l3rian Registered User
#1

i searched + found answers

Hobbes Registered User
#2

Well don't ruin the suspense. Post it.

Repli Registered User
#3

Yeah tell us =D
I heard its the most boring job in the world but the money is good

hussey Registered User
#4

Yeah but if your just out of college its V hard to get a 'good' programming job

I know loads of people who finished college with 2.1's and 2.2
and they cant get a job,
even know of 2 people with a 1.1 and they work in a bar.

money is decent but only for experienced people
from what I gathered from people who did get a job
avg starting was 23k .. two years ago avg was 23k irish!!

england/usa is the place to go for big bucks

Originally posted by Repli
Yeah tell us =D
I heard its the most boring job in the world but the money is good

#5

Originally posted by hussey
money is decent but only for experienced people

Problem with most graduates is they have to be effectively retrained upon entering the workforce, as most of what they learn in their degree is, for lack of a better term, academic in the real world. You’ll often get more practical experience from a Fás graduate than a CS one.

In addition to this there are way too many SC graduates who will have made their way through college cutting ’n pasting other peoples’ code.

Finally, there are too many who went into IT simply for the money, and have no vocation for it. Such people will earn a living in the long term, but rarely make the big bucks, as they’re uninterested in keeping their skills up as much as those with a genuine vocation for programming. Thankfully, the inflow of these has decreased since the dotcom collapse.

hussey Registered User
#6

very true

TomTom Hosted Moderator
#7

Entering the workplace from college does require you to undergo training and changes. Most degrees place you on work experience for about a year before you finish your course. But as was pointed out alot of companies do things differently to others, such as standards and regulations. In my opinion it has to be a boring job but in the states the money is supposed to be good, espicall if you sign your life to micro$oft. I have a probramming job over there if I ever decide to take it. The only thing is I would feel out of dept completely.

#8

Originally posted by TomTom
In my opinion it has to be a boring job but in the states the money is supposed to be good

The only thing is I would feel out of dept completely.

You're actually one of the people I was talking about above.

You should consider law as an alternative profession.

hussey Registered User
#9

why would you feel out of depth??
Not everyone that works for Ms will be a 'Bill Gates' type guy, most will be avg joe soaps. If your good at your job you shouldn't feel out of depth.

Merrion Registered User
#10

As a developer with 12 years post graduate experience I think I have to correct a couple of misconceptions:

1. Programming pays well - Not true. Programming pays less than the bulk of post-graduate carrers. Compare it to law, dentistry, business management etc.

2. Computer science degree is not much use in the real world - Again, not true. Although the languages used in educational establishments (Ada and the like) are not used in many commercial situations the principals (relational database design, structured programming, object oriented programming etc.) are very useful and transferable.

#11

Originally posted by Merrion
2. Computer science degree is not much use in the real world - Again, not true. Although the languages used in educational establishments (Ada and the like) are not used in many commercial situations the principals (relational database design, structured programming, object oriented programming etc.) are very useful and transferable.

A computer science degree will afford an individual with a number of skills that are certainly both very useful and transferable - in the long run. This, however, has to be weighed against their utility to a firm, in the short run, when they first graduate and they must be retrained.

Merrion Registered User
#12

True - but companies that are only in IT for the short run would be better off outsourcing all their IT functions to companies with a longer term commitment to developing their staff...

#13

Good point, but this is not much use to a company in a recession who cannot afford to carry an unproductive resource. One could (arguably) almost as easily employ an inexperienced self or Fás taught developer and develop their good practices and principles, while still having a resource that could be productive from day one.

Nonetheless, I think this a secondary criticism of CS degrees. Primarily I would contend that the greatest problem with them, at present, is that they contain too high a concentration of people who should not be programming in the first place.

Talliesin Banned
#14

If you think programming would be a boring job you will be a crap programmer. If you are a crap programmer then hopefully you will be a failure (hopefully for you as well as for everyone else, since that failure will spur you into a career more suited for you).

CS degrees are great, I wish I'd done one, but only benefit programmers that would want to be programmers anyway.

CS degrees are only essential if you want a career in CS. Programming is not CS, it is a craft built on what CS tells us.

One big issue is that the education system doesn't put much emphasis on independant study and experimentation until third level, and even then it is a relatively minor thing until post-graduate level. Independant study and experimentation is essential to good programming.

If you are doing a CS degree, AND want to be a programmer then spend some time honing your craft and studying outside of the boundraries of your course and the initial period of adjustment to being a member of the workforce will be quicker and easier.

kayos Registered User
#15

Originally posted by Merrion
True - but companies that are only in IT for the short run would be better off outsourcing all their IT functions to companies with a longer term commitment to developing their staff...


I think you are missing the point here. What I think Corinthian meant was when a company is hiring a grad they will not in the short term get any productive work out of them as they must be retrained.

For example in the company I work in if we hire grads they go into training for a couple of months before they are let any where near any projects for clients (there are some exceptions to this). Now during that time they have to be paid and the people training them can not do any production work. This is a double hit on the company in temrs of money and of tiring up resource's that could be used elsewhere.

Now if you hire a developer with exp the training time is greatly reduced and they can be put on projects at a much earlier stage.

The main advantage I see in taking on grads is the fact you can get a extremely talented programmer at a lower cost than a ok programmer with exp (sounds horrible I know, but its true).

kayos

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