CELTIC v BARCELONA

Dub13 · 14-09-2004 4:49pm #1

Any team news yet....is Henrik going to start...?

eirebhoy · 14-09-2004 5:04pm

It looks like Henke will start on the bench with Ronaldinho coming in to replace him and Eto'o as the lone striker in front of Ronnie and Guily.

Celtic's team is pretty easy to predict. Even though Sutton trained I don't think he'll start as he can't be fully match fit.

Marshall

Agathe

Balde

Varga

McNamara

Petrov----Lennon----Thompson

Juninho

Camara

Hartson

Deco was given Celtic a lot of stick today so expect him to get a hostile reception. I'm looking forward to the inevitible shiver down the spine when I hear 60,000 Celts singing You'll never walk alone.

I read yesterday that When Celtic played Juve it was watched by 2,000,000 Scots. Considering the population of Scotland is not far off the population of the Island of Ireland that is some figure.
http://www.celticprogrammesonline.com/PROGRAMME%20COVERS/0102/juventus0102.htm

jesus_thats_gre · 14-09-2004 5:15pm

eirebhoy wrote:

I'm looking forward to the inevitible shiver down the spine when I hear 60,000 Celts singing You'll never walk alone.

Robbing bastards

eirebhoy · 14-09-2004 5:20pm

jesus_thats_gre wrote:

Robbing bastards

It's who sings it better that counts.

The FAI have started playing it before games now too.

I just read that Sutton is expected to start. I don't know whether to be happy, Camara looked very good on Saturday and a Hartson-Sutton partnership is hardly the fastest. He could play in midfield with Juninho behind Hartson though.

Dub13 · 14-09-2004 7:08pm

anybody no whay the game is delayed....?

Pat Bonner does not no what to say.

mike65 · 14-09-2004 7:38pm

Crowd congestion, Decos scores! G'wan Barca!

Mike.

Dub13 · 14-09-2004 8:29pm

Barca just missed a peno...

Dub13 · 14-09-2004 8:32pm

Goal.....for Celtic...Sutton

Dub13 · 14-09-2004 8:53pm

2:1 to Barca

mike65 · 14-09-2004 8:57pm

Larrrrrrrrsonnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn! Rofl!

Mike.

Dub13 · 14-09-2004 8:57pm

3:1 Larrson of all people

eirebhoy · 14-09-2004 9:15pm

There goes the end of the CL campaign for 04/05.

First home defeat in Europe since 2001. Camara, Balde and Marshall were Celtic's best players IMO. Camara really impressed me. Barca didn't know what to do when it went to 1-1 but as soon as they got the 2nd it was heads down from then on.

Makaveli · 14-09-2004 9:18pm

Not really true.
Granted it was hectic once Celtic scored and they took control with some good attacks. However, it didn't take long for Barca to get back in and control the play and tempo again. The back four were happy to knock it about waiting for an opportunity.

A fair score in the end. Barca should have been 3 up at least at half time, and the peno miss, well it was a good save.

3-1 I'm happy. Good performance.

Johnny_the_fox · 14-09-2004 9:30pm

poor defending / central midfield cost celtic

McNamara had a nightmare in defence.

Makaveli · 14-09-2004 9:44pm

McNamara should have been sent off actually, forgot about that. And the initial contact was outside the box so probably fair that Marshall made the save.

eirebhoy · 14-09-2004 9:45pm

There was a few mistakes by Celtic but I honestly don't think they played badly. I would put it all down the the formation both teams played. Balde and Varga would usually have a player to keep an eye on but I don't think they were expecting Eto'o and Guily to play so wide. I think MON was expecting Barca to play more through the middle. That is why O'Neill changed the formation at half time and it definitely worked, Camara was a menice.

Both teams had fairly equal amount of shots, Celtic 10 (6 on target), Barca 14 (8 on target). I don't think Camara is getting the credit he deserves in the ratings:
http://skysports.planetfootball.com/matchratings.asp?fxid=268608&v=yes

jesus_thats_gre · 14-09-2004 9:45pm

Legend of a game. Celtic were lucky to only concede 3!

eirebhoy · 14-09-2004 9:56pm

jesus_thats_gre wrote:

Legend of a game. Celtic were lucky to only concede 3!

I have to say JTG, 1-3 is definitely no more than Barca or Celtic deserve. Celtic had some superb chances (Petrov volley with left foot, Bellinni (sp?) really close to an og, Petrov freekick, Sutton/Varga headers). I think there's a bit of bias in that quote, both teams could have scored more.

Makaveli · 14-09-2004 10:05pm

Both teams could certainly have scored more.
Giuly could have had a hat-trick. He has scored in all three games so far this season, so looking good.

Belletti worries me. As a full back going forward he's decent enough, his crosses need a lot of work though. As a defender he's weakish though. The above mentioned almost own goal, and he missed the ball from Petrov's cross (I think it was Petrov) that Sutton scored from.

Gio had a good game, and could have scored a couple.

One player Barca are missing is Thiago Motta. He's a far more dominant player than Gerard. He's out for six months though after tearing cruciate ligaments in his knee on Saturday against Sevilla.

Like I said before, 3-1 was a fair enough representation of the game imo.

jesus_thats_gre · 14-09-2004 10:49pm

eirebhoy wrote:

I have to say JTG, 1-3 is definitely no more than Barca or Celtic deserve. Celtic had some superb chances (Petrov volley with left foot, Bellinni (sp?) really close to an og, Petrov freekick, Sutton/Varga headers). I think there's a bit of bias in that quote, both teams could have scored more.

If you say so.. Fancy comparing the amount of genine chances they had where last second tackles or fine goal keeping stopped the goal? I can think of 1 or 2 for Celtic, how many can you count for Barca? 10? 11?

eirebhoy · 14-09-2004 11:15pm

jesus_thats_gre wrote:

If you say so.. Fancy comparing the amount of genine chances they had where last second tackles or fine goal keeping stopped the goal? I can think of 1 or 2 for Celtic, how many can you count for Barca? 10? 11?

But how can you put that down to luck? Its Marshall's job to save shots and Balde's job to tackle. Lucky is if an opposing player player is ruled offside when he wasn't or even if they hit the post a couple of times. I don't know if you can take much from this but 17% of Celtic's shots on target went in while 38% of Barca's went in. If you are counting fine saves as luck I can only assume from those stats that Barca were at least just as lucky.

BTW - McNamara is supposed to have broken his ankle which means Valgaeran is LB for a good while.

jesus_thats_gre · 14-09-2004 11:19pm

Basically what I am saying it took some last gaps tackles/saves in the first 65 mins to keep it at 1 nil.. Barca were the vastly superior team up to the Celtic goal. Celtic then out the pressure on for 15/20 mins before Barca burried it.. Barca are an infinetly superior side on both the pitch and paper..

therecklessone · 14-09-2004 11:45pm

Good match all told, Celtic were a mess in the first half (apart from Bobo's tackling and Marshall's keeping) but between Roni missing the peno and Barca's rather fortunate 2nd goal Celtic looked the better side. Barca were rattled.

Balde looked very composed, great tackling throughout, but he was caught position-wise for the first goal, he should have been closer to Deco.

Marshall is a gem, brilliant keeping from him again. He didn't deserve to concede three.

Has Neil Lennon ever put in a good performance when it mattered for Celtic. He was pure muck.

Camara was excellent in the 2nd half, but poor in the first.

Makaveli · 14-09-2004 11:55pm

How can a team be a complete mess in half a match yet look the better side?
They looked the better side for 20 minutes.

therecklessone · 15-09-2004 12:02am

Makaveli wrote:

How can a team be a complete mess in half a match yet look the better side?
They looked the better side for 20 minutes.

I obviously have to spell this one out.

Here's what I said, with the relevant bits in bold:

therecklessone wrote:

Celtic were a mess in the first half (apart from Bobo's tackling and Marshall's keeping) but between Roni missing the peno and Barca's rather fortunate 2nd goal Celtic looked the better side.

Roni missed his peno in the 2nd half, and Barca scored their 2nd goal after that. So for a portion of the 2nd half Celtic looked the better side.

Makaveli · 15-09-2004 12:07am

Ah ha, yes my fault.
Thanks for the bold text.

therecklessone · 15-09-2004 12:10am

Makaveli wrote:

Ah ha, yes my fault.
Thanks for the bold text.

Thats all right.

Sorry for the sarky tone by the way, I'm tired and cranky with a bas*ard of a mouth ulcer on the back of my throat...

jesus_thats_gre · 15-09-2004 12:32am

So it settled.. Celtic were **** for 75 mins of the match when Barca were deadly. Celtic were good for 15 mins when Barca was ****..

Close the thread so...

leeroybrown · 15-09-2004 7:48am

This is one of the most entertaining group stage matches I've seen in recent years. Even TV3's commentary couldn't spoil it.

Barcelona ultimately deserved to win but I think it was one of those games that was going to decided by whoever got the goals whiole they had the upper hand. Celtic almost got the neccessary goal(s) but when Barcelona got the chances they put them away. It was typical of Larsson's quality to kill off his old team.

Barcelona gave me the distinct impression of a team who will win a lot of matches by scoring more than their opposition. I must remember to watch them this season.

As for Camera, I thought he was dangerous in attack but still looks quite raw. If he improves elements of his game such as decision making and staying onside he could be a very good player.

Mighty_Mouse · 15-09-2004 8:17am

Am I the only one here who thought Camara didn't look like scoring. His crossing of the ball was terrible and he gave them no options up front. TBH I thought Sutton and Hartson were better. Also why didnt ONeill take McNamara off sooner. He was having a mare from early on and ended up booked, giving penalty, a deflecting the ball past his own keeper for a goal!!

Lennon was actually non-existant. The type of fast pacy game that will give him nightmares for the rest of his career!

Marshall was superb. Only for him it would of been 3-1 in the first half alone.

Celtic badly need to do some Christmas shopping.

leeroybrown · 15-09-2004 8:31am

Mighty_Mouse wrote:

Am I the only one here who thought Camara didn't look like scoring. His crossing of the ball was terrible and he gave them no options up front. TBH I thought Sutton and Hartson were better.

Most of his failings were down to poor decision making. He picked the wrong option far too many times.

Also why didnt ONeill take McNamara off sooner. He was having a mare from early on and ended up booked, giving penalty, a deflecting the ball past his own keeper for a goal!!

The penalty was just awful play. I thought that he had time to get along side Giuly and exert some pressure and that Marshall was positioning himself well to deal with the problem.

Lennon was actually non-existant. The type of fast pacy game that will give him nightmares for the rest of his career!

TBH I think Lennon can be a walking disaster area who didn't have a bad game last night. Sometimes when I see him he gives away the ball every time he gets it. By comparison he was good last night.

Marshall was superb. Only for him it would of been 3-1 in the first half alone.

Marshall was top class. The penalty save was good. He dealt with everything well. It was nasty seeing the ball pass so close past him after the deflection. He'll be sickened by that for weeks.

Celtic badly need to do some Christmas shopping.

Considering that MON has only spent 1.5M so far this year I'm wondering what charity shops he could do this at. From what I can see Celtic's (board level) ambitions are to win the SPL and Scottish Cup then put on a good show in the CL before having a reasonable go at the UEFA cup.

KdjaCL · 15-09-2004 8:54am

Celtic fans should learn from this , Barca are a big club Celtic think they a big club.
Celtic beat Barca last season and spend 1.5m and get in some barnados players, barca spend 60 odd million and there is the difference.

Celtic were out classed, I would agree with all the Celtic fans who ahve posted above if celtic were AWAY. Barca stuttuered for large parts but when they finally got moving i was amazed it was only 3. Celtic may have ahd chances but in reality they were never gonna take them. The barca players would have taken those chances.

Away to AC Milan next game ...LOL

Defend ye 1st divison players Defend!.

kdjac

Muzz · 15-09-2004 10:00am

eirebhoy wrote:

There was a few mistakes by Celtic but I honestly don't think they played badly. Camara was a menice.

Do you talk to hear yourself or were you watching a different match. The first half was a nightmare for Celtic. A FEW MISTAKES More like a catalogue of errors mainly from midfield. The one good thing lennon is good at is kepeing the ball and distributing it well...What did he do last night? Gave it away every oppurtunity. And as for Camara...What did he do in the first half? Second half was different when he played wider and got more of the ball. Cant afford to have a player that plays 2nd half only. And as for some of his shooting? Wild to say the least. Shooting from areas he was never going to score from instead of holding it up to help arrived!

As for Mr. Optimistic saying that Champions League dream over for another year. Wise up. Still 5 mathces to go. And one thing for sure Celtic cannot play any worse than they did last night. I look forward to a last 16 place!

eirebhoy · 15-09-2004 10:36am

Muzz wrote:

Do you talk to hear yourself or were you watching a different match. The first half was a nightmare for Celtic. A FEW MISTAKES More like a catalogue of errors mainly from midfield.

I would love to admit that Celtic made a load of error's because at least I'd know we can play much better but I honestly can't think of too many. Thompson's header back to Marshall and McNamara waiting for the keeper to arrive when he could have got the ball himself come to mind. The Jackie deflection was hardly a mistake. I know there were more but "a few" seems about right to me.

Camara set up the Sutton goal BTW. He had no choice but to shoot from far on 1 or 2 occasions as Hartson isn't the fastest.

Muzz, I don't know if you're a Celtic fan but we had to get 7 points at home from the 3 matches and have already failed. We got 7 home points last season and 9 the year before and didn't qualify so I don't expect us to qualify with just 6 home points. There is no way we can qualify with our shambolic away form in the CL. Shaktaar are a decent team with a load of money and Milan the best team in Italy.

therecklessone · 15-09-2004 11:48am

leeroybrown wrote:

Barcelona gave me the distinct impression of a team who will win a lot of matches by scoring more than their opposition.

I see you've grasped the basics of the game then...

Lex Luthor · 15-09-2004 12:03pm

the result brought a big

Johnny_the_fox · 15-09-2004 12:29pm

eirebhoy wrote:

The Jackie deflection was hardly a mistake.

If you go watch the match again.. the mistake was Thompson sliding in and committing himself, creating the space for Barcelona to create the chance down the wing for that goal. The first thing any footballer is taught is NOT to commit yourself..

jesus_thats_gre · 15-09-2004 3:09pm

Johnny_the_fox wrote:

The first thing any footballer is taught is NOT to commit yourself..

Shame he couldn't grasp the basics then!!

And ye wonder why he did not get his England call up

smemon · 15-09-2004 4:12pm

poor by celtic but barca just had too much class.

how anyone can say celtic didnt play badly is beyong me, losing 3-1, saving a penalty, a few last ditch tackles and the odd save suggest to me celtic were very lucky to even have the chance of coming away with a point.

lennon, should be put down, too old, a poor player always thought, as is lambert who didnt play. agathe has been stupid the past 3 years, rubbish in big games and it showed again.

petrov is usually poor too despite showing the potential of a legend early in his career, did alright though last night. thompson was poor by his standards too.

camara didnt impress me, ball didnt stick to him and he couldnt beat a man, if he did he was just lucky. set up the goal and did little else, had one or 2 shots that ended up closer to the corner flag than goal.

best performance was from the fans, drowning out the champions league tune. thats why we want a new big stadium in ireland, imagine that atmosphere at an irish match, we'd crush the banana skin teams at home and rattle the big guns.

jesus_thats_gre · 15-09-2004 4:15pm

smemon wrote:

poor by celtic but barca just had too much class.

how anyone can say celtic didnt play badly is beyong me, losing 3-1, saving a penalty, a few last ditch tackles and the odd save suggest to me celtic were very lucky to even have the chance of coming away with a point.

Exactly what he said!!!!

eirebhoy · 15-09-2004 5:00pm

smemon wrote:

agathe has been stupid the past 3 years, rubbish in big games and it showed again.

Only a month ago you thought Agathe was still a winger so you mustn't get to see much of him. I am a lot more biased towards Irish players than Celtic's but I would rate Agathe ahead of Carr as a right back. Did anything come down Barca's left last night? I wasn't fond of him as a winger but he hasn't been playing there in months.

In that same post you "corrected" me when I said we needed a left back, you also thought Mjallby was still playing for us and Valgaeran was first choice.

jesus_thats_gre wrote:

And ye wonder why he did not get his England call up

http://www.thefa.com/England/SeniorTeam/NewsAndFeatures/Postings/2004/03/Squad_announcement_vSweden.htm

jesus_thats_gre · 15-09-2004 5:44pm

eirebhoy wrote:

http://www.thefa.com/England/SeniorTeam/NewsAndFeatures/Postings/2004/03/Squad_announcement_vSweden.htm

Haha legend.. I look at thee god and ask. Did he actually get a game?

If he did, why has he not kept his place

Muzz · 15-09-2004 5:49pm

Muzz wrote:

And as for Camara...What did he do in the first half? Second half was different when he played wider and got more of the ball.

Get it this time eirebhoy?

As for no choice to shoot because of hartson...all he had to do was hold the ball up. Junihno was arriving aswell (dont tell me he is slow aswell) And Agathe over Carr. HAHA what are you on? The man cant even cross a ball for goodness sake. And as a winger that WAS his ultimate job! But maybe you read it differently. :rolleyes:

What does any Champions League team manager say at the start of the league stages. "Normally" winning all your home games will be enough to see you through. Celtic have been unlucky not to qualify with both 7 and 9 points in the last two campaigns. The shambolic away form in the CL has been due to celtic going there in the aim for a point this time it ma be different. Why look at that record when the away record in the UEFA CUP is much more recent and much more favourable to our away chances.

eirebhoy · 15-09-2004 6:29pm

Muzz wrote:

Get it this time eirebhoy?

I got it the first time and never dismissed your comment so I don't see why you posted that (the main reason I posted that he got the assist is because Makaveli thought it was Petrov). The time he did take the long shot, Juninho passed the ball to him and fell, if Juninho didn't fall I am 99.9% sure Camara would have passed it to him. Camara looked across and saw more Barca players arriving than Celtic players so took the shot. Unlucky for him he didn't get the best of shots.

I can't really remember the match but I can honestly tell you that at half time I though Camara was one of the best players. I missed a couple of minutes of the second half and came back to see Hartson and Sutton on the pitch and was disapointed as I thought Camara was taken off. As I said, I can't remember what he did in the first half to impress me but at h/t I though he was playing well.

Agathe: OK he's as bad as Gronkjaer with his crosses but he's rarely needed to do so when playing at right back. You can't tag him a bad right back just because he hasn't got the best of crosses (he does get some gems in every now and again though). Yes, his job as a winger was to cross but he isn't a winger anymore and hasn't been for some time so that doesn't really matter.

Remaining fixtures:

Milan (a)
Shaktaar (a)
Shaktaar (h)
Barca (a)
Milan (h)

I can't see us getting anything away against Milan and Barca. Lets say Milan and Barca both beat us in their home, all Barca would then need is 1 win from their remaining 4 matches to guarantee finishing above us. Milan would need, at the very most, a win and a draw from their 4 matches.

So if we don't get anything away against the 2 big teams its over. If we do get something it gives us hope (if we win one its back wide open). Shaktaar are no pushovers either, Milan didn't score until the 85th minute and they were playing against 10 men for most of the 2nd half.

Makaveli · 15-09-2004 10:41pm

eirebhoy wrote:

Did anything come down Barca's left last night?

Perhaps not that many attacks formed down the left, but that was because Giuly absolutley spanked McNamara for pace. Play to your strengths, Agathe is a quick player.
However, how many time did Gio pop up and get time to get a shot in? Easily three times, and he's a fullback. So Agathe wasn't always around.

Muzz wrote:

As for Mr. Optimistic saying that Champions League dream over for another year. Wise up. Still 5 mathces to go. And one thing for sure Celtic cannot play any worse than they did last night. I look forward to a last 16 place!

Unless they get something in the San Siro a last 16 place looks a long way away. Honestly I think Milan and Barcelona have too much quality to not progress.

CELTIC v BARCELONA

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