Turn Off Your Mind by Garry Lachman

pork99

(With reference to williamgrogan's thread "Is there any similarity between Nazism, Homeopathy, Magnetic Back Supports and Religion?" - which I am NOT trying to reopen)

williamgrogan have you ever read "Turn Off Your Mind" by Garry Lachman?

It supports a lot of your arguments though I found it a bit rambling and inconclusive.

I have found more concisely crafted support for those arguments in Richard Dawkin's collection of essays "A Devil's Chaplain" which I am currently reading. Theres a section called "The Infected Mind" which is a joy to read. Have you read it? He puts forward a "religion is a virus" argument and is very good on the automatic deference given to any crackpot religious belief simply because it is a belief.

Sarky

Not virus, meme.

pork99

Originally posted by Sarky
Not virus, meme.

yes meme

excuser moi

williamgrogan

No I haven't even heard of "Turn Off Your Mind" or its writer but I have read nearly everything Dawkins has written, in fact I've even been accused of plagiarising him. I shouldn’t have included Nazism – it’s too much for some people. It’s a sort of no go word.

I do think more and more that none of us is as free to think objectively as we think we are. Genetic and maybe developmental affects leave us with brains that are so pre-wired with traits that we may very well fall into particular camps more so because of these traits than any amount of reading and thinking. Even reading and thinking are related to traits and abilities. One could argue that if you point out the facts and someone can think logically that the truth can be arrived at but if they are missing the trait that makes you want to read or the ability to think logically then you cannot get them to accept the truth. Just like the smoking ban, maybe the only way to stop Homeopathy et al is to ban them and sod the education angle?

Which reminds me, New Scientist this week (20th March issue) has many articles that are of relevance to Skeptics and to recent debates; what came “before” the big bang, “Bad or Mad” which is relevant to my point why people think the way they do and do "evil" things and that Herbal Medicines and supplements are helping wipe out rare wild plants.

PS I was in Booths today and they are selling; magnetic wrist bands that cure Artritis, 5-day Detox kits, whole sections devoted to supplements and herbal “medicines” etc.

There must be a lot of people who think they are toxic. I wonder what damage it does these people to read in a Pharmacy that they are correct and need to detoxify? I certainly would be worried if I thought I was toxic.

I'm going to start a rambling thread so that the only rule is that there is no point off thread. Can I or is that against the rules?

davros

Originally posted by williamgrogan
I'm going to start a rambling thread so that the only rule is that there is no point off thread. Can I or is that against the rules?

Eh, what? A thread with no point? Is that useful?

ecksor

Putting the weird stream of consciousness stuff in one place might be an interesting thing to gape at.

williamgrogan

No, neither of you are quite thinking what I am. There is no "open" thread where a one off comment or reference to something that needs no debate or follow up. Why do we have to have ALL threads that are specific to a particular point, why can't we have a thread that is NOT specific but for general comments. Someone could make a comment and it might lead to a thread.

Maybe call it the Water Cooler Thread?

PS

I am both a Van Morrison and James Joyce fan.

davros

I'd rather see lots of little threads with meaningful titles. If nobody responds to them, they will disappear off the bottom of the screen.

On other forums, I never open a thread just to find out what it's about. If it's not clear from the title, I move on.

williamgrogan

Having such a thread is not an impediment to starting other threads, in fact maybe will encourage them. Ì think it's obvious that many people do not want to start a thread. I think you have answered the question yourself. If I start it and no one adds any comments or reads it then it will disappear. Is there not an accepted name for such a thread?

davros

Well, the Media Watch thread is similar to what you are suggesting. It has attracted a lot of one-off posts that might not have been made otherwise. But it might also have swamped a developing discussion from time-to-time.

Is there any in-between solution here? Instead of having a completely general thread, have several fairly general threads. For example, one thread could be "Quack Product Watch".

You obviously have an idea what will be in this new thread. Any examples?

williamgrogan

There are a number of reasons I'm thinking of this.

Many people (most?) read but do not post and might not want to start a thread. Even I hesitate as you need to consider whether the point raised is "important" enough. I have no access to the statistics that you have. How many read and never post? Those numbers that indicate number of “reads”, why is there no count of the individuals that have read a particular post? This would be a more interesting statistic than seeing that you read your own thread 1000 times. The ISS needs to attract people and gain attention and not just of readers. Readers can see how easily that other’s comments get attacked and might feel intimidated on a thread where those debating might have some special interest or knowledge in the subject (not withstanding the lack of a relevant degree, Masters and PhD!).

The software used for boards.ie is good but does not provide a "live" thread or header area. Most of the threads are specific and might not be of interest to most people. I can imagine only a very small group interested in say Chernobyl and talking to young voters I find no interest in eVoting for example.

I mention the water cooler as somewhere to stop and gossip. I think that this thread would be more "now" than other threads that demand more effort. Even being told that you are off thread is an impediment to comment. The idea would be that if you went to your PC and posted a general comment there that you would be more likely to start a quick conversion maybe related to something current as opposed to an ongoing campaign. Many of us monitoring this thread can quickly answer Skeptic type queries that might come in from journalists etc or maybe those with questions after watching a Documentary or reading a book where they might want another’s opinion.

It’s a place where you could ask a quick question and get an answer.

Maybe I’m thinking more of a chat room? Why isn’t there a chat room for ISS people?