FAMOUS or INFAMOUS

VERY_board

Is it better to be Famous or Infamous?

I ask this and pose this point......

In sixty years time who will remember Mary McAleese? (Famous)

On the other hand, who will ever forget Hitler? (Infamous)


I'm very interested to see replies to this.

phreak

if you were someone like Hitler would you like to be remembered?

i wouldn't call Mary McAleese famous... doubt many people outside ireland know who she is.

VERY_board

OK,

Gerhard Schroeder or Hitler?

Agent Smith

i would prefare to be infamous



its the infamous people that go down in history


I.E
we all will rememer osama bin laden but who remembers the person who discovered the cure for smallpox

VERY_board

I think it was a guy called Jenner that found the cure, dunno where that came from probably Junior Cert History....


I would also love to be infamous...

it will happen!

tman

i'd rather live on in the hearts of people who have experienced "the bone" than live on through infamy

The Corinthian

Originally posted by agent smith
we all will rememer osama bin laden but who remembers the person who discovered the cure for smallpox

People with an education.

VERY_board

Originally posted by The Corinthian
People with an education.

This is a good point!

flogen

Id much rather be unknown than be remembered for the kind of things Hitler will be remembered for.

Flogen

TheSonOfBattles

We're all gonna die and be forgotten eventually. It's just a matter of time. Even if people remember your name in a thousand years, they won't be mourning you, you'll either be just another name, or a set of experiences no one liked.

Sadly infamous people are remembered long after famous people, but do you want to be remembered for some thing so bad people use you as an example of what NOT to do. Of how NOT to live your life.

More than likely, 100 years after I die no one will even know I existed, and while this makes me sad, it's just another part of life. Death is after all the only surety. So either get busy living, or get busy dying to quote a film I can't remember the name of :dunno:

Big Ears

great infamous soccer players :cruyf(sp) maradonna best

famous soccer players :Just fontaine

these are all greats but way more people know and respect cruyf maradonna and best than fontaine. Im leaving PELE out becasue he destroys my argument. So im just going to say he's an exception becasue he was the greatest ever.

VERY_board

Originally posted by Big Ears
great infamous soccer players :cruyf(sp) maradonna best

famous soccer players :Just fontaine

these are all greats but way more people know and respect cruyf maradonna and best than fontaine. Im leaving PELE out becasue he destroys my argument. So im just going to say he's an exception becasue he was the greatest ever.

One of the better examples was left out...what is George best?

VERY_board

Originally posted by flogen
Id much rather be unknown than be remembered for the kind of things Hitler will be remembered for.

Flogen

What about all the good things Hitler did?

(I am serious)

BKtje

if you were someone like Hitler would you like to be remembered?

Well if you were someone like Hitler you would like to be remembered for what you did as he thought he was right.

rymus

Originally posted by agent smith
we all will rememer osama bin laden but who remembers the person who discovered the cure for smallpox

Edward Jenner. If you don't count all those milkmaids though. I'm not even going to get into that now... back on topic.

Capt'n Midnight

I'd rather be rich and anonymous

But infamy is relative - most war heros - and is a subset of fame. What is the point of wanting to be infamous if no one knows you ?

[edit] Jenner didn't do anything with milkmaids - IIRC it was a small boy..

Woden

but if your really famous not mary mcaleese famous you will be remembered just as much as if you where infamous. take einstein for example

Big Ears

Originally posted by VERY_board
One of the better examples was left out...what is George best?

when the word best came after maradonna i assumed people would know im talking about geoerge best and not maradonna being the best.

VERY_board

Good point there

phreak

Originally posted by B-K-DzR
Well if you were someone like Hitler you would like to be remembered for what you did as he thought he was right.

touché

Turkey

Errrr, good things that Hitler did.
Somehow I do not think the building of a few hundred kilometers of motorway can be stacked up to amongst other tallys of victims, the killing of 10 million Russians and 6 million Jews, and that tiny temper tantrum known here as the Emergency, and more correctly, worldwide as World War 2.



If infamy is the price of fame, I think it's too high.

TheSonOfBattles

Actually Hitler did a lot of good things in a round about way. If he hadn't started World War II then there would have been no push by countries such as America to quickly develop arms. The development of arms and defences in both WWII and the Cold War that followed is what developed the computer. If it wasn't for Hitler it might be another hundred years before computers were invented and we wouldn't be having this discussion.

It's still to high a price, but he did have a good effect in a weird way.

VERY_board

Hitler did alot more than build motorways, but we won't get into that on this post.
I think infamy is underrated in the grand scale of things.

Exit

He hardly set out to do those things.

Exit

On topic, neither of them are all that appealing. When you're dead, you're dead and whether people remember you or not won't matter at all.

VERY_board

Originally posted by Exit
On topic, neither of them are all that appealing. When you're dead, you're dead and whether people remember you or not won't matter at all.

It will for your family who can scam money out of random book writeres and film/tv producers in the future, no?

Johnny_the_fox

Originally posted by VERY_board

What about all the good things Hitler did?

The Voltswagen and the Autobahn?

Exit

Originally posted by VERY_board
It will for your family who can scam money out of random book writeres and film/tv producers in the future, no?

Yes, but whether you're famous or infamous won't matter.

The Corinthian

Originally posted by Johnny_the_fox
The Voltswagen and the Autobahn?

"If our country were defeated, I hope we should find a champion as admirable [as Hitler] to restore our courage and lead us back to our place among the nations?" - Winston Churchill, Great Contemporaries, 1937

Aren’t we all such geniuses with the benefit of hindsight? :rolleyes:

VERY_board

Originally posted by The Corinthian
"If our country were defeated, I hope we should find a champion as admirable [as Hitler] to restore our courage and lead us back to our place among the nations?" - Winston Churchill, Great Contemporaries, 1937

Aren’t we all such geniuses with the benefit of hindsight? :rolleyes:

there is no denying hitler's genius surely?

The Corinthian

Originally posted by VERY_board
there is no denying hitler's genius surely?

I wasn't commenting on Hitler's genius or lack thereof.

TheSonOfBattles

Yea, I wouldn't call someone who attacked Russia in the middle of winter a genius tbh.

Barry Aldwell

Originally posted by TheSonOfBattles
Yea, I wouldn't call someone who attacked Russia in the middle of Russia a genius tbh.

In fairness he was just following the second law of despotic dictators - You've gotta attack Russia. Never mind winter clothes, just attack now.

passive

In fairness he was just following the second law of despotic dictators - You've gotta attack Russia. Never mind winter clothes, just attack now.

hmm...i'm probably walking into something here..but whats the first law?

sionnach

Originally posted by agent smith
we all will rememer osama bin laden but who remembers the person who discovered the cure for smallpox

[pedant]no one discovered a cure for smallpox, edward jenner just found out how to prevent people from getting it [/pedant]

Oriel

George Best has had both, just ask him which he thinks is better...

astrofool

einstein
lincoln
washington
churchill
jesus

all famous rather than infamous and "fairly" well remembered

mike65

Originally posted by passive
hmm...i'm probably walking into something here..but whats the first law?

"Always know where your towel is"....maybe!

Mike.

Kold

Anyone can be infamous if they truly wanted too. I believe that that is the answer to your question.

Capt'n Midnight

Originally posted by TheSonOfBattles
Actually Hitler did a lot of good things in a round about way. If he hadn't started World War II then there would have been no push by countries such as America to quickly develop arms. The development of arms and defences in both WWII and the Cold War that followed is what developed the computer. If it wasn't for Hitler it might be another hundred years before computers were invented and we wouldn't be having this discussion.

It's still to high a price, but he did have a good effect in a weird way.

IIRC Konrad Zeus developed the stored program electronic computer independently. But had to use relays instead of valves because he couldn't afford them. Had the economy been different with less resourses being devoted to the war machine etc. the history of computing could have been very different.

The other big development of WWII was radar and semiconductors. Most of the major combatants (except the chinese) were using radar before the war.

Cabaal

Originally posted by VERY_board
In sixty years time who will remember Mary McAleese? (Famous)

Mary Robinson is far more famous then her, one by the people of Ireland because she was the first women president and two by the UN because she left her position because she got pissed off with the US and what they were doing...

Cabaal

Originally posted by TheSonOfBattles
Yea, I wouldn't call someone who attacked Russia in the middle of winter a genius tbh.

He wasn't the first leader to make this mistake..

Kold

Originally posted by Cabaal
Mary Robinson is far more famous then her, one by the people of Ireland because she was the first women president and two by the UN because she left her position because she got pissed off with the US and what they were doing...

Mary who?

In all fairness, EVERYONE, including Russia, thought that the Germans would crush them. And they did. They were totally under equipped and under staffed, yet they still killed an amazing amount of Russians. They laid seige to cities instead of attacking them which was a mistake, but then again 20 million(the number could have been as high as 50 according to recent reports) Russians were killed by a smallish amount of Germans, and it was only after Russia practically started turning into a war factory that they started to defeat the Germans.

Faust

Long story short you're not gonna give a **** about infamy or eh... famity...... When you're dead!

Barry Aldwell

Well, it's kinda hard not to kill Russians when they just keep running out in the open towards your machine guns. The Russian dependancy on attrition meant the Germans were always going to kill more anyway.

Oh, and the first law of despotic dictatorship is: Never play a game of poker without having a Colt .45 lying on the table to your right. When it happens, you'll know why.

LegacyUser

Originally posted by Faust
Long story short you're not gonna give a **** about infamy or eh... famity...... When you're dead!

only sensible reply yet, though i didn't actually read the whole thread
but yea, aint no diff how infamous or famous you are when you're pushin up daisies its gonna make bugger all diff

phreak

Originally posted by bananayoghurt
only sensible reply yet, though i didn't actually read the whole thread
but yea, aint no diff how infamous or famous you are when you're pushin up daisies its gonna make bugger all diff

its a nice thought that people will remember you when you're gone.

Faust

Well you seem to be banned... I guess uill remember you for that...

TheSonOfBattles

Originally posted by Cabaal
He wasn't the first leader to make this mistake..

That was part of the reason I said he wasn't a genius for attacking in winter.