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England Squad for Euro 2004

  • 17-05-2004 4:30pm
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,956 ✭✭✭✭


    Well its being announced:
    David James (Man City), Paul Robinson (Tottenham), Ian Walker (Leicester); Gary Neville (Man United), Sol Campbell (Arsenal), Ashley Cole (Arsenal), John Terry (Chelsea), Wayne Bridge (Chelsea), Jamie Carragher (Liverpool), Ledley King (Tottenham), Phil Neville (Man United); Steven Gerrard (Liverpool), Nicky Butt (Man United), David Beckham (Real Madrid), Paul Scholes (Man United), Kieron Dyer (Newcastle), Frank Lampard (Chelsea), Joe Cole (Chelsea), Owen Hargreaves (Bayern Munich); Wayne Rooney (Everton), Michael Owen (Liverpool), Emile Heskey (Liverpool), Darius Vassell (Aston Villa).

    Strike Force is a real surprise to me, I can't believe Heskey and Vassell have been selected ahead of Smith and Defoe!!!

    I also think Gareth Barry should have been called in.

    What do you think??


«1

Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 15,552 ✭✭✭✭GuanYin


    Some very suspects selections there.

    The strikers are weak, Joe Cole is a strange selections and the keepers don't scream quality.

    If Terry or Campbell are injured they will face trouble too. where the hell is Woodgate?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,956 ✭✭✭✭Villain


    Originally posted by syke

    If Terry or Campbell are injured they will face trouble too. where the hell is Woodgate?

    Injured, he wasn't deemed fit enough to be included.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 498 ✭✭Harry2001


    Eriksson's strongest XI can give anyone a game it's when he has to dip into the substitutes where the problems arise.

    If fit Owen and Rooney will start the games and Vassell will be used as a sub for sheer pace so Smith and Defoe would not get a look in anyway.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,013 ✭✭✭✭eirebhoy


    Butt out, Defoe in would be just about right IMO.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,956 ✭✭✭✭Villain


    Originally posted by Harry2001
    Eriksson's strongest XI can give anyone a game it's when he has to dip into the substitutes where the problems arise.

    If fit Owen and Rooney will start the games and Vassell will be used as a sub for sheer pace so Smith and Defoe would not get a look in anyway.

    Yea but none of the strikers listed have been in great form season this season really.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,972 ✭✭✭SheroN


    They could really do with shearer coming back TBH.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 88,972 ✭✭✭✭mike65


    Owen had a terrible season - only scored 21 goals!
    Heskey scored 11, Rooney always seems to shine for England (12 goals this season) and Vassell also seems to have a lucky touch (10 goals this season)

    plus a fair chance of some goal action from Beckham, Gerrard, Lampard...

    Glad to see Jamie Carragher get selected even if he's a sub.

    Mike.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,956 ✭✭✭✭Villain


    Originally posted by mike65
    Owen had a terrible season - only scored 21 goals!
    Heskey scored 11, Rooney always seems to shine for England (12 goals this season) and Vassell also seems to have a lucky touch (10 goals this season)

    Apart from Owen, who I dont think did have a good season, all those stats are very poor for strikers.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,392 ✭✭✭jonno


    Originally posted by irish1
    Apart from Owen, who I dont think did have a good season, all those stats are very poor for strikers.

    Well Owen was out for the best part of two months so I reckon he did well with his 21 goals - out of form or not


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,013 ✭✭✭✭eirebhoy


    Originally posted by irish1
    Strike Force is a real surprise to me, I can't believe Heskey and Vassell have been selected ahead of Smith...
    Originally posted by irish1
    Apart from Owen, who I dont think did have a good season, all those stats are very poor for strikers.
    You've kinda contradicted yourself.:)


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,956 ✭✭✭✭Villain


    Originally posted by eirebhoy
    You've kinda contradicted yourself.:)

    How??

    I said the Strike was a real surprise because it included Vassell and Heskey who have had bad season imo.:confused:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,099 ✭✭✭✭WhiteWashMan


    Originally posted by irish1
    Well its being announced:



    Strike Force is a real surprise to me, I can't believe Heskey and Vassell have been selected ahead of Smith and Defoe!!!

    I also think Gareth Barry should have been called in.


    I dont think gareth barry has the quality. he has been in form, but you want class and form!

    heskey is in because he can hold up a ball. old fashioned centre forward type. shame hes shít when he has to do something with it. Vassell has been on fire, would be a shame if he didnt get in.
    Butt out, Defoe in would be just about right IMO.

    oh no!
    BUtt may be on the fringe of the utd squad, but he is still quality and he can deputise for scholes. they need a second hard player in the centre. i wouldnt leave him. personally iw ould have droped dyer for Defoe. Dyer has been injured all season, and may not be fit enough anyway for june.

    i think its a good selection. as said, thats a team that can score from any part of the pitch to be honest. i think the only real weakness is in the full backs. perticularly the left. i dont rate either bridges or cole.

    as for hargreaves, i have no idea where that bloke comes into it!
    he always seems to be selected, but i never hear anything of him during the season, its only when it comes to internationals, he is suddenly there.i dont even know what position he plays :)

    but like i said, i reckon that most of the players on that team can score. i just think the defense is a little shakey. shame woodgate and southgate are out. both have been sensational until injured.

    still could have made room for teddy sheringham as well :)


  • Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 15,001 ✭✭✭✭Pepe LeFrits


    I think it's a pretty decent squad, if a little imbalanced... but that isn't really Eriksson's fault, England don't have quality players in every position.

    James can be very good on his day, if he avoids making any clangers he'll be one of the best keepers at Euro 2004 i'd say.

    There seems to be far too many fullbacks in that squad, but again I don't think Eriksson had much option considering the injuries he has to deal with; Terry & Campbell will be an excellent partnership provided they stay injury free anyway.

    Midfield is where England have the most talent and ironically I think it's Englands biggest problem area... left midfield is the obvious issue but the holding/defensive central midfield role is another. Butt is the only real holding midfielder there, but playing him at the expense of one of the others would be criminal, as would limiting Gerrard in the role or playing Lampard there (wrong sort of player for that role entirely). Hargreaves could be a very useful player for them. Joe Cole doesn't exactly look a fantastic prospect on the left hand-side, I reckon Dyer there would be better.

    Not really surprised by the choice of strikers but there's no way Heskey should be there, Defoe, Smith, Beattie and Phillips would all have been much better choices I think. Not that it really matters, Owen and Rooney will be the first choice pair so anyone else would only be there as a potential super-sub. Super-Heskey!... naaaah.

    From that squad, I reckon Eriksson will go for:
    ..........James............
    
    Neville Terry Campbell Cole
    
    ..........Butt.............
    
    ..Beckham Scholes Gerrard..
    
    ........Owen Rooney........
    

    Which is a very unbalanced team I think. It'll lack width, so Cole and Neville will be expected to provide that a lot, and you can bet that when either of them push forward nobody will bother to fill in the gaps behind them. Gerrard is also out of position, but on the whole it's a pretty strong midfield.

    I'd go for:
    ............James..............
    
    ..Neville Terry Campbell Cole..
    
    Beckham Gerrard Hargreaves Dyer
    
    ...........Lampard.............
    
    ............Owen...............
    
    That's better defensively and more balanced I think, although Owen on his own upfront would probably be a little weak, Scholes might be better in Lampard's position but given Lampard's form I think he has to get the nod. Gerrard and Hargreaves in the centre should provide plenty of industry while being able to create aswell, and Beckham and Dyer would give more natural width. Beckham can link up with Neville well, while Cole and Dyer would be able to link up in a similar manner to which Cole and Pires do at Arsenal.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,956 ✭✭✭✭Villain


    Originally posted by WhiteWashMan
    I dont think gareth barry has the quality. he has been in form, but you want class and form!
    heskey is in because he can hold up a ball. old fashioned centre forward type. shame hes shít when he has to do something with it. Vassell has been on fire, would be a shame if he didnt get in.


    Well as a Villa fan who follows the team very closely, I can tell you that Barry deserves it ahead of Vassell. Vassell has had a very poor season, he scored a few goals near the end of the season but his over all game has being very up and down.

    He has pace to upset strikers but his finishing this season has being pretty crap.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,013 ✭✭✭✭eirebhoy


    Originally posted by irish1
    How??

    I said the Strike was a real surprise because it included Vassell and Heskey who have had bad season imo.:confused:
    You said that they were bad stats for a striker, Smith scored less goals than them all.:)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,099 ✭✭✭✭WhiteWashMan


    doesnt lampard play on the left for chelsea?

    if so, then thats that problem solved.....


  • Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 15,001 ✭✭✭✭Pepe LeFrits


    Originally posted by WhiteWashMan
    doesnt lampard play on the left for chelsea?

    if so, then thats that problem solved.....
    no, that would be duffs position :D


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,956 ✭✭✭✭Villain


    Originally posted by eirebhoy
    You said that they were bad stats for a striker, Smith scored less goals than them all.:)

    Ah yea but come on eirebhoy Leeds were relegated, only Wolves scored less than them throughout the season, IMO if Smith was playing with a top half side he would have scored more than Vassell or Heskey, also Smith is very good at working hard and creating chances for others. I would pick him ahead of Vassell, and its not easy for me to say that being a Villa fan.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,099 ✭✭✭✭WhiteWashMan


    Originally posted by kaids
    no, that would be duffs position :D

    who has been injured for a while....


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,956 ✭✭✭✭Villain


    Originally posted by WhiteWashMan
    who has been injured for a while....
    When he is Gronkiaer (spelling?) or Joe Cole play there, Lampard is not a left sided player.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,099 ✭✭✭✭WhiteWashMan


    in that case, i wonder who is going to play in the left :)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,220 ✭✭✭20 Times 20 Times


    alan thompson celtic

    should have been included after the season he has had


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,592 ✭✭✭✭Dont be at yourself


    I take it from looking at the goalkeepers that Chris Kirkland isn't fit?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,013 ✭✭✭✭eirebhoy


    Originally posted by NekkidBibleMan
    I take it from looking at the goalkeepers that Chris Kirkland isn't fit?
    He is, Richard Wright is the backup keeper. Whats wrong with Martyn?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,592 ✭✭✭✭Dont be at yourself


    Chris Kirkland's fit and he's below Walker in the pecking order? 5th choice? That's crazy, he should be first or second choice!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 182 ✭✭bbop


    Kirkland isnt fit and definatly would have been in the squad if he was, Martyn asked not to be considered, Alan Thompson should never be let near an international team, he is no where near good enough i would prefer to play with 10 men than have him in the team, he is a good player in a bad league, look at Barry Ferguson a far better player than Thompson who made pretty much no impression in his games for Blackburn before he got injured


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,013 ✭✭✭✭eirebhoy


    I meant Kirkland isn't fit, sorry. :dunno:
    Originally posted by bbop
    Alan Thompson should never be let near an international team, he is no where near good enough i would prefer to play with 10 men than have him in the team, he is a good player in a bad league, look at Barry Ferguson a far better player than Thompson who made pretty much no impression in his games for Blackburn before he got injured
    Comments like that make my blood boil. People seem to forget that Celtic play in the biggest club football tournament in the world every bloody year. Please don't comment on a player you have obviously never seen on more than a couple of occasions. Also, learn to use punctuation and please don't reply to this post.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,966 ✭✭✭Jivin Turkey


    Originally posted by eirebhoy
    Comments like that make my blood boil. People seem to forget that Celtic play in the biggest club football tournament in the world every bloody year. Please don't comment on a player you have obviously never seen on more than a couple of occasions. Also, learn to use punctuation and please don't reply to this post.

    In all fairness, so do Shaktar Donestk and Shelbourne or Bohemians, doesnt mean their players are any good. I dont think thompson is good enough although I do feel sorry for him after that last friendly. Ashley Cole and Bridge should play on the left for england because they are both too good to leave out and both could play as either a winger or full back.

    Ledley King? Oh god.
    Vassell? Never rated him. Would rather see beattie geta better chance at it, it would give the attacking options way more balance.

    Alan Smith? He has probably got less than 20 goals in the last 3 seasons. I dont care how hard he works, if you dont pose a threat of scoring youre not worth your place.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,013 ✭✭✭✭eirebhoy


    Originally posted by Jivin Turkey
    In all fairness, so do Shaktar Donestk and Shelbourne or Bohemians, doesnt mean their players are any good.
    I thought you could work out that he plays well for Celtic in the CL aswell as the league.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,441 ✭✭✭✭jesus_thats_gre


    Originally posted by irish1
    Apart from Owen, who I dont think did have a good season, all those stats are very poor for strikers.


    Do you consider this stat poor for a striker?

    16 goals in 29 games, 7 of those he was substitued?



    I consider that a good season?? No?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,441 ✭✭✭✭jesus_thats_gre


    Originally posted by WhiteWashMan
    in that case, i wonder who is going to play in the left :)

    Stevie Gerard!!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,889 ✭✭✭Third_Echelon


    Originally posted by eirebhoy
    I thought you could work out that he plays well for Celtic in the CL aswell as the league.

    i think thats what he meant.... the teams he mentioned always get into europe and play in **** leagues...:rolleyes:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,889 ✭✭✭Third_Echelon


    Originally posted by jesus_thats_gre
    Stevie Gerard!!

    centre midfield every time... no questions... he's not a left-midfielder/winger...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,099 ✭✭✭✭WhiteWashMan


    Originally posted by eirebhoy

    People seem to forget that Celtic play in the biggest club football tournament in the world every bloody year.

    they still play in a crap league. for the first time celtic actually played well in the CL, but now there is no Larsson, who are they going to rely on?
    Originally posted by eirebhoy
    Please don't comment on a player you have obviously never seen on more than a couple of occasions.

    thats a bit unfair. if all only made observations on players we had seen more than 50 times, none of us would ave much to say.
    you form an opinion on what you see. i cant say i would rate him either to be honest.
    some nice play, but i wouldnt make him an international ahead of current choice.
    Originally posted by eirebhoy
    Also, learn to use punctuation and please don't reply to this post.

    listen, just because someone has slagged off celtic, i ont think theres any need for a knee jerk reaction like that. poor form from someone who should know better. you are always the first to talk about trolling and spamming rubbish at others, this is just nonsense abuse.
    as for telling someone not to reply, are you now the post nazis? if you dotn like his opinion, then dont read it, but the poster is fully entitled to reply.

    its this sort of shít that got this forum into the sticky state it has been in recently.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,956 ✭✭✭✭Villain


    Originally posted by jesus_thats_gre
    Do you consider this stat poor for a striker?

    16 goals in 29 games, 7 of those he was substitued?

    I consider that a good season?? No?

    Statistically its not a bad season, but I saw quite a few of his games this year and he missed a lot of chances he would have scored in previous seasons. He obvioiusly is a great talent I have not and would not ever question that, but my point is that I don't think he was on great form this season.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,625 ✭✭✭✭BaZmO*


    Originally posted by WhiteWashMan
    as for hargreaves, i have no idea where that bloke comes into it!
    he always seems to be selected, but i never hear anything of him during the season, its only when it comes to internationals, he is suddenly there.i dont even know what position he plays :)
    Originally posted by WhiteWashMan
    in that case, i wonder who is going to play in the left

    He plays on the left or centre of midfield for Bayern Munich and has bags loads of Champions League football. Hard worker too.

    B.


  • Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 15,001 ✭✭✭✭Pepe LeFrits


    Fabien Barthez (Marseille), Gregory Coupet (Lyon), Mickael Landreau (Nantes); Jean-Alain Boumsong (Auxerre), Marcel Desailly (Chelsea), William Gallas (Chelsea), Bixente Lizarazu (Bayern Munich), Mikael Silvestre (Manchester United), Lilian Thuram (Juventus), Willy Sagnol (Bayern Munich); Ludovic Giuly (Monaco), Claude Makelele (Chelsea), Olivier Dacourt (Roma), Patrick Vieira (Arsenal), Robert Pires (Arsenal), Jerome Rothen (Monaco), Sylvain Wiltord (Arsenal), Zinedine Zidane (Real Madrid), Benoit Pedretti (Sochaux); Thierry Henry (Arsenal), David Trezeguet (Juventus), Louis Saha (Manchester United), Steve Marlet (Marseille).
    what they are up against...


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,013 ✭✭✭✭eirebhoy


    Originally posted by Third_Echelon
    i think thats what he meant.... the teams he mentioned always get into europe and play in **** leagues...:rolleyes:
    I think you missed the words: "played well". Thompson played well against Bayern, Barca, Anderlecht and Lyon as well as big teams in previous years in Europe so has proven himself in Europe. I obviously agree that he plays in a bad league but that doesn't mean he's a bad player.
    Originally posted by WWM
    they still play in a crap league. for the first time celtic actually played well in the CL, but now there is no Larsson, who are they going to rely on?
    They do play in a crap league but they also play at least 14 European matches, 5 Old Firm matches and 1 cup final every year. This isn't the first year Celtic played well in the CL (They beat Porto, Rosenburg, Ajax and Juventus in 2001's CL) and someone like Amoroso will probably replace Larsson.
    Originally posted by WWM
    thats a bit unfair. if all only made observations on players we had seen more than 50 times, none of us would ave much to say.
    you form an opinion on what you see. i cant say i would rate him either to be honest.
    some nice play, but i wouldnt make him an international ahead of current choice.
    I wouldn't comment on a player if I had only seen him a couple of times. Maybe bbop did see him a few times and doesn't rate him because he plays in Scotland, that is the only reason I can come up with TBH. He is not far off Beckham when it comes to crosses and set pieces and IMO has more to offer than Beckham going forward. Its just a pity he's not as good looking and married to a Spice Girl. I am certainly not being biased in saying that BTW.
    Originally posted by WWM
    listen, just because someone has slagged off celtic, i ont think theres any need for a knee jerk reaction like that. poor form from someone who should know better. you are always the first to talk about trolling and spamming rubbish at others, this is just nonsense abuse.
    as for telling someone not to reply, are you now the post nazis? if you dotn like his opinion, then dont read it, but the poster is fully entitled to reply.

    its this sort of shít that got this forum into the sticky state it has been in recently.
    I apologise for expressing how I actually felt to hear: "Alan Thompson should never be let near an international team, he is no where near good enough i would prefer to play with 10 men than have him in the team".

    That is something you hear said about Roy Keane for walking out on Ireland. If someone can make a comment like that about one of Celtic's best players, I certainly wouldn't want to hear what they had to say about Celtic in general. If I was replying to a sensible post (Mine probably wasn't half sensible either TBH) I would have probably put a wink beside the punctuation remark.

    I can't resist replying to most posts and his comments were hardly going to get any nicer so that is why I asked him not to reply and let it rest. I certainly didn't feel I trolled/spammed.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 88,972 ✭✭✭✭mike65


    in that case, i wonder who is going to play in the left

    I really hope Gerrard flops miserably on the left in the two friendlies. Eirrikkssonn must be mad (and was politely told so on Football Focus) stick Wayne Bridge or even Joe Cole out there for Gods sake.

    Mike.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 182 ✭✭bbop


    i think im entitled to my opinion, i have seen Thompson play on numerous occasions this season and I THINK he is a bad player, its not just cos he plays for Celtic, i think thet have some good players Larrson, Hartson, Balde but they also have some players who are nowhere near International class, Thompson cant be compared to Beckhem he isnt even as good as Gareth Barry or JL Samuel
    Also Ericksson is a bad International manager, in the World Cup, England were with out a doubt the worst team to watch, well they were the only one to send me to sleep.....


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,013 ✭✭✭✭eirebhoy


    Originally posted by bbop
    i think im entitled to my opinion, i have seen Thompson play on numerous occasions this season and I THINK he is a bad player....he isnt even as good as Gareth Barry or JL Samuel
    Keep an eye on him during the next CL season and we'll see if you'll be eating your words just like so many others who slagged off Balde.

    BTW - When Thompson played in the premiership with Bolton 6 years ago he scored 9 goals and got 9 assists in 33 appearances. he didn't have the best of times at Villa but was injured for a large percentage of his time there. He has improved a lot since his Bolton days so if he played a part in 18 goals (44% of the teams total goals all season) for an eventual relegated team imagine what he would do with a better team now in the prime of his career. He got 13 goals and 16 assists this season for Celtic.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 182 ✭✭bbop


    the way i see it is if a player like Danny Murphy or David Dunn went to Celtic they would be the best player in the Scottish League and they are no where near the England squad


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,013 ✭✭✭✭eirebhoy


    Originally posted by bbop
    the way i see it is if a player like Danny Murphy or David Dunn went to Celtic they would be the best player in the Scottish League
    i disagree that they would immediatly become the best player in Scotland as there has been a load of high profile players join Celtic and Rangers and become nothing more than squad players. Also, if Murphy and Dunn were left wingers they would surely be in the England squad.

    I have actually shocked myself by finding out that Thompson played a part (either scored or assisted) in 44% of Bolton's premiership goals in 97/98 and he only played 33 games that season.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 182 ✭✭bbop


    the main problem with the England squad is they have no player to come off the bench and frighten the opposition, 1-0 down with 10 minutes left id be happy to see Vassell or Heskey take to the pitch


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,549 ✭✭✭The Brigadier


    Rooney may fill that role...

    I can see SGE going with Heskey and Owen up front...

    I don't think Rooney will get the starting berth.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,441 ✭✭✭✭jesus_thats_gre


    Originally posted by Third_Echelon
    centre midfield every time... no questions... he's not a left-midfielder/winger...

    I agree, he has been the best English Central Midfielder this season with Lampard and close second. But wait and see. Who do you drop out of Scholes, Gerard, Lampard and Beckham?? I wouldn't like to make that decison, who will be the centre two?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,441 ✭✭✭✭jesus_thats_gre


    Originally posted by eirebhoy
    I meant Kirkland isn't fit, sorry. :dunno:


    Comments like that make my blood boil. People seem to forget that Celtic play in the biggest club football tournament in the world every bloody year. Please don't comment on a player you have obviously never seen on more than a couple of occasions. Also, learn to use punctuation and please don't reply to this post.

    A club playing in the Champions League means nothing to be honest. A club advancing to the Quarter Finals is worth talking about!! Thompson is a deent player but 40 games a year in Scotland and 6 in the Champions League does not on its own justify his inclusion. Yes he has CL experience, but it's against mediocre teams.


    Regarding you comment regarding a previous posters punctuation, cop the **** on, you are starting to act like a spoiled little boy again. I wonder is it just because he disagreed with you?

    Originally posted by bbop
    the way i see it is if a player like Danny Murphy or David Dunn went to Celtic they would be the best player in the Scottish League and they are no where near the England squad]

    Agreed, an average player in the Premiership can be a one of the greatest in the Scottish League. Look at Hartson and Sutton for example. Sutton was good back in the day with Norwich and Blackburn but was appalling at Chelsea. He left and went to Scotland, plays well week on week but could he do it south of the border again? Hartson is one of the best in Scotland, how good was he in the Premiership? Thompson is another example, was decent in England but has shone in Scotaland. Its a totally different class of fooball.

    The Scottish League as a whole is on par with the English First Division. I would have said the Second Division only for Rangers and Celtic. Celtic and Rangers could be rated as a mid table team in the Premieship, at best!Celtic and Rangers can match and even beat a Premiership team when its played as a cup match, they wouldn't perform anywhere near as well week on week in the league though.

    Lets face it, Celtic and Rangers have about 10 competitive games a season, possibly less!!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,966 ✭✭✭Jivin Turkey


    I think he should leave Lampard out and play Butt, hence given the midfield more protection and allow Gerrard more freedom.

    Englands bench lacks any sort of bite, Lampard coming off it would be a threat. Also the lack of width might not be so bad considering they will probably start with Owen and Rooney.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,441 ✭✭✭✭jesus_thats_gre


    Originally posted by Jivin Turkey
    I think he should leave Lampard out and play Butt, hence given the midfield more protection and allow Gerrard more freedom.

    Englands bench lacks any sort of bite, Lampard coming off it would be a threat. Also the lack of width might not be so bad considering they will probably start with Owen and Rooney.

    Its an impossible decision, but you can;t drop Lampard who has had a brilliant season for Butt who has not had a season at all!!

    They are obviously gonna play a diamond formation with Scholes playing behind the two strikers. Beckham will play on the right of the diamond with Gerard or Lampard playing the left and rear of the diamond!! I would be inclined to put Gerard at the rear of the diamond, his work rate, tackling and general distribution is superior to that of Lampards. I would put Lampard on the left of the diamond purely for his ability to get forward and put a few away like he has done all season.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,013 ✭✭✭✭eirebhoy


    Originally posted by jesus_thats_gre
    A club playing in the Champions League means nothing to be honest. A club advancing to the Quarter Finals is worth talking about!! Thompson is a deent player but 40 games a year in Scotland and 6 in the Champions League does not on its own justify his inclusion. Yes he has CL experience, but it's against mediocre teams
    In the last 3 seasons Celtic have played against the likes of Juventus, Porto, Bayern, Anderlecht, Lyon, Barcelona, Villarreal, Liverpool, Blackburn, Celta Vigo, Ajax, Stuttgart, Boavista, Valencia as well is smaller European clubs. This year they played 16 European games, the year before they also played 16. They played Rangers 5 times this year and are also in 2 cup finals (a cup final is a cup final). That is 23 decent enough matches. Also, the top half teams in the SPL, when at their best, are no walkovers and are totally underrated.
    Originally posted by jesus_thats_gre
    Regarding you comment regarding a previous posters punctuation, cop the **** on, you are starting to act like a spoiled little boy again. I wonder is it just because he disagreed with you?
    I have seen a few people comment about people's punctuation in posts without any backlash, my comments were caught up in an angered post so will get an angered response. I've just done a search to prove it: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=161110&highlight=punctuation. I honestly didn't say it to harm him. JTG, I can't remember ever having an argument with you but I must have at some time?
    Originally posted by jesus_thats_gre
    Agreed, an average player in the Premiership can be a one of the greatest in the Scottish League. Look at Hartson and Sutton for example. Sutton was good back in the day with Norwich and Blackburn but was appalling at Chelsea. He left and went to Scotland, plays well week on week but could he do it south of the border again? Hartson is one of the best in Scotland, how good was he in the Premiership? Thompson is another example, was decent in England but has shone in Scotaland. Its a totally different class of fooball.
    Hartson was no average premiership player, he looks better in the SPL but I could argue that he's at the peak of his career (he's only 29). I posted Hartson's acheivements in another thread to prove he was above average in the premiership:
    Hartson - For WH he played 73, scored 33. For Wimbledon played 54 scored 21. For Coventry played 12 scored 6. He was England's top scorer in 97/98. He was Britain's most expensive teenager when he joined Arsenal, he joined WH for a record fee and Wimbledon for a club record fee. I think he was also Celtic's record signing at £6.5mil.

    As for Sutton, he had a bad spell at Chelsea, there could be plenty of reasons for that (no partner, bad tactics, etc). You don't suddenly turn from one of the best to average in a few months and most of Chelsea's current signings should prove that (MON wouldn't pay so much for a player if he didn't think he would be up to CL standard). BTW - You could also switch that round and say one of the best players in one league could be average in the SPL (eg. Capucho, Kanchelskis).

    And if you read back a few posts you will see a few suprising stats about Thompson's time in the premiership with Bolton.


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