right to refuse entry?????

WhiteWashMan

Originally posted by Caliden/Rainbow

a college student

ixoy

Are you still drunk writing this?
Where was it anyway? I'd never wish to queue for so long just to get in somewhere. Not worth it.
Your first mistake as getting argumentative with the bouncer. That'd never work. You say the male bouncer let you by, but the female bouncer halted you? Were your friends to blame at all? You say "not all 3 of us were 18" - I assume that's a typo.

Anyway, they can refuse who they wish, especially if they think you're drunk. Under the Intoxicating Liquor Act 2003 it is an offence to admit a drunken person to the bar. Thus the barman is liable (for up to a €1500 fine) and therefore he doesn't want to risk it so any potential trouble - the cut of your jib, attitude, etc. - he could blame on that alone. Interstingly you shouldn't enter a bar when drunk [Liquor Act 2003, Part 2, Section 6, Sub-paragraph ii].

Anyway the particular section you want is in Part II, Section 8.5:

(5) It shall not be unlawful for a licensee to refuse admission to
the licensed premises to any person convicted of a offence under this
section where, having regard to the obligations of the licensee under
the Acts and this Act, admission could reasonably be regarded as
involving a substantial risk that the person would engage in disorderly
conduct.

They could probably use that against you. You could maybe apply to the District Courts if you felt strong enough [there is provisions in the Act] but I'm sure the judge would just tell you where to shove your case....

thesteve

This kind of thing has been happening for years, before they could quote from any act... as long as they have those words on the wall "Management reserve the right to refuse admission"... we're all screwed, you could try and argue the fact that the bouncers are not management but good luck getting them to understand sentences with more than 6 words in them...

I knew one of the bouncers in CP's years ago and he used to say that when it gets busy in there, they stop every 6th person, simple as that, as hard as it is for them to count their fingers on more than one hand, that's all it takes to ruin some peoples nights

one more thing..... i bet if you had tits you wouldn't have been stopped

seamus

They have the right to refuse entry. Period.

Recently if a bouncer doesn't like the look of you, or doubts your ID, he'll just tell you you're not getting in.
If they give a reason, they'll have to back it up, and if they can't, will land a big fine for their employer.

Lately, refusals from clubs tend to go as such (as I got a few weeks ago, though I only ever get refused when I go out with my housemate);
"Sorry gentlemen, we will not be admitting you entrance to our premises this evening."
"What, is it full or something?"
"No, you're just not getting in."
"Em, ok, f*ck you too." (Walk off)

(The next week I heard that particular gob****e utter the immortal words of the fool, "Are you questioning my authority?" :rolleyes: )

imp

Yes they do have the right to turn you away if they have good reason. But apparently, under law, you have the write to demand a reason for it in writing. I've never tried this myself but some people I know do say that they're entitled to a reason in writing if they get refused and the doorman lets them in rather than going to the trouble of writing out a reason for them.

I'm not sure if you're definitely entitled to that though.

}:>

ixoy

Originally posted by Caliden/Rainbow
ok thanks for your replies people.
at least now i know where i stand when i go out

Seriously tho' thesteve is right. If you had breasts hanging out, you'd have enjoyed yourself last night. And they say men have all the advantages...

Seraphina

pffff
girls dont even need to have their breasts hanging out
i've never had trouble getting in anywhere, even most of the time when underage.
i get id'd sometimes but thats it
sad isn't it?

zAbbo

you waited in a Queue for 30minutes, cop yourself on lad

BKtje

Once in my youth (ie 2 yrs ago when i turned 18) i was told it was locals only, i asked how you became a local then if you dont let people in. i then walked off cos of the look on his face. Heard they shut down recently, guess all their locals left

patch

You prolly just seemed a little drunk to one of the bouncers.
CP's bouncers seem to have a chip on their shoulders at the best of times.
A couple of years ago I decided to question them calmly after I was refused, which resulted in my demanding to see the manager.
He seemed the decent sort and conceded that I wasn't actually drunk at all. However, he said it's policy that he can't question the head bouncers decision(!!??).
So I went elsewhere that night. I've never had a problem since.
The only advice i'd give you is don't piss off the bouncers, otherwise you'll never get in.

tman

Originally posted by Caliden/Rainbow
ok went out lasy night (thursday) went to pub for a pint with my friends , then we headed to CP's around 11pm

cp's in galway?

jesus, if i had a post for every time i'd been refused from there, i'd be higher up the list than victor

get over it!

Originally posted by tman
get over it!

Exactly! So what if you got refused...and why did you join the line again if you weren't drunk?

xzodia

They can refuse you but they are obliged by law to give you a reason

ixoy

Doesn't the reason have to be substantial? I mean could they say, "Because you smell"? Well probably not - that's personal harm and a lawsuit - but you get my point. Does the reason not have to relate to either their clothes standards or being drunk?

Sangre

I hate most bouncers, some are sound enough but generally they're wánkers on power trips.
Although this reminds of a story I find funny for some reason.
Group of lads I know from school(dont hang around with them) got refused from a club so they decide to give the bouncer a hard time, they start shouting at him how he's only a bouncer, has a **** job and has **** all money (dont know if this is true ), then they say, right so fúck this, lets take our money elsewhere. Then they take out their wallets, take out a wad of twenties and start rubbing their faces with them and smelling them. The look on the bouncers face was hilarious, then the lads left.

I love it when asshole bouncers get hassled.

Caesar_Bojangle

That’s the kind of crap that puts me off going out in Dublin. I was in that Judge whatever? pub at the end of Grafton street a few weeks back, and at 11pm or so, the bouncer was going about from table to table asking people - who'd been drinking there all day, for some i.d. The laughable part is the majority of them were probably about 30.

ixoy

Ah Judge Roy Beans. I was in there for one pint last nite but it was so sh1te that we left. But yeah, most of the people there looked well over the age limit. Bouncer was probably trying to make himself feel important.

ferdi

Originally posted by bazH
you waited in a Queue for 30minutes, cop yourself on lad

twice, he queued up again:rolleyes:

if you get refused its cause theyre arseholes and i dont want to e in a place run by arseholes so i'm happy enough not to give em my hard earned cash

seamus

Originally posted by xzodia
They can refuse you but they are obliged by law to give you a reason

Nope. They are only limited as to what they are allowed give as valid reasons. "You're not getting in" is a valid reason

bugler

I frequent CP's regularly, and I'm not happy about that either (but Galway hasn't really been blessed with a slew of late bars). I've been going there for maybe 3 years, and have to say that I've rarely had much trouble getting in, on most occasions I wouldn't care if I was stopped. Unfortunately, last Wednesday I did want to go in, and yet was stopped for the only time that sticks in my memory. It was by some short-arse who I hadn't seen before.

I then approached the female bouncer (who I believe is actually of a management type position) and explained the situation. I said I'd been going there for a few years and rarely had any trouble, and that ordinarily I wouldn't care about being stopped but a few of my friends had finished their exams that night and I wanted to be out with them. She listened, checked my ID, and then asked which bouncer had refused me. She then approached him, had a brief chat and came back and let me in.

There's only a couple of points to be drawn from this story:

1) Bouncers can and will be arbitrary in their refusals. Just try and cut down the possible reasons for being refused. Dress appropriately/whatever. As far as I'm aware the idea that they have to give you a reason is bullsh1t. You're not entering a public park. You're entering private property. Whoever the owner is, it's not you. You have zero rights as far as admittance goes.

2) If you feel hard done by or else you really want to get in for some reason, then try and make your point known. Bouncers themselves almost never change their minds, so you'll probably have to go above them. They probably won't like this, so you may have to weigh up any further possible ramifications against how badly you want to get in. Be polite, empathise..don't shout or threaten...If you come off well to the manager then you'll stand a good chance of getting in.

Real drinking is best done in quiet pubs with no bouncers, who even if they had bouncers wouldn't have been on the door when you went in at 1.45 pm

blondie83

Went down to Galway for a few days last Summer with two of my friends. I remember we went into CP's on the 1st night down there. We didn't have any trouble getting in, weren't even ID'd, (prob cos we were 3 girls), but the place was terrible, boring as hell. Seriously why would you be bothered trying to get in there, try the other place (can't think of the name) it's down a side street near the chipper - we went there the other nights, and I remember the bouncers were really sound. Was a good club too!

tman

Originally posted by blondie83
Seriously why would you be bothered trying to get in there, try the other place (can't think of the name) it's down a side street near the chipper - we went there the other nights, and I remember the bouncers were really sound. Was a good club too!

lmao:D
if cp's is WORSE than the alley, i'm ****ing glad they never let me in:p

the alley is great for grooving to some brittney spears & getting in fights with fat rednecks for "chattin up meh wumman"

nlgbbbblth

Originally posted by Caesar_Bojangle
Judge

Judge in "Wanderly Wagon"?

Cabaal

Originally posted by Caliden/Rainbow
....we either had garda ID ...

This makes me laugh, the VFI pushed for a general form of ID for years and now pubs and night clubs can randomly refuse a person with a Garda ID,

Thing is if a PassPort can get me into a country well then it should be able to get me into a pub/club without ANY issues, but again they can turn around a look for Garda ID and visa versa.

Its a total joke in this country

irishgeo

Originally posted by Caliden/Rainbow

i have heard a rumour that some clubs in galway are going 21+ ,

They cant do that as its breaking the Equal Status Act and your entitled to sue.


Been refused in my CPs myself. And quite a number of other nigghtclubs in galway.

I have learned a few tips.

1. Dont get pissed off with the bouncers.they are likely to remenber and use it to stop you again.

2. Get there early. Thet cant afford to pick and choose who they let in with its busy but if you go there early your much more likely to get in.

bugler

As far as I'm aware the prohibition on age restrictions has been cut down somewhat lately, I'm not sure how or why. I say this as a number of pubs in Galway have started openly displaying "Over 21s Policy" signs on the premises, most notably the Skeff. I have no idea how this came about or what the strict legal angle on it is.

eirebhoy

Just count yourself lucky your not living in Dublin. I get refused in at least 3 niteclubs when I go out at the weekends.

Cabaal

Originally posted by bugler
I say this as a number of pubs in Galway have started openly displaying "Over 21s Policy" signs on the premises, most notably the Skeff. I have no idea how this came about or what the strict legal angle on it is.

Was this not made illegal a number of months ago?
The Mega Pub/Club setup in this country is gone to the bloody dogs!

Lenny

Originally posted by Cabaal
Was this not made illegal a number of months ago?
The Mega Pub/Club setup in this country is gone to the bloody dogs!

Yea, but was then removed so pubs/slubs can set whatever age restricions on their place whenever they want,
so if you want up. and are 22 and they don't like the look of you, they can just saw its over 23's only.
My local has "21's" on the door, rarly see the bouncer refusing people. but its so if people are too drunk or know they're scumbags they can use that excuse

sceptre

Originally posted by Caliden/Rainbow
it was CP's in galway

Passed the place last night. There were people queuing in a queue that didn't look like it was ever going to move. Having read this thread the day before, I laughed under my breath.

PHB

They can not legally refuse you with a Garda ID, isn't that the whole point?

Grom

So being skuttles drunk and having a garda id permits your addmitance I dont think so tbh

de5p0i1er

Bouncers tend to be brain dead **** on a power trip latley, they just like to turn ppl away for no reason because it makes them feel big, if there so great how come they stand around for a living.

DaithiSurfer

Funny how everyone always seems to know their rights

The simple fact is : if they dont want to let you in there is **** all you can do about it legally.
Show me someone who's who's succesfully brought a case


It might go like this.

you: Yer honour this big bouncer refused me but didnt give me a reason and thats why im suing his ass.

judge: Well bouncer is this true?

bouncer: No yer honour he was pissed, couldnt even stand up so i told him hey ur too drunk yer not gettin in.

you: I have me mates as witnesses (and they are telling the truth that you were on OJ the whole night).

bouncer: but those little ****ers were all pissed too.

judge: **** off you little drunken dickhead out of my court room. Yis were all pissed because the bouncer says so.

kiffer

Originally posted by DaithiSurfer
Funny how everyone always seems to know their rights

The simple fact is : if they dont want to let you in there is **** all you can do about it legally.
Show me someone who's who's succesfully brought a case


It might go like this.

you: Yer honour this big bouncer refused me but didnt give me a reason and thats why im suing his ass.

judge: Well bouncer is this true?

bouncer: No yer honour he was pissed, couldnt even stand up so i told him hey ur too drunk yer not gettin in.

you: actualy I went across the road and I have this Garda here with whom i spoke on the night ...

Garda: he did not appear to be intoxicated on the night inquestion.

judge: so Mr. Bouncer why did you stop him?

bouncer: um... argueing?

you: but I only started argueing after you refused to give me a good reason ...

judge: sigh ...


----
if you push, you will get to sue ... i guess this is why they changed the law to get rid of the no-agism thing.

seamus

Originally posted by kiffer
if you push, you will get to sue ... i guess this is why they changed the law to get rid of the no-agism thing.

Nazi McDowell repealed the law. Clubs can enforce and age policy, but only if they have a sign up outside the door saying so. If a bouncer tells you it's 21's/23's and there's no sign visible to you, they're fecked.

As I said, you can't sue if a bouncer doesn't give you a reason. You have no right to be let in, but you have the right to not be discriminated against

Big Chief

you queued up 3 times in a row?

arent the sharpest knife in the drawer are you


if i get refused i just move on... why waste my time and theirs just standing around scratching my scrotum on the off chance i'll get in..

Ronan|Raven

Originally posted by Caliden/Rainbow
ok went out lasy night (thursday) went to pub for a pint with my friends , then we headed to CP's around 11pm

CP'S? I think I have found your problem. CP'S has a good history of having complete tossers working on the door and besides the club is a pure joke imho I was in it twice in my life and both times felt like peeling the skin off my face.

DaithiSurfer

come on now
If you bring a guard over (if you can find one that could be arsed) the bouncer could just say something like 'The little bollix started swearing at me so i didnt let him in'
Or 'he was in here last month and started a fight'

and You'll never win then

Now one thing that really gets on my nerves are people stating rights and points of law as fact. Most of it they pulled right out of their arse.

Where does it say 'if he doesnt give you a reason he's ok' or
'If a bouncer tells you it's 21's/23's and there's no sign visible to you, they're fecked. '

Or even that they need to have a sign up saying 'The management have the right to refuse admission' if they want to refuse admission.

I don't know whether any of these are true or not, but please peoples dont just pull these statements out of your arses.
If you know them to be fact then show the rest of us where we can read these laws, so the rest of us dont go down to the pub and pass bull**** information on as fact and continue the vicious circle.
Follow ixoy's example here.

I hear so many conversations where people pop in 'Its a known fact that .... blah blah' and they are completely talking ****e.

Kopf

HANG THE BASTARDS

seamus

Originally posted by DaithiSurfer
Now one thing that really gets on my nerves are people stating rights and points of law as fact. Most of it they pulled right out of their arse.

Where does it say 'if he doesnt give you a reason he's ok' or
'If a bouncer tells you it's 21's/23's and there's no sign visible to you, they're fecked. '

Or even that they need to have a sign up saying 'The management have the right to refuse admission' if they want to refuse admission.

I don't know whether any of these are true or not, but please peoples dont just pull these statements out of your arses.
If you know them to be fact then show the rest of us where we can read these laws, so the rest of us dont go down to the pub and pass bull**** information on as fact and continue the vicious circle.
Follow ixoy's example here.

I hear so many conversations where people pop in 'Its a known fact that .... blah blah' and they are completely talking ****e.

I'll go off and find the relevant links. (Normally I don't put in such effort for AH threads since they tend to be 'pub talk' type threads. )

TacT

It's funny, the past few weeks we've found ourselves in big groups standing on late bar doorsteps/clubs with the bouncers saying "how many is in your group?" We just do a twirl of the finger around us and all of a sudden the bouncers are worried and don't want to let us in as there is 10+ of us. Someone comes forward from the group, has a polite chat, says we're not all drunk, bit of light humour and we all walk in the door.

places in question - Thomas Reids - Dame street (v.friendly bouncers)
The Hub (used to be switch - not so friendly bouncers but let us in)
The Shelter (cold bouncers but reasonable enough to let us all in with a grumble)
Karma (Fishamble st, used to be Handels, bouncers won't let you in if you look in any way young, that's it, otherwise grand and considering a mate managed to smash 2 of my drinks within the first 10minutes of us being in there, they were absolutely fine)

seamus

Right, there are two things in effect here, the Equal Status Act 2000, and the Intoxicating Liquor Act 2003. Unfortunately, I'm having trouble finding a simple and comprehensive text of the latter, but have links from justice.ie which should be reputable enough

From http://www.efc.ie/publications/legal_updates/articles/litigation/intoxicating_liquor_act_03.html

# A person who claims that conduct prohibited under the Equal Status Act, 2000 had been directed against them at the point of entry to a licensed premises may seek redress before the District Court and the current means of redress available under the Equal Status Act, 2000 is extended to include the temporary closure of a licensed premises.

This seems a bit ambiguous. It seems to suggest that a club can, for example, choose to ban black people, but if a black person believes that such a policy isn't in force, and a bouncer at the door decides not to let black people in, then he has a case. If it's club policy to have 'no blacks', then that's fine. But I could be wrong about that.

From: http://www.justice.ie/802569B20047F907/vWeb/pcRXHR5QJFEC

Amendment of Equal Status Act 2000:

—Section 25: Licensees are permitted to set a minimum age for the sale and consumption of intoxicating liquor at a level above the statutory minimum of 18 provided the policy is publicly displayed and operated in good faith;

IMO, the "He doesn't have to give you a reason" bit is common sense. If you believe you are being discriminated against, then by all means take them to court. They still don't have to give a reason to refuse you, so the onus is then on you to prove that you were being discriminated against...how the hell do you do that?

Faust

Originally posted by seamus
Right, there are two things in effect here, the Equal Status Act 2000, and the Intoxicating Liquor Act 2003. Unfortunately, I'm having trouble finding a simple and comprehensive text of the latter, but have links from justice.ie which should be reputable enough

From http://www.efc.ie/publications/legal_updates/articles/litigation/intoxicating_liquor_act_03.html

This seems a bit ambiguous. It seems to suggest that a club can, for example, choose to ban black people, but if a black person believes that such a policy isn't in force, and a bouncer at the door decides not to let black people in, then he has a case. If it's club policy to have 'no blacks', then that's fine. But I could be wrong about that.

From: http://www.justice.ie/802569B20047F907/vWeb/pcRXHR5QJFEC


IMO, the "He doesn't have to give you a reason" bit is common sense. If you believe you are being discriminated against, then by all means take them to court. They still don't have to give a reason to refuse you, so the onus is then on you to prove that you were being discriminated against...how the hell do you do that?

That's some hardcore research. Congrats

Big Chief

lets face it, if a bouncer refuses you then 99% of the time you wont get in...

if you start trying to spew legal rubbish at him the chances are you will do 2 things :

1) get your face known and the chances are you will never get in

2) make yourself look like an eejit (this especially applies if your drunk and trying to give this rant)


really, what is the problem here exactly? shìt happens, so you never got in, big wow... it happens to everyone and on a nightly basis, dont get into one place then move onto another and coming up with all the facts in the world isnt going to change the fùckwit on the doors mind..

dont like it? too bad, just stop getting your knickers in a twist over it.. besides dublin is a 100 times worse for it anyway

the only time i was let in by a bouncer after being rejected is when i told him i was supposed to be meeting my girlfriend and that he could come down with me till i got her and moved on, he agreed to let me in as i didnt cause a scene. I used to cause scenes about not getting in when i was younger (18 like you now that i think of it) but i was wise to the ways of the world after a few years and REALISED that this just happened and there is sweet FA you can do about it!

harsh? maybe so... but what ya gonna do

now stop crying over spilt milk, pick your rattle back up from the floor and get on with this piece of shìt that we call life.

[/rant end]

fozzle

Originally posted by Sangre
I hate most bouncers, some are sound enough but generally they're wánkers on power trips.
Although this reminds of a story I find funny for some reason.
Group of lads I know from school(dont hang around with them) got refused from a club so they decide to give the bouncer a hard time, they start shouting at him how he's only a bouncer, has a **** job and has **** all money (dont know if this is true ), then they say, right so fúck this, lets take our money elsewhere. Then they take out their wallets, take out a wad of twenties and start rubbing their faces with them and smelling them. The look on the bouncers face was hilarious, then the lads left.

I love it when asshole bouncers get hassled.

...and then you muppets wonder why bouncers get so cranky! Seriously, that kind of carry-on is not cool, it's just ass-hole kids trying to lord it over someone else because they're feeling insecure in their pimply teenage world.:mad:

I'm friends with a couple of bouncers in Galway (not from CP though) and most of them are sound out.
As for being "only a bouncer", well one of the lads I know is workingto pay his rent while he does his doctorate, he'll probably wind up with more money than those lads could dream of. And what's wrong with being a bouncer anyway? I think it'd be a fairly enjoyable job except for muppets like you and those lads.

*end of rant*

Faust

Originally posted by fozzle
...and then you muppets wonder why bouncers get so cranky! Seriously, that kind of carry-on is not cool, it's just ass-hole kids trying to lord it over someone else because they're feeling insecure in their pimply teenage world.:mad:

I'm friends with a couple of bouncers in Galway (not from CP though) and most of them are sound out.
As for being "only a bouncer", well one of the lads I know is workingto pay his rent while he does his doctorate, he'll probably wind up with more money than those lads could dream of. And what's wrong with being a bouncer anyway? I think it'd be a fairly enjoyable job except for muppets like you and those lads.

*end of rant*

i agree with this rant and or preachy thing

fozzle

You mean I'm not just old and cranky? Ah good, that's nice to know.

I just get really annoyed when people b1tch about people who are just trying to do their job. I mean, you've got to give a little respect to get any back folks.

And yes, I work part-time in a bar, and little feckers who act like they're better than me just cos I'm staff really p1ss me off. I happen to like my job, don't try to drag me and my friends into your world of self-loathing!

Faust

Everyone just needs a bit of perspective. Most bouncers are alright some are not and some just get aggrevated from the assholes who start fights etc...

DaithiSurfer

Up until i was about 23 or so i used to make a point of not going to niteclubs where there were long queues in case igot refused after a long wait.
I never went to a club that had no alternative either in case i got refused.
e.g what did you do if you got a taxi to c92 and then got refused.
It was another taxi into town then and by the time you got there you wanted to go home.

Funny though, since about 23 years old to over 30 i never got refused once.
I think it is indeed just a maturity thing. The older you look (provided you're not pissed and dont hane the skanger frown) the better your chances of getting in.
Hedge your bets though.

monument

Originally posted by Caliden/Rainbow
lasy night (thursday)

(Not a collage going week)

+

Originally posted by Caliden/Rainbow
student

+

Galway (or most places)

=

Your answer

It's the same thing for a non student on a student night.

To simply put the new liquor laws – their fudked.