Timing Belt Problem..

comanche_cor

Just bought a 2nd hand renault megane. Asked them to change the timing belt before I collected it (have paid a deposit on it only). However the garage has managed to mess up changing the timing belt. When they went to start the engine bad things happened - they bent at least one of the values. So the long and the short if it was that the timing belt was not fitted correctly.

Can anyone tell me where I stand with this? The are about to fix the damage, but from what I know this can be quiet extensive - smashed piston heads, messed up valvue guides etc.

Can someone tell me if I take on this car am in for a world of pain? This is quiet fustrating as I've spent over a month looking for the right car!

tdvit

if I were you mate I wouldnt take the car. if you cant get out of it then I would make sure they give you at least a years warranty incase of disaster.

comanche_cor

Yeah am I really don't know what to do here - my thinking on this though is that if it is not fixed right I will know straight away? Surely there are no in between measures with this sort of problem? Suppose one thing that could complicate this is that is a 16 valve engine!

You are definitly right about the warrenty - they are already giving me a 3 month warrenty but am goingi to make him bump it up to the year if I do decide to take it!

alias no.9

Through no fault of your own, this car is no longer in the same condition that it was when you agreed to buy it. As far as I can see, you're perfectly entitled to ask for your deposit back and walk away, if you still want the car then make sure they knock a few quic off it AND beef up the warrenty.

alias no.9

comanche_cor wrote:

Yeah am I really don't know what to do here - my thinking on this though is that if it is not fixed right I will know straight away? Surely there are no in between measures with this sort of problem? Suppose one thing that could complicate this is that is a 16 valve engine!
QUOTE]

Given that they couldn't time the thing up properly in the first place, I'm not sure I'd trust them on the repairs. The face of one or more of the pistons might be damaged and they might decide you'll never know if they didn't replace it. They'll have to have the head off to fix it, or maybe even replace the head. If they make a balls of putting it back on, you could end up with head gasket problems that might not manifest themselves for a couple of months or maybe 'till you spend an hour and a half in really heavy traffic. The 16v bit only makes it more likely to be an interference engine (ie the piston will meet the valves if they are incorrectly timed) but since you know there's at least one bent valve, you knew this already.

comanche_cor

Presume there is no easy way to know if any of the pistons are damaged?

What I am thinking of doing is taking to a renault dealer for an inspection and see what they say - for the sake of 80 quid or so i think its worth it..

Hellrazer

What year/engine size is the Megane???If you want I can find out from a mate of mine who works for Renault what type of damage usually happens when a belt breaks in a Megane.

Not all cars do massive damage with a broken timing belt.Some only break the belt and do no other damage wheras others do in pistons,camshaft etc.
Richie

Seth Brundle

a renault dealer could do various tests e.g. compression test but could not guarrantee that it has been repaired satisfactorily.
Furthermore, the dealer will not really want to get involved in something like this so it is likely that any answer from them will be that they cannot fully determine whether it is in factory condition regardless of positive looking test results. IMO, this is a waste of money!
Get your money back from the muppet show and look elsewhere. it is a renault megane - there are quite a few of them about so it shouldn't be too difficult to find another one!

tinofapples

Not exactly what happened here but the timing belt went on my Vectra over a year ago , it too had a 16 Valve engine. It cost me 1300 to get the f**kin thing fixed and I traded it in soon after cause I lost confidence in the car.

Demand your deposit back and look elsewhere. As someone has already mentioned the car is not in the same condition as it was when you put down your deposit.

comanche_cor

Hellrazer wrote:

What year/engine size is the Megane???If you want I can find out from a mate of mine who works for Renault what type of damage usually happens when a belt breaks in a Megane.

Not all cars do massive damage with a broken timing belt.Some only break the belt and do no other damage wheras others do in pistons,camshaft etc.
Richie

Its a 99 renault megane - 1.4 RXi

Think what you are talking about here Richie is interferance v's non-interferance engines? Think the megane is interferance...

BrianD3

The engine in that car is an interference type, so there *will* be engine damage, however since the breakage happened at low speed it should be limited to a few bent valves. Although this will still require a lot of work to put right. As mentioned already, if the garage can't get the timing right can you trust them to do a competent and honest job on the engine repairs?

Walk away from the car. There are loads of similar 99 Meganes on the market, you'll find another car pretty easily.

BrianD3

Hellrazer

Ok just rang that mate of mine and the only damage they do is bend a few valves.Pistons dont get damaged.

Plus if fixed CORRECTLY you shouldnt have any problems again.Id ask for extra warranty and a few quid off the price if I was going to buy it.
Do you mind me asking what you are paying for it??
Richie

Kersh

The timing belt on my gto went at 80mph on the m50. And still, out of 24valves only 12 were bent. I did all the work myself, and it cost me less than 500 euro. (head gasket set was 230 of that!)And that was a 3.0 v6. Then I changed all the belts, and no problem since.
My advice is get a good discount, and a warranty and take it, but then...if the garage that is fixing the new problems also caused them...then that aint good.

Seth Brundle

assuming it is done CORRECTLY!
Personally I wouldn't touch it with a bargepole - plenty more fish...

comanche_cor

Well to be honest I was tempted to walk away from the car in the first place simply because I thought the asking price was too low it was 4500 for 1999 with 92k on the clock. Took it for a test drive and it drove really well ... well its not doing that right now!

Its just the fact of weighing up the risk v's the hassle of finding something again..

What I can't get over is that fact that this guy admitted to me that this happened - am surprised that the didn't say that they needed to order a part or something while they were scarpering to get it fixed up and say nothing!

mike65

Nothing much too add except I think I'd either look for a hell of a price cut or walk away...I'd want them to do a compression test with me watching and then let it sit idleing on there forecourt for a good 30 mins. See how nervous they get!

Before starting the engine for the first time, be sure it has been properly pre-lubricated.
Never add cold water to the cooling system while the engine is running. The engine should be allowed to run at normal operating temperature.
Start engine and run at fast idle, approximately 1500 RPM, and check the oil pressure.

Run the engine for 30 minutes even though coolant may rise to operating temperature in a few minutes. Adjust tappets, if required, carburetor and ignition timing. If the coolant should "boil over," stop engine and allow to cool. Then start again and proceed as above.

When required retorque cylinder heads and manifolds to engine manufacturer's specifications in proper sequence. Readjust tappets if necessary.

Start engine again and make a test run on the road at 30 MPH in "drive" range or select the proper gears for standard transmission.

Periodically accelerate to 50 MPH and decelerate rapidly. Repeat this procedure at least 10 times.

NOTE: Applying loads to the engine for short periods of time causes increased ring pressure against the cylinder walls and helps to seat the rings. This is especially important because you are "breaking-in" the engine with heavy duty oils. The rapid deceleration increases vacuum and gives extra lubrication to the piston and ring assemblies.

Mike.

comanche_cor

Hellrazer wrote:

Ok just rang that mate of mine and the only damage they do is bend a few valves.Pistons dont get damaged.

Plus if fixed CORRECTLY you shouldnt have any problems again.Id ask for extra warranty and a few quid off the price if I was going to buy it.
Do you mind me asking what you are paying for it??
Richie

Thanks for that - at least thats a bit of goodish news. Its a 1999 1.4 RXi with 92k on the clock. Going for 4500 - whadda think?

alias no.9

Hellrazer wrote:

Ok just rang that mate of mine and the only damage they do is bend a few valves.Pistons dont get damaged.

For the valves to get damaged there must be some contact with the piston, I can see how the valve will take the brunt of this but I'd still want the pistons checked (the ones on the cylinders with bent valves) and probably replaced if it wasn't my money.