Should I report grant cheat?

lukin

There is a mature student I know who is receiving an accommodation allowance illegally and also receiving the full Higher Education grant despite not being entitled to it.
The student in question does not need the money and finds it absolutely hilarious that he/she is receiving this money at other, more deserving people’s expense.
As I myself (also a mature student) am receiving sweet F.A. (thanks for nothing, Mr. Dempsey) and am getting increasingly peed off at this person flashing his/her dishonestly acquired cash, I was wondering if I should report this person to the relevant authorities, and if I do, will they actually do anything about it?
I hate to “rat” on anyone but I feel so strongly about it I would be quite prepared to do it provided I could remain anonymous.

Annasopra

Only if you are absolutely sure that the person would be able to afford to complete their education without the grant

bugler

They're not really getting it at another's expense. Fair enough it's coming out of the coffers, but it's not like someone else is going hungry because this person is getting it. My gut reaction when I first saw the title was "No". But if they're being a total tosser and laughing and bragging about it then maybe. As Johnny says though, I'd hate to think that I'd put someone in hardship out of spite, so be aware of the consequences whatever you do.

Serbian

Originally posted by bugler
Fair enough it's coming out of the coffers, but it's not like someone else is going hungry because this person is getting it.

I'd have to strongly disagree here. I think you are slightly missing the point too. Sure people aren't going to go hungry by missing out on it, but I know of at least two people who had hoped to go to college or return to college and were offered places, but had to turn them down as they were not given a grant. They didn't go hungry, but for them it was the difference between higher education and no higher education.

simu

There is a mature student I know who is receiving an accommodation allowance illegally and also receiving the full Higher Education grant despite not being entitled to it. The student in question does not need the money and finds it absolutely hilarious that he/she is receiving this money at other, more deserving people’s expense.

I know ppl don't like to "rat" but Irish ppl in general are too tolerant of those who abuse the system. Maybe somebody else is missing out on an education because of this student's greed.

rander00

Report the leech, theres loads of ppl that shud get a grant but dont, and vice versa, but if he/she doesnt need it, report the leech.

GuanYin

Maybe somebody else is missing out on an education because of this student's greed.

Noone who meets the criteria set is refused a grant. So noone would be missing out.


As for reporting the person, I'd say if you know them and are friends with them then perhaps politely point out to them that "flaunting" the matter isn't the bright course of action as they may offend people who are not as well off.

If you are not friends with them then its up to you. But remember, some people have alot of false bravado about these things. Are you sure they are not eligable? Could it be that they are, for whatever reason, proud and embarassed taking a grant and may perhaps be exaggerating their financial position?

And most importantly, are you sure that they can afford to finish their education without a grant?

The thing is, as the recent grant report showed. Free education has not had the desired effect. More rich people are going to college and more poor people aren't.

Even if they don't deserve a grant, under the current system doesn't man they don't need one. Many, many people aren't entitled to a grant and need one...and in a fair system should get one.

Its hard enough to afford an education in this country without having it taken away by someone else.

Victor

If you are sufficiently happy that they are not entitled to it then do.

bugler

No, I don't think I am missing the point. The 'hungry' bit was irrelevant really. And how offensive were you first time around?


Noone has been refused the grant because this punter is getting it.

but I know of at least two people who had hoped to go to college or return to college and were offered places, but had to turn them down as they were not given a grant.

And you're saying that if this person hadn't been claiming the grant that (in theory) one of those people you know might have been awarded one? Incorrect, as far as I'm aware. There are set criteria for the award of grants, and there is no first come first or limited number of grants element to it. Correct me if I'm wrong, I don't think I am.

You can claim this person is morally bankrupt, a leech, and a general waste of skin, if you want. You can't say they are getting their ill-gotten money at another student/prospective students expense, or that they've robbed someone else of the chance to go to college. Again, I'm prepared to rescind all this if I'm completely mistaken about the nature of the system.

If they really don't need the money, then grass away, Snitchy :P

EDIT: Saw Sykes post now, but am leaving original post untouched.

simu

Noone who meets the criteria set is refused a grant. So noone would be missing out.

Even so, this is taxpayers' money being wasted.

Even if they don't deserve a grant, under the current system doesn't man they don't need one. Many, many people aren't entitled to a grant and need one...and in a fair system should get one.

The present system is far from perfect but that dosen't justify everyone grasping at whatever funding they can get under false pretences. Then getting an education would be a matter of being able to find one's way through loopholes in the Dept. of Welfare's assessment methods.

bugler

Yeah but there are far bigger wastes of tax-payers money at the moment, look at T.D's expenses. If you're going to get grumpy over misuse of tax-payers money, there are a lot more worthy and important targets than fiddling students. I agree entirely by the way, but where do you start and stop?

Then getting an education would be a matter of being able to find one's way through loopholes in the Dept. of Welfare's assessment methods.

Welcome to Fianna Faíl/P.D's Ireland

If it meant I could go and get an education then I'd screw the Welfare Department six ways from sunday. I'll repay them with my higher wages and therefore increase spending into the states coffers..

GuanYin

Simu, you are of course right. I'm not arguing that the system is perfect or not or whether it is right to exploit the loopholes.

I am arguing that all these things considered, unless the poster knows for a fact that the person involved can afford the education without the grant, then they should be cautious in how the act.

I was wrongly refused a grant, and I thought about "defrauding" the system *. People knew what my parents did but didn't understand my circumstances, most probably thought I was well off, but had I done this and relied on the grant instead of one of my part time jobs, and been "snitched" on, I would not have gotten a 3rd level education.

If it turns out they do need the grant and can't afford the education without it, then, no matter how they achieved it, no, I don't think any money is being wasted.


*
I didn't get a grant despite the fact I have been living alone since 17 without any family support. despite this, as my mother and step fathers earnings were taken into account, they earned too much for me to get a grant, I only found out after I graduated that the county council were wrong for refusing my application as my step fathers earnings shouldn't have counted.

ASTRACLUB

let him enjoy


why are u worried.....

what would have been ur reaction if u woul dhave been getting it..
so just take it easy...
there are some big corruption..in this world....even in this country ..some politician...are there to eat millions

he is just a small medium class person..thats why he is happy to get it..
let him continue...

...
and there is no point for u atleast as i think u only got to know from him..
do not stab in the back

simu

True, I can see your point. Most ppl feel so isolated from the government's decision forming processes that the only option they see as viable is to look out for themselves and their families only.

It's pretty depressing but understandable:(

/Going off-topic rapidly...

decob

Originally posted by lukin
There is a mature student I know who is receiving an accommodation allowance illegally and also receiving the full Higher Education grant despite not being entitled to it.
...
, I was wondering if I should report this person to the relevant authorities, and if I do, will they actually do anything about it?
I hate to “rat” on anyone but I feel so strongly about it I would be quite prepared to do it provided I could remain anonymous.

Hell yeah report the leech!

As for wheither the relevant authorities will do anything, they may need some proof or at least a statement of somesort from yourself as to how there person is defrauding them, Pretty sure they would keep your identity anonymous.

Sleipnir

Hell yeah! why the hell are we all paying for this sh!t to drink the grant he doesn't need? There's too much of this type of thing going on and there's only one way to stop it; REPORT HIM!

lukin

To tell you the truth, I'd kind of made up my mind to report him/her before I posted the thread, but I just said I'd throw it out there.
To answer a few questions:
Yes, I am absolutely certain that this person can afford to complete his/her education without the grant.
It makes no difference that "no-one is going to go hungry" as a result of this person abusing the system as we all pay taxes and some of our money is being taken by this low-life.
Yes, Irish people in general are too tolerant of people who abuse the system.
I wouldn't actually consider repoting him/her at all except for the fact that he/she is always blabbing on about how great it is to get so much money into their account every week.
True, this is not a very bright course of action but the person in question just doesn't give a ****e, basically.
He/she is actually a very good student, but again, that's irrelevant.
I know there are probably loads of other students getting the grant or/and accomodation allowance who shouldn't be.
I can't do anything about all of them but at least I can do something about one of them.
Anyway, I've made my mind up on the matter.
I don't think I'll go to the County VEC in question, as I think they are in on it too, but I will go to the Department of Education.

bugler

Originally posted by lukin
It makes no difference that "no-one is going to go hungry" as a result of this person abusing the system

It may not, but I said that to refute what was being said on the thread, namely that this person was getting money that was actually destined for someone else, which was untrue.

To be honest Lukin, and I don't expect you to care or admit to it or whatever, but reading over your posts I'm fairly sure your motivation is not that of an outraged citizen/taxpayer.

jesus_thats_gre

I would argue this point, at least he/she is doing something with their life still.

It annoys me that people on the dole get a decent few quid for sitting on their ass, while people who are studying often get nothing.

I personally feel that the grant system is aload of bollox in this country and that it should be available to consdierably more people..

So at that, I wouldn't drop him/her in it. It would be different if they were claiming it and not actually going to college.

planck2

Of course, because what the mature student in question is doing is called fraud, and fraud is a criminal offence. Of course the fact that its happening in the first place shows up exactly the inadequacies of the system

loismustdie

Originally posted by Serbian
I'd have to strongly disagree here. I think you are slightly missing the point too. Sure people aren't going to go hungry by missing out on it, but I know of at least two people who had hoped to go to college or return to college and were offered places, but had to turn them down as they were not given a grant. They didn't go hungry, but for them it was the difference between higher education and no higher education.

of course people can go hungry because of not gettin the grant, the point of it is so you have money to live on

you should report the person, there's no harm if he/she is doin nothing wrong

Thanx 4 The Fish

Report them immediately. If they are not cheating then well and good and if they are then they will be stopped stealing from the country.

Trojan

It's like those ethics sections of professional exams, e.g.

"You have discovered that your colleague John has illegally obtained questions for this PMI examination. Should you:

a) Report the matter to the PMI and his manager
b) Have a quiet word to tell him not to be so obvious
c) Ignore the situation
d) Ask him for a copy"

I'll answer a) on an exam for sure. But in Real Life (tm) I'm not so sure I could turn around and drop a mate in it. Maybe someone I didn't like though

Ronaldo7

Leave the guy alone. Why rat him out? Let it be. I understand your frustration author of the post, but if you were to get a grant then you would, since you dont have one, you clearly and obviously dont deserve one. I hope this backfires and the guy doesnt get in trouble.

*reminds me of school when guys smoking used to be ratted on. So stupid.

Sleipnir

The last post before you on this thread was 5 months ago. You've really been giving this one a lot of thought

Ronaldo7

lol this happened when i searched for grant and saw this and just had to say somehting...didnt realise till after but **** it. silly me! :rolleyes:

Senor_Fudge

what sweat is it off ur back anyone who gets a grant is entitled to it but i must say he might deserve it with all that bragging tut tut should be a damn sight smarter than that i say