You may have seen the recent article in ‘The Slate’ magazine entitled
‘Blacks in the Jacks’
Do you think the article was Racist ?
What is your feeling on the matter generally ?
A link would be really really helpful
sorry gandalf, dont have one, only briefly saw article myself,
will do a search and get 1.
Anyone who read the article and thought it was racist has to be retarded. They printed letters from the self-righteous morons who wrote in to complain in the next issue and quite rightly slagged them off. The whole point of the article was to satirise the mentality of the pub and club owners who create these "blacks in the jacks" jobs. It's like apartheid-era South Africa.
Ive never heard of the magazine but i presume its something to do with hiring foreigners to do work we regard as too dirty.Theres nothing immoral in paying a foreigner to clean toilets that a native wont do.You dont force them to take the job.
The article was a satirical piece on the policy of pubs and clubs of "hiring" (in many cases these guys are NOT paid any wage) the aformentioned 'blacks in jax' which is a reference to the guys who offer you soap, hand towels, gum etc. in the bathrooms of virtually every pub in dublin now. The article drew particular attention to the fact that these guys are almost ALWAYS black and was close to the bone, too close for many people.
A pub on a busy night, lads with enough beers to make everyone their best friend and with money to spend on them, each taking X amount of trips to the toliets? They probably make more money in a night than we ever will in a week
not a hope sand. Ask yourself how often you tip them and how often you see other people doing it.
Well personally I think that if the public wants this service then it should be a legal waged position (subject to min. wage legislation as well as PRSI Tax etc.) as it stands Sand, sure if they have a good spot and people are generous they may make good money, but they do not get ANY of the, albeit limited, protection afforded to workers in this state.
I feel they are being exploited by the pub owners and then in turn to a degree exploit the sympaties of drunken revelers.
I also think that Ireland is still not very mature in its attitude to minorities, and having "blacks in jax" only serves to reinforce our provincial attitudes and at worse leads to a dangerous view that black people and other minorities are servile and inferior.
Quite true that they should be extended the same protection as other workers - assuming of course that the pub owners are willing to hire them to provide what is a non-essential service under those conditions. The guys there could actually wind up worse off i.e unemployed altogether:|
About the maturity etc- An argument brought up in favour of immigration a lot is the fact that immigrants would be willing to do jobs Irish people wouldnt do. But now its wrong for them to do jobs we wouldnt do? No ones holding a gun to their heads.
I didn't at any point say that, I merely said they should work legally with the protection that provides. Obviously anyone willing to do a job should be allowed to do it, but it should be within the bounds of the law.
No, thats usually just in the coutries we ship asylum seekers back to when we deny them refuge.
I never said you did Gerk, I was referring to your last paragraph where you talked about the jobs the immigrants are asked to do as reinforcing negative attitudes etc. These are the jobs that Im being told theyre willing to do that Irish people arent and thus why immigration, illegal or otherwise, is good. As such I dont see the fact that they take up these jobs as reinforcing negative attitudes. Surely the fact that people can see them working actually reduces negative attitudes?
As for the "less than legit" aspect of the jobs - thats true, but these jobs are barely nessassary - personally I find them just one more person to side step while trying not to slip on the puddle of piss on the floor . Given that, I dont think the bar owners will hire them with increased costs - theyll actually do worse off because they wont have jobs.
Youre kinda sliding off the point with the "not holding a gun to their head" thing, these people are taking these jobs, they probably hate them (who doesnt hate their job ? ), and theyre making enough money that they do more than one week at it.
The only thing is, this was totally unheard of until about 3 years ago. It seemed to arrive with the new influx of immigrants. Whether they brought along entreprenurial ideas like this and asked for the job or whether pub owners are exploiting immigrants inability to get work elsewhere is all up in the air. Is anyone actually friends with any africians who could possibly state on the nature of all this?
was in touch with the slate but their archives are not available on the web yet.
If you want a copy of the article call to their office where I am reliabably informed they have loads of that issue left .
I personally feel they are being exploited , not by the pub owneres ( which IS a surprise being greedy bastards) but by the 'AGENCIES' who approach the pub owners offering this 'FREE' labour in the first place ?
( they are paid nothing by the pubs )
Did you ever notice if you tip less than 2 euros, it is promotly removed from the saucer and put into the attendendant's pocket ? so that a precedent of tipping a 2 euro minimum can be psychologically set in your head ??
Begs the question ?? , which 'organisation' ends up collecting this TAX FREE revenue ??, and i think it's SICK and SHAMEFUL they are happy to exploit their own in order to finance their network here.
If I thought for a second i was helping pay the poor sods rent , i'd have no problem , but that is sadly not the case.
I refuse to tip them , sorry.
Unless its the favourite at aintree at 4 o clock...
"Exploitation is three wolves and a sheep (with a machine gun to their heads) deciding on what to have for dinner."