Help please.

LegacyUser

Hey, I need to know the definition of rape very quickly. Someone I was with has decided to tell me that they can get me charged with rape even though they didn't try to stop me having sex with them even though they said no. Anyone???

Unpossible

they said no

I think this defines rape, but my advice is to go straight to a solicitor (sp) who can give you proper advice.

Calm down for a second though and explain a little more, was this a gf? did she say she was filing a rape charge? did she report it and get a physical? Could this be some jealous ploy or a way to blackmail you somehow?

RossFixxxed

they didn't try to stop me having sex with them they said no

Err...? Well having sex with someone who says NO is pretty clear cut to me. Were they too drunk/high/wasted etc to say no or what? Oh. Your. God, this better be a troll.

You better explain this one, and remember that you're putting all this into the public domain.


"I felt guilty once. Then she woke up half way through."
- Quagmire

Beruthiel

Originally posted by Buggered
they said no.

this defines rape

what do you mean by they 'didn't stop me'?
you would have to give us more details however, for us to come to the correct assumption

Agent Orange

It depends: did she enjoy it or not?

Beruthiel

Originally posted by Agent Orange
It depends: did she enjoy it or not?

Agent Orange
read the CHARTER regarding replies like this
consider this a warning
B

davej

If somone much bigger and stronger than you decided to mug you and you said "please don't mug me", but did not put up a physical fight when they took your money, does this mean it wasn't a mugging ?

Depending on the situation with this girl I would try and discuss it with her and explain how you didn't see the signals etc. If it's too far gone between the two of you it's time to get a solicitor methinks.

davej

Sleepy

No sympathy for you mate.

Try to remember that there's no difference between what you've done and what "Bubba" is doing when you scream no but are too scared to fight back in the prison showers.

uberwolf

'can' get you charged and 'will' get you charged and then a court case that will stick are three entirely different concepts.

How is your relationship with this woman, I'm gathering you knew her before you were with her? It may be worth discussing it with her but of course you may something incriminating or so forth that ends up back firing, so if you're taking this route be careful.

I remember the topic of rape being discussed here a number of months ago, and the question of what defined it was brought up.

I believe that there could theoretically be a difference between rape and what you describe (very few details given, so my own supposition is filling in a lot of details). However a large part of the previous debate was about the blurring of the lines and ultimately there being no one point or distinction which clarifies what has happened. The image of rape being a dark alley and a stranger is clearly not sufficent. You describe her as having said no. You clearly ignored this or believed that she didn't mean it, or could be persuaded otherwise.

ignoring = rape. No doubt IMO.
Believed she didn't mean it... very dangerous call, one I wouldn't make.
Persuaded otherwise. You reckon she could be turned on enough or whatever and there after she'd be game. However if you felt the need to ask her once maybe you should proceed with this game plan for the time needed and then ask again??? You could probably still be convicted on this one. But its a little more blurry. Its the male role to persuade, "to pull". This doesn't advocate or excuse rape however.

You obviuosly don't feel you forced yourself upon her

they didn't try to stop me having sex with them

some other posters have covered this accurately enough though, no struggle doesn't mean no objection.

seamus

As uberwolf says, the lines are blurred. She said no, and you admit this, so in court the onus will be on you to prove that even though she said no, she wanted it to happen.

I'm no lawyer, and you haven't given us much information, but reciprocation would be a good place to start your defence. So her kissing you passionately while in the act, stopping midway to go and get a sex toy, giving a blowjob off her own intiative, that kind of thing. Reciprocation is a very difficult thing to prove, and mostly relies on her actually telling the truth under oath.

From the tone of your post, it would seem that she is using this as something to hold over your head in a spiteful manner. I could go off on a tangent as to what the implications are in that case, but you haven't given us nearly enough information.

The Sweeper

Originally posted by seamus
From the tone of your post, it would seem that she is using this as something to hold over your head in a spiteful manner.

At the same time, she could be pointing out the fact that she could have the original poster charged with rape, in an effort to get him to realise the seriousness of what he did?

Yes we have been through this before on this board, about what does and does not constitute rape. I'll reiterate my opinion - a rape is a crime of power and domination, not a crime of sex. The perpetrator wants to exercise power and control over the victim, and does it in the most intrusive way possible. The most effective way to prove that you can dominate someone is to pentetrate their body against their will. That's why prostitutes can be raped. And women who were allegedly "asking for it" because of how they were dressed. That's why there's oral rape and anal rape, rape against men, rape of children, etc. etc.

A rape is not justifiable as a crime of sexual frustration - "she teased me but then wouldn't have sex with me so I raped her" - it's a power crime - "she teased me but then wouldn't have sex with me and it pi$$ed me RIGHT off so I decided to show her who's boss". (Do you think it's okay to shoot everyone who annoys you? Then why would it be right to rape everyone who teases you?)

Original poster: what do you think happened? Was it rape? Was it consensual sex? Do you even care past whether or not you're going to get into trouble? I'd be more worried if I thought you really don't understand what rape is. If that's the case, then you are a danger to society.

seamus

Originally posted by Minesajackdaniels
At the same time, she could be pointing out the fact that she could have the original poster charged with rape, in an effort to get him to realise the seriousness of what he did?

Sorry, yeah, I badly worded that. Put "that you think" between 'seem' and 'that'.

A rape is not justifiable as a crime of sexual frustration - "she teased me but then wouldn't have sex with me so I raped her" - it's a power crime - "she teased me but then wouldn't have sex with me and it pi$$ed me RIGHT off so I decided to show her who's boss". (Do you think it's okay to shoot everyone who annoys you? Then why would it be right to rape everyone who teases you?)

Precisely.

Jimi-Spandex

To give a definite answer to this question on the meagre facts you've supplied is impossible.

The crux of the issue in your case is consent and whether or not her saying "no" classifies your act as rape. Obviously this is all determined by the context of the sex.

Such factors as a pre-existing relationship, intoxication and the integrity of both of your characters will more than likely be determining. I'm going to assume that there is physical evidence of the intercourse but if not, then it will be difficult if not impossible for the DPP to secure a conviction on the basis of her testimony alone.

If you were in a relationship, it is less likely that the dpp will press ahead with the case seeing as it is their choice. If ye were both intoxicated then you could realistically claim that you misinterpreted the "no" or even completely missed it. The old, no doesn't always mean no chestnut.

Of course, if she is using this merely as leverage in black mail, record every contact she has with you, every word she says to you. Obviously don't go around wearing a wire. Just make a note of all of this after the fact.

Get a good solicitor if she persists with these threats. And be 100% honest with him, even if it makes you look like a filthy evil, bastard, It'll improve your chances no end.


The bad news is on what you have said, you probably are guilty of rape but wouldn't get that much of a sentance.

The Corinthian

I remember crashing at a girl’s flat once as a student and sharing her bed under the strict condition that ‘nothing happened’. To my credit I was a perfect gentleman, until that is, she got fed up waiting for me to try it on with her and climbed atop of me.

So a good question is, whether she was saying no, was she doing yes? That she just lay there and did not try to fight you off is not enough to defend you, but if she actively participated, then it becomes very difficult to accept that it was rape regardless of what she said. If on the other hand she ‘just lay there’, then that would most likely be rape.

What is most interesting however, is that she is even saying this to you rather than going straight to the Gardai. What is her motive?

MojoMaker

The original poster, although possibly a troll, is referring to a homosexual liason.

ballooba

Just because the nick is 'buggered'?

uberwolf

Originally posted by MojoMaker
The original poster, although possibly a troll, is referring to a homosexual liason.

the deliberate failure to mention gender was noted, as was the automatic presumption by everyone! (incl. me) that it was a male poster.

LegacyUser

No, this wasn't a troll. I've been kinda going out with this girl for a while and she suddenly decided to inform me that she could get me arrested for rape. I sorta freaked it a bit and ran here (sad, I know) to try and figure out where I stand. Now she says she was only joking. Question is now whether to finish it with her.

Thanks for you help anyway everyone. B, you can lock this now if you like.

Davey Devil

Eh, I think I speak for everyone when I say - DUMP THAT PSYCHO BITCH!!!

joePC

DUMP THAT PSYCHO BITCH!!!

Hear, hear

Someone like that deserves to be slaped, witisssssssshhhhhhhhhh, witisssssssshhhhhhh

Lainey

she is just a stupid cow who is trying to have the power.. run as fast as you can from her.. imagine what she will do next :rolleyes:

Töpher

Give her a slap, let her know who wears the trousers in the relationship... :rolleyes:

*cough*
In all seriousness, if someone can even joke about such a disgusting subject, and in such a disturbing manner, and it was only done to fúck with your head, I'd tell the bítch to go suck an exhaust pipe. It's not clever, or even remotely funny.

As Lainey said, imagine what she could come up with next...

Mutz

But if you dump her she's more likely tp turn psycho on ya and then SHE WILL scream rape!

WHAT WILL YOU DO!!!???? :eek:

Lainey

Originally posted by Mutz
But if you dump her she's more likely tp turn psycho on ya and then SHE WILL scream rape!

WHAT WILL YOU DO!!!???? :eek:

yes.. really scare him.. :rolleyes: (but i was thinkin the same thing )

weeginger

People who cry rape when it isn't are very dangerous individuals. They prevent actual rape vicitims being believed and can have grave effects on the outcome of court cases. I don't know enough about your case only to say be careful.

LegacyUser

I've been thinking the exact same as everyone else here. I don't know what to do though. I'll just have to talk to her about it.

Beruthiel

Originally posted by Buggered
Now she says she was only joking. Question is now whether to finish it with her.

I cannot express how angry this makes me. There are so many women out there who have been seriously raped; this kind of silly, childish, immature comment is what can get many a rapist off the hook.
If one woman can joke about it and be found out, why not others? Get rid of her, asap! Who’s to say she wouldn’t do this to you again and follow it through next time?
She needs to spend a few weeks working in the rape crisis centre and see what rape really does to women. I will stop now before I really start to rant

B, you can lock this now if you like.

I'll lock it now - if you wish it re opened, drop me a PM in confidence.
a