the new mario and sonic?

neohoki

You know that age old question which is better mario or sonic?
There was the nintendo kids and the sega kids and they all had their opinions.....
But what is there now??
Is it ps2 v xbox or what?
And what games would you compare?

Goodshape

feck ye's. I'm still a Nintendo kid. Less hype, better games.

BLITZ_Molloy

If you pick both series at their peak (Sonic 2 and Mario 3) then Mario 3 wins hands down. It's an utterly flawless design. For character design Sonic wins though because he had such an impact that he sold the Mega Drive platform to the masses.

However both characters are floundering at the moment. Sonic has lost all his pacy arcade dynamic and Mario lacking a certain pick-up-and-playability as well.

I look forward to the days when they start to make pure platformers again instead of diluting them with ****e adventure elements. I hate exploring environments, I hate collecting ****ing tokens. Are you listening to me Sonic Team, Miyamoto-san!?

bugs

So true, sonic of old was all about running about at bullet speed trying not to die. All you do in his current games is slot him into some form of booster where the computer controls him as you take a back seat and look at him spin thru some loops and land after a bit where you can continue wandering aimlessly and slowly.

public_enemy

mario was better, but only just

adventure elements are part of the natural evolution of 3d platform games as they become less bound by genre.

that said though, there are loads of "pure platforming" sections in mario sunshine, you know, the bits with all the weird coloured blocks and stuff? and the original theme music? its true...

BLITZ_Molloy

But I've always hated adventure games. They're utter ****.

The problem with Sonic or Mario these days is you get 5 minutes of platforming, 20 mins of wandering and 10 minutes of story/cutscenes. That's not giving the platforming fan value for his time.

Let the adventure fans buy Zelda. Those games always bored the hell out of me. I don't care. Let people play them if they like. Just keep that **** out of my games thank you very much.

Sega need to get AM2 or Amusement Vision to do the next Sonic game. Sonic Team have totally lost the plot.

Nintendo just need to ditch franchises in general. They're stifling Miyamoto's creativity.

goo

Miyamato isn't the be-all-and-end-all of Nintendo you know?
I have a question. Does anyone know what he is doing at the minute? I know he took a back seat on Zelda but, well, is he working on anything openly at the minute? I know he had something to do with the version of Pacman but there isn't a whole lot to that yoke.

BLITZ_Molloy

Well, true. He hasn't actually designed a game since Mario 2: Lost Levels. He just produces most of them.

I just think Nintendo are bogged down updating things that aren't necessarly relevant to todays market. There's no point in making games for your existing Ninty fanboy audience. They'll buy your products anyway.

Nintendo need to try and read the market better. They've gotten lazy in recent years. They needed to do a WW2 game and a ganster game this generation. Trying to eek more out of the Resident Evil franchise was a lost cause.

If they're going to sell more units they are going to have to read the trends. EA have been doing that exceptionally well recently which is why they have ten 2million+ selling games and two 10million+ games. All down to market research not software quality.

lordsippa

I think the problem with platform games these days is just that they lack the speed of the old ones. I mean there were parts to Sonic where you just zoomed past half a level, trying your best to kill everything in your way without slowing down. Hell, remember Bugsby? :eek: now THAT was fast.

I'd love to see them do Golden Axe 3d, now THAT would be platformer bliss... <basically Two Towers with "jump" added>

TheAlmightyArse

Originally posted by public_enemy

adventure elements are part of the natural evolution of 3d platform games as they become less bound by genre.

I would have agreed with you had Donkey Kong 64 never happened. Both it and the SNES DKs had loads of collecting crap, but where the SNES ones saw you ferreting out extra trinkets from hard to reach spots and required a bit of cunning and a fair bit of skill, DK64 saw you running about stepping on switches or popping the right ape into a barrel with their face on it. Which is unsurprisingly uninteresting and tiresome.

Shinji

Nintendo need to try and read the market better. They've gotten lazy in recent years. They needed to do a WW2 game and a ganster game this generation.

Then they wouldn't have been Nintendo any more, and would have lost their core market. If Nintendo tried to follow the trends in the same way that EA do, they'd go bust within five years.

And please stop spouting this nonsense about Miyamoto being "stifled" by franchises. Miyamoto is the director of all software development at Nintendo. He DECIDES what they're going to develop, and he CREATED the vast majority of the franchises they work on. It's not like Satoru Iwata (Nintendo president, and himself a game designer - he was responsible for Kirby and Earthbound, and also Fire Emblem I believe) is issuing evil edicts from on high and forcing Miyamoto to slave away on new Mario and Zelda games....


By the way, something you may not be aware of but probably should be.

Zelda: Wind Waker is the best-selling console game that's been released this year, on ANY console platform. Zelda: Link To The Past is the best selling GBA title of the year to date, and well into the top ten of the best selling new releases across all formats.

Mario Sunshine remains the best selling game on the GameCube, miles ahead of the likes of Metroid Prime.

Nintendo should dump franchises? I think not.


If you want new, interesting platformer style games, I suggest you play Jak & Daxter or Ratchet & Clank, which are probably the two best "pure" platformers of the last few years. Mario Sunshine is also excellent, obviously. Sly Raccoon isn't a pure platformer, as it incorporates significant stealth elements, but it's very, very good.

weemcd

you should put a poll on this foroum, i loved sonic and cool things like putting another sonic game into the top of sonic and knuckles cartridge unlocked secrets and you could play through sonic 2 with knuckles. Pure genius, if you put sonic the original into the top, you unlocked bonous stages. that is one of my favourite mega drive memories!!!

lordsippa

<Sigh> Happy days....

public_enemy

i feel i should strenghten shinji's points by also informing everyone that zelda - the wind waker, is now the most pre-ordered video-game of all time too.

and about dk64, yeah, it was tiresome, although i did do absolutely everything in that game... and there was a free expansion pack too.

if you put sonic the original into the top, you unlocked bonus stages

are you sure? i tried that before and i just got a blank screen. what kind of bonus stages?

BLITZ_Molloy

There was a cheat that allowed you to lock on Sonic 1. The bonus stages were randomly generated I think, infinite number of stages.