El_Duderino 09 Registered User
#3,631

silverharp said:
El_Duderino 09 said:
He’s Tony Robbins crossed with Bill O Reilly. Self help for the conservative white man. His message is tailored for you so I imagine you see his message as common sense

Stand up straight, shoulders back, tidy your room. The left are all wrong. Common sense for the conservative without challenging any of your beliefs. Magic.


white men eh? blacks and women banned


Not banned. The message isn’t tailored to them the way it’s tailored to you. That much should be clear

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Brian? Moderator
#3,632

silverharp said:
at a minimum he has always been a professional motivational speaker, he is a bit too slick and came across to me like a TV Evangelist.


At a minimum? He is a motivational speaker. I wouldn’t be a fan of his delivery, but some very successful people I respect are big fans of Tony Robbins. His message is simple and inoffensive, delivered with razzle dazzle.

Zubeneschamali Registered User
#3,633

silverharp said:
white men eh? blacks and women banned


Not banned, just not his intended audience.

His message is all about individuals taking control of their own lives and forging their own path. This is a message aimed at your single white male, playing life at the easiest setting. He is absolutely able to take control of his own stuff, stand up straight, clean his own room and find himself on top of the world.

Because he was born on top of the world, and only his own screw-ups put him anywhere else.

Black women, facing all sorts of personal and institutional discrimination, are not so receptive to the message that if they just sort out their own crap they'll succeed.

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needwater Registered User
#3,634

Zubeneschamali said:
Not banned, just not his intended audience.

His message is all about individuals taking control of their own lives and forging their own path. This is a message aimed at your single white male, playing life at the easiest setting. He is absolutely able to take control of his own stuff, stand up straight, clean his own room and find himself on top of the world.

Because he was born on top of the world, and only his own screw-ups put him anywhere else.

Black women, facing all sorts of personal and institutional discrimination, are not so receptive to the message that if they just sort out their own crap they'll succeed.


Right, so if you face challenges and your life is a bit harder because you don't have "white male privilege", and you're not quite on top of the world the same way a single white man is, you might as well not sort out your own crap.

Zubeneschamali Registered User
#3,635

needwater said:
Right, so if you face challenges and your life is a bit harder because you don't have "white male privilege", and you're not quite on top of the world the same way a single white man is, you might as well not sort out your own crap.


You are much less likely to buy a book saying "just sort out your own crap and bob's your uncle". Bob will never be your uncle no matter how on top of your crap you are.

Meanwhile, the SWM who can sort out his own crap loves this message, since it means he doesn't need to concern himself with all the institutional discrimination against people who are not just like him until they sort out their own crap first.

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needwater Registered User
#3,636

Zubeneschamali said:
You are much less likely to buy a book saying "just sort out your own crap and bob's your uncle". Bob will never be your uncle no matter how on top of your crap you are.

Meanwhile, the SWM who can sort out his own crap loves this message, since it means he doesn't need to concern himself with all the institutional discrimination against people who are not just like him until they sort out their own crap first.


Bob might not be your uncle but your situation will seriously improve.

Can you define concretely any institutional discrimination you're referring to?

Zubeneschamali Registered User
#3,637

needwater said:
Can you define concretely any institutional discrimination you're referring to?


Well, black people and women were mentioned earlier. If you are not aware of any institutional discrimination suffered by black people and women, Peterson's book is perfect for you.

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El_Duderino 09 Registered User
#3,638

Zubeneschamali said:


Meanwhile, the SWM who can sort out his own crap loves this message, since it means he doesn't need to concern himself with all the institutional discrimination against people who are not just like him until they sort out their own crap first.


That’s a really important part of the Peterson sermon. Don’t attempt to change the world/society/anything except yourself. Young people know nothing ‘literally nothing’.

“Get your own house in PERFECT order before you criticise the world” - Peterson, adnausium.

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Mountainsandh Registered User
#3,639

El_Duderino 09 said:
That’s a really important part of the Peterson sermon. Don’t attempt to change the world/society/anything except yourself. Young people know nothing ‘literally nothing’.

“Get your own house in PERFECT order before you criticise the world” - Peterson, adnausium.


Not really, it's get your house in order before you can change the world, usually he uses the phrase "to be a force for good"in the world.

Looking at it cynically and doubting the person's good faith is the easy, conspiratorial way out of this conundrum for people who feel threatened by his attempts to make people think.

You can choose to look at the world that way, or maybe just to present the world that way, or you can actually try and listen, and learn.

The man is a lecturer. His purpose is to make people think.

Evidently he's failing with some.

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Zubeneschamali Registered User
#3,640

El_Duderino 09 said:

The man is a lecturer. His purpose is to make people think.


He used to be a lecturer, but this new celebrity self-help for dudes who don't need help and want to believe no-one else does either gig pays much better.

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Mountainsandh Registered User
#3,641

Mountainsandh said:


He used to be a lecturer, but this new celebrity self-help for dudes who don't need help and want to believe no-one else does either gig pays much better.


Well yeah. So ? I don't understand what the big deal is, about him making money. Would you like him to lecture for free, or live like a recluse ?
He's still lecturing, not full on myths, religion and psychology anymore, but actually, using all of that still. Making great money, and not so shackled by uni anymore.
How is that a problem ? He's not stealing money from people, he's not fooling them into buying something. He's selling a book, and explaining the contents of the book to lots of people who are happy to pay a ticket to hear him.

The book is only part of what he's at by the way. The talks with Russel Brand are not about the book at all. He had debates with Sam Harris, an example of a theme was "what is the nature of truth?". There are many talks in universities, and since it appears that it's the unis who decide what the theme will be, it's not necessarily his book that he discusses.

Look, it's fine to be cynical, I'm cynical on some things too,; and the guy cannot be everyone's cup of tea but I would highly recommend listening to other talks before anyone making their minds up, the book stuff is just the book stuff, breadwinner sort of thing.

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Zubeneschamali Registered User
#3,642

Mountainsandh said:
he's not fooling them into buying something.


Of course he is. The 3 arena full of the poor saps.

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Mountainsandh Registered User
#3,643

Zubeneschamali said:
Of course he is. The 3 arena full of the poor saps.


Fooling them into what ? Please explain.

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Zubeneschamali Registered User
#3,644

Mountainsandh said:
Fooling them into what ?

Paying him for inane advice their mother gives them free. Pick up your room. Stand up straight. Stop your moaning.

But by sprinkling some own the libs magic on it and using big words, he gets them to pay to hear advice they have no notion of following simply because it makes them feel superior.

He is putting his psychology expertise to good use.

On the suckers who pay him.

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Professor Moriarty Registered User
#3,645

Zubeneschamali said:
Paying him for inane advice their mother gives them free. Pick up your room. Stand up straight. Stop your moaning.

But by sprinkling some own the libs magic on it and using big words, he gets them to pay to hear advice they have no notion of following simply because it makes them feel superior.

He is putting his psychology expertise to good use.

On the suckers who pay him.


You're having a very good day.

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