TV Set up - Wexford

marclt

A friend of mine has asked me to put up an aerial for her.. now I know the basics... but for an economical set up, what do I need to pull in the the Presely signals from Wexford... she already has a VHF RTE aerial.

An aerial installer quoted over E350 - but it shouldn't cost that much surely?

Another question... in our own house, we get green and red diagonal lines crossing the screen on BBC1 only... whats causing this.. and how can I get rid of it???

byte

Equipment needed is gonna vary strongly depending on whereabouts in Wexford you are. Is it Wexford town? Maybe you were quoted for a super high gain aerial like Triax UNIX100 or Hirshmann equivalent. You'll also need masthead amplifier and power supply unit. It's possible to get wideband masthead amps with VHF bypass input. What sort of aerials has her neighbours? Are they massive long aerials or rectangular Grids for example? This may help determine what to buy.

marclt

just like most streets in wexford, there are huge aerials and then the person next door has something slightly smaller!

Its not far from the quays, slightly higher actually... so it shouldn't need anything too monster...

What sorts of costs do you expect... its all about the money!


Anyone got any ideas about the red/green lines on BBC 1 at my own place? Doesn't affect any other channels... a problem with aerial or cable???

A simple grid aerial should pull in presely fairly well in Wexford town if you have a view to the sea to the south east.
You will also need a masthead amp and power supply unit.
peats have a grid aerial here for €30, the mast head amp for €30 and the psu for €25
Add another €20 max for cable and Your total is around a €100

You will need a thin piece of pipe for a chimney or gable end mount and the brackets.
All in all you should be spending no more than €150 or so.

Those work very well for presely in North wexford.
The guys you see with the large aerials are getting better reception but I reckon depending on the exact location you should be ok at that.

Galway

A Triax unix 100 gr B is £43 (about €54) on line - www.brymar.co.uk best to use a triax or johansson wideband UHF only amp (rem, Five is on ch. 37) plus a compatible power supply and it should come in crystal clear as u ahve a sea path there. Mind u I have noticed tidal fading at Rosslare harbour on the Presely signals- any reports of this from wex?

I shouldnt think the Mt Leinster signals would need any amplification there - I would caution against using an wideband amp to combine UK and Irish signals- u may end up with cross modulation and/or need to attenuate the RTE/TV3?TG 4 signals b4 they go into the VCR. Probably better to combine the Presely gr B signals and the TV 3/TG 4 signals using and A to E combiner (MUST pass channel 37 -triax or fringe)(with dc pass on the Group, B presely signals only) [URL=http://]www.fringeelectronics.co.uk[/URL] an then a VHF to UHF combiner to add the Rte VHF signals- johansson, triax, televés, alacad or fringe all manufacture these.

There is A DAT 75 Televés aerial (the one with the 3 sections) on the front at wexford,i presume getting Freeview digital terrestrial from Presely - that too may be a possibility but you will need a freeview box about €99 i think and u will need to get from the UK.

Let me know how u get on.

Galway

Galway wrote:

Mind u I have noticed tidal fading at Rosslare harbour on the Presely signals- any reports of this from wex?

Thats common no matter where you watch presely, but is only a major problem in rainy weather,it's very rare to lose it altogether

I shouldnt think the Mt Leinster signals would need any amplification there - I would caution against using an wideband amp to combine UK and Irish signals- u may end up with cross modulation and/or need to attenuate the RTE/TV3?TG 4 signals b4 they go into the VCR.

Mt Leinster is visible from wexford,you'd get the signal well on an indoor telescopic,even here in Arklow where you can't see it that is the case.
The wideband amp would be mainly a problem in the summer months when high pressure clutters up the UHF band.

There is A DAT 75 Televés aerial (the one with the 3 sections) on the front at wexford,i presume getting Freeview digital terrestrial from Presely - that too may be a possibility but you will need a freeview box about €99 i think and u will need to get from the UK.

Freeview is possible about 7 days out of ten from presely where you are in a good reception area in wexford with a simple grid aerial and amp..
That rises to 8 or 9 days out of ten during the summer months.
You can be unlucky though and need the sea view and some height for it to work well ( It works well here where I am for instance )

marclt

hi folks... she hasnt got back to me yet about the new install but i'm quite keen to upgrade what we have here at home.. i've got a freeview box... brought it back with me from UK.. Ch42 is by far the most robust signal, over the weekend we had most of the multiplexes apart from a period yesterday when all the channels were affected by overloading... made TV3 very poor.

We have an aerial -must be about 14years old ... its connected to a labgear masthead amp. that goes into a combiner (blue box) which the tv3 aerial is fed into. this all goes into a labgear cablevision distribution box which has a socket for the VHF aerial (RTE). some of the other tvs are now distributed via the sky digibox so that we can get sky around the house... so should we shelf the labgear box in favour of something else.

Another thing I've noticed is that since TG4/TV3 have come on line at the Cairn Hill transmitter this is almost always co-channel interference with the corresponding channels from Presely. So would a grid aerial give better protection from signals coming from the behind the direction of the aerial. We have line of sight to mount leinster and presumably the sig from cairn hill comes along with it. Any ideas that would be great...

Regarding cairn Hill,its very powerfull but thanks to hills doesn't figure at all in North wexford-imagine that, no co channel at all on presely , it's totally clean
It's coming down from Longford so in theory the fact that you can see Mt Leinster has no bearing on it at all, though if you were closer to Mt Leinster, it would actually be a help as it would block out the Cairn Hill co channel.

If you are getting the co channell from cairn Hill theres no way out really,although it shouldn't affect your free view as its not strong enough to affect adjacent channels in far away wexford, just the ones it shares-that leaves only ch 5 analoge unaffected.

As regards improving reception, why not consider a twin aerial set up using the Group B's that Galway suggested, though I would recommend getting an installer to put them up for you.
I don't know who climbs and builds masts in South Wexford, but I do know Mylie Redmond in Gorey is good and theres a guy in Riverchapel courtown whose name escapes me who is quite good too.
You will be running into several hundred Euro by going that route but you will be guaranteed ITV1 wales and Channel four amongst others maybe 8 or 9 days out of ten in digital form on freeview if you go that route.

Galway

yes, a grid aerial will mitigate some of the c--channel from cairn hill but the gain isnt great. u can combine 2 or even 4 grids to overcome this but u wouldneed to get a guy who knows what hes doing as it can be tricky.

Deffo have a separate 10 element standard group A horizontally polarised for moun leinster tv3 and tg 4 and 5 element VHF wideband or log periodic for RTE 1 and Net 2 from Mt Leinster. By fitting an A-E combiner to join the Presely and Mt Leinster UHF signals that should help reduce any co-channel from cairn hill picked up by the group A aerial. You could also fit a filter to block out group B signals from the Mt Leinster group A aerial, Neither the group A or the Vhf aerial should need amplification,just the group B. If u use a channelised masthead amp make sure it will pass Ch 37 for Five.Also the combiner needs to pass ch 37 on the group B amplified leg. triax do one - channels 21-35 (gr A) with channels 37-69.

if the aerial is 14 years old i suggest a replacement - better to go for higher gain if u can. If the distribution box is ok u can use it but need to feed in the combined UHF signals and then the VHF to get a single output.

marclt

I'm going to try a grid aerial.... the main cause of picture problems is the co-channel interference, i've only been back a couple of weeks and there was one occasion when all of the channels were very poor... is this sea path interference? I've over the last couple of days BBC1/S4C *ch 46/50* goes quite fuzzy when BBC2/HTV stays quite clear... surprizing there are no problems on BBC1/S4C from Blaenplwyf which we've also managed to get at the very same time this problem occurs.

We often get short spells directly after high pressure periods when theres ghosting on the presely channels... of course presely is shaded away from this part of the world - Fishguard has its own tx because of an obstruction of mountains in the way of presely to the north west of the site itself... so north wexford should get a better picture...

BBC2 and htv are located probably nearest the dead centre of what your current group B aerial allows,whilst BBC one and s4c are at the edge of the B band closer to what a CD aerial is grouped for and hense the latter are weaker received.

The tidal fading is corelated to the curvature of the earth.
Our location in Wexford is well beyond the horizon viv a vis presely and therefore the presely tx is pumping its signal against that curvature.
It may be at a good height above sea level but the distance beyond the horizon and the earths curvature means that by the time the signal gets to us, it is as if it is being transmitted at sea level or below.
Thus waves on the Irish sea block out some of the signal causing the fading that you sometimes see.

However if you have altitude in wexford with your sea view , you cancel out some of that affect.
People living behind me for instance at about 900ft asl can receive presely on a stripped piece of co ax with no aerial at all and mostly get it crystal on a grid with an amp-no fading except in extremely bad weather.

Galway

can u get a constant signal from blaenplyf? try the grid mount as high as poss and get a good masthead amp - try a johansson 40-69 up to 35 db gain.iu have one for cairn hill here with a triax unix 100 gr B aerial - excellent pics 8 miles south of tuam(high ground) and 16 north of galway city. in high pressure we can get interference from Black Hill in Scotland as uses same channels as cairn Hill and aerial is facing north east too. get the presely signals sorted first then the Irish tx ones from mt leinster

blaenplyf overlooks cardigan bay,I've had a group a here in Arklow pointed to it with a direct sea path on a 60ft mast on high ground looking unobstructed directly out over the Irish sea towards cardigan bay(a much shorter sea path than would be from wexford town which would more than likely also have some local obstacles in it's direction) I managed to get a fair signal but not as good or as reliable as presely.

Incidently if marc decides to use the grid with a good wideband amp, he'll get caradon hill from cornwall fairly regular during the summer even with the aerial pointed to presely, complete with an analog channel four.
That came in well with the group a swung around to the south from here and is a frequent visitor in high pressure weather conditions, to anyone who tunes it in with a grid .

I'll also point out that if you are using the grid aerial, you shouldn't need a separate aerial for TV3 or TG4 mount leinster at all.
We can't see it at all up here and they come in fine despite having an aerial group B( yes B and not A ) and amp pointed to presely.
A cheap 20 Euro 10 element vhf vertically polarised will do for mt Leinster RTÉ.

marclt

I do find this whole subject realy amazing... I've been out at work this afternoon.. left the house and the Presely channels were fine.. come home and its a white out... BBC1 - non existent with the odd rolling of co-channel.. but there's no sound. BBC2 slightly better. sounds comes and goes... HTV every now and again there is some colour here but again masses of co-channel and I guess teh singal is jsut v. poor. S4C similar to BBC2 and there is nothing on channel 5.. i can see some co-channel on this one but its mostly rolling zig/zag lines. No Freeview... Whats it like with you Earthman??

Its quite dull and v humid here so maybe that's the cause.. whats the co-channel on 5?

Managed to get quite a lot at the weekend... Channel 4 on Ch65... very strong particularly on Sunday, is this the Huntshaw Cross TX? Caradon Hill wasn't as good... Also got some Carmel at the weekend too... S4C on Ch53, BBC2 Ch63 etc.

marclt

Galway wrote:

can u get a constant signal from blaenplyf?

No, its very patchy... and just comes in with the good weather.. mind you its a group B aerial we have... maybe a widescreen would be better.. I know its 250kW and have driven past it many times (its not a big mast, Presely is much bigger) but I think the signal is directional.. inland mainly, but even that way the mountains prevent it travelling far! I did get Ch5 on Channel 56 from there though - its uses much less power than the others!

I also got two multiplexes on channel 54 and 61 Llandonna the week before last during a good spell of weather!

Galway

yes but presely is NOT same direction as Mt Leinseter in wex town.aso id advise 2 separate aerials.the johansson wide band amp is good with an adjustable 20-35 db gain. are the signals any better at rosslare harbour?

This is not the best weather for distant UHF reception. u might be better to get a Uk sky card and a digibox or a skyplus box with a uk sub all bbc free to air (inlc BBC wales) and S4c and ITV1 Wales accessible vai other channels.

What is Fm reception from Blaen and haverfordwest like down there?

marclt

Galway wrote:

yes but presely is NOT same direction as Mt Leinseter in wex town.aso id advise 2 separate aerials.the johansson wide band amp is good with an adjustable 20-35 db gain. are the signals any better at rosslare harbour?

What is Fm reception from Blaen and haverfordwest like down there?

We have two seperate aerials already... Its just tonight things are very bad.. I'd love to get an adjustable gain, but I don't live here full time... so it would only confuse the folks! It would help during periods of high pressure and stop the overloading that happened at the weekend.

Rosslare harbour is better... direct views over the sea, and for the most part Rosslare harbour is above sea level... (Rosslare Strand at sea level) so they are a bit higher... its almost the closest place to Presely (Carnsore point only being slightly closer but they have lots of wind turbines now)

As for Haverfordwest FM.. in Wexford anywhere in a line south of Forth Mountain gets quite decent FM reception.. I've driven all the way to Duncannon and only lost them a few times... especially further west.. its only tx's at 20kW ERP so its not a massive transmitter and its actually on lower ground than Presely by a long shot... its just positioned so that it cuts around either side of the Preseli's. I've noticed around Gorey that you can pick up Classic FM and Real Radio from Presely but its not very good in Wexford. Blaenplwyf - again directional and patchy.. you've probably got better chance of getting Llanddona than Blaenplwyf.

Galway

keep me posted on the progress as i said a digibox and UKcard would be a much more satisfactory route. Cairn hill crystal clear here. Reception also from maghera (local tx),castlebar transposer UHF on 9kw balla deflector in mayo, truskmore (poor UHF) MullaghanishUHF (perfect last night) and ocasionally TV ch 26 from Mt Leinster. TG4 from there on same channel(23) as TG 4 from castlebar so can get interference in high pressure. very weak UTV ch 28 from Brougher Mt too

byte

UTV is Ch25 from Brougher. BBC2 is Ch28, maybe it was that channel that was weak

Galway

i stand corrected it is UTV ch 25 very weak b/w only but using a grB Unix 100 and johansson groupised masthead amp- 4-69 facing cairn hill anyway.in 1978 Rté categorically stated cairn hill would have no discernible effect in the transmissions from presely but in those days of course only 40 and 43 were being use from there now 46 and 50 have been added for TV3 and TG4. Cairn hill also shares same channels with Black Hillin Scotland which can cause probs in summer and winter when high pressure prevails.

marclt

marclt wrote:

I've noticed around Gorey that you can pick up Classic FM and Real Radio from Presely but its not very good in Wexford. Blaenplwyf - again directional and patchy.. you've probably got better chance of getting Llanddona than Blaenplwyf.

Yeah, real radio is like a new local station round here, RDS and everything - tiz gas!
I get Llandonna here often enough but it's weak.
The Arfon relay signal is very very strong, this side of the Irish sea even though it's only 10 kw erp most people in wicklow use it and it's good even tonight - vertically polarised group B
Actually this evening is one of the rare occassions that presely has been very low , there is a lot of heavy cloud cover and fog/mist which are the conditions that sea paths hate the most.
I wouldn't expect it to improve too much untill after tomorrow.
By the way the interference from cairn hill to presely is very bad in Arklow, which is a pity because the area gets presely very strong.
Funnily enough though, its solved by using freeview with the added benefit of Ch4
A few miles further north and west towards rathdrum and that interference is gone, presely being totally clean as the proximity to the hills wipes out cairn hill, but the path to presely and the sea is relatively clear.
Presely , whatever kind of a transmission,it is, is even capabale of getting well inland into wicklow when there are hills between it and the sea.
It's quite good in parts around Tinahely for instance , yet theres no view to the sea and hills in the way, it's the only welsh tx that I know that has such a wide beam that it can bounce a bit around the edges of hills.
By wide beam I mean when you swing your aerial( if its a B ) you wont see a signal loss for at least 3 ft( here ) and indeed can swing it right round and still have it when pointed backwards when the signal is good.
When you do that in Arklow town you get cairn hill with heavy presely co channel

Here endeth the ramble

marclt

Yeah, Real Radio... is pretty strong up there... don't know if anyone can identify what the green/red stripes are on our BBC1? I'm going to change the aerial next week, but just want to know whats causing them...?

Talking about aerial direction... I think if you look around any street that has aerials pointing towards Wales, especially Presely, very few will actually be pointing in the same direction.. some installers even have difficulty getting the direction of Mt. Leinster right!!

So a grid should prevent picking up signals from behind - is this denoted by the back to front ratio, in most aerial specs or is that something different?

I'll be back in Wales at the weekend so I can see how strong the TV3 signal is over there?!

To be honest with you marc,don't expect much of an improvement on co channel with a grid.
Certainly in Arklow, theres no difference ,the co channel is just as bad on presely from cairn Hill with a Grid as opposed to a group B.
Remember, the grid may be bringing in the competing channel weaker than the proper grouped aerial, but it's also bringing in the presely channels weaker by the same proportion.
Dont know what your green and red stripes are...
Do the adjacent houses have them?
It sounds awfully like somethings wrong with the amp and or a combiner somewhere, there could be some shorting due to dampness or a bit of mushy wet leaves in there or earwigs.

marclt

Last night... the co-channel was mad... I think I just need to have a mess around and reposition things abit... where can I get my hands on a filter to put on the Grp A aerial?

The stripes have only appeared after we had a guy to look at the system... it never used to be there... maybe its some radio interference

Booms

Hi Marclt,

When my granny got colour tV in the seventies, I used to play around with her b/w set, and discovered I could get either blue/yellow or red/green stripes on the colour set by tuning into specific frequencies for each channel she was watching at the time. Wasn't too popular when I did it.

Try switching off any modulators you have, one at a time, and check any new equipment that you got just before the trouble started. You might need to change the output channel on something like your video.

It sounds like you're in a great place for picking up signals. All you have to do is minimise the signals you don't want.

best of luck.

marclt

FROM RTE:

TRUSKMORE, MAGHERA, MULLAGHANISH
Due to essential maintenance, there
will be brief periods of reduce power
during the week 23/08/2004 to 27/08/04.

I'm not in Wexford at the moment, I wonder will it make any difference to the co-channel on Presely???