hatrickpatrick Registered User
#76

Thomas_IV said:
No idea how you can say that with lots of anti-immigrant and even far-right supporters and Holocaust deniers posting there. I could tell some names but I won't as this would go too far. But I also know that there were lots of conservative views expressed as well. The FF bashing was a daily business over there whenever they liked to have it.


The trouble with Reddit is that the ranking system inherently favours the zeitgeist and makes it harder for minority views to be heard. It's one of the issues with Reddit's otherwise very clever thread ranking system. Of course, you have the *option* to view threads and comments chronologically, but most people, particularly new or unregistered users, generally don't bother unless they have a specific reason to. So in practise, unfortunately, when it comes to matters of ideological difference Reddit's system has the creation of echo chambers / ideological ghettoes pretty much hard-coded into it.

It was probably always inevitable that left and right would have to split into two separate sites (Reddit and Voat) but it still a massive shame. And ironically, Voat has an ultranationalist view which encourages pushing away any new right wing community which migrates from Reddit after Reddit's content policy moves further to the left, because they're paranoid about protecting the status quo when it comes to votes - a direct hangover from the days in which they existed on Reddit but always got hidden by being downvoted into the minus figures.

Because of this, Voat is a bit of a disaster. Over time, its overton window has moved further and further right to the point at which even members of /r/The_Donald were driven from Voat in an organised manner, for being "cucks", after Reddit changed its algorithm specifically to prevent The_Donald appearing on the front page.

I just miss the days when the internet was a proper thunderdome of argument, as opposed to two parallel internets for left and right wind views where the opposing side is tolerated so little by the side running a particular site, that you never really get a proper argument going. Politics.ie is unique in that regard, in that while it has a right wing bias (probably due to migration from other mainstream sites which have slid to the left over the years), they're happy to debate and don't tend to try to push people away when they go there with opposing views to discuss.

Just my two cents anyway. As I say, maybe I'm unusual in this, but I really miss the days when the only rule on the average discussion forum was "if you can't hack the sesh, feck off. Otherwise, enjoy your stay."

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Grayson Registered User
#77

hatrickpatrick said:
I just miss the days when the internet was a proper thunderdome of argument, as opposed to two parallel internets for left and right wind views where the opposing side is tolerated so little by the side running a particular site, that you never really get a proper argument going. Politics.ie is unique in that regard, in that while it has a right wing bias (probably due to migration from other mainstream sites which have slid to the left over the years), they're happy to debate and don't tend to try to push people away when they go there with opposing views to discuss.


But you could say that boards has taken that place. Sured there are some extreme views that will get you banned but there's plenty of offensive stuff said.

Harry Palmr Registered User
#78

get it while you can.

http://www.politics.ie/forum/current-affairs/265572-absolute-state-politics-ie.html

that PoliticalIrish site looks appalling - ie full of nazis.

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Thomas_IV Registered User
#79

Harry Palmr said:
get it while you can.

http://www.politics.ie/forum/current-affairs/265572-absolute-state-politics-ie.html

that PoliticalIrish site looks appalling - ie full of nazis.


Thanks for the link as I have seen that nothing really has changed over there. No need for me to look into that site again. It's already gone down the toilet and no wonder by the statement of the owner after years in which due to his absence the decline was running continuously. I just read the first page and that was enough for me. All the same, the blame lies always somewhere else on someone else and never by the posters themselves as the many of them have as usual a lack in self-reflection.

But I like to Quote one poster from page one of that link:
Post #6 by The King:

Why did you even buy an Irish Political site Monte, what are your real interests here?

Would it not be better to just sell the place to someone who really has an interest in Ireland and Irish politics with a bit of know how?

No idea what you paid, but I am willing to bet if you sold it you could still turn a profit.

Time to hand it over to people who actually care.



I think that he's damn well right in his opinion. Such boards needs to be attended by the owner and the moderators needs to be checked on the feedback from the users. Monte (the owner) did that at the start when he took over the ownership but after a while, he seemed to have lost interest and I wouldn't complain much about it, given the behaviour of many users over there and their attitudes to treat one another. I have to admit that I was dishing out in return as well if I saw it necessary to defend myself or just to pay someones rudeness and insults back. But that was the spirit that took manifestation over there by many users which left one with some choices either to 'returning fire' or to increase the names on ones ignore list. Civilized and meaningful exchange of opinions in a normal and civilized manner I have experienced with just a handful of posters over there and they were those with no radical or extreme stances. The rest were just going there for the daily craic and some just for ruining every thread they liked to spoil.

hatrickpatrick Registered User
#80

Grayson said:
But you could say that boards has taken that place. Sured there are some extreme views that will get you banned but there's plenty of offensive stuff said.


The problem with Boards isn't moderation of individual users, the problem with Boards is the locking of threads which stray into an area which is too controversial for the mods' liking, usually when it encompasses a debate involving far right viewpoints - immigration, Islam, the recently locked thread on gender identity, etc. Usually the excuse is either "we've had this conversation before", "there are other threads on this [which tend to also get locked, so it's a moot point]" or "this has gone on long enough". Totally arbitrary and can't ever cite a specific site rule which has been broken, since the actual "rule" they're going by isn't actually written down anywhere - "thou shalt not have discussions which make people too uncomfortable or are too blunt / harsh in their disdain for the current mainstream zeitgeist".

Politics.ie doesn't do this, which is why I maintain that as a political discussion forum, it has an edge. Again, I don't believe Boards' moderation of individual users to be a problem, Boards is generally very good about handing out cards and infractions when they're needed, and not doing so unfairly or unnecessarily. It's the wholescale shutting down of entire threads because their subject matter is too controversial or too "squeamish" in the context of what is currently considered an acceptable range of opinions by polite society. No other website I post on does this, and in my view Boards really suffers for it.

Dravokivich Moderator
#81

Boards is more interested in protecting itself which is why the controversial topics get closed. They were also pointed out as a reason behind people becoming less involved with the site.

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....... Registered User
#82

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hatrickpatrick Registered User
#83

To be fair, Boards' dislike for hosting controversial and un-PC discussions, and Boards' fear of legal repercussions from libel etc, are totally different issues.

Boards' fear of allowing any discussion relating to court cases stems from a total clusterf*ck of the Irish judicial system which took place in the mid-2000s. In either 2006 or 2007, there was a spate of violence and vandalism at one of the Oxegen campsites, and when people took to Boards (which in that pre social media era, really was the central hub for Irish people to discuss pretty much everything) to complain about the security arrangements and the fact that the situation had been able to spiral out of control, MCD promotions promptly took Boards to court for libel and secured a temporary injunction against any discussion of any event related in any way to MCD. Because of the ridiculously slow pace of the Irish courts, this meant that all MCD events were off limits for discussion on this site for years - possibly up until around 2011 or 2012. For instance, the U2 concerts in 2009, arguably the biggest selling concerts of that year in Ireland, were an elephant in the room here - you couldn't so much as mention their existence without your post being deleted, because of that ridiculous injunction.

Ireland has no "safe harbour" rules with regard to the internet, which is a huge, huge problem. In Ireland, if someone posts something illegal, the platform is legally responsible, not the individual user who posted it. Because of this, if I for instance libel someone on Boards, it's not me who gets sued for millions of euro, it's Boards itself. This causes a gigantic chilling effect. Other websites such as Reddit and Facebook are less exposed because they're not hosted in Ireland, so they're not subject to our moronic laws around libel and who is responsible - Ireland's laws regarding the internet are similar to holding a bartender responsible for libel because someone he's served a drink to shouts out that some local lad is a rapist. It's moronic, but it has caused legal problems for Boards in the past with MCD, so their paranoia is understandable.

This has nothing to do with ideological / Overton Window thread closures though, and those are the ones which I for one find totally infuriating.

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....... Registered User
#84

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hatrickpatrick Registered User
#85

....... said:
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I post regularly on it, but it's not quite - you'll notice that if an article mentions an ongoing court case or investigation, they don't allow comments, just like here. In fact, when the article about GSOC's Ian Bailey report was published yesterday, they weren't allowing comments on that.

The legal censorship isn't Boards' fault. The ideological censorship absolutely 100% is.

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Harry Palmr Registered User
#86

Re MCD - boards.ie had two run ins with them, the first in 2005 when a diabetic and her partner who both posted here often enough were accused of trying to smuggle in drugs, presumable heroin as it was insulin!

http://janet.ie/opps/

http://www.mulley.net/2006/09/03/more-mcd-woes-boardsie-users-biting-back/

I think they were just itching to take their revenge and the 2006
Oxygen debacle gave them the opportunity to have a go at boards. The wiki entry for the festival that year has a whole section on it.

DEFTLEFTHAND Registered User
#87

....... said:
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I think O'Dwyer was an active member of boards for a few years.

This might have been the reason why his case couldn't be discussed on the site. Very awkward situation.

Keplar240B Registered User
#88

Politicalirish is much better technically just needs more people.

https://www.politicalirish.com/

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Muahahaha Registered User
#89

....... said:
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Yeah the Belfast rape trial too. Even though it was a different jurisdiction Boards would not allow discussion on it till after the case despite other platforms allowing discussion. I followed it on Peoples Republic of Cork and despite the controversial nature of the rape trial none of the posters were going around defaming anyone, it was a civilized discussion

hatrickpatrick said:


Ireland has no "safe harbour" rules with regard to the internet, which is a huge, huge problem. In Ireland, if someone posts something illegal, the platform is legally responsible, not the individual user who posted it. Because of this, if I for instance libel someone on Boards, it's not me who gets sued for millions of euro, it's Boards itself. This causes a gigantic chilling effect.


Thats one of the main problems with our defamation legislation which really needs to be reformed. When Nell McCafferty called Mary Harney an alcoholic on Newstalk it was Newstalk who Harney sued, not Nell McCafferty. What this results in is a media who have to tip toe around many issues and avoid other ones altogether for fear of being sued for what someone else says on air.

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#90

What was that leftist breakaway a few years ago? Politicalworld.org. Full of commies !

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