The use of the word 'gay' as a derogatory term

yellum

Do you find the use of the word "gay" as a derogatory term offensive ?

It seems to me more and more people especially in the gamer and online world are substituting the word gay for "substandard" , "crap" "lame". "retarded" etc

Does this bother you ? Do you find it offensive ?

Would it bother you more if someones crap pc was classed as being "irish" because it was such a heap of junk ?

Lukin Black

I didn't find it particularly offensive as much as annoying. And it's getting much worse - and spelling it ghey doesn't make it any better. I just think enough is enough.

By the way, did you know the pink atari jaguar option was going to be pink.. or was that a freaky coincidence?

ixoy

Not offended by it when people are using "South Park" gay. Shrug. Far more offensive are terms like "****" and so forth.

yellum

Originally posted by ixoy
Far more offensive are terms like "****" and so forth.

What I'm saying is terms like **** and so forth were meant to be offensive for years but now the word gay is being used by people as a word to put down other people and things.

yellum

Originally posted by Lukin Black

By the way, did you know the pink atari jaguar option was going to be pink.. or was that a freaky coincidence?

Coincidence.

Señor Juárez

Seemingly people use these words such as queer, ****, etc, as offensive terms but sometimes without even trying to infer homosexuality.... get some new insults tbh.

BuffyBot

Do you find the use of the word "gay" as a derogatory term offensive ?

No

It seems to me more and more people especially in the gamer and online world are substituting the word gay for "substandard" , "crap" "lame". "retarded" etc

..and in the world of that joyful creature that is the teenager. That is all it is, the word has been seconded and is used not as a derogatory to homosexual people. If it isn't being used in this way, against us - why should we be concerned>

Does this bother you? Do you find it offensive ?

Nay, nay and thrice nay.

Would it bother you more if someones crap pc was classed as being "irish" because it was such a heap of junk ?

No really, although I'm sure it would bring more sensitive souls than I out in a rash upon contemplation.

amp

I'm always calling people and things gay. But I'm certainly not implying that my burnt toast or crashed computer is homosexual. I think the word has diverged into two meanings (or three if you count the older gay = happy, carefree etc.).

I'd definitely object to the word "irish" being used in a derogatory way because the word can't have multiple meanings like gay can. If something is irish it means it comes from Ireland. But calling something/someone gay can mean it's happy, homosexual, annoying or possibly all three

Talliesin

Originally posted by amp
I'd definitely object to the word "irish" being used in a derogatory way because the word can't have multiple meanings like gay can.

Some meanings for Irish:

1. With added alcohol.
2. Fieriness of temper or passion; high spirit. (from which there is "Get one's Irish up"; to become angry or outraged).
3. Amusingly contradictory or inconsistent; illogical.

I find all of these senses of the word Irish to be offensive and I think the use of them by Irish people or people of Irish descent makes them less rather than more acceptable (if someone is dipsodic, lacks self-disciplined or is stupid I'd rather they realised they had a personal problem rather than blaming it on a nationality they share with me).

yellum

Originally posted by amp

I'd definitely object to the word "irish" being used in a derogatory way because the word can't have multiple meanings like gay can.

Gay has evolved to be used as a word to refer to homosexuality, but its evolving to become a negativism now as well.

Would you object if the word Irish started being used as a negative, right now you say it has one meaning but if it started replacing one of the uses you make of the word gay what would you do/say ?

Talliesin

Ned Flanders Vegas Wife: Can I have some Irish in this coffee?
Todd and Rodd [shocked]: She said a swear!
Ned: Eh, we don't use the 'I'-word in this house.

Seriously it's not like the origins of gay/ghay/ghey meaning worthless/inferior are lost in the mists of time.
Gay is synonymous with crappy because of an opinion that gay people are crappy. That definition and that opinion are too closely linked that you can have one without inferring the other.

Michael6754

I don't really like this new use of the word gay. I think it is derogatory, but probably isn't worth getting too bothered about.

I live in Glasgow now, and regularly hear crap things being described as "that's a bit Irish". Really gets on my tits. An O'Brien's Irish sandwich place opened next to where I work, and the big joke in the office was "What's an Irish sandwich, does it have bread on the inside and meat on the outside?"

Just a bit of a throwback I suppose.

BuffyBot

Gay is synonymous with crappy because of an opinion that gay people are crappy. That definition and that opinion are too closely linked that you can have one without inferring the other.

Is it? Seems rather subjective to me to be honest. I think that we should be careful in making such assumptions.

Seraphina

hmmm
i got into the habit of using the word gay as a derogatory term for things, my brother over-uses words and they tend to rub off on me even when i dont want them to, but that definately doesn't mean i have a problem with gay people.
i've become alot more conscious of it recently because i've started having more interaction with the pink side of things, and i often worry that i'm offending people because i will use the word without even noticing it sometimes...

spose i just need to learn to bite my tongue. as most of you have confirmed, few of you find it offensive, but i still dont like using the word in that way.

tendofan

I think context is everything - it depends on who says it and how they say it. I've too much on my plate to be honest to get worked up about it. :-)

Tendofan.

Doodee

Originally posted by yellum
Gay has evolved to be used as a word to refer to homosexuality, but its evolving to become a negativism now as well.

Would you object if the word Irish started being used as a negative, right now you say it has one meaning but if it started replacing one of the uses you make of the word gay what would you do/say ?

Not really, Gay appears to be the slang (general) for HomoSexual. irish however, is the actual context for Something from ireland.

"He is a Homosexual"
Statement of guys sexual preference.
"Omg, T3h Gh3y, H34d Sh0t, N0 W4y! HA><0r!!!!"
some n00b blaiming the fact he sucks on a script.

now irish
"That Person is irish"
Statement of person belonging to the Country/Their nationality.
"O man, That Gig was Irish,The bands were so irish,and the price was irish too"
General cause of confusion!

irish has been used as a derogetory term btw, alot of English folk used to call people of lesser intelligence or social stature "Paddy" as alot of Irishmen Built the English Road network. and they were labelled "Paddy" as they were irish, and also, according to the offenders, not intelligent enough to be in employeent of something more worthwhile. (Ironic since those yobbo's wouldn't be able to travel to work and these "Paddies" not built their roads/buildings they needed).


tbh Yellum ur so Gay

Yoda

We have lots and lots of words in English to disparage or otherwise abuse people and things. I think it is unfortunate and unnecessary that "gay" is being used in this context. It's probably South Park that's responsible for transmitting this innovation.

BuffyBot

I think it is unfortunate and unnecessary that "gay" is being used in this context.

Probably what the people who used the word to mean "jolly" and "happy" said when it began to be used to refer to homosexuals... don't see them getting to worked up over it

Yoda

I shouldn't think so, BuffyBot. Yes, it's true, some lamented the extension of "happy-gay" to "homosexual-gay" but it happened, and it's become a fairly neutral and safe term for people to use – and there were lots and lots of other "happy" words to choose from. That the term is now being hijacked for "useless-gay" is lamentable because there are not so many positive "homosexual" words to choose.

BuffyBot

I just find it funny that we're so worried about language evolving. What next, we worry about the connotations of the word queer...oh hold on, someone was using that first too..language and meaning is constantly evolving and it really isn't worth getting so worried about

yellum

Originally posted by BuffyBot
I just find it funny that we're so worried about language evolving. ....language and meaning is constantly evolving and it really isn't worth getting so worried about

Its forced evolution for one and its going down a path that I personally don't like.

Gay has been a harmless word from the start but is now being used to insult people and used to describe things that are crap and inferior.

I do not like that a word I'm happy for people to use to label me (lets not for now get into the labels thing :P ) start to be used as a negative.

I'm not into the whole shouting and screaming for discrimination thing that some people are into as I'm pretty chilled but this one thing bothers me a lot.

And its not just the word "gay" its the decline of the english language and people becoming lazier and lazier. Language evolves and thats fine but I don't think this is a good way to go and don't want to sit back and let it go this way.

On that note - http://www.wordpirates.com

BuffyBot

Well then, the lame will have to protest, and the mad, crazy and insane...the list goes on. Everyone can be equally sinned against :rolleyes:

yellum

Lame, mad, crazy and insane were all words used to describe a negative aspect of something from the begining.

BuffyBot

Lame, mad, crazy and insane were all words used to describe a negative aspect of something from the begining.

Perhaps. People seem to operating on the assumption that being labelled gay is a good thing. However this is another debate.

The point is that it is a word. Bird's Eye aren't getting upset over people saying something is a "load of waffle" and I personally can't see why people get so upset about something being "derogatory".

Michael6754

Now that I've thought about it more, I do disagree with this use of the word gay, and do think it is an unfortunate development. As I understand it (and I may be wrong) the word gay was appropriated by homosexuals back in the 1960's, as a reaction to the fact that all slang words for homosexuals up until then had negative connotations: for example queer, bent etc. Gay was a happy word which had no such negative connotations, and represented a major step forward; in that calling a homosexual person gay did not imply there was something bad, deviant or abnormal about them.

Yet now that the word "gay" is an established way of referring to homosexuals and the homosexual community, the word has evolved to mean something negative again - gay means crap, to be gay is to be crap. We may as well call ourselves bent again.

Most of the people here have said they are not bothered by it, but this does not mean it isn't wrong. It is a backward step.

BuffyBot

Originally posted by Michael6754
Most of the people here have said they are not bothered by it, but this does not mean it isn't wrong. It is a backward step. [/B]

Well actually I don't beleive it's wrong. I don't even believe it's a step. It just is.

LegacyUser

I think you're over-reacting, to be honest. I'd say at least 90% of people who use that term for something "substandard or annoying", don't mean to associate it with homosexuality at all.

What I would find far more concerning is the use of the word "retard" for a stupid person. Now THAT's offensive. I don't think the "gay" thing is a big deal at all, especially by comparison.

Undergod

I'm not gay, and I use this term all the time in a derogatory way. As a derogatory term, it still is sort of related to the 'homosexual' meaning, but anyone that knows me would be able to tell pretty quickly I'm not homophobic, and I use it freely around gay people in colleg and the like, and no-one seems to be offended.

EDIT: ****, didn't realize how dead this thread had been... apologies for the resurrection.

smileykey

I use it, as do most of my gay friends and when I was LGBT rights officer at my uni our rainbow week t-shirts had "homophobia is gay" written on them. I think for must people I know, gay and straight, the word has 2 different meanings for them, 1 being homosexual and the other being lame. It wouldn't be the fisrt time that the word gay has ment different, unrelated things. The use of the word in reference to something being lame is nothing to do with gays and is not ment in a derogatory way towards anyone. Not anymore ayway, maybe when it first started being used in that sense in that sense it did but I think the meaning has been reclaimed.

shay_562

As with any potentially derogatory term, context is everything. Depends entirely on who's saying it, in what situation, and to who. It's kinda facile to just declare that a word or phrase is or isn't offensive, automatically and in all situations.

O'Coonassa

Talliesin wrote: »

(if someone is dipsodic, lacks self-disciplined or is stupid I'd rather they realised they had a personal problem rather than blaming it on a nationality they share with me).

Personally I find the whole concept of 'nationality' 1000x more offensive than what you mention. With it's flags and parades and it's cheering it's absolutely totally gay. With it's implicit belief in 'race' and superiority it's also a bit Irish. I thought the rainbow people would know that most of all, I'm a bit dissapointed tbh.:(

oisindoyle

Its interesting to see that those who think its ok to use the word gay and dont have a "problem " with it are straight ..
Theres no ifs or buts about it but people useing the word /term "thats so gay or you're so gay " do so as a means of belittleing someone ..In other words its used as a term of abuse ........its wrong very wrong

Undergod

Yeah, in the same way any term of abuse is wrong.

pikachucheeks

I hate when people use that word as a synonym for bad, crap etc.

I don't think it's used to be homophobic or anti-gay, but it's incorrect use of the word and it's used to in a negative way.

I'd probably take more offense if I was gay, but I do feel annoyed when people say it, nonetheless.

Rev Hellfire

pikachucheeks wrote: »

but it's incorrect use of the word and it's used to in a negative way.

How exactly is it an incorrect use of the word? If all parties have a mutual understanding as to the meaning of the word then its valid to use it in that context.

Anyway for better or worse the word gay is now firmly routed in the common vocabulary as an alternative to bad, lame, etc.

I'd imagine the lgb community have enough actual discrimination to deal without having to attempting to invent some where clearly they aren't been referenced. :rolleyes:

smileykey

oisindoyle wrote: »

Its interesting to see that those who think its ok to use the word gay and dont have a "problem " with it are straight ..
Theres no ifs or buts about it but people useing the word /term "thats so gay or you're so gay " do so as a means of belittleing someone ..In other words its used as a term of abuse ........its wrong very wrong

Eh excuse me but I'm far from straight. Please don't make assumptions about people. All of my friends, gay and straight, use the term and none of them mean it in a derogatory way. Its the same as the term "thats a bit Irish" for something that ridiculous or over priced.

Balfa

yellum wrote: »

substituting the word gay for "substandard" , "crap" "lame". "retarded" etc

Does the same thing apply to "retarded"? I find using either "gay" or "retarded" as a synonym for substandard offensive. Or calling someone a retard because they said something stupid. Although to be honest I occasionally use both. It just slips out sometimes. And I usually feel bad after it does.

It's kinda similar to how I'm not even christian, but I still exclaim "Jesus Christ!" at some things. It's just a use of the language that's been impressed upon me by society

jeckle

I personally find use of the term ‘gay’ to describe something in negative terms both highly offensive to gay people & ignorant.

Most people are aware of how gay people have been discriminated against in the past, & how difficult it has & sometimes is to merely live their day to day life without being cast in a negative light.

Most gay people can take a joke & can laugh at themselves – but sometimes it’s easy to forget that comparing any minority group (or using a term commonly used to describe that minority) to anything negative can be & is offensive to that minority group IMO, & goes a long way to reverse any positive change in attitudes & opinions (especially those of younger, more impressionable members of society, who are our future leaders).

Yes of course language & slang words evolve – & quite a lot of the time it evolves through popular tv shows aimed at the young & impressionable such as South Park, Simpsons etc. I’m not so sure that if the word ‘Jew’ for example (or any other minority label) had been used instead of ‘Gay’, had been chosen to describe things in a negative way that it would have been aired so freely & been allowed to catch on.

I just feel that in present times it’s best to steer clear of using minority groups (race, religion, sexual orientation, physically/mentally impaired) to describe things in a negative way. IMO it's a huge step backwards!

Leopards can’t change their spots – neither can bigots….not that everyone who uses the term is a bigot...I just think that it's best not fuel the fire for those who are :eek:

Red_Marauder

Well I don't read anything into people using gay to mean jovial or fun, so why should I read anything extra into gay as it relates to something negative or dull?

OP when people say something is gay (as in, man, the nitelink is gay) they're obviously not referring to sexual orientation so it is not a sexually derogative term. It's a term that is used in an entirely different context and meaning when used in the above way.
I don't use the term myself but have no problem with it at all.

smileykey

This thread is so gay

(sorry, I couldn't resist)

jeckle

This one was nicely covered by Simon Amstell: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YgSD7jb-7x4

Cabbage Brained

All these arguments that gay has three meanings don't really wash with me. The term f@ggot refers to a couple of different things, but that doesn't make it ok to use. Of course people have the right to use whatever words they want, but the use of the word "gay" as a derogatory term is at minimum pretty insensitive and unnecessary.

Red_Marauder

Cabbage Brained wrote: »

All these arguments that gay has three meanings don't really wash with me. The term f@ggot refers to a couple of different things, but that doesn't make it ok to use. Of course people have the right to use whatever words they want, but the use of the word "gay" as a derogatory term is at minimum pretty insensitive and unnecessary.

If an old lady told you she had a gay old time on holidays, would you feel like she was referring to your sexuality?

Lets presume that's a no.

If the positive meaning has nothing to do with sexual identity, why on earth do people then presume the term gay in the negative sense is related to sexuality?

I really do not see anything to be offended about.

Cabbage Brained

Red_Marauder wrote: »

If an old lady told you she had a gay old time on holidays, would you feel like she was referring to your sexuality?

Lets presume that's a no.

If the positive meaning has nothing to do with sexual identity, why on earth do people then presume the term gay in the negative sense is related to sexuality?

I really do not see anything to be offended about.

No, but I also wouldn't be offended if she asked me to light up a bundle of f@ggots. Of course words can be used in different contexts and have different meanings, I'm not arguing that they can't. But it is absolutely obvious that the word gay as a derogatory term originated from a slur against homosexuals. To argue otherwise is just plain silly. And this is why I don't think it should be used.

Anyway, whatever about the semantics of it, the fact is that it does offend a lot of people, and all but the most naive users of the word are aware of this, yet they continue to use it. That shows a lot of insensitivity IMO. There are nearly a million words in the English language, surely you could choose one that doesn't fall under such a grey area when it comes to offending 5 to 10 % of the population.

Undergod

Cabbage Brained wrote: »

There are nearly a million words in the English language, surely you could choose one that doesn't fall under such a grey area when it comes to offending 5 to 10 % of the population.

Yeah, but it's a good word. No other word has the same meanings associated, even taking away any kinda homosexual slur. Or at least no common word.

mollzer

Just thinking that if kids are called 'gay' in school it will mean lame rather than a slang on sexuality.

So maybe this is a good thing? there will be a generation (the national school kids now) who will not use 'gay' as a sexuality term.

Maybe they will be the generation who wont see sexuality as something to slag off!!

Cabbage Brained

Undergod wrote: »

Yeah, but it's a good word. No other word has the same meanings associated, even taking away any kinda homosexual slur. Or at least no common word.

Are you serious?

'Gay' used in this sense can be substituted by literally hundreds of words without any loss of meaning.

Gaspode

The english language changes daily, and like it or not 'gay' has taken on a new meaning, in the much same way as it differs from what it meant a hundred years ago.

Boston

Gaspode wrote: »

The english language changes daily, and like it or not 'gay' has taken on a new meaning, in the much same way as it differs from what it meant a hundred years ago.

Very true, just the other day I was describing a leather jacket as being "****** black". Everybody congratulated me on being so forward thinking.

Anyway.