Smoking ban loopholes

rubadub

I saw on the news that the Irish cigarette machine association is planning on selling herbal cigarettes in pubs. Surely the minister is not so incompetent that he left this out of the bill along with the prison/hotel issue (god help the next FF canvasser who knocks on my door if he did). Are we now looking at another 3-month delay? If the ICMA had any cop on they would have saved this plan until the last minute, how many more loopholes are going to delay the ban?

If you can smoke herbal cigarettes then I would agree that the ban is unenforceable. It’s like saying you can’t attack somebody with a flick knife, but a kitchen knife is ok. I would presume the smoke from any burning leaves is harmful to workers health, not just tobacco, and so I would have thought the burning of any plant material would be made illegal. Or were all those ads about hitting the ground in a burning house to avoid smoke just propaganda by those demon anti-smokers…
If my local lets people smoke herbal cigarettes will I be allowed to bring my raked leaves into the pub and burn them? It would be only a nice small controlled fire like the smokers tend to have in their hands.

Has anybody seen the wording of the ban yet? I really want to know what is the definition of “outside”. I have already seen a few pubs with giant canopies out front with tiny entrances to them, in effect they are just rooms with thin walls. Will pubs be allowed to rip their roofs off and install retractable ones to allow smoking?

If somebody sprayed mace at a person they are allowed to subdue them on the grounds of self-defence. Will people have the same right if assaulted with carcinogenic gas? Surely what basically amounts to physical assault IS a matter for the gardai to enforce.

Hobbes

If you can smoke herbal cigarettes then I would agree that the ban is unenforceable. It’s like saying you can’t attack somebody with a flick knife, but a kitchen knife is ok.

Except that the flick knife is sold as a weapon where as a kitchen knife only becomes a weapon through intent.

So if we were to follow that logic I would guess people who smoke herbal cigs would be ok but those who are doing it to get around the ban wouldn't.

Actually I thought the legalities was you weren't allowed smoke at all. There was nothing in the bill (that I am aware of) about not being allowed to sell cigerettes. Just not smoke them on the premises.

So I am not sure why the machine people are getting thier panties all knotted. My guess is the publicans probably threatened to stop selling them if they didn't back them (after all they do run this country you know :rolleyes: )

Has anybody seen the wording of the ban yet? I really want to know what is the definition of “outside”.

Go look it up in a dictionary.

DiscoStu

Go look it up in a dictionary.

the can be a rather large gulf between a legal definition and a "real world" one.

Knowing full well that this bill was going to be ran through with the finest of fine tooth combs by the vested intrests concerned and considering the amount of poor wording, loop holes and other such general messyness that has been exposed to date its blatently obvious that this bill is nothing but a smoke screen(pardon the pun) to deflect attention away from the lack of progress with health service reforms.

star gazer

It looks like another avenue of attack to undermine the smoking ban. I presume it's the Tobacco industry that would be making the herbal cigs. It's probably just a pie in the sky idea put out to be part of a process of sowing seeds of doubt in people's minds about the validity of the ban.

rubadub

Originally posted by Hobbes
Except that the flick knife is sold as a weapon where as a kitchen knife only becomes a weapon through intent.

So if we were to follow that logic I would guess people who smoke herbal cigs would be ok but those who are doing it to get around the ban wouldn't.

you missed my point. the ban on smoking is to protect peoples health, just as the ban on stabbing people is too. what i am saying is that to still allow people to physically harm others with carcinogenic gas of a slightly different form is as ludicrous as allowing people physically harm others with a slightly different knife than others.
it doesnt matter what they were sold as.

Originally posted by Hobbes

Actually I thought the legalities was you weren't allowed smoke at all. There was nothing in the bill (that I am aware of) about not being allowed to sell cigerettes. Just not smoke them on the premises.

AFAIK it is planned to ban the sale of cigarettes in pubs