Loop Studios... Ugh

Töpher

Anyone else have similar experiences with Loop Studios? We had to practice there yesterday as our usual spot was busy with recording for the day, as much as we knew it sucked there, sometimes ya just have to put up with it anyways. This quote is from what I said in the sticky on rehersal rooms after the last time. This was months ago, and was hopeful that maybe things had changed....

Originally posted by Einstürzende
must be said, last time we were in loop drum kit was held together with a vice, couldnt get my top toms any closer than about 12 inches from each other due to this vice and the shít stands, horrible, bass drum spokes were broken, cymbal stands were unadjustable in any sense cuz they were mix'n'mathced together and didnt fit together, and snare stand collapsed mid-play! tom stands, were like cymbals stands, all wrong sizes, exact response from guys was "well we cant do anything about that", this meant that when i hit bass drum, toms rotated around the place, which is annoying, especially in songs with double kick. in all, i wouldnt advise the revs to practice there, let alone anyone half decent!

Now the new stuff:
Drums were no better, both rack toms were the same size, snare stand was dire, unadjustable, quite literaly stuck at nipple height! :eek: Enough on the drums, they were simply disgraceful, noone can logically play them with any sort of competence.
The bass amp: Oh dear Jesus, thats all I can say. It sounded like it was about to blow up when turned above 3 or 4, it was an old Trace Elliot, so it should have been ok, but the speaker in it was fúcked! Sounded like it was about to explode (and not in a good way! ) any given second, was ridiculous.
So with myself and the bassist rendered effectively useless we just packed up our stuff and left. Was ridiculous. The guitarist would have been ok (I think) cuz he brought his own amp head etc with him....

We would have been charged "75-80 euro" (in their words) for the session...
Personally, the standard of equipment and service down there doesnt deserve 20 euro a session, let alone the ghastly high prices they charge.

Does anyone else here have similar experiences with them? Or (if possible) good experiences and regularly use the place?

[/rant]

Giblet

Em, bring your own gear next time

Elektra's drumkit is worse, held together with duct tape.

Töpher

Was a once off! Never ever go back, use a much better place usually (but it was taken up with recording). At the minute I only have an electric kit due to where I live, so I rely on the rehersal room to have a half decent kit when we go to jam! And ugh, surely someone must have complained about that bass amp before!

They called a few hours later (after they realised we weren't there - we were actually able to pack up everything and walk out without anyone noticing!) and were saying about how they have better equipment but just don't put it in the rooms or something.... So you get what ya pay for, nice gear for them to use privately while you use complete cráp! And they were half an hour late letting us down to the room too...

Doctor J

Bring your own gear? These places charge extortionate fees (€70 ) for a 5 hour session and expect you to put up with shyt gear, but if you ask, they'll go and get the stuff that works? Sounds like a scam. According to Loop, the backline is included in the fee (drum kit, bass amp, guitar amp, mics and PA) so you're paying to use the gear whether you actually use it or not.

It's a bit much to leave out junk and then, if you ask, they'll get you something which will do what you're paying for it do do :mad:


Edit ---> Last time I played drums in there the rack tom skins were held together with duct tape and the "drum stool" had wheels - for those of you who don't drum just try to picture that in your mind

Töpher

Originally posted by Doctor J
Edit ---> Last time I played drums in there the rack tom skins were held together with duct tape and the "drum stool" had wheels - for those of you who don't drum just try to picture that in your mind

Had to play double bass on one of them there myself!

funktastic

Yeah they charge extortionate prices but if you are a drummer there's no point expecting an even half-decent drum kit except in a proper studio, just have to get on with it if you can't bring your own gear. If you're serious enough you shouldn't practice on **** kits like that, no point crying about it.

Doctor J

If you're paying money you're a right to expect working backline.

dabhoys

Theres a difference between half decent and non playable. I'm not a drummer and I can see how hard it would be to play them. Not to mention the state. Trust me where we usually practice has a good nick kit. 3 actually. You pay enough. What the **** do they do with the money???? Theres a good question. I'm in no ****ing rush back to it....

loop studio

Hi folks

I work and am one of the directors of Loop Studios. I saw this thread and would like to respond to some of your complaints.

Firstly I do agree that the drum kits are in a bad state of repair with regards the skins on the toms and we will be rectifying that soon. The reason drum kits tend to get in a state is that all drummers go about tuning kits in a different way and playing them differently we have also found that due to some drummers being theives our kits tend to get run down very quickly, small screws and bolts that hold the kits together generally get nicked from here and as such effects all the other drummers who play here, as any drummer can attest it can be annoyingly difficult to get these replacement parts you end up haveing to buy new stands or rack tom holders instead, which we have done continuously. However...we do have four fully functional drum stools three fully functional cymbal stands for each of the rooms so I don't know what happened to einzdurzende when they rehearsed here on Sunday. I also know for a fact that none of our rack toms need a clamp to hold them in place so einzdurzende that was also a lie!

In response to the bass amps I'm a bass player and I have just checked all the bass amps to see what might be up with them, there is absolutely nothing wrong with them, nothing...For those of you who are regular customers you would have noticed that for the last couple of months Loop has been undergoing upgrades we have bought new guitar amps, new bass amps, new P.A.'s we have new mic stands and microphones on order and will be replacing all drum skins in due course.

In response to Dabhoys purile comment "what the **** do they do with the money" I 'd just like to state that we are a cooperative company and as such the four guys who work here are also directors. We have done this for the past four years and still are receiving less wages from it then if we were on the dole. I presume that from some of the comments posted here that some people have no experience of what it is like to run a business in Dublin, but let me tell you for a small busioness it is very hard. For instance over the last 2 years our insurance went up by 200%, our rent which is high also went up as did rates, waste charges and electricity. I understand that these are factors of business but if we did not increase our rates we would have gone out of business and it would have been the punters who suffered with less reheasal space again in Dublin ( in the last two years we have seen two rehearsal facilities in Dublin close). Our basic rate here which includes drum kit, 1 guitar amp, 1 bass amp and microphones is €65 which if you split that betwwen the average band size of four members works out at €16.25 (not enough to get drunk on).

As a final statement to Dabhoys I'd challenge him to run a rehearsal studio and see how long he lasts, it's not easy, has no real financial reward so the only real reason for continuing to do it is for the love of music... are you that altruistic Dabhoys? I think not! and to you einzdurzende firstly get your facts right the charge for your session would have been a maximum of €70 not €75-€80 as you incorrectly stated and next time you have a problem with anything in life try confronting it like a man and not sneaking away like some skullery rat, that's how you'll accomplish what you want rather then bitchin' in some forum...einzdurzende we know who you are and we'll be glad not to see you back here again!

We do take our customers concerns here seriously and continously try to address them but unfortuneatly due to financial constraints sometimes this takes a little longer then we would all like (if something is particularly unsatisfactory we always implement a discount) . We are getting there though and over the course of time if we can keep this ship afloat we will become a premier rehearsal facility where everyone is happy with everything, but you know what they say about pleasing people...

Töpher

My comment about the kit with the clamp was from months ago, as I said it my post, I copied it up as a comparison. The kit was not held with a vice on Sunday, I never said it was. As stated, that was in regard to a few months back. Please read my post carefully before accusing me of being a liar. I am just annoyed I did not have a camera with me that day. [For your own personal reference, it was the room at the end on the right hand side that had the vice holding up toms. You must know that as well as I do, was a tough days drumming]. Same thing applies to the stool comment, there was a stool on sunday (altho it was missing locks and stuck incredibly low - and unlike some drummers, I dont like covering other peoples equipment in tape to suit my needs, it effects everyone that plays there after me), the wheels was, again, from before. Read it.

Drummers tune in different tunings? Surprising that, particularily when both rack toms are the same size.

The price quoted 75-80 was what one of the guys working there said to us on the phone when talking after we had left. Presumably it was more because I required the use of a snare which appears to be listed as an extra charge now.

I'll be glad not to go back there again, without trying to be harsh, the place is, in my honest opinion based upon this recent trip, and several in the past, a shambles.

Anything I said, was true when stated, and in regards to the prices discrepency, this is what was told to us over the phone, by one of the guys working there. My facts are solid.

[Would it have killed you to copy and paste my name seeing as you clearly can't see it well enough to type it for yourself]

Doctor J

Originally posted by loop studio
In response to the bass amps I'm a bass player and I have just checked all the bass amps to see what might be up with them, there is absolutely nothing wrong with them, nothing...

I have been in the little room Einsturzende is referring to and if you still have the old 15" Trace Elliot combo in there try plugging something into the 'Active' input. When you've accepted there is something very wrong with that (ie it is dead) then plug into the passive input and put the input and output gain at about half way, flatten the EQ and play some notes. G especially caused the speaker to shyt itself, in my experience. That amp should well be capable of that without the speaker farting and flapping.

There is something wrong with it.

I appreciate running such a business must be tough, but you are trading on the strength of renting out rooms and a backline. If the backline isn't up to scratch then your customers have a right to complain, and a right to walk out as any customer does when they are not being treated correctly.

dabhoys

Just to give some credit the guitar amps we're fine. Although I did bring my own. I'm not looking to run a business like this. I'm in an entirely different field. But I can understand your difficulties. But why can other places in dublin run less rates and provide a better service. For one your selling a product to the public. Simple business good service means good business. Regardless of artistic or musical love. In the harsh reality of this world if you don't appeal to the people they won't come back. I don't appreciate my motivations for playing music for being attacked. We're not being sneaky either. We we're just posting our views on a particular item and seeing if anyone had the same problem. There is nothing wrong with that. Don't be attacking me for my opinions. There nothing sneaky. What if I worked for a paper and was doing reviews about rehearsal spaces in dublin would you accuse me of it then??? We're entitled to our opinion as is anyone else and if they want to continue using your facilities then let them gladly do so.

Shane Smith

My only issue with Loop is the recent price hike! But as I'm trying to run my own business, and having read your explanation it does make some kind of sense (INFLATION! ; )

They haven't increased prices in a good while but gear wise, maybe if all u dumbass novices stopped stealing n breaking the stuff it might actually serve its intended purpose & lets face it, most of u don't even put ur ****in' rubbish in the bin - u know who u are >: (

Sometimes life doesn't work properly

John

I've practised in a few places around Dublin and I can honestly say that Loop, while it's not the worst, it's far from the best. I can understand problems with rates, inflation and all that but you're not the only business affected. If rent is so bad that you can't afford to keep decent equipment, move to another cheaper location. I think people would be willing to travel a little further if they were getting their money's worth.

If life is as tough as you claim for a rehearsal studio then I suggest you seriously think things out for the long run, if you can't afford to buy new amps and drum equipment then you're going to lose a lot more punters.

And if theft is such a problem, maybe you should keep better watch over the rehearsal rooms rather than letting people take the things in the first place. But that would take away from sitting in your office all day. And would it kill you to run a mop around the place once in a while, you can count the fungal colonies on the discarded Rizla packets.

loop studio

Dahboys and eindurzende (I'm gonna spell your name wrong intentionally from now, it was an honest mistake but since we're getting petty). I was not attacking you Dahboys for your opinion I was just responding to it. When I see a comment like "What the **** do they do with the money????", it upsets me as I work really hard for very little and I felt what you said was a little flippant. If my response seemed a bit curt I apologise but it is was due to the fact that I believed you didn't really have a sense of how hard it is to run a business.

With regards other peoples rates all I can say is that we were one of the cheapest studios in town for a long time but as I previously stated it would not have been viable to continue in business without a price rise. In fairness we haven't raised our prices in five years infact when the changeover to the euro happened we actually rounded down our prices as opposed to up as so many other business's did.

Another reason for our price rise was to address the concerns of our customers and undergo an equipment overhaul which we couldn't have done at our previous rates. Dahboys I do accept your point that we rent out rooms with backline and as such everything that you pay for should be in working order. I hope I have been able to address your concerns in this matter and over the coming months as a result of our price rise you will be much happier to rehearse here as you will know that the equipment is top notch, we're getting there and we do appreciate our clients patience in this and their notifying us of problems. Really the price hike (although this sounds a bit weak) is for the sake of our customers and their satisfaction with our services.

In response to other studios around town being cheaper then us the reason must be that their overheads are less, I don't know how legitimate all of them are but I would suspect that some are not registered companies i.e. do they declare VAT, pay rates, corporation tax, PAYE, PRSI, Insurance, audit fees etc. Since we are a city centre studio our rent is going to be quite high and as such that is also passed on to the client. The benifit being that of a central location. If travelling outside the city centre is not a problem for a band they will find cheaper spaces on the outskirts of the city centre, but for most bands it's easier to meet up in town. As far as I know we are fairly much on par with TBMC's rates.

I was not accusing you dahboys of being sneaky nor anyone else who posts on forums. I agree with freedom of speech and you are entitled to your opinions and as a director of a business I respect your opinions as your custom is my livelyhood. Sometimes it is nice to hear these criticisms in person rather then come accross them (they're easier to address then). However I was accusing eindurzende of being sneaky as this guy and his band sneaked out of the studio without informing anyone of their concerns and the first we hear of it is a public announcement. In my view that is neither an honourable or mature way to deal with a problem. As I said earlier if the equipment was unsatisfactory to them they could have told us and if we couldn't have rectified it and they were still unhappy they could leave and we wouldn't charge them. In the past when this has been the case we have infact offered a free rehearsal, something I'm sure eindurzende(is this winding you up now?) will not be availing of now. Eindurzende I will give you taht at one stage a tom was held together with a clamp, pathetic I know but this was due to thievery and an unavailability of a replacement part. With regards you having two toms the same size this was due to tom heads being bust. If you had asked Dave in the office to swap it for a different tom I'm sure he would have been able to manage it as not all drummers use two toms and I would imagine one was available. I do accept howver that 13" and 14" toms should be available for all kits and over the next two weeks that will be the case.

To finish I beleive most of our equipment is up to scratch at the moment with the exception of some of the drum skins (I will look into the concerns about the active input on one of the trace elliot combos and the state of the driver, I don't understand how it would just fart and flap on G though?) . Once the drum heads have been replaced we will pay closer attention to the upkeep of the drumkits. In fact if there is anyone out there who might fancy a nixer of tuning and looking after the upkeep of our drumkits get in touch as none of us here are drummers and don't really now the best way to keep kits in tune. Any other concerns just get in touch with us here and we'll see what we can do email info@loop.ie tel 01 8720199

loop studio

To John2

To set up a new rehearsal space costs a lot of money. You're looking at around €5000 per room for the soundproofing alone that's without airconditioning, which unfortuneatly we also don't have here! We currently don't have the capital required to pitch our tent elsewhere although if we stay in this business it will be something we will do, and when we do all of our customers requests will be adressed to make it the best place to rehearse!

As for being able to afford upgrades as I said earlier we are now getting in a position to do so and have been doing as our regular clients will attest. We recently purchased new hardware for all the kits, a laney guitar amp, a hughes and Kettner bass amp and two new P.A's with more upgrades on order I feel we will be able to stand by the state of our equipment.

Ahhhh the mopping!!! yes you were right but if you've been here since christmas you'll have noticed that things have changed, we have implemented a dayly roster
for the mopping and clearing out of rooms...hope you enjoy the changes there's more to come! Hopefully people will feel that they are getting their moneys worth

Just to let all of you know if you fancy an air conditioned studio with Ampeg rigs, DW kits, orange, mesa boogie or Vox Ac30 amps for 4 hours for €40 move to spain you can get them in Madrid and get payed to play! Actually that's the case with a lot of places outside Ireland. The reason rehearsal is expensive here is the same reason everything is expensive here...we're not the ones to blame look to the government, but this is not a political thread

Töpher

So, you withdraw your accusation of me being a liar over that tom-vice statement? I have since gotten a rather unflattering picture of that off my guitarist, who did have a camera that day, but I see no need to post it to prove my point as you have now, seemingly, admitted to this.

I had specifically asked for a high tom, and after several minutes of searching I was finally given a mid tom, presumably because nothing else was available, this on its own was not so bad, I would have just tuned them differently, but with everything else I thought it was worth noting.

And for the record, we didn't exactly sneak out, in fact we weren't quiet leaving at all, perhaps over the gaming in the office we couldnt be heard. Might that also be why we were half an hour late being allowed down to the room?

These forums are for free expression and discussion, and I stand by my right to put up an account of what we experienced.

Spelling my name wrong does not wind me up at all, I just pointed it out because it wasn't even close to correct.

welly

having used loop on a few occasions i found it to be stuffy and dirty but its rock and roll, its not supposed to be perfect and shining .:D chill guys
:cool:

loop studio

Einstürzende

It dosn't matter if you were like a herd of elephants leaving, bands come and go to the shops, buy coffee, supermacs etc... we're used to people coming in and out it's just the fact that you never bothered to tell anyone, you just walked out leaving no explanation, can you now accept that telling the person in charge of the office of your grievances would have been the courteous thing to do?

As for getting down to the room late this would have been the result of the morning band finishing late. When this happens the band coming into the room can stay on for the time they were delayed by.

As for the gaming the person who was playing games had finished his shift and there was someone else on duty.

As far as waiting for your tom this was probably due to other bands making requests at the same time, which there's nothing we can really do about, sorry...

These forums are for free expression and discussion, and I stand by my right to put up an account of what we experienced.

I also stand by my right to respond to our version of what you experienced there are always two sides to every story.

Töpher

Of course there are two sides, you attacked me about putting it on the forum, I defended my right to do that, exactly as I would defend your right to tell your side. That is afterall the point.

I have nothing against waiting when I ask for something, what I was pointing out was there was no high toms available.

I still, however, do not feel I was obliged to stop and explain myself, people walk out of restaurants when the food/service is unacceptable, of course the person in charge will be angry and offended, but perhaps it will change the way they deal with customers or prepare the food in the future - similar situation.

Dr. Loon

Originally posted by Einstürzende
, people walk out of restaurants when the food/service is unacceptable, of course the person in charge will be angry and offended,

Eh..... no they don't. They complain first, inform the manager they don't intend to pay and then walk out.
If you were to get caught simply walking out of a restaurant without informing anyone or paying, you'd likely have the police called.

Where are Loop studios, I'm trying to think whether we've used them before?Sounds pretty expensive.

Fianna

I've been to Loop Studios a few times now, and while it isn't perfect, it does the job. Like somebody said earlier, it's not meant to be perfect, it serves its purpose. All me and my band want is somewhere to thrash out a few songs for a couple of hours. Maybe the more professional bands want more than that, but it suits us fine for now. We should just appreciate what we've got.

Only problem I've had was being let into the room late. And that was in the morning, so it was nothing to do with the band before us. All the bands scheduled for the morning were left in the entrance hall for about 45 minutes. But in fairness we were charged an hour less, so it didn't bother us really.

I can only speak for the guitar amps, but they seemed fine to me at Loop. I've never had any touble there with amps, unlike TBMC...depending on what mood a particular staff member at TBMC is in seems to determine the quality of the equipment supplied...:rolleyes:

Doctor J

Regardless of where it is or what it is, if you're paying money for a service you are entitled to feel hard done by if you're not getting value for money. I've been playing long enough and wasted too much time in rehearsal rooms waiting for faulty/damaged equipment to be replaced (or trying to find a way around the problem because there is no working equipment available) which should never have been put in the room in the first place. It's incredibly frustrating to show up for a rehearsal and waste time messing around with faulty electronic equipment or trying to get a reasonable thud from a duct-taped drum skin (x 3).

If the backline isn't in good condition then the band should have the option not to use it and not pay for it. I think Apple had their pricing set up in such a way, ie the room costs €x, bass amp costs €x, guitar amp etc etc. If decent working equipment isn't available then the musicians should be informed when the booking is being made (ie- you'll need to bring x y z). It is unfair to expect people to walk into a room and find crap/malfunctioning equipment and pay for the privilege of suffering using it when it's too late for them to do anything about it. I can understand the frustration. Nobody's asking for perfection, just what is says on the tin, so to speak. In respnse to "I don't understand how it would just fart and flap on G though?" - the speaker farted out on all notes, but really clipped overwhelmingly around 200Hz, even with the EQ adjusted to remove it.

bombidol

Loop aint great to be honest, it gets SO feckin hot its scary in there. and the Drum gear is among the worst in the city. they DO have nice Laney guitar half stacks, and bass wise i wouldnt know to be honest. The PA has always been fine when ive been in there. we usually play in the underground, i reckon its the best around. altough jsut last night we had to remove a bass amp AND and guitar amp and replace them cause the originals were knackered.

dabhoys

Hey loop I appreciate you for addressing my concerns. I understand how hard it is to run a business. Appreciate you at least responding to this forum as it is a great method of feedback for you. You get to hear whats going on....

loop studio

Cheers Dabhoys

It's been good reading the comments and we are taking everything that's been said here into consideration. Hopefully it'll help make Loop a better place for all, one of the lads is actually ordering heads for all the kits as I write this piece. Thanks for all the feedback folks.

bombidol

It was handbags at dawn there for a while ladies. but im glad to see its settled down a bit. Its excellent that we can get representatives of these companys here. loop and Music maker spring to mind. People can find it easier to air their problems online than actually confronting the people in the shop etc. If these reps can listen to the punters and make some positive steps then its a good thing

Mrs Grohl

loop isnt the worst, guitar amps are as good as any weve used around and same with the PA's. although out of the 3 rooms weve been given on different occasions 2 were very cramped(especially for a 5 piece) and hot!. you get the room opposite the office with the piano tho and your laughin..

has anyone here recorded in loop...? how does it compare