and that is not a good fps by any means.

I'd advise you to hold out another few months for Ati's new core.


BloodBath

forbairt

MrPinK wrote:

The X800 was a big improvement over the 9800. Take a look at any benchmarks, this was a truely impressive performance boost and not just the usual 10/15 extra fps you usually get going from one generation card to the next. Definitely worth the extra money imho.

But if money isn't an option like you said, why would you want to go with an inferior card?

EDIT:

Did you look actually look at those benchmarks before posting them? There's a 75-115% increase (depending on resolution) with Far Cry for example. That certainly isn't small potatoes.

to be honest I didn't ... as you'll see later on I say go for it if you've got the money to spare I had wanted to get the 6800 when I was buying my system but ... *sniff sniff* couldn't justify the cost of the wee beasty...

forbairt

BloodBath wrote:

No offence but that's complete BS. I have a 3.6ghz P4 with a 9800xt and 1gb of 500mhz ram and I can't play Doom3 on maximum resolution and high detail and get a good frame rate. Now either your highest resolution is 640x480 or else your idea of super frame rates is an average of 20-30. I play on 1024x768 with ultra detail and get an avergae of about 30-40fps. This is with a better rig and that is not a good fps by any means.

I'd advise you to hold out another few months for Ati's new core.


BloodBath

doom 3 on full uses something like 512 mbs of textures ... and my card which is a 128mb 9800 .. plays .. very slugishly ...

Ardent

BloodBath wrote:

No offence but that's complete BS. I have a 3.6ghz P4 with a 9800xt and 1gb of 500mhz ram and I can't play Doom3 on maximum resolution and high detail and get a good frame rate. Now either your highest resolution is 640x480 or else your idea of super frame rates is an average of 20-30. I play on 1024x768 with ultra detail and get an avergae of about 30-40fps. This is with a better rig and that is not a good fps by any means.

I'd advise you to hold out another few months for Ati's new core.


BloodBath

I'm hurt that you think I'm lying.

Seriously, I'm getting the same frame rates you're getting (for me, anything above 30 FPS is good enough, but that's me). My FPS in the demo tests average around 40 and rarely will my FPS drop below 30, unless I'm in a vicious burly brawl type scenario. For the record, I have the Doom3-optimised Catalyst drivers and various tweaks to boost the game. I'm shocked to be honest, with your rig, that you're not getting more FPS from the game.

davmigil

Going from a 9600XT to a 9800Pro isn't a massive generation change...Doesn't seem worth the money. If you have the money, I'm sure the X800 is nice (or 6800GT). Boils down to whether you are happy spending 400 every X months, or 200 every 1/2X months really. Then when you throw PCI-express into mix, you have to factor in that if you decide to go that route in the future what you do with your legacy equipment.

My value of X is 48 months, so I go for the 200 option, as i find the todays top spec card is tomorrows mid range card.

Two things worth waiting for at the moment:

1. Some real benchmarks on HL2
2. The availability of 6600GT AGP cards and how they perform vs 9800Pro

And also komplett to get some GFX cards into stock (don't like Powercolor, have more faith in Sapphire).

regeneration

Indeed, but it's anyone's guess how long a card will last given the change - I'd say 48 months is a touch generous, but then it would be top of the (present) range of cards. I will probably way for HL2 anyway to come out lol. as for PCI express, well im ruling it out for the moment. I will wait at least for another few week's pay packages

secret_squirrel

Save your money and wait - the jump in performance between a 9600XT t0 9800Pro isnt worth it - and whilst the jump is between a 9600XT and an X800 is - if you wait until after Xmas then prices will probably drop due to both supply being sorted and Xmas profit taking being finished. Also you will have a chance to evaluate how well HL2 runs on your 9600XT - there might even be a few mods out just after xmas......

BloodBath

I wouldn't worry about HL2. The engine is a year old now. Far Cry and doom3 are more stressful than it.


BloodBath

regeneration

huh? the Source engine has been in development for five years, as was the doom3 too.

CivilServant

BloodBath wrote:

I wouldn't worry about HL2. The engine is a year old now. Far Cry and doom3 are more stressful than it.


BloodBath

True. The benchmarks show that doom3 is a lot more stressful than the source engine. 9800 Pros are running the source engine benchmark with excellent framerates.

BloodBath

huh? the Source engine has been in development for five years, as was the doom3 too.

That doesn't mean they will come out the same. HL2 is over a year overdue. It would have been stressful and really groundbreaking if they got it out september 2003 but 14 months on most of us have at least 9800pro's. Judging from cs-source, the hl2 alpha and reviews i've read it will run very well on anything above a 9800pro. Even the 9600's will run it quite well.


BloodBath

regeneration

BloodBath wrote:

... 14 months on most of us have at least 9800pro's...

we do ? that's nice; must mention to the 90% of people i know that they atually have 9800's and not the midrange cards they only "think" they have

f1refox

Why not just get a new board with pci express and get a pci express card which will out preform any agp card out there. That's if you want the best :rolleyes: .

Nukem

When are all these new PCI-E graphics cards coming out?
Its kinda poor selection at the moment.Still gonna wait a month or two ta see what happens.

astrofool

there's 0 performance difference between an agp8x card and pci-e card. In fact, there's virtually a 0 performance difference when running an agp8x card at agp4x speeds.

Prior Of Taize

{QUOTE!!!}
"Trust me, it's a great card. With this and a P4 2.8 Ghz and 1 GB of RAM, I'm getting super framerates in Doom 3 at the highest resolution. Other games like Rome Total War and FarCry with all the full settings purr as well. I'm sure Half Life 2 will be happy with it as well. "
{END QUOTE!!!}

Im running a 3.2Ghz 64 bit with 1.5 Gb's of DDR-400 and an X800Pro 256Mb Gddr3 and Doom3 runs off a S-ATA Hard Drive and i cant run it at full res on a new 19" Samsung monitor...Now my machine clearly rapes your machine...So where the fook are you getting a solid frame rate from...maybe you are scrolling through screenshots at high speed or something

Bear in mind that HL2 will supposedly run on something like an 800Mhz...so your pc with its 9800 doorstop graphics card will certainly be up to the task...

(Also the Sapphire 9800 Pro ULTIMATE EDITION(!!!!!) is the only 9800 worth buying imo)

[url]http://www.driverheaven.net/showthread.php?p=423812[/url] for HL2 benchmarks (ATi EATS the NVidia card!!!)